/cofd/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Chronicles of Fagness

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Since I managed to post RIGHT AS THE THREAD ARCHIVED last time... Here's another attempt at my possibly-ill-advised Homebrew VtR Mystery!

I took people's advice and went back to the drawing board with it, narrowing its focus and adjusting its power level (and making it a bit more obviously "we stole half of this shit from Sin-Eaters").

Thoughts/Comments/Critiques? I'm still having trouble judging what can be considered "balanced" for Coils, given that we only have a few official ones to compare to (and two of those aren't even final yet). Also, any suggestions for cooler names for Coils and Scales would be awesome, as names are never my strong suit...

>>45365750
Some notes:
-I'd like to add an Auspex-style mechanic to the first Coil that allows the Dragon to ask a question about a Ghost/Anchor/Etc once per session/chapter - good idea? How often should they be able to use it?

-Yes, the 4th Coil is just a Sin-eater's Boneyard Manifestation. The temporary Influence mechanic is supposed to somewhat replicate (some of) the different Keys; if someone has any suggestions of how better to handle that (or even just better terms for the Influences to give) I'd love to hear them.

>>45365750
Love the final coil, but one issue with the honorary rank. Seems too easy to hit rank 5. Make it half the total of scales and coils.

>>45365581
All of my players keep to the high road. A keep over from mostly exalted (dnd) player. The ones most willing to kill are the sin eater and a werewolf both of which have a very different kind of mortality from humans.

>>45365811
Well thats still only 20 exp spent, compared to the werewolfs 57 or so exp spent to get that same rank.

Why are Sabbat fans so fucktarded?

"Dude, why don't you play sabbat? Don't you know, the thing is, right, the Sabbat are RIGHT and the camarilla is WRONG!"

"Dude it's fine if you don't like it but you really don't have to go so far as to -hate- on the game, it's a really good game."

It's low-brow, juvenile goth kid wank fantasy and the "muh anti dee loonians" is one big excuse for it.

>>45365802
Tske a look at the Essentiaphagia discipline from the Ordo Dracul book. Its all about how they interact with ghost including the abilitu to eating one to gain all of its numina and abilities except a select few.

>>45365581
No character I've ever played has dropped below Morality 5.
I've had a few breaking points where I've accidentally been a party to murder (with good reason), but really the worst level of sin that my characters have become accustomed to is Grand Larceny where I stole about $5 million in Gold ingots.

Not to spend of course, but to cripple a bad guy's finances.

>>45365802
Add the Auspex thing as a Scale, and let it be once a ghost per scene.

I feel like Influence: Anchors isn't that great an idea. It's too "strong" and doesn't fit with altering the nature of the Dragon herself.

The third one shouldn't be Reflexive or help Dodging.

Maybe make the additional abilities (crossing Rivers, opening Gates) be a Scale. Have the Dragon bathe in vitae and one draught of the River to be able to cross that River for a number of days equal to their Blood Potency. They can only cross a number of Rivers equal to their Blood Potency.

I don't actually think the Boneyard thing works well. It's not very thematic, and it's kindof too much of a new power as opposed to changing the Dragon's natural state of being.

That last one is really great, though. I do think you should make it based on the Werewolf chart and use all coils, though. And don't give them any new Numina.

>>45366602
I moslty agree with him.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/824045-hurt-locker-equipment-appendix?p=828437#post828437

Change of the "Loaded for Bear" merit in Hurt Locker by a poster was good enough to get included in the final work (mind, I think that poster is a freelancer for at least one other book, ctl2)

The Condition/Merit:

>So, here's what I think will be an easier way to track this. New Condition - Armed to the Teeth Your character is carrying extra ammunition for her weapon. Pick a specific ranged or thrown weapon when you acquire this Condition. By spending an Instant action and shedding this Condition, you can restore a weapon of that type that has run out of ammunition to full capacity. Shedding the Condition in this way does not grant a Beat. A character can have multiple instances of this Condition, each associated with a different weapon. >Possible Sources: A character can acquire this Condition with a purchase at Availability one less than the Availability of the weapon it is associated with (minimum 1). At Storyteller discretion, a character may be able to get it by other means, such as robbing a sporting goods store or scavenging ammo off of someone equipped with the same type of weapon, Resolution: Have your ammunition confiscated or stolen. Beat: n/a Loaded for Bear allows you to reload a weapon without expending Armed to the Teeth a number of times per scene equal to your dots in the Merit.

>>45365962
>>45365750
Here is a link to the Ordo Dracul pdf the discipline in question is on starts on page 180.

>>45365811
>>45365905
>>45366602
Yea, I'm still not sure how best to handle honorary rank... I know that having it directly tied to Coils is a bit fast, but I feel like the pace from Werewolf is a bit slow? Since it does a lot more for a Werewolf than for a Vampire, I don't think it should require as much of a buy-in. But I guess I'll make it (Coils+Scales)/2 or something similar.

>I don't actually think the Boneyard thing works well. It's not very thematic, and it's kindof too much of a new power as opposed to changing the Dragon's natural state of being.

I had originally considered just giving them Influence dots, but I thought that would be too powerful. I suppose I could just make it some kind of "temporarily gain Influence dots" effect. I could make the Boneyard effect a Scale, come to think of it....

>>45367219
I don't think Boneyard or Influence works. Don't Ghosts not even have Influence?

Also, if you're a Dragon, chances are you're going to go into the other Coils. It's okay to base it off of all the Coils. Although maybe just put a cap on it. Half of your BP.

Hell, just saying "you become a Rank 4 Ghost, your Disciplines are now Numina" is probably fine.

>>45367219
You can have this Rank system have a greater effect on the vampires abilities. Such as have them only be able to effect Ghost equal to or less then their Rank.

>>45367375
Ghost actual have influence in 2E but their first influence has to be their anchor.

>>45367429
Or give them Honourary Rank while alive. In that case it would definitely be good to have it be related to the total number of Coils, the way that Werewolf rank is determined by the total number of Renown.

>>45367375
Ghosts have Influences in 2e - weaker ones only have Influence: Their Anchors, but more powerful ones can gain others related to their means of death, where they haunt, etc.

Really I just wanted there to be a Coil that gave something similar to a Sin-Eater Manifestation, and I figured having Influences similar to Sin-Eater Keys would be a good way to do it.

>>45367552
I ment honorary Rank not real Rank, but my point still stands.

>>45367568
But that takes away from another splat. Chronicles of Darkness try to make splats not steep on the toes of other splats. So taking one of the main abilities from and fold it into one 3 exp cost is kinda short changing Sin-Eaters.

>>45367568
Honestly, the sin-eater manifestations are dumb.

>>45365746
Like Clockwork

>>45365581
Who's this pretty punk poltergeist princess???

>>45365581
I've mentioned before the story of how my Werewolf group's first session ended with us entering the secret top floor of a night club, which was filled with rich fancy types, and our Ithaeur going Gauru because she saw her Abuser in the room(and ended up eating him).
I also went Dalu/soft rage because of her howl(personal triggers are a bitch), and ended up tackling and killing an old lady who was in the room.

We burned the place down to cover our tracks.

>>45367696
>Who's this pretty punk poltergeist princess???
>google reverse image search is hard
http://mika-blackfield.deviantart.com/art/Molly-The-Dresden-Files-575902925

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>>45367765
>>45367696
This time I also kept the artist in the filename.

It's Molly Carpenter, of the Dresden Files (which is also in the filename).

>>45367765
Isn't super easy reverse Image search just a Chrome feature?

>>45367765
>>45367842
Maybe anon just really wanted to say that alliteration.

>>45367842
>Isn't super easy reverse Image search just a Chrome feature?
True, I guess
>>45367904
Probably

>>45365750
You could use the rules for Ash that Devours for the coil or a scale for it.
Its on page 67 of the blood sorcery book.

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>>45367765
>>45367842
>Isn't super easy reverse Image search just a Chrome feature?

click the arrow next to post, click image search.

not chrome only. sooo hard.

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>>45368885
I counter your meme.

>>45368885
Again, I'm using Chrome, so it's a lot easier for me
http://i.imgur.com/nlEFYaT.png

I don't think most people have ever even noticed that feature. It's not like there's a 4chan user manual. What the fuck is iqdb?

Dubs decides my character concept for a Cam game I'm playing in. The only stipulation is that it must be one of the 7 mainstream Cam clans.

>>45369092

Toreador who wants to revive glam rock.

>>45366792
>Change of the "Loaded for Bear" merit in Hurt Locker by a poster was good enough to get included in the final work (mind, I think that poster is a freelancer for at least one other book, ctl2)

No, that poster isn't a freelancer for me.

But that may change.

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>>45369292
Did someone just got a job offer?

>>45365581
Sweet! Acually good-looking Dresden Files fanart.
Way too rare.
Just need more tats and piercings to be realistic.

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>>45369292
Man, apparently I need to post more critiques of the spoilers.

>>45369724
>Acually good-looking Dresden Files fanart.
It can happen. This is the same artist, though.

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>>45369724
Found more

>>45369843
Yeah. Dug through his gallery. Good stuff there.
Need more greek gods of cologne.

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>>45369978
Her, actually.
https://plus.google.com/+FredHicks/posts/atcqQ4ftCZi

>>45369292
Say David you got any more spoilers for Secrets of the Covenant?

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>>45370009
Ah. Used to Mika being a male name.

Have some McGrath art.

>>45369557

No. But I did talk to said person about doing a submission. Not because of that, per se, but because I feel that person really gets my vision of some game concepts like those in Changeling on a very fundamental level, and I want to see if they can express them in a cool, readable, interesting way with new ideas as well as well-interpreted old ideas.

So, I hope that turns out.

>>45370032

Alas, no.

I'm not even sure what's up with it. I really want to see it. I have to be mindful of teasers and stuff of things I'm not directly developing.

I'm particularly excited for my Carthians chapter. I had a ton of fun writing it. I'm really eager to see how they laid it out, since I went with a pretty nonstandard format. I want to see what people think of the cities/stories involved.

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So, WoDg.
What kind of creature would this be?

>>45370226
A horror?

>>45370226

A cute one

>>45370274
Nah. An Angel. Analyst.

>>45370199
I'm very glad about the submission, charlaquin has some great ideas on the forums.
A bit sad about no spoilers but I would hate for you to get in trouble for it. I love the work you are doing with changeling.

>>45370226
Monster created by the Seers to watch mages without magical means.

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>>45370226
Prometheans shouldn't be this sexy.

>>45370226
Grigori.

>>45370366
That face is far from sexy.

reminder that mage 2e will literally never come out and you're dumb if you think it will

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>>45370063
I really like the Nebizal art from the comics. Even if War Cry did kind of have a dumb story.

>>45370437
Totally dumb story.
All comics save Welcome to the Jungle have been disappointments. But yeah, the art (especially the cover art) is good.

Welcome to the Jungle was, incidentally, the only one Butcher solo-wrote.

>>45370429
One day your words will be proven wrong.... one day maybe.

>>45370489
If i come into the thread and post that and get hit with mage coming out, I'd cry tears of happiness. I don't shitpost because I hate Mage, anon. I shitpost because... I must.

>>45370526
You shitpost because you're a shitposter.

>>45370463
War Cry wasn't too bad, until Dresden unleashed a horrible murder monster with no real backup plan and let it kill a ton of White Court minions.

>>45370597
>War Cry wasn't too bad, until Dresden unleashed a horrible murder monster with no real backup plan and let it kill a ton of White Court minions.

Too Deus ex Machina-heavy for my tastes.

>>45370274
Brief nightmare stats
Perception: 5
Brawl: Chance
Everything else: 2
Dread powers: Eye Spy, Madness and Terror, Jump Scare
Not especially unique, used as spies.

>>45370597

Have you considered that they're an Immortal and their shitposting keeps them living eternally? It's like a Guardian, but with shitposts.

>>45370199

DavidH, how do you feel about prople saying "CtL 2e isn't about abuse, it's about trauma."

Because people keep parroting it on the forums and I don't want it to be true.

>>45370838
Eh. Why don't you want that?

>>45370838
shut the fuck up atamajakki

>>45370838
If the story is centered on how you were abused, then how can it grow?
While trauma is more broad in what could have happen to you, and the story can center on moving on.

>>45370838
Abuse is legitimately just a form of trauma. Shut up and let the game be playable by other people, atamajakki

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WRAITH 20 WHEN

WHEN
H
E
N

>>45371151

no

>>45371205

Next year, with luck

>>45371205
Right. I consistently forget that these threads are about oWoD as well.

>>45371338

We should have killed the old worlders a long time ago

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>>45371335
>next year

>>45371362
Hey there are some good things from Owod. Such as Demon the Fallen

>>45371205
>>45371335
>>45371366

As someone who hasn't got stakes in this... What is the hold-up?

>>45371387
>>45371362
>>45371338
The samefaggery is strong with you, child.

Enjoy Mary Sue: the Sue-ening and Chronicles of Narnia.

>>45371396
Something about a Cabin in the Woods, and Elder Gods I think.

>>45371407

I'm wanna be Edmund and be sexually molested by the White Witch

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>>45371407
Nope. It ain't.

>>45371396
I've been told that it's being held up right now by them trying to get the art situation settled, among other assorted "we wanna write more 2nd ed NWoD" problems.

really I don't know anything personally besides the fact that we don't have any goddamn Wr20

>>45371412
Seriously. What is the hold-up?
Did it need serious revision, or something?

>>45371455
The post above has a better clue then I do. But the thing about the cabin might be true.

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>>45370838
Atamajakki, just stop talking. Just... Stop.
>>45371338
I forget as well.
>Something something, split the threads.
>>45371396
Dat Tom Clancy money, that's what.
>>45371424
The oWoD fans like to pretend that they're not the minority here. Sad, really.

>>45371504

The developer of Wraith20th is Richard Dansky, a well known horror writer and perhaps currently best known as the head writer for Ubisoft's Tom Clancy games. All of them. Including the upcoming ones.

So, he recently took a writer retreat in the woods with a haunted book and finish pretty much all of his portions. And then his mom died. So the dude's dealing with a high workload and grief, but progress is happening.

>>45371559
well I guess I've got to inform my not-reputable-at-fucking-all source how wrong he is

which is a shame but i guess the silver lining is we have time to find a 3rd and 4th for the actual game

>>45371559
Wait he really went daekness raising on us? Cool.
>>45371554
Can't say I like Owod just a few things from it, mostly Demon the Fallen.

>>45371554
>implying i'm some kind of faggot purist

Requiem, Promethean, Lost and Geist are good. Fuck the 2nd ed shit.

Mage is always garbage.

Fallen is shit, Dreaming is shit, Forsaken is shit. Apocalypse and Wraith best tier.

>>45371655
Your priorities, your ideals...
There all shit.

>>45371688
Opinions as well. Don't forget their opinions.

>>45371710
Well yay. But I like wraith and Orpheus as well.

>>45371688
I bet you own all the 2nd ed books too

>>45371753
Yup, both of the books i own ate demon books. I'm the guy who first leeked Demon storyteller Guide.

>>45371794
Are demon books.

>>45365750
Hay are you still on the thread?

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>>45371655
Atamajakki, consider suicide. It's your only option now. It's far too late for you to change.

>playing oWoD unironically

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>>45372300
literally who

>>45372525
>being a le chronicles of le darkness purist baby

>>45372300

That wasn't me. I hate Geist and Apocalypse and have grown to like Awakening. I've also always liked 2e.

I'm not everyone you dislike, anon.

>>45372573
Well we thought it was you sense you posted similar things about changling 2E. Guess we were wrong.

>>45372573
Oh shit. I thought he was you since he replied to a comment about your taste. Apparently he has even worse taste than you. He might have the worst taste in any of the threads. I mean, LIKING Apocalypse?

>>45372607

I got into a big spat with DavidH in one of these very threads and he pointed out to me that all my beef with CtL 2e stemmed from a shitty freelancer on the forums, not the actual text.

Do I need a trip to make this clearer for people? I don't want one, but all the mistaken identity in these threads gets a little heinous.

Or should I just always mention Mummy in my posts, so you know it's me.

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>>45372569
Congratulations. You have the worst taste in the thread. On the internet. On the planet. Please namefag so that we can filter your shit taste.

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>>45365581
Suddenly I want to play a Geist character consisting of a punk chick who got trampled to death in a crowd with her Geist having the appearance of endless ephemeral skeletons

>>45372769
Not saying it your fault. The guy did not correct use about this. And do talk about Mummy in every post, mummies are cool.

>>45372804

I'm not them, but I'm excited for the Mummy Dark Eras. I really liked Ruins of Empire and the new Merits it added.

>>45372791

If I ever play Geist again, my character's a drowning victim whose geist is The Lost Cosmonaut, a critter that represents peace with the void. Just a mute space suit with the stars inside.

>>45372923

I cannot wait for the Mage/Mummy crossover setting, because holy fuck yes I gooe we get a dedicated Legacy.

As for Ruins of Empire, the backer who got the expansion for it said he requested:

>add in the Deceived
>add in Shuankhsen and demons of Duat
>expand the section on WW1
>double the size of the crossover sidebar

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>>45372929
I can get behind that. Geists as better Stands/Personae always struck a good chord with me.

>>45372968

Fuck yes to all of that! I'm going to have to try to fit in a Ruins of Empire arc in my Mummy game now. I mean I was already considering it with the preview version but with those additions it's pretty much a must at this point.

>>45372791
>Image.
That's not Chernobog, THIS is Chernobog.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLCuL-K39eQ

>>45365581
At the risk of upsetting those of a more serious disposition, does anyone have the .pdf of the Magical Girl fanslat for Hunter the Vigil?

>>45371655
how could a human prefer apocalypse over forsaken

>>45371655
>>45372300
How can that be amatajakki? He doesn't tell you how great Mummy is or how worried he is about Changeling. Also amatajakki loves Fallen and is worried Dracula will change it.

>>45372787
>>45372675
>>45374954
Good lord, let the person like what they like. I know plenty of people who like Apocalypse. I think it's super dumb and any cool the setting has is ruined by three dumb things. But some people are into that whole "HEAVY METAL WOO" bullshit.
>how could a human prefer apocalypse over forsaken
Well to be fair until like April Forsaken was garbage.

>>45374482
http://vindae.tumblr.com/post/123476195745/magicalgirls
Sample character
http://vindae.tumblr.com/post/123718907575/maggie-hamilton

I may actually playtest this soon.

>>45374954
I can actually see why. Apocalypse is all about a mighty warrior culture, which is pretty damn cool, to be honest.

Also, Forsaken 1e sucked.

>>45374964

>telling people how great Mummy is makes you amatajakki

Shit, now I'm fearing people might have thought I was amatajakki when I did that long ass thing about how I'd rework Mummy.

Gdammnit.
In our current CofD game, we have a bit of an XP disparity between some of the players. (One has vastly more XP than the rest.)
The obvious solution would be group beats. But the excessive player says that'd be unfair. The reasoning is that the rest would just coast on his RP-ing and more active use of Conditions and suchlike.

How do I convince him that Group Beats is a better and fairer idea, without sounding like Lenin?

>>45375156
If he legitimately earns more Beats than there is little you can do without sounding like Lenin.

The only argument you can make is that Group Beats encourages people to work together to earn Beats which might come out with more net Beats total for him.

>>45375156
Sounds like that player just became the biggest threat to whatever enemies your group would face, making him their main target.

Maybe he'll reconsider group beats when he has a (completely legitimate) target on his ass

>>45375238
Ahead of ya.
Player used the additional combat to get more Exceptional Successes, and thus Beats.

>>45375156
>>45375221
This is basically the worry that I always have with Group Beats. The guy who gets the most is going to say "it's not fair". As the Storyteller, you should remind the rest of the group when they can do things that will earn a Beat (you DO remind your players about options their characters have that they haven't considered, don't you?).

More than that, though, tell the guy that it's a game, and it isn't fun for everyone else when he's so much better than they are.

Alternately...? Don't sweat it. Unless he gets to be so good that he can solve all the group's problems, it doesn't matter if he's a little more skilled. Hell, especially if he's the designated bruiser of the group, a few extra dots could be helpful.

>>45375260
What gameline?

>>45375263
>(you DO remind your players about options their characters have that they haven't considered, don't you?).
You mean like, point out when there's a chance for Virtue/Vice? Yeah.

>More than that, though, tell the guy that it's a game, and it isn't fun for everyone else when he's so much better than they are.
That might work...

>Alternately...? Don't sweat it. Unless he gets to be so good that he can solve all the group's problems, it doesn't matter if he's a little more skilled. Hell, especially if he's the designated bruiser of the group, a few extra dots could be helpful.
It started out like this, and I didn't worry. Now the bruiser has grown to the degree that they have grown beyond mere bruising.

>>45375278
Vampire.

To be fair, it takes a lot of extra Experience for a character to truly noticeably become better than other characters. Unless he is really cheesing a certain advantage, other PCs should still have plenty of room to shine.

>>45375283
>You mean like, point out when there's a chance for Virtue/Vice? Yeah.
Also Conditions. And helping them set Aspirations.

>>45375260
Then change things up. You've had tons of combat? Okay, now let everyone else have some fun and Bruno can stand back and cross his arms menacingly while the 5xp Daeva makes back room deals.

>>45375301
Yeah. I'd still be a bit uncomfortable giving someone something like 20 Experiences extra, but you can really make a character that's pretty much the same efficiency as someone a little more Experienced.

>>45375156
>The reasoning is that the rest would just coast on his RP-ing and more active use of Conditions and suchlike.
Coast on?
Is there some finish line he needs to get to?
We use group beats in our game, and I'm the one that's always on the lookout for conditions, chances for critical failures, etc.
But why would I care if group beats mean the other players get more xp and I less than I could? I don't play for the advancement!
It really just isn't important enough to care about. I don't play to advance my character, that's just a nice bonus. The other players give back more than enough by being awesome people I get to play Mage with.

>>45375156
>But the excessive player says that'd be unfair.

Not going to lie dude - that's a huge red flag on the player's part. Thinking it's "unfair" that other players get an equal amount of XP as him? Wanting to play a game where he's consistantly more powerful than the rest of the party? That's SUPER That Guy sounding to me.

>>45375535
I've always used Group Beats, because I've found it makes the whole group more proactive. They're more likely to help each other set up situations that fulfill Aspirations (and more likely to choose Aspirations that make things interesting for their group dynamic).

A question for DaveB if he's about: I went over the summary of Consilium building, and I was wondering if your view on the Gnosis/Arcana structure of a "typical" Consilium had changed now that XP is linear. Are there more masters? More high Gnosis Awakened?

>>45376145
He answered that one. The opposite is actually true. There are LESS high Gnosis mages around because less are required for the Legacy system to make sense and work. On the other hand, Masters are now truly feared for what they can do.

Experience has always been an abstract thing at best, so you should not automatically conclude that linear cost equals more stuff bought.

First time ST needs help!
I've gone through character creation, for 6 players.
I expect some people to drop, as they might not enjoy it, so overpopulation may not be a problem.
I kept people from knowing about clans, and peoples clans will be determined by the human characters they created.

I'm hoping to base my story around an exiled Toreador Elder, who seeks to reclaim his position in Cam society, by taking advantage of a group of new pupils.

How could I justify having multiple clans as parts of this Toreador's house?

The characters so far:

A Brawny police detective, lots of physical stats, as well as investigation, typical WOD cop.

15 y/o serial killer (I know, Its awful), has megalomania, seeks to purify the world of those she deems inferior.

33 y/o ex-PMC mercenary, basic soldier skills, quiet professional.

42 y/o M.D., Famous doctor with lots of connections, definitely the "leader" of the group.

20 y/o professional entertainer, works as a mermaid in a dinner show involving mermaids. Flower child, loves nature, moreso plants than animals.

English Reporter, insufferably obsessed with outing corruption in the local police force.

I doubt Toreador would fit all of these characters, especially the 15 y/o, who will obviously be Malkavian, I just havent found a way to explain multiple clans working together, without the Cam/Sabbat being heavily involved.

>>45376785
Also, what clans do you feel would fit each character the best? Any ideas on how I should build their Embrace scenes?

>>45375156
>But the excessive player says that'd be unfair. The reasoning is that the rest would just coast on his RP-ing and more active use of Conditions and suchlike.
As the player in another group who's been in that situation, being the only player doing any work to generate XP and then losing 4/5 of it to other players who didn't bother and got to just play the game normally feels awful.

I'm beginning to hate the concept of player-action-generated XP in general after months of this. Having way more XP than everyone else sucks, and so does being the only person generating Beats and then losing most of them.

>>45375641
As someone who's been in a similar position, it's not that, it's that everyone else is getting the same rewards he is WHILE he's the only one putting the work in to trigger Conditions, Aspirations, etc. Everyone else gets to just sit back and play the game. I actually actively DISLIKE being consistently more powerful than the rest of the group, since that just compounds the feeling of "I'm the only person here who can get shit done and it sucks".

>>45376843
>play the game normally
Wut. playing "normally" involves generating beats. If the other players aren't constantly generating beats they're doing something wrong. And being very boring in the process.

>>45376145

Fewer high Gnosis masters, as mages now have other things than just Gnosis to spend Arcane XP on, and Legacy Attainments have to be bought.

The Gnosis requirements to learn those Attainments have also come down, but the Gnosis level to learn Arcana has gone *up* (no more Gnosis 3 Masters).

So... There's still a bell curve, and if anything it's a steeper one. The majority of mages are Gnosis 3-6, or should be, anyway.

>>45376921
Playing normally involves generating 3 Aspiration Beats per session if they actively chase them, and 1 "I showed up" Beat. 1 Aspiration Beat and 1 "I showed up" Beat per person is more common. Everything else depends on either lucking out and rolling five successes (to generate a Condition, which they then have to resolve), or lucking out and rolling a failure specifically on a roll they can safely convert into a Dramatic Failure without fucking people over unacceptably (which they then usually have to go out of their way to try to resolve, since bad Conditions don't let you resolve them by cashing them in for a bonus).

>>45376921
>If the other players aren't constantly generating beats they're doing something wrong. And being very boring in the process.
The other players are doing neat stuff all the time, it just usually isn't stuff they specifically wrote down before the session on their "I want to do this stuff" list, since as a group we're pretty improvisational, and it also isn't stuff that necessarily involves rolling 5 successes. Rolling 5 successes is actually pretty fucking hard, unless you're a supernatural making one of the specific rolls those supernaturals are designed to be able to cheese (like Werewolves rolling Perception, where they can basically have an always-on +4 dice whenever they feel like it, and buy a 1-Experience-cost Gift that bumps down the Exceptional Success threshold to 3 dice). Honestly, as a group we don't actually physically roll the dice as often as the game seems to demand we do in order to keep up a flow of Beats - we roll specifically on important stuff we can't afford to fail catastrophically, usually (which means no Beats from Dramatic Failures), and most of those rolls don't have dicepools of 15+ (which means no Beats from Exceptional Successes). The vast majority of the time we end up with 1-3 successes, or a failure we can't afford to convert into a Dramatic Failure, which does absolutely nothing to generate Beats.

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>>45376942
So does this still apply? Or have there been some alterations?

>>45377021
If you rarely roll dice, how did faggotron the mighty get all that extra XP?

>>45377100
Insisting on rolling way more often than everyone else, mostly, and constantly harassing the ST about Conditions when he wanted to storytell. Also harassing the ST about the ST-fiat Beats option.

All just to keep up a decent XP rate after it gets divided evenly across five people.

>>45377069
Everything before Gnosis and Legacies should still apply. I know Path, Order, and Gender are all still correct.

>>45377306
Sounds like a budding That Guy.

I just saw a documentary on how paper is made guys, it was so WoD inspiring

>>45370226
What happens when a Nephali mage decides to specialize in divination.

>>45376785
>Forcing your players to play specific clans
>Stereotyping them into these clans based on how they build a human character
>Not thinking someone could possibly be part of a clan without fitting into the stereotype for them
>Putting someone into Malk just because they have a derangement as a serial killer, when a Lasombra, Assamite, Ravnos, Tzimisce, or Nosferatu could work better for the serial killer concept
Fucking disgusting

If you're starting them off as humans in-game, fine, have them get embraced by whatever clan you think is most fitting, but don't then come crying when your players aren't happy with you forcing them into specific clans. If anything, *that* is what will lead to players leaving.

My suggestion would be to take each player aside and suggest a few of the clans that fit their character, either by name or in loose terms(eg for the serial killer, "shadow-manipulating goths, super-stealth assassins, mind-fuck professionals, body-horror nobles, or spooky scary nightmare people", add in "crazy people" if you feel like you have to include Malks in her options), and let *them* choose which clan they fall into.

Taking away player agency leads to the opposite of fun.

>>45377509
Give me a break, anon.

This is my first time as ST, and the first WOD experience for 5/6 of my players.

We're all working on limited knowledge here.

>>45377660

Better question: Why are you playing oWoD?

>>45377739
We're playing VTM because it's the only one I have any experience with.

>>45377660
Do your players know that they will be playing a vampire game. If so ask them on what kind of powers they seem interested in, that should help you pick the right clans.

>>45377660
>Give me a break, anon.
Hence why I offered another way to go about it instead of taking away player agency.
>My suggestion would be to take each player aside and suggest a few of the clans that fit their character, either by name or in loose terms(eg for the serial killer, "shadow-manipulating goths, super-stealth assassins, mind-fuck professionals, body-horror nobles, or spooky scary nightmare people", add in "crazy people" if you feel like you have to include Malks in her options), and let *them* choose which clan they fall into.
As far as the rest of the characters go:
>A Brawny police detective, lots of physical stats, as well as investigation, typical WOD cop.
Brujah, Ventrue, or Giovanni if he wants the dirty cop/mobster thing.("Tough badasses, mind-controlling leaders, or mobster necromancers")
>33 y/o ex-PMC mercenary, basic soldier skills, quiet professional.
Brujah, Assamite, Gangrel("Tough badasses, silent assassins, bestial hunters")
>42 y/o M.D., Famous doctor with lots of connections, definitely the "leader" of the group.
Ventrue, Toreador, Tzimisce, maybe Tremere("Mind-controlling leaders, smooth-talking artists/hedonists, body-horror nobles, magic nerds")
>20 y/o professional entertainer, works as a mermaid in a dinner show involving mermaids. Flower child, loves nature, moreso plants than animals.
Toreador, Gangrel, Tremere("Smooth-talking artists/hedonists, bestial nature-lovers, magic nerds")
>English Reporter, insufferably obsessed with outing corruption in the local police force
Brujah, Malkavian, Toreador("Passionate badasses, crazy people, smooth-talking artists")

>>45377759
Well a huge thing you have to realize is that most Malkavians aren't insane until AFTER their embrace. Making your 15 y/o serial killer a Malk would be like dumping a fish bowl into a fish tank; yeah, the fish might be happy with the additional space, but it's still going to just be a fish swimming around in a glass case.

And hell, as far as the clans I suggested earlier, that's just a small selection of what 'megalomaniac serial killer' could fit into. We kind of need information, to make *good* suggestions.
Any one of the clans could have megalomaniacs in them, and all of them are basically guaranteed to have serial killers in them.

Though as far as the 'purifying the world of the inferior' thing goes, Ventrue is a good fit. As is Tzimisce.
Granted, if you're playing a cammy game, you might not want to offer the options of Tzimisce, Ravnos, Lasombra, Setite, Giovanni, Assamite, and Gangrel(If you're making them Independent).

>>45376785
your first mistake was having six players for your first ever time as ST. Game's already doomed, let it go.

>>45376843
>>45376861
I just... I'm sorry, I can't comprehend how this can happen.

I'm STing a game with 4 players, two of which have only ever played one tabletop campaign before in their lives (which was 1e nWoD), and they're managing to generate 3-5 beats per person per session. Even the guy who's still getting the hang of actually roleplaying manages at least 2.

>>45376843
>>45376861
This really seems like a group issue. I also agree with >>45376921, but if you're who I think you are, I've already pointed this out.

>>45376954
There are tons of ways to get status effects. Most buff powers are no longer "you get +2 for the scene", they're "you get a hanging +2 and can resolve this for more". Dramatic Failures for Beats is simply a way to make those actually happen now, not your primary source of them. And even then, having players go out of their way to resolve their Conditions means more Beats.

>>45377021
>>45377306
This sounds less like your group isn't pulling their weight and more that you're trying to carry everyone when you don't need to. For one thing, harass the ST about Conditions for other players, an get ST-fiat Beats for them. Nevermind that MOST negative Conditions are things that encourage you to suffer problems narratively. "Your bad leg means you let someone get away, or they catch you" or "you go off to investigate the Spooky Noise".

>>45377354
The person you're saying is a That Guy is the one you're talking to. And at this point I'm definitely sure it's a friend of mine (I'm not in the game). It's a matter of no one else going for Beats, but he feels they need more Experiences. The "correct" answer is either to calm down on the Beat whoring and just let it go that people aren't getting a new power every session or two. Having a barbecue with a Seer shouldn't really do much more than give you information and maybe Arcane Beats.

Or, another thing I've suggested: Multiply Beats, don't divide them. 5 Beats in the pot, 5 players, 5 Beats each, not 1 Beat each.

>>45379823

As the player that usually pushes the story along in 90% of my sessions: it's because I'm usually the most invested in my character, and the most willing to create and execute my plans.

>>45379823
I can relate. I have a player who actively trys to avoid gaining conditions and argues half the times when he does get them. If player just don't put their characters in situations when rolling is needed or where they do not leave altered by a condition they don't really get beats

>>45378320
>"Player Agency"
Oh come of it. On top of that, you were being an asshole and telling him that everyone will hate him and that he'll fuck up spectacularly. You gave him a suggestion on the tail end of telling him that he was horrible and should be ashamed.

Also, don't suggest a new player a bunch of non-standard clans like Assamite and Tzimisce and Losambra. Unless he's playing V20, where those are in the corebook.

>>45376785
>>45377759
Honestly? I'd suggest going with VtR2e. It's a lot easier for new players, and you've got a lot less Clans to wrap your head over. On top of that, the Clan stereotypes are a lot looser, to the point where it WOULD make sense for all of them to be Daeva. Or you could have the "Toreador" working with a few other vampires, and that's 5 instead of 13 options.

If not, well, >>45378320 still has a point. That said, you've also shot yourself in the foot having six players, and I feel like both mechanically and narratively the whole Bloodlines style game where you're all JUST Embraced never really works out. It means having a whole bunch of people Embraced just last night, and it also means that technically the characters are able to do things that the characters don't know about. Vampires really work best when you don't worry about the training montage.

Ask your friends who's MOST interested, then cut down to four or maybe three. Run another game for the others, if you have that kind of free time. Maybe even run the same game twice, and see how it differs between groups.

>>45379910
>>45379858
>I'm usually the most invested in my character, and the most willing to create and execute my plans.
Then as I said, this is really an issue that's a lot bigger than some of the group not pulling their weight. You've put them on a sledge and started dragging them across the ground by your teeth, but they're perfectly fine staying where they are.

>>45379858
>>45379910
Just stop playing with those people IMO, sounds like they suck.

>>45375018

I knew you weren't and that was good stuff. A new edtion of Mummy, if it ever happens, is a long way off, and the 1e line seems to be done but have you considered submitting something for it for OPP?

Alright so, enjoying reading up on the various aspects of WoD games, looking to join a game online likely via rpol as gotta be by text. Only thing is, ive been reading through VtR2e, and when im poking around rpol, all the long standing games are VtM. Is that just the more popular system? Should I just go read up that one instead and go join that?

>>45381171

VtM has a bit more popularity, but you might want to expand your search a bit to other gaming sites. Roll20 apparently has a sketchy WoD community (so you'll have to do some vetting before you jump in) but there's an even mix of VtR and VtM there.

>>45381171
You have been misled my friend.

>>45381390

I doubt that given that i've just picked it up, no-ones told me jack.

Regardless, which way misled. Ie, which ones more popular?

is there anything more lame than a motherfucker who doesn't want to read the setting for a cofd game he wants to play

like nigga why you even trying this if you don't wanna read

are you fuckin retarded, do you not realize you just reading on here all goddamn day

>>45381385
I feel like everywhere that has a "WoD community" has a sketchy WoD community.

White Wolf games attract pretty awful fanbases.

>>45381604
Could be worse. We could be Rifts.

>>45381450

It's hard to tell the popularity of tabletop games due to the fact that there's no real gamer census system. Roll20 says that it's less popular than World of Darkness but more popular than New World of Darkness and "White Wolf", which tells us pretty much nothing: http://blog.roll20.net/post/116828584295/the-orr-group-industry-report-q1-2015

Based on personal experience (which again, not a scientific measurement and certainly shouldn't be taken without a grain of salt), I'd say the popularity on the tabletop is about even. The V20 line gave VtM a shot in the arm and VtR2e increased the number of those games too.

If we're talking about general, mainstream popularity, it goes to VtM with no contest, due to Bloodlines. Even then, though, that's not much because VtM hasn't had a big mainstream media push in years. Things probably would have been different if New Line Cinema made that Vampire the Requiem movie like they wanted to but New Line Cinema merged with Warner Brothers at the same time that White Wolf merged with CCP so that was never going to happen.

>>45381752

Of course, Roll20 or its community seems to have streamlined its naming, because the latest examination breaks White Wolf stuff into "World of Darkness" and "Exalted": http://blog.roll20.net/post/137560897420/the-orr-group-industry-report-q4-2015

>>45381171
I wouldn't join any random game on the internet. Find people you like and then play with them, not the other way around.

>>45381598
Different formats. Reading a thread is easier than reading a PDF for some people. I know I hate reading PDFs because they load slowly on my computer. I also find it easier to read comments in a thread because they happen 'slower'--that is, if I'm part of the thread they pop up while I'm reading, they don't get dumped in my lap--and they're all in pieces. There's not much chance of "losing my place" when the comments are all barely three lines (though some people feel the opposite, and can follow books a lot easier). On top of that, for some people reading this kind of back and forth is a lot easier than reading the writing in a book. You can also ask questions here.

They're completely different experiences and shouldn't be compared. It's rarely the volume of text read that's the problem. Oh, and then there's the fact that some people just don't care to read what isn't important to their characters, so they miss out on rules that are squirreled away in the wrong section.

>>45383019
never play with those people

I'm going to do an XCOM game with CofD, should I just use the alien rules from Bleeding Edge or maybe build them like they were spirits / angels?

>>45383111
I'm one of those people. I understand that reading a game book can feel like reading a textbook. That's why I do my best to help teach any new player I bring in. I was even almost done making a cheat sheet for Werewolf before that game got tanked (and I probably still have one for Changeling somewhere), plus my Hunter cheat sheet. Still need to make a Vampire one.

I understand that not everyone is going to be able to pour through every fucking sourcebook and memorize everything. Even the people who do read the book may not understand it, and they'll be less likely to remember everything.

>>45383223
Just use the Horror rules in CofD core. One day i'm going to sit down and make a whole fan supplement filled with Horrors.

How would you best explain away (in-setting) characters receiving flashbacks to past lives?

I want to run a Dark Eras game concurrently with a modern one, but need he,p with the framing of it.

>>45384005
In nWoD? Easy, with some creative interpretation of the Fog of Eternity.

in oWoD? Elders' manipulating their blood, or an extremely strong magical ritual.

>>45384005

Depends how you want to go with it, and what line you're doing. Off the top of my head, you've got a few options: power of hypnosis, accessing the collective unconsciousness, drug induced hallucinations, dreams in Torpor, accessing familiar places in the Temenos, scattered memories of a Promethean's assembled parts, stories from a Pack's Totem, Oneiromancy, flashbacks from a Geist's previous Bargains or a Horror's previous hosts, regained Memory dots, or memories of previous Angelic incarnations unlocked via God-Machine douchebaggery.

>>45384065

Fog of Eternity isn't a thing anymore, as of VtR 2e. It also doesn't help with non-vampire characters.

>>45384153

As someone who doesn't really /get/ Mage, could you explain how the Temenos would work for this? The Astral has always been the most confusing thing to me. Does this tie into the Aeons at all?

>>45384178
I don't think the Temenos would have anything to do with it. The Oneiros is the layer that's "You". The Temenos is "Humans as a collective".

My changeling has been approached by some Ventrue who wants to work out some sort of deal for a monthly tithe of Wyrd Vitae, I can also name my price for all the information I have on the Hedge and contracts.

The Winter Monarch tells me to keep out of vampire affairs because it all boils down to some internal power struggle with them, and this particular Ventrue has an unhealthy obsession with all things Fae.

Do I want a vampire ally, or do I want to remain in good standing with the current freehold monarch?

>>45384271
>Vampire
>"Ally"

>>45384178
>>45384231

I chose the Temenos specifically because of its whole "humans as a collective thing", to do a more Mage version of the "collective unconsciousness" version of doing past lives, but Oneiros related stuff works just as well, especially since it's the place where a person's memories are accessed.

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>>45377407
>More bitching about me sharing WoD inspiration and ideas
Fuck you.

https://youtu.be/CmRih_VtVAs

We're going to talk about Suicide Squad now. There's a plot hook in one of the books (probably Hunter core) about Taskforce VALKYRIE using Supers outfitted with cranial bombs. I want to run a game, maybe a one shot, maybe something more substantial, where the players are supernatural creatures built with a modified generic monster Template. They'd all have Potency, and Energy, and they'd be able to take Dread Powers and I'd work with each of them to define their "template". They'd be captured and working for VALKYRIE to take down things that VALKYRIE doesn't want to spend it's own resources on. Maybe they're given some Advanced Armoury, maybe they aren't.

Anyone have any suggestions for making that kind of a game work?

>>45384429

>We're going to talk about Suicide Squad now.

Or you could have ignored that post making a joke from seven hours ago, and we can instead talk about this neat past life game idea using Dark Eras that the one anon had. I've always liked the concept of past lives myself, but they're pretty dang hard to game, especially if you want to use them to do a non-linear game.

>>45384483

One of the Chronicler's Guides for Werewolf has a framework for jumping between modern Forsaken and ancient Sumerian god-kings; they explain it away using magic bricks, but the plotline is neat.

Sothis Ascends proposes the ideas that Mummies experience time non-linearly, and that Sothic Turns all exist simultaneously; one of the Arisen may bleed his perceptions between all four of them.

>>45384483
B-but I want to talk about MY idea...
I really like the idea of using non-standard monster player characters.

>>45384065
Honestly you don't need that much of an excuse. It could be as simple as they did something in their past lives and now they need to do it again. Once upon a time they banded together to seal an ancient evil and now it's rising again. The actions of their past lives will help them discover the secret to defeating it once again. Or like in Mummy Returns they could be a queen bangin' the high priest and now he wants to bang them again.

>>45384178
The Temenos is the collective consciousness of humanity, and as such has all of the weird off the wall shit. It's the dreamworld of everyone on earth, while the Oneiros is the dreamworld of specific people.

>>45384429

Use ordinary humans with light powers like pyrokinesis, telekinesis, visions, etc...

You can incorporate them as the Valkyrie's secret weapon for messy jobs.

See Clive Barker's Jericho for example.

If you are interested in the crunch part you can find a lot of merits and other things in the Second Sight expansion book.

>>45384586
>Temenos
>consciousness of humanity

No, it's the collective *soul* of humanity, which is far broader and deeper in scope within the CofD / Mage cosmology.

>>45384634
I want them to be more than just psychics. I mean, that's a thing they could be, but I'm also thinking vampires or shapeshifters or whatever. I want to turn the mini-template used for antagonists in Hunter into something player characters could use more easily. Which mostly just means making Potency a little more expensive than a merit, and using Essence or something instead of Willpower.

>>45384761
Why bother
Just do a mixed game and give them all the caveat of 'you have a cranial bomb that will blow up if you piss off the boss'.
100% easier than trying to beat the horror template from Hunter into something that works at all for a player.

>>45385060
>Why bother
"Fun"
>Just do a mixed game
That's more complicated.

It's not like the monster template is that complicated. Hell, there's even a power that lets you become a Vampire in Nightstalkers. It's cool, and I've wanted to make a Mekhet (maybe even a Khaibit) who botched Nehebkuah's Tears.

Which gameline would be best for a Russian Civil War era?

I want to play a cossack supernatural.

>>45385308
Could you be a bit more specific?

>>45384160
Oh. I haven't read any nWoD since it first came out, my bad.

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I don't know what breed I'm gonna play in Pugmire

>>45385947
Chihuahua. It suits you perfectly.

So, I know it's been mentioned that mages use the astral realms to communicate, but HOW exactly do they do that? I know it's apparently incredibly efficient, but HOW does it work? Is it, in fact, faster than a cell phone, or magebook?

>>45385308
I've thought about it and I think Vampire.

>>45385308
I think one of the Dark Eras is going to be Demon during the Russian Revolution. But Vampire would work well. You could maybe frame it as the different covenants throwing their weight in, make it a conflict between the Invictus and Carthians, maybe.

>>45387480
>tfw your players were too stupid for a Vampire chronicle set in 1700s Montreal focused on the war between the British Invictus and the French Lancea

>>45387597
I'd love to play that. Especially if I could speak in a ridiculous Quebecois accent.

>>45387061
You meditate into the Astral at the same time as someone else, and find each each other within one specific realm of the Temenos, or "collective unconscious".

It's not fast or accessible compared to modern tech, but its a great way of meeting secretly and securely, especially if you're both part of the same legacy.

>>45387668
Then how do the heralds of a consillium work? I know Dave mentioned in neolithic using the astral to communicate with a Mage from another village, but that would be difficult to time, no?

>>45387732
Mundane methods of communication, dead drops, telepathy, leaving secret messages in the Astral.
You could even just have one day a month you go and meet with your friends in a popular realm.

>>45387795
>meet with your friends in a popular realm

Astral Starbucks?

>>45387821
Possibly. It exists.

>>45387821

"So, any of you faggots tame fire yet?"

>>45387848
You'd want to go to the iteration created by people who like the place though. Otherwise it'll be horrendously shit

>>45387821
>Astral Starbucks

Shitty coffee serves the Lie.

Drink Starbucks in the Astral and you may never return home.

>>45387885
>>45387821
>>45387899

I prefer Astral Dunkin' Donuts.

The coffee is better and there's nothing like Astral donuts with sprinkles after a hard day of wizarding.

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>>45387795
>>45387668
Bummer. I'd heard it was a really efficient. It seems useful, but efficient isn't a word I'd use for it. I had thought you'd visit a particular mages oneiros, or something

mods are asleep, post Mummy

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Thread is dead, filename time.

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>>45389592

>>45387937
The Canadian and Michiganite Mages won't shut up about Astral Tim Hortons.

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>>45389592
>>45389629

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>>45389669
Fuck me that's one of my favourites.

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>>45389727
God, that one gives be a little panic attack.

>>45389727
>That moment where he's trying to get his butt through
Can you imagine getting stuck at that point?

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>>45389829
Game over, man. Game. Over.

>>45389667

I could go for some Astral Timbits.

Can someone explain what rote skills and rote actions are?

>>45389886

A rote action in most senses is an action where you reroll all failed dice on the initial roll. So, for example, say I roll 8 dice and get two successes, I'd reroll the six failed dice.

On rerolling the six dice, I get another two successes. However, I don't keep rerolling, since the rote action only applies to the first roll.

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>>45389886
A rote action is an action where you reroll each of your first failed roll. It's awesome.

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>>45389886
The Rote Action is when you reroll any failed dice once. So if I have rote and I roll 4, 8, 1, 2, 3, 9, 6, 10, I get 3 successes and I get to reroll the 4, 1, 2, 3, and 6. (I also get to reroll the 10 as normal). If I get 7, 3, 5, 1, 8, 4 I have a total of 4 successes, but I don't get to reroll anything.

Rote Skills are from Mage. They're skills where a Mage gets +1 when using that Skill as part of a Rote. Rote Skills are determined by your Order, though there's a merit that gives Rote Skills as well. These don't actually give the Rote quality.

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>>45389954
>>45389956
>>45389968
There's another tidbit. If you roll a ten, roll those rerolls first. If those fail, the rote applies to them too.

>>45389994

Where do you get that from?

>>45389968

Sorry, what is a rote in a Mage context? I know it's a spell, but what does that mean? And what's a peaxis, while we're at it?

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>>45390044
When you’ve got plenty of training and the steps you need to follow are laid out in front of you, you’ve got a significant chance of success. When you make a roll, you can reroll any dice that do not show an 8, 9, or 10. If you’re reduced to a chance die on a rote action, don’t reroll a dramatic failure. You may only reroll each die once.
>You may only reroll each die once.
>each die once.
Basically, each die gets one rote. So let's say you rolled 4 dice. A 10, a 9, and 2 8s by some miracle. That 10 rolls a one, that die has now not rolled an 8, 9 or 10.

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>>45389994
I don't think so? You roll each batch of dice at the same time.

>>45390118
Oh. In Mage, a Rote is a specific type of Spell that's been codified and wrapped up in the Fallen World's symbolism. i.e.: It's the kind of spell where you wave your fingers around and make hand signs and gestures and that makes the spell easier.

In 1e a praxis is your outlook on the supernal and your place in it. In 2e it's different. But 2e isn't out yet.

>>45390153
That's a fucking stupid interpretation.

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>>45390153
>When you make a roll, you can reroll any dice that do not show an 8, 9, or 10.
That die showed a 10. That's why it's getting rerolled in the first place.

When you roll the dice, you roll them all at once. You then reroll all the rerolls at once.

>>45390118
Rote is a custom spell, hand crafted by a master. In 2e, it means you get a mudra of the rote skill. Praxis is a custom spell that is one of your specialties. From what we know, it gets you exceptional successes on 3.

>>45390195

WHAT THE FUCK IS A MUDRA

MAGE IS A RABBIT HOLE WITH NO END

>>45390260
Fancy hand waving bullshit.

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>>45390260
A boost to your die pool, to put it simply.

>>45390260

muda muda muda

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>>45390318
Funny enough, if your rote has intimidate or something as it's skill? Your mudra could very well be muda muda muda.

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http://chroniclesofdorkness.tumblr.com/

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Alternatively, "Telling someone you're going to Ascend"

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>>45390698
I'm not even sure what happened there...

>>45389954
>>45389956
>>45389968
where is this rule?

>>45390260
>MAGE IS A RABBIT HOLE WITH NO END

Oh thank god I'm not alone.

>>45391289

I'm not dumb. I can wrap my head around weird cosmology just fine.

But there's something about all the fucking terms and quirks of Mage that just makes me go full retard, to say nothing of the rules. I might just forgo 2e altogether and use a FATE hack, because spellcasting is utterly impossible for me.

What would it take to permanently change your true/sympathetic name? Mastery of Space? Archmastery?

I want to play a transgender character and having their deadname be magically potent is stupid.

>>45391431
Surely a trans Mage could just change their gender.

>>45391431
>I want to play a transgender character and having their deadname be magically potent is stupid.

How is it "stupid" ?

>>45391442

But that wouldn't alter their sympathetic name.

>>45391445

Because why would a name they don't view as theirs have any power over them?

>>45391461
Because it's the name that's engraved at the tower.

>>45391461
Because it's still their name.

I can sexually identify as an attack helicopter all I like, doesn't mean spells that affect humans will stop working on me.

>>45391461
>Because why would a name they don't view as theirs have any power over them?

Because sympathy isn't about what you care about?

You might not consider Jerry your friend in the slightest, but if he spends every day for a year with you, he's going to have a sympathetic tie to you.

Sympathy is for making mages paranoid, not (in)validating their beliefs about their gender. Deal with it.

>>45391416
All the game lines have weird terms. Not just Mage. I still don't get how people are confused by Mage spells. 13 things that you can do.
>>45391461
Doesn't matter what the Mage thinks. A Mage that changed his name to escape his past didn't get a new sympathetic name, either. The lex magica doesn't care about gender, sex, anything like that.

>>45391261
In chronicle of darkness. Pg 72.
But here it is for now, you can fact check it later.
Rote Actions: When you’ve got plenty of training and the steps you need to follow are laid out in front of you, you’ve got a significant chance of success. When you make a roll, you can reroll any dice that do not show an 8, 9, or 10. If you’re reduced to a chance die on a rote action, don’t reroll a dramatic failure. You may only reroll each die once.

>>45391431

Last time this came up, I believe the call was that you'd need an Archmage to do it.

>>45391461

Because that was the name they were referred to by many years by many people, especially those that birthed them. It's not their true identity as much as enough sympathetic connection built up over time with that name to still count as a magical ID tag.

>>45391416

I'd say you should give Mage 2e a chance, it looks like the spell-casting will be simpler in play than it is in partial descriptions over several years. That said, you could do an awesome FAE hack with the Five Paths. I keep meaning to write that up myself.

>>45390260
And right now we are so far down it even ALice would need to ask for directions.

is there anyone in canton ohio who plays world of darkness, Im trying to assemble the vamp squad or buy a copy if changeling from ya if ya got it for $$$

so why don't you guys just

put "no OWoD allowed, NWoD only" in the OP instead of being passive-aggressive faggots about it

>>45391416
2e spellcasting is fucking simple though. Hell, it's more simple than 1e, since all spells use the same rules.

>>45390260
A mudra is a type of yantra.

More helpfully, it's a set of physical gestures that function with the specific, practiced, rote version of the spell that makes it easier to cast. When you cast a Rote, you can apply your skill rating in any of the skills it's designed to work with as a dice bonus when casting.

Considering most other yantras require you to jump through a ton of hoops just to get a +2, having a potential +5 bonus from one yantra is amazing.

>>45392409
It's just one faggot who keeps going "Why bother playing VtM when VtR is infinitely better" while not realizing they're designed to be distinct games, especially post-1e.

>>45392563
A Gnosis of 6+ still lets you increase skills beyond 5, which potentially means a Munda could give a bonus has high as +10.

>>45392563
For reference, a "yantra" is "anything that gives you a die bonus when spellcasting that isn't your Gnosis rating or Arcana rating". Things like saying magic words, doing specific gestures, casting in a symbolically-appropriate place for the spell effect you want to cast, constructing a magic circle or painting a set of runes around the edges of the area you want to do magic in, etc.

>>45392595
>Things like saying magic words, doing specific gestures, casting in a symbolically-appropriate place for the spell effect you want to cast, constructing a magic circle or painting a set of runes around the edges of the area you want to do magic in, etc.
FORZARE!

>>45391461
>Because why would a name they don't view as theirs have any power over them?
Because the sympathetic name isn't one you chose, it's a prison tag forced on you by the Exarchs (to paraphrase DaveB's comments from the Broken Diamond AP).

>>45391461
>Because why would a name they don't view as theirs have any power over them?
The whole point of the sympathetic name is that it's a name you don't view as yours that gives others power over you. Your "real" name is the one you chose for yourself, and it protects you from those who would do you harm.

>>45392834
Hell, based on the fact that this is a centuries-old practice, Mages would probably be more accepting of transgender people than most.

>>45391431

A person's sympathetic name is the scar left in Pandemonium by their own sense of self. It's what the people with strong sympathetic links to a baby think of her as when she first realizes that she is separate from the rest of the world (which happens very young) and starts forming sympathetic links of her own.

To a Mastigos, it no more defines you than your navel does. We changed it from "real name" to "sympathetic name" to try to get that across; it's not your identity, it's a bit of your Space Pattern that all human beings have.

You can suppress it with Space 4, but it just comes back when the spell ends. Destroying it entirely would, I suppose, be Space 5, but it would really fuck you up, mentally, unless you somehow grew a new one based on what people with the strongest links to you think of as "your name".

>>45392872
>You can suppress it with Space 4, but it just comes back when the spell ends.
Given there's no longer a limit on spell duration on living beings, or spell tolerance, couldn't a Mage simply cast the spell with an infinite duration than relinquish control over it with Willpower?

Or would the potency of that spell merely be an additional factor that people had to overcome should they attempt to use your sympathetic name?

>>45392889
Still dispellable though.

>>45392902

Yes, still dispellable.

Your best recourse, then, if you cannot abide your sympathetic name, is to find a Master of Space willing to first cast a Making spell giving you an additional one, then an Unmaking spell to cut your old one off.

The Imperial spell "True Name" often comes up in these discussions, but it's not the same thing - that's an Excision spell that removes your capacity to be targeted sympathetically *at all*, unless the caster knows a password "name" which the archmaster sets. It's a permanent change to how Space interacts with the character.

>>45390946
shift consequences is an ability that lets you change who suffers the effects of a roll, it's a demonic embed or exploit, I forget. So you could say, throw yourself and someone else out of a building and make it so that the car suffers the effects of damage from falling at terminal velocity, instead of yourself. Though, you don't actually chose "who", you just say "I shift the damage from falling"

>>45392951
Neat!
Thanks for these mini-spoilers.
They make the waiting easier. :)

Any chance for something fun to say about new Fate tricks? :)

>>45392849

They are, for several reasons.

First, the overwhelming majority of mages construct Shadow Names for themselves; magical identities that reflect who they feel they really are Supernally, without the Lie's constraints. And the few who don't suffer consequences for it. So mages in general don't even blink at, say, a man who was born with a female body.

Second, where idiots can ignore things outside their own skulls and tell themselves that the transgender person must be imagining it, or mentally ill, the barrier of proof is really, really low for a mage. Accepting that someone is in the wrong body is a beginner-level Mind or Life spell away, and when mages enter the astral realms they appear as who their souls are.

And third, changing your physical sex is only Life 3 anyway. You'll even be fertile.

So, while they're as prone to being racist as anyone else, on this one issue mages really don't care. A transgender mage coming out of the closet is usually met with shrugs and offers of Life spells if they can't do it themselves.

>>45393007
...And then there's the Daksha, ruining it for everyone.

>>45393028
Yeah fuck those guys.

>>45393007
>A transgender mage coming out of the closet is usually met with shrugs and offers of Life spells if they can't do it themselves.
The more Mages need to ask others for spells, the better the favour trading economy of Mages works. So between their focus on everyone deserving the chance to be who they really and their investment in keeping Mage Society running, Silver Ladder are proabably especially welcoming of transgender Mages. Need to keep those favours rolling.

>>45391431
>>45391461
Dead names are already socially potent. Honestly for most characters that means their True Name is double hidden. I'm not 100% on board with the way True Names are handled (I prefer if names themselves pick up Sympathetic baggage, not just the one you're born with), but it's not like a transgender person's name is any more not-viewed-as-theirs than me going by my middle name or someone who changes their name for other personal reasons.

>>45391486
>Because sympathy isn't about what you care about?
But it really should, shouldn't it? Sure, coworker Jerry might have some sort of sympathy towards me, but presumably my girlfriend of six years has a stronger and deeper connection, shouldn't she? Just because I'm always around Jerry doesn't mean we're approaching Intimate, unless he's sticking his dick in me.

>>45391493
Isn't the Lex Magica the literal Mage Law, not the cosmic metaphysical forces of reality? Some aspects of the Lex are based around the metaphysics, but they're also based around how you can act towards other Mages.

>>45391543
>Because that was the name they were referred to by many years by many people
Actually, I think Dave said that it really is JUST the name your parents gave you. There's even a story in Imperial Mysteries about a woman trying to find her own True Name so that she can become an Archmaster. If you were adopted and given a new name days after your Birth, you still have that first True Name.

>>45391483
I don't think your True Name is inherently the one you engrave on the tower. For one thing, a lot of people won't be using their True Name to begin with. Many people use nicknames or altered names. Shortened forms of their real names and just legally changed names. Changed up spellings. Or, as above, they just don't know their True Name.

>>45392872
What I don't understand is why it's your FIRST name that was given to you. What about all the people who's parents gave them fancy names but intend them to go by the shortened version? "Chrysanthemum" going by "Chris" for instance. What's her Sympathetic name? Most of the people who know her don't even know her name is Chrysanthemum.
What about, well, Transgender people? Or actors who go by their stage name? Is what >>45392697 says true? I'd never thought of your sympathetic name as being a horrible thing, just something that needed protecting.

>>45392951
>if you cannot abide your sympathetic name
Who wouldn't? It's sounding like people might be better off without one.

>>45393007
>where idiots can ignore things outside their own skulls and tell themselves that the transgender person must be imagining it, or mentally ill, the barrier of proof is really, really low for a mage.
To be fair, when has proof ever changed someone's mind? I've linked studies proving it that trans people are real and still been told it's all a lie.

>>45393028
Goddamned three eyed hermaphrodite space Nazis.

>>45393078
I thought the Mysterium was the one that was big on Guanxi.

>>45392984
No, I mean "I can't tell what is happening in that tiny, darkly lit, confusing webm clip".
Also, nothing about Shift Consequence says you can't choose your target.

>>45393109
>Actually, I think Dave said that it really is JUST the name your parents gave you.
The exact quote is:
>sympathetic name is not always the name on your driving licence - it's what the people with sympathetic links to a baby think of them as while their sense of self develops, so looking through someone's mortgage paperwork is not a surefire way to get it.

>>45393162
>What about all the people who's parents gave them fancy names but intend them to go by the shortened version?
If the shortened version is the one the parents think of when they think of their child during its baby years, then that becomes the sympathetic name. If they think of the baby using the long one, that becomes the sympathetic name.

Using someone's sympathetic name in Mage Society without being the most intimate of friends is, putting it bluntly, "fightin' words".

Transgender mages aren't different in that regard. The asshole Mastigos in the next Cabal over could be utterly comfortable with his gender identity and sexuality, but call him "Daniel" instead of "Halcyon" without his permission and get ready to duel.

And, if you're in some Orders like the Seers of the Throne or Silver Ladder, prepare to get punished by your own Order, too.

(Seers of the Throne are, while their younger members enjoy doing the "Mr Anderson" schtick as much as the next agents of cosmic tyranny, far more hardcore about Shadow Names than the Pentacle are. They even call them Sacred Names. Using a Seer's sympathetic name reminds him that he's *not* a prince of the universe, but just another human. And then he'll do his best to murder you.)

>>45393162
>What I don't understand is why it's your FIRST name that was given to you. What about all the people who's parents gave them fancy names but intend them to go by the shortened version? "Chrysanthemum" going by "Chris" for instance. What's her Sympathetic name?

"Chris".

Would Rick Sanchez be a Mage?

>>45393167
"No, Bob, you can't be transgender. Stop trying to come up with background reasons why your sympathetic name is harder to find".

>>45393180
>>45393200
That actually makes sense for Mage, but at the same time it's almost the opposite of what you'd expect.

Compare:
>"Hey First"
to
>"Firstname Middlename Lastname! You get in here RIGHT this instant!"

>>45393191
>All Mages have Deadnames
The concept is just hilarious to me as a transperson.
The whole Shadowname thing has always felt like the Pyro/Magneto "no, what's your REAL name" scene. Which while I'm clearly all for it's still silly when the real name in question is "Pyro".
Or I guess they're just Japanese and don't want you getting too friendly.

>>45393211
For all our sake let's hope not. He'd either be an oMage or a Genius.

>>45393162
I thought it said so explicitly. Using the example, "You can shift consequences from being shot, but have no control over who the consequence shifts to, usually a wall or nearby object".

>>45393230
>Genius.
Perish the thought

>>45393230
Stop responding
>>45393162
to every individual
>>45393109
in the fucking thread
>>45391543
It's obnoxious.

>>45393231
>Shift Consequence ( Demon: The Descent -- Page 137 )

>This somewhat dangerous Embed allows a demon to change the results of a scene by changing who suffers the consequence. A critical injury, poison, humiliation or a Condition can change from one target to another.

>This Embed can be activated any time between when the consequence appears and the end of the scene. The demon specifies which consequence he wishes to shift. It must be something that occurred within the last scene and it must have a game effect -- damage or a Condition are the most likely targets.

>Dice Roll: Manipulation + Occult - Resolve, Composure, or Stamina (Storyteller's discretion)

>Action: Instant

>Dramatic Failure: The demon suffers the consequence himself. Anyone else involved in the scene that wants to inflict her own consequence on the demon may do so. This won't kill the demon; the demon suffers only the most intense injury. In addition, though, the demon must check for compromise as described under Success.

>Failure: No effect; the consequence stays where it is.

>Success: The demon shifts the consequence to another eligible target. If the consequence is damage, the demon can change it to an inanimate object (the wall took the bullet instead of the demon's friend, for instance). Conditions, however, only shift to targets that might conceivably have them. Cars don't get Embarrassed and buildings don't become Lost. The character also risks Cover (apply a +1 modifier).

>Exceptional Success: As above, except that the character does not check for compromise.
Admittedly, I just grabbed that from http://www.thesubnet.com/portal/cod/dtd/CreationEmIn.html

>>45393238
One of those isn't even me. Also, why would I?

>>45393238
Youe sillye buggere

>>45393238
>It's obnoxious.
So are you.

>>45393230
>No, Bob, you can't be transgender.
Being transgender doesn't really make your sympathetic name harder to find, as most will use fake ID's even for their non-Mage life even if they aren't transgender. So if your ST gives that argument they are a fucking idiot.

>>45393230
>>All Mages have Deadnames

Reason four mages are cool with other people's self-identification, yes.

>>45393300
Technically that was your Reason One >>45393007

>>45393300
This whole makes me think of Stromae.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAMWdvo71ls

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>>45393481
I want this video flipped. I don't know why but the hair being combed to the left bothers me. It really feels like it should be combed to the other side. Like pic related.

No idea what they're singing, but cool video.

This might be the third or fourth time Stromae has come up in /wodg/. Is that you, or are there more francophone WoD fans than I'd have expected?
https://youtu.be/8aJw4chksqM
https://youtu.be/UKftOH54iNU

So, for ephemeral beings. Say you've got one, and it's got a spear(made of its own epehemera), is this spear capable of having a damage rating or would it have to ACTUALLY have a spear after manifesting? What if its body were, in its entirety a weapon(like a sword for example)

>>45393585
I generally rule that a spirit with a weapon-like growth, such as a spear, or huge nasty pointy teeth, have a weapon modifier equal to their rank. The actual size and shape doesn't matter, the mystical power behind the critter does.

>>45393601
yea, that would make the most sense. Either that or do it a la blast, where they can spend essence to "give" their weapon a modifier up to their rank.

Suicide Squad person here. I gave my potential players an example:

>I decide that I want to be a robot. To start with I decide that my Potency will be Reactor and my Energy will be Charge.
Because I'm a robot, it might do to have super tough skin, so the ST decides that 1/2 armour is a good idea. On top of that, I think it will be a good idea to have the "Natural Weapons" Dread Power, possibly just at X dots, to represent the fact that my fists are made of steel and plastic, wrapped in synthetic flesh. Because of my original functions, I also take the Biomechanical Nightmare Dread Power at 3 dots. It lets me pop out some of my robotic features, allowing me to connect to computers (allowing me to make Extended Computers rolls once per turn), unlock my hand to reveal a gun of some sort (the ST decides that I'll need to put bullets in it and suffer the Initiative penalties for using it, though), and an obvious sensor array that lets me see in the dark.

>It's also decided that because I'm a robot, I can't actually heal. If I want to get rid of my injuries, I have to make a Crafts check instead of Medicine and spend a point of Charge. It takes an hour a roll, but each time I heal 1 Lethal damage or 2 Bashing. If I get Aggravated, it'll take a day's worth of fixing to heal. When my Charge is lower than my Reactor dots, I get the Deprived Condition. I regain Charge with the Absorb Energy power related to Electricity. It isn't ranked and doesn't cost me any Charge to use, and I roll Stamina+Resolve+Reactor to see how much Charge I can gather up in a scene. (The ST decides that a wall outlet can give me maybe 1 Charge a day, but that if I really want to reCharge I'll need to be proactive about it).

I've actually been tempted to make a fan-made Night Horrors book that's just... monsters and shit.

>>45365581
Art please?

>>45370838
There was a group of aghori in a game I ran, that trained and performed specific ascetic practices in specific places to that a faerie would take them, due to fulfilling ancient oaths.

If the practitioner did everything correctly, Ravana appeared to him in flesh and taught him raksha-yoga, with training being harsh, mindfucking, but enlightening and fair.

So yes, if you want, it can be not-abusive trauma. Same for people whose Durance was inflicted on them by a Realm and not another sort of Title, "Revenant" (the movie) style, or like this guy here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexey_Maresyev

I notice that the book makes reference to the "Destiny Merit" for the fate sense numina, but unsurprisingly it's not in the book. Is it listed in one of the errata?

>>45393533
>No idea what they're singing, but cool video.
Try turning on Closed Captions.

>>45394009
I did. It still didn't make much sense to me. I don't understand the genderbending part.

>>45393946
>Put Fate back in
>Still don't put in Destiny
Ffuuuuuuuuuuuck. Why does my favourite game have to be so baaaaaad at thiiiiiiiings?
https://a.uguu.se/kjfzai_ChronicleofDarknessAndornWoD2e.pdf
Here's the most recent and ostensibly final version of the book. It still doesn't have Destiny listed as a Merit. Treat it either as Cursed or use the Mage version:

>[ 1 - 5 ] Destiny ( Mage: The Awakening -- Page 81 )

>Effect: Your character's thread stands out in the skein of fate. It may be cut short through tragedy or catastrophe, but until then, she has the ability to weave it into a sound pattern of her choosing. She is fated for great triumphs, and this Merit helps her achieve them. In true heroic fashion, she also has a fatal flaw -- no matter how strong her Pattern might be, it has one weakness others can use to tear it apart. For each chapter in a story, you have a pool of "destiny dice" equal to twice the number of dots your character has in this Merit. You can use them all on one dice roll, or split them up between different dice rolls. Either way, once you use them, they're gone until the next chapter or game session.
>Drawback: Your character's blessing has a price: Her bane. There is one type of person or situation that can bring her down. This bane can be summed up in one sentence, generally describing what her downfall will be. The Storyteller must either declare or approve this bane during the course of the game. Whenever the bane comes into play, the character's dice pools are penalized by one die per Destiny dot he possesses. This applies only to dice pools for directly dealing with the bane or for resisting its attacks, spells or even Social rolls to intimidate or persuade the character.
I had to cut out a lot of the "for instance" and examples to fit it in a 4chan comment.
http://www.thesubnet.com/portal/cod/mtaw/CreationMe.html

>>45394098
>Put Fate back in
>Still don't put in Destiny
NOICE.

>>45390946
He tackled a guy out a window, they landed on a car, he's completely fine after the fall.
The other guy and the car, not so much.

>>45393771
read the file name
alternatively
>>45367765
>>45367842
read the thread

ALTERNATIVELY
>>45368885
>>45369022
reverse image search using one of the given methods

>>45393585
According to CofD p.129 if the entity has a weapon use the appropriate weapon modifier.

>>45394961
She looks really J-Pop to be Molly Carpenter, who's supposed to look like her All-American Cheerleader Princess mother.

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>>45395487
Molly is also a teenager. Well, throughout most of the series. And now forever.

But that's official art for the LARP book. Also, could be worse. This is her from the DFRPG book, (I think)

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>>45395570
But this is the German cover

New Thread

>>45396543
>>45396543
>>45396543