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ROTS vs TFA
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Last poll got hijacked by bots so I'm doing this again

http://strawpoll.me/6455764

Which flick is better?
>>
Revenge of the Sith has Sheev.
>>
>>64505356
This.

ROTS has bigger meme potential, and that's about all there is to say about these two movies.
>>
they both shit

but TFA had no excuse, so ROTS
>>
>>64505303
If the last one was hijacked by bots then what be different this time you absolute fucking mank
>>
if you pick TFA you're literally everything wrong with /tv/
>>
>>64505303
ROTS by far.

TFA is a glib facsimile.
>>
>>64505481
>Did not open the poll to see

What's it like being a retard?
>>
>flick
Reddit is that way kid
>>
>>64505634
This.
Revenge of the Sith is clearly a film.
>>
RotS.
>>
kinda funny how every post so far was pro-ROTS and yet TFA is winning

the shilling is real
>>
>prequel memesters are behind
Good. Goooooood.
>>
ROTS is original as fuck compared to TFA
>>
>ywn not say "that's no moon" to yourself when the pie chart appears
>>
I thought TFA was just plain boring, and completely used nostalgia to make it interesting. Literally just A New Hope 2.0 but somehow worse
At least ROTS was exciting.
>>
>TFA winning

reddit sure is here
>>
the fact that ROTS isn't winning by a wide margin is ridiculous
>>
>>64505303
Rots had nothing going for it, and was boring and charmless
Just becsuse TFA borrowed plot devices (may i point out the archetypal quest structure used in tfa, one which was completely lacking in any of the prequels) doesnt mean its by any means worse. In fact the plot worked to its advantage because they could make everything else likeable, unlike anything in ROTS
>>
>>64506380
Not everyone's a meme poster.
>>
>>64506464
God awful opinion. Tourist please leave.
>>
>>64506477
ROTS being better isn't a meme.
>>
>>64505303
Both are bad but ROTS was original
Ahould be an option for both being shit tbqh familia
>>
>>64506464
GLIB
>>
Jesus fuck is this whole
>the prequels weren't that bad
meme still going?

Fuck you.
>>
ITT: /tv/ at its contrarian best.
>>
>>64506659
Better than groupthink
>>
>>64506635
They're bad, but TFA is even worse

>>64506659
>le contrarian boogeyman

Fuck off.
>>
>>64506682
>implying /tv/ isn't groupthinking that the prequels aren't bad
>>
>>64506659
From my point of view, people who like TFA are contrarians!
>>
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>>64506701
>They're bad, but TFA is even worse
>>
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>>64506635
>>64506659
>it's star wars so they must be contrarian!
>>
>>64506714
Being contrarian is in direct opposition to groupthink.
>Why don't you like it! Everyone else does! Fucking contrarians
>>
>>64506769
Meant to reply to >>64506712
>>
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>>64506741
>the prequels aren't eye-gougingly bad
>>
>>64506769
if everyone's contrarian, it stops being contrarian and becomes groupthink. /tv/ as a whole is groupthinking the contrarian meme.

DUH
>>
>>64505303
Snooky is displeased. Snooky want smoosh smoosh.
>>
>>64506825
So is /tv/ contrarian groupthinkers or groupthinking contrarians?
>>
TFA is not even worthy of me pirating it to watch it again
it is that bad
>>
>>64506890
yes
>>
>>64506825
damn....
>>
>>64505303
TFA's votes can't be this high.
Probably someone crossposted the pol to reddit.
>>
everyone who says Revenge is shit, go put it on and tell me that intro with the drums over coruscant and the assault on greivous' ship isnt the best intro to a star wars film ever.

TFA is fucking awful. i thought people here had taste. revenge is objectively better and thats fact
>>
Some nigger is getting people to vote ROTS even though TFA is clearly a better movie.
Oh nvm /tv/ being contrarians again.
>>
>>64507442
>TFA is fucking awful.
no it's not, they're both good SW movies, but the opera scene in ROTS outclasses anything in any other star wars film
>>
>>64507442
bowm b dum bowm b dum dowm b da d a da da dum
>>
>>64507461
>contrarians
This word gives away the troll to easily.
Switch it up.
>>
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Gonna post poll on reddit so that they vote TFA. They won, after all.
>>
>>64507461
>>64507477
samefag
>>
>>64507477
>but the opera scene in ROTS outclasses anything in any other star wars film
someone post the pasta
>>
>>64507530
redditor in disguise
>>
>>64507477
if you take away the lightsabers and the obvious faces, TFA is just a high budget, fancy effects flick which is just using sw as a mask.

there is nothing star wars about TFA, and it makes me sad that people consider it a respectable part of the franchise
>>
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>>64507552
This scene alone is better than all of TFA.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=05dT34hGRdg

Revenge of the Sith is painted in broad brush strokes. It is played out a mammoth stage by actors with megaphones. It is Big and Bold. It is outrageously epic geographically and emotionally. The symbolism is grand too and because it is in keeping with the story's sweep it does not unbalance the story.

On this scene, at the Opera House, the Mon Calamari put on a show where sperm-like ribbons float in and out of a massive watery egg. The discussion between the Chancellor and Anakin about the creation of life cements the visual message.

>"Ironic isn't it? ...He could save others but not himself" - Sheev
>"He saved others, let him save himself if he is the Christ of God, the Chosen One" - Priest Luke 23:35

The director George Lucas uses the language of Christian heritage, words already resonant with meaning, as stepping stones to a greater understanding. In this way he subtly illuminates for us the roles, the motivations and the size of what is at stake.
>>
>>>64507608
i unironically agree with all of this
>>
>>64505303
from my point of view both of them fucking suck
>>
if you mean being contrarian is not liking the flick it means you assume most people liked it. Do you have a source on that?
>>
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>>64507442
>it's a good movie cuz in the beginning there was lots of lasers and spaceships exploding with music
>>
>>64507608
there was nothing like this in TFA. no indepth conversations, no substance. just nothing of interest. TFA is a fast paced action flick on par with flicks like transformers, and people actually rate it as a decent film! lmao
>>
>>64507675
>I like TFA because it's newer, CGI is more better, there is more polygons on screen

a-ok
>>
>>64507703
said no one ever
>>
>>64507675
lol youre an idiot
>>
>>64507719
you don't even have to say it
>>
>>64507703
CGI still not better than avatar you 12yr bitch, and the alien designs were straight from highschool art students, pathetic
>>
>>64507719
no, but thats why they like it.
theres nothing good about TFA apart from the effects, it tells you alot about the people that like it
>>
>>64507725
a well thought-out counterpoint, i hadn't thought about that :^)

>>64507728
whatever helps you sleep at night memefriend

>>64507744
who's "they"?
>>
>>64507768
damage control
>>
>>64507787
another bombshell
>>
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If you look at the original films, Luke has a (foster) family; he participates. He does his chores (there is a sense of social responsibility). He's ordinary. Rey is a loner and a survivor, and clearly extraordinary in her abilities across the board, with no responsibilities. Luke is a slightly dorky teenager to whom we can relate - he seeks a role model; Rey is beautiful and dynamic - orphaned, but with no need of parental guidance. The orphan trope itself has become somewhat selfish, and speaks to a certain narcissism of modern independence. The film is not really not focussed on a social dynamic, nor the idea of any kind of altruism; they're presenting you with new characters whose primary motivations are selfish.

Rey doesn't decide to leave and pursue Luke; she escapes Jakku and then tries to return. There is no heroic motivation for her, and that she forgets about going home in favour of finding Luke is convenient but never given a believable basis. Luke decided to rescue someone.
>>
>>64505303
>Revenge of the Shit winning
Fuck you guys so hard.
>>
>>64507866
it's a meme
>>
>>64507866
Literally crying
>>
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>>64507866
Sheev shits all over your ugly waifu
>>
>>64507719
There are 3 reasons for liking TFA:
1. Graphical fulfillment
2. Believing a film has value for the number of diversity boxes it checks
3. Marvelesque dialogue that priorities humorous quips over substantive character development, using the emotions they generate to disguise the superficial interactions between characters.
>>
>>64507879
no it's not
>>
>>64507889
i didn't like it for any of those reasons. what happens now?
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>>64507884
holy shit his arms are fucking MASSIVE wtf
>>
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>>64505303
I really don't know an adequate answer that would be satisfying.

TFA would win if the competition was only about visuals.
There is no denying of the fact that TFA, due to the the advanced time and new technical achievement and the sacrifice of a shit ton of CGI, looks way better.

But if we would search for originality and an "interesting" story ROTS would win because Lucas at least tried to do something original with the license at hand.

Acting wasn't that good in both films and each had its really cheesy moments
>>
>>64507928
you have shares at Disney®
>>
>>64507948
Listen to your heart, anon

You know that RotS is better
>>
>>64507948
trying to tell an "original" story and utterly failing in every way isn't worthy of any praise
>>
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>>64507845
>Rey doesn't decide to leave and pursue Luke; she escapes Jakku and then tries to return.
It's called Refusal of the Call. It's the moment in the Hero's Journey where the Hero is called to adventure, but would rather stay at home in comfort. But the Call is always more powerful, and drags him (or her) in anyway.

Luke had it too: he knew his uncle depended upon him, and so he was unwilling to go rescue Leia. It was only after his aunt and uncle were found dead that he decided there wasn't anything left to keep him there.

Rey didn't have ties so weak, she still felt obligated to remain. Her ties weren't a person, but the promise or expectation of a person. It was only after her ordeal, after discovering who she was, that she decided it was better to seek out Luke and better train herself in the Force.

>>64507884
>implying Queen Senator Hershlag is my Star Waifu
>>
>>64507928
I forgot to add:
4. It was like a New Hope
If it's not that then you are truly lost
>>
>ITT teenage fanboys who try to like TFA so hard but it sucks so it really isn't easy

little champions
>>
would you guys have liked it better if rey and darth emo were removed , the protagonist was finn the antagonist was captain phasma, and the film more organically explored finn questioning his role as a stormtrooper before leaving the empire remnant?
>>
>>64508022
I realise that a film can't stray to far into visualizing character intentions for fear of ruining the quality of a film, but that doesn't change the fact that some features of character motivations require some establishment. Whilst TFA utilized classic tropes and story tools like the Refusal of the Call, there was still no reason for her to train in the force or enter the fight. There needed to be something more crystal than "having nothing better to do" as motivation.
>>
>>64505303
Revenge has Grievous.
>>
>>64508036
what if i genuinely enjoyed the new characters and had fun watching it? i know 'fun' is a meme now and you're not allowed to say that on /tv/, but honestly it's important to me.

i have complaints about the movie as well (especially trying too hard to be like ANH with Starkiller base), but for the most part i liked it.

plus i've literally not seen a single person said they liked the film because it was racially diverse and had good cgi.
>>
>>64507948
RotS, and the prequels, are good concepts executed poorly, whereas TFA is a boring concept done reasonably well.

so while I give a lot of points to RotS for its concept, it was still a bad film
>>
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>>64508017
Telling a story that is more or less a Frankenstein construct of its preceding movies isn't worth of any praise either.

You see the dilemma don't you, anon?
>>
>>64508017
A noble failure will always rank higher than than a crashingly mediocre movie made by accountants with a spreadsheet for a script, in my opinion.
>>
>>64505303
>comparing a film that capped of a trilogy with a film that starts a new one

should be vs TPM tbqh faqm
>>
>>64508193
TPM all the way then. The choice is actually easier.
>>
Why do people act like the prequels are original somehow? They borrow heavily from the original trilogy too -- sometimes shot for shot.

At least when The Force Awakens does it, it's actually a quality movie.
>>
>>64508193
TPM is even better than ROTS tho.
Give TFA a chance, buddy.
>>
>>64508193
But TPM vs TFA would be a really easy win for the latter, no doubt about it.

Would be a rather boring thread wouldn't it?
>>
>>64508241
>>64508259
you honestly think TPM is better than RotS?
>>
I'll always prefer to watch a so-bad-it's-good movie with friends over a mediocre, Avengers-style movie that will be forgotten in 5 years.
>>
Revenge of the Sith is better no doubt about it
>>
RotS is infinitely better than TFA, it has plenty of problems but it raises lots of important issues such as the use of false flags to control & manipulate the population.

TFA is just an average action film that does nothing original.
>>
>>64508247
>it's actually a quality movie
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>
>>64508296
yes

>>64508282
*ladder
>>
>>64508247

> They borrow heavily from the original trilogy too -- sometimes shot for shot.

The reason that the prequels borrow from the originals is that they are prequels. The point is to tell the backstory of the original characters. It makes sense that Anakin, Obi Wan, and Padme are the main characters of the prequels because they are the most important characters to the backstory of the original trilogy. What they do (Anakin marrying Padme, Anakin being trained by Owi Wan, etc) are necessarily borrowed from the originals. What is the sequels in universe excuse for borrowing the exact same characters and concepts as the originals? There is none.
>>
>>64508147
oh anon.. every story you encounter is more or less recycled from something else. everything you think is original is actually inspired by something else you're simply unaware of. even /tv/'s post-ironically beloved prequels borrow heavily from the OT (and do it poorly).

there is no dilemma. both the prequels and this new trilogy carry the weight of a cultural phenomenon on their shoulders. but the prequels leaned too heavily on spectacle and nothing else. and while TFA can be nitpicked to death, the characters and settings in TFA are clearly resonating with audiences a lot more than the prequels ever did, and nothing you or this strawpoll say will change that.

also about half that image is wrong. might want to get a new one.

>>64508164
*tips fedora*
>>
>>64508247
There aren't that many story similarities between the original series and the prequels are there?

Still the Ring Theory proves to be perpetual in the Star Wars Saga
>>
>>64508326
this so much

RotJ = a masterpiece of unintentional comedy
TFA = boring summer flick that no one will remember 10 years from now
>>
The Prequel Trilogy is more creative, has better worldbuilding and in many ways better space opera than The Force Unleashed, They also have far more memorable scenes (Darth Maul vs Obi and Qui, Podracing, Jango Fett decapitated, Sheev etc)

Too bad the Prequels have probably some of the worst effects, writing, pacing and acting in major blockbuster history and are basically unwatchable without cringing all the way through. There was a good movie that could have been made with the prequels, too bad Lucas wasn't just producer.

TFA on the other hand is bland, derivative, unmemorable nothing shit out of some corporate office, but is very well made from a production standpoint and nothing is really offensive apart from how it's an unmemorable generic modern blockbuster movie.

I personally would rather watch TFA than any of the prequels, at the same time I would rather watch some of the scenes of the prequels on youtube than watch TFA.
>>
>>64508430
>ad populum
hella f*ckin' epic
>>
>>64508022

Although they attack the new 'Death Star' in the end, it is not the impetus for the story - that is the search for Luke, who himself has decided to absolve himself of responsibility (against his character) and remove himself from society.
Even Han has lapsed back to crime after failing as a dad - something that dishonours his previous arc that saw him go from scoundrel to hero by joining the team. In fact, it says more about him that he hasn't looked for his dear friend in decades. Everyone is disengaged, and there is no sense that forming a societal bond will help them. The filmmakers eschew the idea of a common good in favour of an outward message of empowerment. In fairness, we do get a heroic 'change of heart' from Finn, who decides to rescue Rey - only she doesn't need rescuing, and the dramatic gesture is mostly pretty useless - once again confirming to the audience that the bond of friendship is largely irrelevant. Finn and Rey do seem to like each other, and even hug at one point, but they seem much more like acquaintances of the Facebook generation than real comrades who share values.
>>
>>64508443
*RotS
>>
>>64508467
>Although they attack the new 'Death Star' in the end, it is not the impetus for the story
>this makes a second trench run OK
l o l
>>
>>64508500
what if instead, they do a trench run but the bad guys actually win by learning from the mistakes on the previous deathstars?
>>
>>64508423
>What is the sequels in universe excuse for borrowing the exact same characters and concepts as the originals? There is none.
The fact that Star Wars was always about the characters, so of course the sequels will focus on what happened to those character in the originals.

In fact, very few sequels change the focus of who the main characters are, so I don't get your point.
>>
>>64508536
>In fact, very few sequels change the focus of who the main characters are
r u dum
>>
>>64508465
hella f*ckin' red herring

my point was that the characters in TFA are easier to relate to because they act and talk like real people. it's only natural that audiences would resonate with characters that feel real.

what was memorable about Qui-gon Jinn or Queen Amidala? how about Mace Windu? even the star of the show Anakin just spends most of the time on-screen brooding and whining, only to be easily duped by the worst con ever. his character is perpetually mocked.
>>
>>64508589
>what was memorable about Qui-gon Jinn or Queen Amidala? how about Mace Windu?
What isn't. These characters all much more memorable than Katniss and Kevin Hart in space.
>>
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>>64508430
>half that image is wrong

This still implies that half it is true.

Also, I'm aware of literally everything being unoriginal when you trace down the inspirational sources for its creator.

Furthermore things like the Monomyth make everything less original than it already is
>>
>>64508536

To clarify there is no excuse for the sequels to introduce new characters as carbon copies of characters that were previously killed off like having Kylo Ren be the new vader, Snoke be the new emperor, and Hux be the new Tarkin. That is shit writing. As for the sequels reusing the same characters if it was decently written they would follow the arcs of the previous trilogy rather then cancelling them out. E.g having Han Solo be a smuggler again, having Han and Leia break up, having Luke not do anything and be a hermit, etc.
>>
Every aspect of filmmaking is just better done in TFA than in ROTS. The acting is better, the cinematography is superior, the set design is more interesting, its ability to tell story through images (the purpose of a visual medium) exceeds everything in the prequels, every aspect of the mise-en-scene is just of a higher quality. It's fair to disparage its lack of originality, but to sit here and say that you prefer a 20 minute lightsaber fight to shots like pic related just proves that the memes have consumed you
>>
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>>64508645
>the cinematography is superior
kek
>its ability to tell story through images (the purpose of a visual medium) exceeds everything in the prequels
topkek
>>
>>64508645
>trip
ok
>>
>>64508589
>talk like real people
>"I didn't know there is so much green in the universe"

There is no arguing that the acting was better in TFA than it was in every movie of the prequels but this doesn't make it less of a copy of Star Wars IV with spliced in elements from VII
>>
>>64505356
>>64505433
/thread
>>
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>>64508645
>i go to star wars movies for the technical displays of cinematic prowess
>>
>>64508296
I consider TMP to be an average/okayish movie while RotS is a mix of utter retardation, entertaining action sequences and perfect rape of the original trilogy.
>>
>>64508645
>its ability to tell story through images
>what is Padme's ruminations
TFA has nothing even close to as show don't tell as that scene.
>>
>>64508630
then what is the merit of using originality as a marker for the quality of the film? unless we're going to accuse TFA of being a ripoff of ANH which i suppose one could make an argument for - but there are just as many things different as there are similarities
>>
>>64508707
>but there are just as many things different as there are similarities
hehe. . .meme
>>
>>64508705
What a fucking joke. Two people looking out of a window says absolutely zip regarding their situation or the story. That scene is nothing compared to Rey staring at the old woman doing exactly what she's doing and realizing that that's her future if she doesn't get off Jakku. That's visual storytelling done right.
>>
>>64508645
i bet you think that Avatar was a good movie too
>>
>>64508776
>Two people looking out of a window says absolutely zip regarding their situation or the story
One of the signs of autism is the inability to pick up non-verbal cues from other people.
>>
>>64508673
>>the cinematography is superior
Wow, digital cinematography, how fucking impressive. Literally all you have to do is compose the image, everything else is done in computers. Compare that to TFA, where positioning, lighting, lenses, film type, etc. all play a role.
>>
can anyone her recall a single song from TFA?
>>
>>64508841
>score by john williams AND some spic
nope, i remember thinking i'd heard some pieces in a video game, but that's it.
>>
>>64508076
That would be awesome
>>
TFA is losing even during the time period where the hype blinds the more impressionable folks to all the flaws, that really says a lot. In a few years all the TFA fans will almost certainly hate it just like how they liked TPM at first then only started hating it months later when it became cool to do that. Maybe RLM will even make a video to let them know what their new opinion should be.
>>
>>64508824
That could be why most of TFA went over your head. There's no exposition, just characters reacting to their environments.
>>
>>64508707
I really liked watching TFA and I consider it to be a good movie.
The problem I'm having is:

Firstly the possible accusation of TFA being a ripoff of ANH.

Secondly the fanbase that's just sitting there circlejerking about how great the movie is and that it's a masterpiece of our time (which doesn't degrade the actual quality of the movie but still is something that takes away some of its qualities).

I think deep in my heart I know that TFA is better, but I still like to shitpost. Quality wise it is superior in arguably every possible aspect, we don't need to argue about that, I guess
>>
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>>64508899
>over my head
>"tfa is deeper than you think you guiz"
>>
I want reddit to leave
>>
>>64508890
>TFA is losing even during the time period where the hype blinds the more impressionable folks to all the flaws,
It's actually the opposite. This is an Empire Strikes Back situation, where most people left the theater hating it, but it grew on them over time. Back when Empire came out fan were actually fucking pissed.
>>
III>VI>IV>II>V>I>TFA

Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
>>
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>>64508705
>Padme's ruminations

i love how prequel defenders can only point to this one scene in the ENTIRE trilogy because it's the only 2 minutes where the characters finally shut their mouths and it seems like something deeper is happening. it's as if Lucas briefly remembered he used to care about the art of filmmaking and made a hamfisted attempt at capturing it again.

this shot is on-screen for just a few seconds in TFA and it speaks volumes.
>>
>>64508825
who cares about that shit
what matters is the final product, what people see on the screen
>>
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>"New Star Wars? Pft, even the prequels are better! In fact, they weren't bad at all!"
You guys are the biggest contrarian faggots on the internet.
>>
>>64508825
So you are "CGI is always bad, practical effects are always good" type of autist, I got it
>>
>>64508957
>speaks volumes
That shot is intsagram trash because JJ put in some kind of simulated gate weave.
It looks all faux retro.
>>
>>64508970
its relativity anon
>>
>>64508917
>Secondly the fanbase that's just sitting there circlejerking about how great the movie is and that it's a masterpiece of our time

This was the case in the first week after coming out, the shine has already faded away

https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/3zglnb/star_wars_fans_that_didnt_like_the_force_awakens/

Even /r/movies hates TFA and it's the biggest disney/marvel/blockbuster circlejerk board on the internet.
>>
>>64508945
5 > 4 > 6 > 3

the rest is trash
>>
>>64508966
The final product sucks because it isn't real. There's no tangibility, or unintentional accidents that come from all these elements interacting.
>>
>>64508970
>contrarian
loving every laugh

>>64509002
>linking to reddit
/tv/ 2016
>>
I like how a couple trolls started this forced meme about how the prequels are better and now there are people who have jumped on the bandwagon as if it's an actual opinion a functional adult could have.

Literally the worst subforum on the internet.
>>
>>64509015
>no tangibility
le tactile autist faec
>>
Fuck yeah, finally ROTS is first by at least a small margin. The last poll was embarrasing, all these cucks voting for Jew Jew's Marvel flick
>>
>>64508975
TFA has a ton of CGI. Preferring real sets doesn't imply that you dislike computer generated effects.
>>
>>64508975
>>>64508825
>"CGI is always bad, practical effects are always good" type of autist

Nothing autistic about telling the truth
>>
>>64508589

> what was memorable about Qui-gon Jinn or Queen Amidala? how about Mace Windu?

The main characters of the prequels are Anakin, Padme, and Obi Wan. The other characters are side characters.

> even the star of the show Anakin just spends most of the time on-screen brooding and whining, only to be easily duped by the worst con ever.

He whined a lot before he married Padme because you know he was an angsty, young boy. He doesn't whine when his relationship is going well with Padme. Is their wedding scene not better then anything in TFA?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVyGmiRmKs0
>>
>>64509044
You're free to leave.
>>
>>64509002
>other people dislike the movie therefore that's evidence of its lack of quality
Are you really using this argument?
>>
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>hurr durr da prequels were shit PlebRedditCuckia told me so! downboated everyone in this thread if you disagree you're contrarian!
>>
>>64509089
>opinions are facts
>>
>>64509123
no u
>>
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>>64509097
but before let me explain why you are sub human and will always be one
>>
>>64509161
Dude what?
I was telling a TFA tourist to leave.
Is this an elaborate false flag to discredit prequel fans?
>>
>>64509046
That's a completely legitimate opinion. Watch the chase scenes in films like Children of Men and the new Mission Impossible and compare them to Obi-Wan chasing Grievous in a Dinosaur.
>>
>>64509058
it was 58% for ROTS at the beginning of this thread.
Then reddit joined.
>>
>>64508993
regardless of your babby's first film class opinion i was speaking of the shot's symbolism

>>64509092
>The main characters of the prequels are Anakin, Padme, and Obi Wan. The other characters are side characters.

ok well Padme is Queen Amidala and when she became Padme she wasn't all that different. she went from monotone, boring queen to monotone, boring senator. Ewan McGregor tried his best to work with the material given to him. can't say the same for Hayden.

>Is their wedding scene not better then anything in TFA?
the problem with the wedding scene is their love story is unbelievable so their wedding has no emotional attachment. why are Anakin and Padme in love? why do they get married? is it just because they want to fuck eachother? Padme has no reason to love Anakin as a person. Anakin was nothing but a creep, a weirdo and a self-centered sociopath when he was around her. then they get married? she just ruined the career she claimed to care so much about. what a great love story.
>>
>>64509195
>he likes Cuaron
opinion discarded
>>
>>64509216
>he doesn't think Cuaron is a fantastic visual director
His bad writing can't even ruin his good direction
>>
>>64509208
>babby's first film class
Put your trip back on.
>>
>>64509207
Then people started making good arguments in favor of TFA. Just proves that no one is capable of having their own opinions.
>>
>>64509161
>poo digimon
>faggot nigger
>chewbarebacker
>gey
>gaylord
Hilarious stuff! I came up with more:
Leia should LAMEIA, get it?
Hux could be KEK
>>
>>64509262
don't have one but thanks for letting me know you've been #triggered
>>
>>64509248
I beg to differ. Gravity was a ruined movie.
>>
>>64506635
They're crap,but thats how bad TFA is. Its like a putting a fat chick next to an even fatter chick at a party.
>>
>>64509007
3 is long as balls and still feels like they are rushing to tie everything together, meme-tastic, and has the worst dialog/acting.

Ep I basically shouldn't have been made. II and III should have been split up into three movies.
>>
5>4>6>3>7>2>1

prove me wrong

>Protip: You can't.
>>
>Watch Episode I in theaters
>people cheer at the opening
>completely silent until the end


>Watch TFA in the theater 16 years later
>people cheer at the opening
>they laugh at Poe Dameron's joke
>they laugh at all of Finn's jokes
>they cheer the falcon reveal
>they laugh at BB-8's thumbs up
>they cheer and laugh at C3PO's reveal
>they cheer when Rey gets the lightsaber at the end
>everyone leaves the theater excited and energetic

People comparing TPM reaction to the TFA reaction are too young to have been around for both. I'm not saying that TFA is a better movie because of this, i'm just saying that the people who argue "well people loved TPM back in the day too" are too young to be making that argument.
>>
>>64509483
autism
>>
>>64509518
compelling argument
>>
>>64509477
IV > VII > the rest

There are two good Star Wars movies
>>
>>64505303
ROTS wins simply because of
>HIGH GROUND
>>
>>64509483
>people laugh at comedy

What's your point? E1 had no comedy, just a retard and a shit child actor.
>>
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>>64509542
>not liking V

really nigga
>>
>>64509551
>E1 had no comedy
>this is bad
>>
>>64509551
generally you want your audience to enjoy watching your movie, unless you hate them or something
>>
>>64509551
Episode I had attempts at comedy that failed miserably. My point is that The Force Awakens is a much better received movie, both critically and by audiences. This doesn't automatically make it good, but the argument you often read here about TPM also being loved initially just isn't true.
>>
>>64509542
Shitty troll.
You used to be alright, but I guess all trips are attention whores in the end.
>>
>>64509597
>I never hated you, you always hated me
>>
>>64509579
It's pretty good, it's not great. I have issues with how it complicates the lore, and C3PO is Jar Jar Binks tier in it.
>>
>>64509542
TFA fans, everyone.
>>
>>64509651
see
>>64509613
pls stop embarrassing yourself
>>
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>>64509582
yoosa already forgettin meesa?
>>
>>64509208

> ok well Padme is Queen Amidala and when she became Padme she wasn't all that different. she went from monotone, boring queen to monotone, boring senator. Ewan McGregor tried his best to work with the material given to him. can't say the same for Hayden.

She was a queen and then a senator. She married Anakin and got pregnant with his children. She is an interesting character. I don't think she is just a boring senator.

> the problem with the wedding scene is their love story is unbelievable so their wedding has no emotional attachment.

They are both hot young adults I don't see what is so unbelievable.

> why are Anakin and Padme in love? why do they get married?

Anakin and Padme are both servants of the republic. Anakin is a jedi and she is a senator. They both meet again when Anakin is sent to protect her. Padme isn't just attracted to Anakin she feels safe around him. Relationships have been built on a lot less.
>>
>>64509685
oh shit I did
sorry Jar Jar

Maybe weesa... being friends?
>>
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Apologize, /tv/. Look into his eyes and say that you were wrong.
>>
>>64509613
I know in internet circles its fun to deify the original trilogy, but the notion that The Empire Strikes Back is some sort of masterpiece is a modern one, and one that started the horrible trend of "dark" being a substitute for fun. It's not a bad movie by any means, but it doesn't capture the energy of the original Star Wars, or the energy that The Force Awakens imitates and borrows from the original Star Wars.
>>
>>64509710
I'm sorry, George.
>>
ROTH for lore alone.

TFA is just a remake, adding almost nothing to the story. It has 30 seconds of meaning with Han Solo dying and the force dream. Episode 8 will be the true character and story test of this trilogy.

Shit Han didn't even teach MaRey Sue anything. He wanted to give her the job and se fucking said no. Obi Wan's loss to Luke in IV was far far far more meaningful.

Han's loss means the most to the fans, rather than the characters and that's why it doesn't work.
>>
>>64509724
Yoda ESB scenes>anything else in SW.

or are you part of the new 'Yoda is retarded' contingent?
>>
>>64509710
please come back george
im sorry
>>
>Lucas will die in your lifetime
>>
>>64509685
>He doesn't think racism is funny
>>
>>64509766
No?
He bought early access to Google's developing cellular regeneration and rejuvination chamber project.
lrn2deepweb
>>
>>64509710
Sorry George.

Save Star Wars
>>
>>64509799
I just never saw how this was rascist
>>
>>64509856
it's 2016
>>
>>64509612
>the argument you often read here about TPM also being loved initially just isn't true

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSaaa_OBkzw

Also read old imdb reviews of TPM
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120915/reviews?filter=chrono;filter=chrono;start=3560
It's got some bad reviews, but overall reaction is quite positive.
>>
One of the things I dislike about TFA is how it they basically wiped out the entire EU, while the prequels worked in many ways quite closely with established EU lore.

While lots of the EU is stupid shit, the "core EU" stuff is what has actually basically defined Star Wars as what it is, without the EU we wouldn't get a scene of Anakin being burnt like a kebab in Lava, without EU we wouldn't get much of the development of the Sith or basically much of the universe itself since the movies don't actually do that much worldbuilding themselves.

I get they needed to clear a lot of the EU to make their movies (TFA is in direct conflict with the incredibly popular Thrawn series) but lots of the EU world building was fantastic and things like KotoR are up there with the animated series in popularity which is strange since KotoR has been deemed non-canon despite not impacting on Disneyverse in any way.
>>
>>64509757
Yoda was amazing, but that's the only part of the movie that stood out to me. I know the Vader reveal is a big twist that people loved (i'm too young to have seen the film in theaters so it couldn't possibly impact me in that way), but I hate it for starting the coincidental bullshit of everyone being related. It makes the universe small, and turns the force into some deterministic thing relating to genes. I also dislike how they officially turn Obi-Wan into a ghost, rather than leaving his voice in A New Hope open for interpretation.
>>
>>64509872
Your point being?
>>
5>4>6>3 >7>2>1

I was the first person on this entire fucking planet to say Ep3 was better than Ep7.

I made posts about it and the none of thr sheep that saw it the first day would back me up.

Nice to know people are finally coming to their fucking senses.
>>
>>64509701
>She is an interesting character.
what is interesting about her? what interesting things does she do? i don't recall her accomplishing anything of note unless you count following Anakin around and getting knocked up.

>They are both hot young adults I don't see what is so unbelievable.
you obviously have never been in a relationship before. just because two people want to fuck doesn't mean they immediately want to get married and have kids. Padme was a senator, she clearly cared about her work in the senate. i could understand her wanting to have a fuckbuddy to relieve some stress from her job, but get married and have a kid? she turned into a fucking homemaker the second she realized she was pregnant with a guy who she barely knows except for the fact that he has a penchant for genocide and fascism.

>Anakin and Padme are both servants of the republic. Anakin is a jedi and she is a senator. They both meet again when Anakin is sent to protect her. Padme isn't just attracted to Anakin she feels safe around him. Relationships have been built on a lot less.
but Anakin openly admits to Padme he actively disagrees with her politics and supports Palpatine's dictatorship and the consequential demise of the senate, on which Padme has based her career.

while it is true that Anakin is tasked with protecting Padme, she doesn't seem all that happy about it. on two occasions Padme expresses being uncomfortable with Anakin's behavior on Coruscant. i would hardly say she feels safe around him. she never asked for him to be around, he was simply obligated to be there and she had no choice but to accept it.

when they go to Naboo suddenly she does a 180 and is constantly cockteasing Anakin. this was just inconsistent with her character and a byproduct of bad and lazy writing. there is no reason for her to suddenly love him.
>>
>>64509804
I thought he is hoping to replace his physical body with a fully CG likeness that would go back to old photos and videos of himself and update them.
>>
>>64509881
But the family stuff is what makes the saga good.
Even JJ is trying to steal that with not!Jacen.
>>
I guess I'll never really understand why people put TFA above any OT film. Yeah they had flaws, but this felt like a marvel version of Star Wars. It just doesn't feel like some grand part of a large story, but some flick to lead into other flicks. It's entertaining, but it has no staying power and I seriously think people are just loving it on hype for Star Wars alone
>>
>>64509873
This is why i'm talking about actual reactions rather than just stated ones. People did call TPM good initially, but my point is that the reaction in the cinema itself told a different story.
>>
>>64509893
Great taste, anon

Agree 100% with your ranking
>>
>>64509893
>i was the first person to have this trivial opinion
your trophy is in the mail
>>
>>64509993
>but my point is that the reaction in the cinema itself told a different story.
Same with TFA.
When I saw it, people loved the first half hour, but by the end the mood was extremely deflated.
NOBODY was hyped walking out.
>>
Reminder that KotoR and KotoR II are the best Star Wars stories and that Kreia is literally the best written character in the entire Star Wars universe.
>>
>>64509929
I'll concede that most people like it, I'm not big on it though. Kylo Ren being related to Vader is pretty interesting, given how ancestor worship is important to Nazis, and The First Order are just space Nazis, but the character would still be interesting without that element. He could worship Vader without also being his grandson.
>>
>>64509993
I was a kid but I do remember people hyping about in cinema
>>
>>64510045
This is all anecdotal, of course, but my theater was different. But even loving the first half hour is more than the immediate deflation after the opening crawl.
>>
>>64510068
I'm playing KOTOR for the first time since 2004 right now. It reminds me how much lower the standards are for videogame stories.
>>
>>64509893
actually i posted it earlier get fucked kid
>>
>>64510109
>But even loving the first half hour is more than the immediate deflation after the opening crawl.
I love this meme. The TFA crawl was way worse than the TPM crawl.
It was poorly worded, and went like 2x the speed of the other six crawls.
>>
>>64508899
nice one.
>>
>>64510045
oh ya well in my theater everyone walked out in the first 15 minutes and snuck in to Road Chip
>>
>>64505303
Hi 4chin.

There was a show when i was a kid. There were people who would enter a challenge room with the objective of completing a challenge and getting a diamond and escaping the room in time.

If they failed, they got locked in the room and the other players could exchange one of their diamonds to free them if they wanted to.

Each diamond counted towards more time in the final chamber where the players would gather their crystals, and enter a room with money and gather as much as they could until the time ended.


Anyone know the name of this?
>>
>>64506490
An opinion is subjective. It is both good and bad.
>>
>>64509895

Being a Jedi is like being an NFL quarterback, a fighter polot, a star footballer and an astronaut all rolled into one. Plus he's super good looking.

Your post is invalid on that alone because
he could literally have any chick in the galaxy he wanted at any time if they were single.
>>
>>64510151
I said after the opening crawl. But anyone who seriously believes that the wonderfully simple "Luke Skywalker has vanished." is worse than the stilted and awkward "While the congress of the Republic endlessly debates this alarming chain of events..." is someone I can't reconcile my views with.
>>
>>64510235
>It is both good and bad.
That's not what subjective means.
>>
>>64510243
>implying weird religious cultists with light-up swords were easily recognizable galactic superstars

ok
>>
>>64510221
Crystal Maze.
>>
>>64510281
Never fucking reply to me again unless you're contributing to the thread.
>>
>>64510252
>Luke Skywalker has vanished.
Luke in this flick was not the Luke of the OT.
>running and hiding
He is a proxy Ben/Yoda.
>>
>>64510317
nigger
>>
>>64510281
Aye, I know. I'm not good with my England.
>>
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>>64510137

KotOR is straight OT Star Wars storytelling. It plays it safe, keeps the light and dark side black and white, and delivers a satisfying but ultimately basic experience.

KotOR II: The Sith Lords is more EU tier. Basically, Star Wars written in a world that's not black an white and where EVERYONE you meet is an asshole. The narrative is layered and complex, as are the companions. The answers don't come easy, but when they come they feel earned, and the writing is solid across the board. You can also put all of your female companions in Slave Leia costumes and act like a dicklord. Your call. Shit's fucking tight either way.
>>
>>64510333
I read in an interview with the first screenwriter of the movie that it was impossible to have both Luke and Han in the new movie without it overshadowing the new characters. Having Luke turn into Obi-Wan was probably just an easy way give Finn and Rey room.
>>
>>64510068
pls keep your /v/ memes on /v/
>>
>>64510456
>Having Luke turn into Obi-Wan was probably just an easy
It was lazy character ruining garbage in service of a halfhazard ANH remake.
>>
>>64510333
I'm talking about the wording itself, not what it implies. And I see what you mean, but the decision to impose self-exile seems like something that comes from age and cynicism. It could be something that an old Luke does.
>>
>>64510281
tell that to kanjiklub
>>
>>64510500
How'd it ruin his character? He could have realized that he's too old to defeat Snoke, so he hid in order to wait for a strong force user who is able to defeat him to find him. Makes perfect sense.
>>
>>64509895
>what is interesting about her?

The main things are that she is a senator and that she marries Anakin.

>what interesting things does she do?

She is a servant of the republic. As a representative of the republic she went to Geonosis with Anakin to negotiate with the Confederacy to free Obi Wan. But she got captured and war broke out. Then she married Anakin and got pregnant with him. Then she told him of her pregnancy.

>she turned into a fucking homemaker the second she realized she was pregnant with a guy who she barely knows

She didn't just barely know Anakin by the time she got pregnant. There are years between ATOC and ROTS and in that time they got to know each other very well.

> but Anakin openly admits to Padme he actively disagrees with her politics and supports Palpatine's dictatorship and the consequential demise of the senate

They both agree about politics because they are agree about the need to protect the republic from the confederacy. They even were at Geonosis together. Anakin had a vague one off statement about someone wise ruling but that was never repeated. And no one ever said anything about abolishing of the senate, that didn't even happen until years after the empire was formed at which point Padme was long gone.

> i would hardly say she feels safe around him.

There is no evidence of this. She does feel safe around him.
>>
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>>64510608
>Geonosis
>Geo nosis
>Geo gnosis
>Greek. Literally "planet knowledge"
>mfw when the Deathstar was designed on a planet called Planet Knowledge.
>>
>>64510549
No, it is Luke being written like Yoda, when that id not who he is.
>>
>>64509483
>people cheering while watching a movie
Does this actually happen in America?
>>
>>64510549
>too old

literally the whole point of the force was that you could be old or small but still be powerful.

If anything, Luke close to death should be more likely to go on a suicidal confrontation, because he chooses not to abuse the force to keep himself alive.
>>
>>64510711
shieet
>>
>>64510752
>"I'm getting too old for this sort of thing" - Obi-Wan Kenobi

Age was a major part of both Yoda and Obi-Wan's decision to avoid confronting Vader directly, which is why they waited for Luke. Luke waiting for Rey seems like the sort of thing a Jedi would do.
>>
>>64510857
No, seems like the sort of thing Obi or Yoda would do. Luke is a bew kind of Jedi. Watch the OT.
>>
>>64510749
It happens everywhere. There are youtube reaction videos of people cheering in theaters in Brazil, Indonesia, and Ireland.
>>
>>64509483
do you think it may be a cultural diffrence between the time periods?
>>
>>64510935
He's just american.
>>
>>64510857

Not at all. Luke is the character who went to save his friends at Bespin in ESB. The Luke of the OT is nothing like the Luke of the Disney sequels where he ran off the be a hermit.
>>
>>64510887
Do you not think that age is a major factor in that change? Older people behave differently than when they were younger. The Obi-Wan in Episode II wouldn't do that, but an older Obi-Wan would. Same could be said of Luke. I mean, it's nearly 40 years later, we shouldn't expect characters to be the same.
>>
>>64510988
>The Obi-Wan in Episode II wouldn't do that
Yes he would.
ur dumb
see
>>64510987
>>
>>64510935
I saw Return of the Jedi in theaters when I was very, very young. I don't remember it, but there are plenty of stories of people cheering when Vader saved Luke at the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxBafn2t5v4

Recording from 1977 of people cheering during Star Wars
>>
>>64510987
>>64511022
I don't get you guys. The brave Obi-Wan who confronted Dooku and killed Maul choosing exile when he's older is somehow less believable than the similar Luke choosing to do the same for utilitarian reasons? Again, it wasn't fear, he's waiting for Rey to come so that he can train her.
>>
>>64511150
SW characters are more static than you seem to think.
>>
>>64511238
Which would be a criticism of the series if it were true.
>>
>>64511150

>The brave Obi-Wan who confronted Dooku and killed Maul choosing exile when he's older is somehow less believable than the similar Luke choosing to do the same for utilitarian reasons?

Watch the original trilogy. Yoda and Obi Wan both try to convince Luke to stay and complete his training. They are both the cautious type and the type of person which would run off and be a hermit. But Luke is not that kind of jedi. He goes to Bespin to save his friends. The Luke of empire strikes back would never run off well and be a hermit well his friends and family are at risk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZNLA7t-gIY
>>
>>64511266
It is true for Obi-Wan, bud.
In ROTS he chooses exile. He has not changed that much from AOTC.
Ergo, episode 2 Obi-Wan would have chosen exile.
>>
>>64511285
This.

Get fucked, jew fucker.
>>
>>64511285
Luke starts off reluctant in the opening of A New Hope, becomes rash in Empire (and pays the price for it), and is wiser and more in control in Jedi. There's an arc to his character. The notion that he remained the same in Jedi that he was in Empire isn't true, let alone over 30 years after Jedi. It would be absurd to have a 60 year old behave as impulsively as a 25 year old.
>>
>>64505303
TFA is a stinking pile of beer shit
RotS is a cute turd
>>
>>64511315
It makes far less sense in Episode III than in Episode VII for that very reason. This is a criticism of the prequels, not the sequels.
>>
>>64511340
How old are you? 21? 22? Now imagine you making a comment like this at 60. That's my point.
>>
>>64511458
I'm 60 though?
>>
>>64505497
>confusing memes with quality
Hello reddit
>>
>>64511483
>capitalization with no punctuation
phone poster pls
>>
>>64511388

Luke has friends and family he cares about. In empire strikes back he goes to Bespin to save the people he cares about. There is no precedent in his character for him to run off and do nothing well his friends are in danger. You can't simply explain this away by saying time has passed.
>>
>>64511612
bingo
>>
>>64511150

Luke is a different Jedi from Obi-Wan and Yoda. He doesn't reject his fear and anger the way they tell him to, but he doesn't let himself be consumed by it.
>>
How would the prequels change if Qui Gon wasn't killed by Darth Meme? Would Anakin be such an insufferable douche?

Would be cool to see Qui Gon duel Dooku
>>
>>64511388
>is wiser and more in control in Jedi.

>dresses in black
>threatens and Force chokes people
>pummels Vader into submission

Yeah sure.
>>
>>64511675
>Darth Meme
kek
I like Maul, but I give a top kuk 4 you.
>>
>>64505303

Revenge of the Sith.

I didn't think Force Awakens was terrible, but I didn't find it to be better than the Original Trilogy. It just seemed like a blatant rehash and reboot of it. Revenge of the Sith just has more going for it. It actually seemed like a movie instead of a product made by a bunch of board members and a committee. I dig the scenes between Anakin and Obi-Wan, I love the opening space battle, I think Palpatine is one of if not the best characters in the entire saga. I know people like to rip the acting and scenes in the prequels, but I thought the opera scene and that little quiet moment where Anakin is looking out the Jedi Temple and Padme is looking out the apartment window before Anakin makes his deal with the devil is quite brilliant.

Here are some things where I think Revenge of the Sith tops Force Awakens,

>Sith has a better John William's soundtrack
>better, more intimidating Trooper designs
>creature/character/planet designs are all top tier and original
>more emotional (the Jedi being betrayed and Obi-Wan fighting Anakin > Han Solo getting stabbed)
>better pacing
>better ending

I like that the climax in Sith is just Obi-Wan going to the lava planet to bring down Anakin and Yoda going to the Senate to bring down Sheev. It's not some macguffin bullshit like an even "BIGGER Death Star!!!". It's just a clash of ideals. Brother vs. brother, master vs. master. Then the resolution of what to do with Luke and Leia, starting the events that lead to the Original Trilogy.
'
>>
>>64511612
By going to Bespin and refusing to listen to Yoda he fucks everything up. A character flaw leading to a negative outcome. By the end he chooses to die rather than to be captured by Vader. In Jedi he actually allows himself to be captured multiple times, because he's smarter and understands the value of waiting for the right moment. The Luke in TFA is similar to the Luke in Jedi, only older. He's much smarter and understands the value of waiting for Rey in order to train her. A Luke who doesn't do this and instead allows himself to be killed for some impulsive need to save a few rather than wait to save the many wouldn't just go against his heroic nature, it would be a devolution of his character.
>>
>>64511668
>doesn't reject his fear and anger
The film literally ends with him rejecting his anger
>>
>>64511785
>>better, more intimidating Trooper designs
>>creature/character/planet designs are all top tier and original
>inb4 CGI Boga pic

CGI=/=creature design

Godd post by the way.
>>
>>64444444
>>
>>64509856

>Jar Jar is basically a nigger with downs
>he was played by a 7-foot tall nigger with a Jar Jar hat on his head while filming so the other actors would have a reference
>imagine Being Liam Neeson and trying to keep a straight face as George berates the Jarnigger for not beign dopey enough

>also Watto was a Jew

>the Nemoidians were cranky old Chinese men
>>
>>64511638
>characters shouldn't change at all
bingo indeed
>>
>>64511814
No?
He just rejects the dark side.
His anger won him the fight.

rejecting Sheev=/= no anger

He's still wearing black robes in the final shot. And yes, he had time to change clothes. He chose not to.
>>
Memes aside, ROTS is one of the best Star Wars films ever.

Kicking off with an opening space battle that utilises a roller coaster ride POV to spectacular effect, the film twists and turns us in it's stylishly comfortable grip, throwing us headlong into the already ensuring action. Meeting up with old friends Obi Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker (the love and respect between accomplished master and seasoned Jedi clearly apparent in these early sequences) as they cut a destructive swathe across the screen, cursing and teasing each other in equal measure as they take apart ships, scenery and even mechanical staff wielding bio-droids (magna guards) is a joy to behold (and it's noteworthy here to mention how utterly at ease both Ewan McGregor and Hayden Christensen now appear to be in their respective guises)...but the fun ultimately cannot last forever...Controlling the pace like the master story teller and film editor Lucas is, it's a restrained twenty minutes before the Jedi once again encounter Christopher Lee's elegantly vicious Count Dooku, but Anakin is no longer the fool hardy padawan he once was and it's from this point on that the first 'real' inevitable step towards the dark side is taken. Forsaking the cartoon-like cuddly tones of 'Menace' and even the pressure-cooker foreboding of 'Clones', 'Sith' stakes it's claim in this newly explored darker territory with glee; this is not, and was never designed to be, an episode for kids.


1/7
>>
>>64511785
The fact that someone can write this post with a straight face is really depressing
>>
As the story progresses and tragedy draws ever near, the film bludgeons Christensen's Anakin with heart rending blows at every turn. His learning of his secret wife Padme's pregnancy is cursed with sudden and traumatising visions of her death in childbirth, reawakening his feelings of regret and loss over the death of his mother (whom he is still convinced he could have saved) and in-turn, his feelings of resentment towards his 'family', the Jedi, who continue to praise his abilities yet refuse him the one thing he desires most in the world. With the enduring guidance and influence of the artificially benign Chancellor Palpatine (seemingly able to offer Anakin all the answers at a time when he is most in need), the young Jedi begins to doubt everything, even the fidelity of the very woman he is trying to save till finally, when the pitch of the movie appears to have reached it's dramatic peak, Anakin makes a choice that will ultimately lead him down an irrevocable path that will change the face of the galaxy...and set the stage for cinematic history.

2/7
>>
>>64511285

The only way I can see Luke running off is because of the godawful massacre of all of his students by one of his own.

He might have lost confidence in himself as a teacher and worried about doing more harm than good.

Not that I'm defending TFA imind you.
>>
`Revenge of the Sith' boasts not only some of the most audacious set pieces yet attempted in a blockbuster (Kenobi and Grievous' wheel bike/dragon mount chase, the continuation of The Clone Wars, Yoda and Sidious' epic senate duel, where politics and morality clash physically for the very first time) but some of the most intense and emotionally affecting. In essence; `Sith' is an action movie with heart. For sentimentality and effective storytelling using the minimum of trickery or techniques, look no further than the wonderfully sombre and underplayed moment of telepathic understanding that Anakin and Padme share across a Coruscant afternoon sun shrouded cityscape, or that Padme's final words are of concern for the man who has, in essence, murdered her emotionally and physically, or the look and tone of sadness Yoda exhibits as he is forced to flee his encounter with Sidious, or more importantly, the haunting shades of music and imagery that follows the execution of Order 66...

3/7
>>
>>64511913
His anger helps him defeat Vader, but he ultimately regrets it when he looks at his robotic hand and realizes that that anger is turning him into Vader. He then throws down his weapon and refuses to finish the fight. That's the entire point of that scene.
>>
>>64511935
The fact the you haven't killed yourself yet is really depressed.
>>
>>64511979

...but for both emotion and hyper charged dramatic electricity, the climatic Mustafar duel between Vader and Kenobi is unsurpassed. This is a duel that people have been waiting to see since 1977 and it does not disappoint. For the battle of heroes where 'brothers' clash with clear intentions that only one will survive, Lucas has married all tools at his disposal (a tragic yet epic sweeping score, a blink-and-you'll-miss-ten-moves lightsaber choreography, acting intensity that never fails to convince, CGI that threatens at every turn; VERY real danger, etc..) to create a sequence that both excites and moves in equal measure and despite the fact that we all know how the battle ends, it makes it no easier to watch the horrific events unfold.

4/7
>>
>>64511979
>Revenge of the Sith' boasts not only some of the most audacious set pieces yet attempted in a blockbuster (Kenobi and Grievous' wheel bike/dragon mount chase,
Literally worse than any scene in the phantom menace
>>
>>64511981
stop posting
>>
>>64512009

In stark contrast to maulings regarding the acting in the other two prequels, the performances in `Sith' are first rate. Ewan McGregor predictably shines in a role it seems he was destined to play (particularly in the final minutes of the Mustafar confrontation) and flickers of Alec Guinness punctuate throughout, never threatening to turn his performance into mere mimicry. Natalie Portman, (however little she was required to do), breaks our hearts as the man she loves literally rots from the inside before her very eyes. Ian McDiarmid turns in an oscar worthy performance, hamming it up where necessary to break stride suddenly with a glare and a disembowelling tone when the mood takes him, but above all (and despite protests to the contrary), it is Hayden Christensen for whom the highest regard must be reserved. His performance permeates one of utter believability, shifting remarkably from eager Jedi knight to chilling Sith apprentice so smoothly that it's startling to witness. The ferocity and utter neutrality that Christensen exhibits as the young Darth Vader is truly impressive if not downright mesmerising, yet the best is saved for last in the final confrontation that husband and wife share prior to the fiery duel into the very bowels of hell. Hayden's demeanour of a man who believes above all else that he has done the right thing yet utterly blind to the fact he has caused more damage than good is staggering, his tone (in a wonderful symmetry with 'Menace`) echoing the youthful idealistic young boy he was once, reminding us yet again how far the soul has fallen. It's a moment (like so many others) that entrenches itself so deeply into the mind that you will be hard pressed to rid yourself of certain emotions long after `Sith's' credits have rolled.

5/7
>>
>>64511994
The fact that you can't even write a basic sentence says a lot.
>>
>>64512015
That's a high standard tho.
>>
>>64512033

Expectedly, `Revenge of the Sith' will delight as many as it will disappoint, but as far as taking us on a new and unexpected journey a long time ago through a galaxy far away in spectacular fashion (never allowing indulgence or flights of mere fancy to intrude upon the story), `Sith' is a worthy contender for the greatest Star Wars film of all time.

In closing, I have already watched `Sith' more times than I have seen the original trilogy and the film leaves me with a different impression every time. The birth of Darth Vader is something everyone has been dreaming about since the release of the classic `A New Hope,' thank god George Lucas has managed to create a movie that will live on just as long.

6/7

Well, I guess I miscounted how many segments I had. Anyway, if anyone still believes TPM can unironically get near ROTS there're a fucking autism-loaded moron.
>>
>>64512037
What do you maen, jackass?
>>
>>64511931
>>64511960
>>64511979
>>64512009
>>64512033
>>64512061

Can anyone provide a rebut, or do I /thread?
>>
>>64512032
Nice rebuttal. By the way, this isn't even my interpretation, this is literally what Lucas says.
>>
>>64511786

> The Luke in TFA is similar to the Luke in Jedi, only older.

Not at all. Luke's character motivations in return of the jedi are to save his friends and family exactly as they were in empire strikes back. He goes to save Han Solo because he is his friend. He doesn't go to Vader to kill him but rather to save him because he cares about him since he is is his father. The Luke of TFA is nothing like the Luke of the original trilogy.

> A Luke who doesn't do this and instead allows himself to be killed for some impulsive need to save a few rather than wait to save the many wouldn't just go against his heroic nature, it would be a devolution of his character.

You don't understand his character, like at all. He is absolutely the type of person who will go to save a few of the people he cares about like his friends and family even at risk to himself. This is why he leaves Bespin in ESB and why he goes to save his father in ROTJ. The heroic nature of his character is defined by his relationship to his friends and family this is completely abandoned in TFA.
>>
>>64512015
Idiot.
>>
>>64512093
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABcXyZn9xjg
>>
https://vimeo.com/150297066

you are all welcome
>>
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>>64511935

What's wrong with what they posted? Revenge of the Sith wasn't hated on when it first came out and it got a great, positive, critical response. I'd bet anything that most of the people that hate Sith on here and the internet loved it at one point. There's a lot to like about ROTS. It's not my favorite, but the good outweighs the bad.

It's got some crappy, awkward moments in it, but so do all the Star Wars movies. As far as this thread goes, Force Awakens DEFINITELY does.
>>
>>64512138
So he wins.
>>
>>64512138

Can you try any harder than Redditlettermedia?
>>
I think because I know and love the characters, ROTS. I really like ROTS desu, the plot alone wins it for me. TFA is just ehh
>>
>>64512118
>Luke's character motivations in return of the jedi are to save his friends and family
Which is his exact motivation in TFA. The only difference is that the methods of achieving that are different. He understands that attempting to defeat Snoke and Kylo Ren on his own is a fool's errand. The only thing he'll achieve is dying, and Rey would be left on her own unable to receive any sort of training.

>You don't understand his character, like at all.
As opposed to you, who's unable to understand the very basic concept of a charter arc? The Luke in Jedi who leaves in order to "save" Vader isn't the Luke in Empire who leaves in order to presumably defeat him. The Luke in Empire who refuses to listen to Yoda isn't the same Luke in Jedi that follows the advice of the dying Yoda. The notion that he's rash in Empire and more in-control in Jedi is articulated in the opening scene at Jabba's Palace in particular.
>>
>>64512177
People in the theater were literally laughing at the ending. ROTS only got good reviews for how bearable it was in comparison to the previous two.
>>
>>64512480
>People in the theater were literally laughing at the ending
I don't believe you.
>>
>>64512093
It's just a review. There are plenty of positive reviews for TFA online, and plenty of negative ones for ROTS. You can't rebut opinions.
>>
>>64512505
I sware to fucking God that people laughed at Vader's "Noooooooo!" Not just me, there are stories about it online. It became a meme for a reason
>>
>>64512538
You might be telling the truth, but I don't believe you.
>>
>>64512619
It was meme on YTMND before I even saw the movie. I remember actually feeling bad when people laughed because 14 year old me thought that the movie wasn't that bad up to that point.
>>
>>64512434

> Which is his exact motivation in TFA.

No its not. He does nothing well Han Solo dies or well his own sister is in danger of being killed in moments by the Starkiller Base. That is him abandoning his friends and family which is something he would NEVER have done in the original trilogy.

> He understands that attempting to defeat Snoke and Kylo Ren on his own is a fool's errand.

This doesn't make any sense whatsoever. He would NOT be alone at all. He would have the entire New Republic and the resistance at his side. He would have Leia is even mentioned to be just as force capable as him in ROTJ. The Luke in ROTJ would have trained her afterwards but again this Luke is not based upon the original trilogy.

> As opposed to you, who's unable to understand the very basic concept of a charter arc?

Abandoning Luke's entire characterization and shoving him into the role of a hermit like Obi Wan is NOT a character arc.

> The Luke in Jedi who leaves in order to "save" Vader isn't the Luke in Empire who leaves in order to presumably defeat him.

Only because he learned Vader was his father. His knowledge changed but his motivations did not.

> The Luke in Empire who refuses to listen to Yoda isn't the same Luke in Jedi that follows the advice of the dying Yoda.

His motivations are the same even if he is more trained. His motivations are still to protect his friends and family.

> The notion that he's rash in Empire and more in-control in Jedi is articulated in the opening scene at Jabba's Palace in particular.

Not at all. The plan at Jabba's palace didn't work and he got himself captured. Are we watching the same movies?
>>
>>64512480

Don't remember this at my showings.
>>
>>64512672
Okay I believe you.
;_; I really ROTS all the way through to the ending binaru sunsut tho.
>>
>>64508957

>speaks volumes

What does this shot tell you about the characters or the story? Nothing. It just gives some background: there was a battle in this planet.

JJ just put this shot here because he thought it looked cool. Also, probably Disney told him to put it, as there's a new canon novel that tells a story about why that star destroyer is there.

I'm not saying the shot is bad. The only scenes I actually enjoyed about the film were the ones in Jakku. But it's not a masterpiece shot, nor better than any random shot in the prequels just because it has instagram filters.

Btw, about that novel: it's a 'young adult novel' telling the story about a male rebel and a female imperial, both in love since childhood, that face each other in the battle of Jakku. The imperial one actually commands this star destroyer and decides to crash it in the surface when the rebel boards the ship or something like that. Bravo Disney.
>>
>>64512677
I fucking hate getting into these point-by-point internet arguments, All they do is eat hours out of my day and accomplish nothing. I can talk about how much the character changed and how age compounds that change even more. I can talk about how there are different forms of heroism, and that letting your friends die in order to save the galaxy is actually noble, but your rebuttal will amount to little more than "nuh uh." I'll waste my time to avoid you saying that I dodged your points, but I fucking hate this.

>He does nothing well Han Solo dies or well his own sister is in danger of being killed in moments by the Starkiller Base.
If he's incapable of defeating Kylo and Snoke, what's the point? Rash self-sacrifice for no end is something a 25 year old Jedi would do, not something a 65 year old man with a mission would do.

> He would NOT be alone at all. He would have the entire New Republic and the resistance at his side.
Resistance + New Republic + Leia wasn't enough up to that point. Why would adding an elderly Luke suddenly help them win the day?

>Abandoning Luke's entire characterization and shoving him into the role of a hermit like Obi Wan is NOT a character arc.
40 years. 40 years. 40 years.

>Only because he learned Vader was his father. His knowledge changed but his motivations did not.
If Luke were someone whose entire motivation to save someone was what that person meant to him personally, he'd be a selfish prick, not a hero. He tries to save Vader because he felt the good in him, and he was on a mission to bring balance to the force.

>His motivations are still to protect his friends and family.
Not in fucking Jedi. The entire point is that he HAS to confront Vader in order to bring balance to the force. He's a man on a mission, and that mission is more important than Han and Leia being stuck on the forest moon of Endor (whom he leaves).
>>
>>64512990
Actually it articulates the passage of time since the OT, establishes the environment of Jakku, and tells you what Rey does for a living. That shot says a lot. Far from "cool and random."
>>
>>64513040
>regurgitates debunked opinions
>doesn't address the getting captured at Jabba's point
You lose, Kenobi!
>>
>>64513150
>>doesn't address the getting captured at Jabba's point
Doesn't he say something along the lines of "don't worry" and winks at Han when he's being taken?

>debunked opinions
It's literally all opinions. There's no "fact" regarding your subjective view of Luke's character.
>>
>>64513197
>stands on a trapdoor
>acts surprised when it falls
>>
Looks like Revenge of the Sith won this one
>>
>>64513040

You can talk about different kinds of heroism if you want to the point is those types of heroism do not apply to Luke. Luke is meant to be a certain type of character, and that should remain consistent with the original trilogy. I keep pointing this out and you keep saying "nuh uh" and "40 years" you dismiss the complete change of his character based upon age alone.

You also seem to dismiss this by claiming that an elderly Luke wouldn't be able help but that doesn't follow from what we know. Older jedi are still shown to be powerful despite Obi Wan's one statement about getting old. All indications are Luke even in his age would be a great asset if he was still around rather then a hermit.

I won't dwell on the notion that he supposedly isn't enough to defeat Kylo when he was already beaten by Rey who picked up a lightsaber for the first time. The point I keep coming back to is that his character should've have been someone who would not abandon his friends and family under any circumstances. He faced considerable odds before and he didn't run.

Your attempt to claim that Luke is a selfish prick falls on its face because part of his characterization is that he is able to risk himself for those close to him. Risking himself for others is not what the word selfish means. You also seem to be changing the topic to bringing the balance to the force which isn't even mentioned ONCE in ROTJ. But it is mentioned that Luke went to save his father. His motivation was to save his father. He wanted to protect his friends and family like in empire strikes back. It would have been nice to see that him again, its too bad.
>>
>>64513322
The poll doesn't mean anything. Once people defending TFA start posting TFA starts to receive more votes. People just vote for whatever people around them are telling them to vote for. Sith was like at 58% before Jeff Mangum came to the thread.
>>
>>64513120

>articulates the passage of time since the OT

No. It just says imperials and rebels battled there. It doesn't say what happened to the imperials and the rebels in the end. Just like the entire movie, remember that JJ isn't able to explain at all (or just doesn't care) why is there a Resistance, why the First Order, why the New Republic doesn't fight, and a lot of other whys that were poorly explained in the end in the novelization or other places we got to know about because of the internet.

Any person that went to the cinema to see the movie didn't get any answers to any of these whys. That doesn't say any good about the director. No, he doesn't >speak volumes with his shots, nor with his dialogues.

>establishes the environment of Jakku

Just like any other Jakku shot.

>tells you what Rey does for a living

No, it doesn't. Previous shots did, where she was actually scavenging.

Here you just see her driving.
Again, I'm not saying the shot is bad. But please stop making things to be way more than what they are. This is just a cool shot. It doesn't tell anything of relevance.
>>
>>64513426

u dumb man

Do you really believe people read the thread before voting?
Do you really believe people vote based on what other anons posted?
Do you really believe outside of /tv/ everybody prefers TFA over RotS?

I mean, of all the sites I've visited and all the people I've talked with, /tv/ is where I've seen the most TFA lovers.
>>
>>64513463
>No. It just says imperials and rebels battled there. It doesn't say what happened to the imperials and the rebels in the end.
Seeing junked versions of older ships after we already saw their newer counterparts in the opening scene actually perfectly articulates the passage of time. A dilapidated Star destroyer is more than just the remnants of a battle.

>remember that JJ isn't able to explain at all (or just doesn't care) why is there a Resistance, why the First Order, why the New Republic doesn't fight,
He doesn't say it through exposition, which seems to be the only storytelling you're able to understand given your analysis of that shot.

>Just like any other Jakku shot.
Jakku is a fucking junkyard. How does a shot of sand say that better than a shot of a junked ship?

>No, it doesn't. Previous shots did, where she was actually scavenging.
It's part of the same scene. That shot of the Star Destroyer is the completion of that sequence of shots of her scavenging. In fact, it becomes more clear what she's doing once you see that shot.
>>
>>64505897
pretty much this
>>
>>64513376
I'll break this down point by point.

>It's been 40 years since Return of the Jedi.
>Yoda in Empire is different than the Yoda we saw in Episode III
>Obi-Wan in Star Wars is different from the Obi-Wan we saw in Episode II
>the notion that Luke wouldn't change in that time and behave exactly like he did when he was 27 is fucking stupid
>A New Hope and Empire establish previously powerful Jedi Yoda and Obi-Wan as weaker in their old age
>Luke knows who Rey is and understands that she needs training in order to defeat Snoke
>Luke has a plan for how to defeat him, hence him leaving the map behind
>Luke, being wiser, understands how much more heroic saving the galaxy is than saving Han Solo
>>
>>64513547
Reddit and youtube reviews love the film? Where is all of the negative criticism outside of /tv/?
Thread replies: 339
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