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MtG Modern General
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>mfw people still don't realize that WotC intentionally ruined Modern to give people more reasons to move to their new not yet announced Eternal format and buy Eternal Masters
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>>45355096
you can't ruin something that was never good in the first place
>>
That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
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>>45355096
Do you think 9/11 was an inside job, as well?
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>>45355096
>intentionally

Simian Spirit Kek
>>
I don't think so but if they did I will be so mad. I just bought my playset of snapcasters.
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R8 my brew:

Gifts Loam

Creatures: 12
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Radha, Heir to Keld
1 Snapcaster Mage
3 Eternal Witness
2 Restoration Angel

Instants and Sorceries: 16
4 Faithless Looting
4 Path to Exile
3 Life from the Loam
1 Oona's Grace
4 Gifts Ungiven

Other Spells: 7
3 Molten Vortex
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Seismic Assault
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Trading Post

Land: 25
2 Raging Ravine
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Windswept Heath
2 Stomping Ground
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Steam Vents
1 Temple Garden
1 Breeding Pool
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Island
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Academy Ruins
1 Kessig Wolf Run

Sideboard: 15
3 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Stony Silence
2 Dispel
1 Negate
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Ray of Revelation
1 Celestial Purge
1 Disenchant
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
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>>45355446

>No Lingering Souls to flashback.
>No Primeval Titan.
>No Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite.
>Life From The Loam to get you back land you shouldn't need on your fourth turn.
>Not having Spellbomb on your Sideboard.

I mean some bits work, Eternal Witness and Faitless Looting work very well, but it's a bit too clunky to go finding lots of lands and burn the opponent out with Molten Vortex.

Build regular Gifts, man.
>>
>>45355096
>mfw SFM will be reprinted at mythic rarity
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>current meta
Why aren't you playing Hedron Alignment Combo /tg/?
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>>45355735
Because Eldrazi beats me before I can get the combo off.
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http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/modern-shouldnt-be-a-pro-tour-format/

>This was a bit of an epiphany for me. I knew you had to mulligan a lot in the format and I adjusted my play as such for the event, but I didn’t truly appreciate or understand how much until Sunday of the Pro Tour. The best way to get an edge in the format was to hope to play against people who had unplayable decks or that those who had made a good deck choice wouldn’t mulligan often enough.
>The nature of the Modern format is such that in most or all of the matchups you play, the influence of a single card in your hand is enormous. I know that if I play Infect against an Affinity or a Collected Company deck that I will have a much easier time winning if I draw Blighted Agent versus when I do not. It’s just so good against those decks, and they play little-to-no removal. Or look at Eye of Ugin in the Eldrazi deck—every matchup is better for them when they have that card in their opening hand, and the rest of the draws simply aren’t anywhere near as good.
>In most of the matchups I playtested in Modern, the game ended on turn 4. That’s insane! If the game ends on turn 4, you simply don’t have time to draw out of a risky keep. This is untrue of Standard, Draft, and Sealed, where you often play a match where both decks are slow and cumbersome. For that reason, you can keep a wider range of opening hands, because the cards you start with don’t hold all the power over how the game is decided.

tldr; Modern is shit because it's all opening hand coin flips due to the format being so impossibly fast.

>Now, how to beat Eldrazi?
>I don’t know.

Eldrazi literally beats Vintage decks. Eye of Ugin is ramping harder in Modern than Black Lotus does. Eye into Mimic + Mimic requires the same mana provided by Lotus Island into Mimic + Mimic. Phyrexian mana is also playing a part in the stupidity because it's also fast mana.
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>>45355948
It's a sad state of affairs when a Modern deck is so singularly powerful that it beats out Vintage decks. Isn't MUD supposed to be the strongest deck of all time? How does it do against Eldrazi?
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>>45355948
>listening to Owen "RTR/Theros standard was the best format ever" Turtenwald

He's right that Modern shouldn't be a PT format, but it has nothing to do with mulligans and everything to do with the fact that being a PT format means WotC has to create artificial rotation with bans to "keep things fresh" and give new cards a chance. Owen's just butthurt because he didn't win, because he's a fucking manchild.
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>>45355948
>Eldrazi literally beats Vintage decks
The only reason Eldrazi beats Shops is because Shops is tuned for Vintage's super degenerate meta.

Eldrazi can't touch Oath or Storm or whatever Vintage's FotM Control deck is.
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>>45356050
Modern is a format where winning is predicated on the matchup lottery, then preboard, the goldfish draw, and postboard the silver bullet sideboard draw

Skill ceiling is down in the Mariana Trench
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>>45356045
MUD is a metagame deck

most of its tools are near useless against Eldrazi because they're designed for the vintage metagame, it's a shit comparison.
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>>45356068
Eat a Snickers, Owen. You're not you when you're hungry
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>>45356098
He's right, you know.
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>>45356098
I mean, it's not like he's wrong. PVDDR even said that modern is boiling down to who draws into their sideboard cards first.
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>>45356107
>>45356110
If that were true, you wouldn't see the same people consistently winning. Except Patrick Dickmann's has been hugely successful in modern with surprising consistency, using multiple decks
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Rev up those fryers
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>>45356161
Millhouse will never be a meme
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>>45356068
>>45356110

and why is that?
because modern is a safe space format created for people who perceive interaction, control and combo as unfair and unfun

I was never happier than after this PT to actually sticking with Legacy
there is bullshit in this format as well, but at least it is exciting bullshit that requires some brain to grasp


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dakyl80hzvQ
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>>45356161
Give me a hug, mayne
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>>45356137
You see the same people consistently winning because they're the ones consistently playing.
Most people don't have money to spend on traveling around to every GP or SCG event.

Winning with surprising consistency using multiple decks isn't exactly an argument FOR format complexity.
If players can switch between decks and there's enough carryover in decision making between all of them that they're always doing well, that would imply it's not difficult for the players to switch. Which means either the players are skilled in all of the myriad strategies and choices to make in every deck they've played, or their skills are universal because every deck is the same fucking thing
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REMOVE BLOOD MOON remove blood moon you are worst moon
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>>45356209
Not only this, but most people have jobs and a life outside of magic, that usually means you have other fiscal responsibilities than travelling around playing games.

Look at the typical sideboards across modern right now, that shows you how much each deck is the same fucking thing
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>>45356261
Fuck off, scrub.
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>>45356261
>eldritch moon prints eldritch moon
>all lands are wastes
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>>45356261
Blood moon meh moon, leave it be, people need to feel special
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>>45356275
thank mr tentacle
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>>45356209
>You see the same people consistently winning because they're the ones consistently playing.
Sounds like a healthy format in which more experienced/skilled players beat less experienced/skilled players, and not one determined by lucky draws.
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>>45355542
>No Lingering Souls to flashback.
Lingering Souls is nice, but Molten Vortex should give me plenty of board control.

>No Primeval Titan.
?
I've never seen a Gifts or Loam deck with Titan. He's Valakut thing.

>No Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite.
I though about putting in the Unburial Rites combo, but I don't think it's that useful in Modern any more.

>Life From The Loam to get you back land you shouldn't need on your fourth turn.
I have 9 discard outlets to dump lands I draw with Loam. I'll have to playtest it before I can finalize the numbers on some cards though. I might shave a Gifts, a Loam, Radha, a Vortex, or Trading Post for Lightning Bolt or Helix and another Snapcaster.

>Not having Spellbomb on your Sideboard.
Eh. Some way to deal with pro-red and pro-white maindeck is nice.

You did remind me to run Nihil Spellbomb over Cage in the sideboard though.
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>>45356267
>complains about the pro tour
>lol, people have lives outside of magic, loser, I should be able to wander into a random event and win whenever I want. Modern is too hard, guys!
>>
>Don't try to kill the Eldrazi titans. And don't let the titans escape to threaten other worlds.
Seriously, what to do?
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>>45356368
Forgot pic
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>>45356358
>I though about putting in the Unburial Rites combo, but I don't think it's that useful in Modern any more.
Literally Creatures: the Tappening.
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>>45356368
get a magic dragon man to imprison them
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>>45356364
>Regionals Event
>Haven't gone to an event in a long time
>Buy last minute entry
>Build Eldrazi Aggro at event before player meeting
>Win consistantly throughout event
>Drop after 8 hours because I have a life
>MFW 6-0 at an random event
>MFW I win whenever I want
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>>45356376
I don't know how these fucking idiots killed a single fucking eldrazi like seriously build a deck with as many Jaces, Gideons, Chandras and Nissas you want and any eldrazi deck will just facefuck you to death this makes me really fucking mad.
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>>45356382
I know, that's why I'm going to burninate them with Molten Vortex and Seismic Assault.

The problem with Gifts-Rites is that it's slow and it puts a bunch of dead cards in your deck. With the exception of Trading Post (which is jank next level tech and not core to the deck) none of the cards in my deck are dead unless you draw them in multiples.

That's the issue with traditional 4c Gifts in my experience. If you build too much around Gifts then eventually almost every card in the deck revolves around resolving Gifts and you just have a pile.
>>
>New to modern
>Decide the new gauntlet mode on MTGO is a good way to get familiar with decks
>Join a queue
>Get given Goryo's Vengeance deck to play
>Have no idea what I'm doing

The gauntlet mode is a good idea in principle, but including combo decks with loads of different angles probably wasn't a smart idea.
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>>45356422
they started on turn 10 and forced the eldrazi to jump into the game at turn 0
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>>45356429
>That's the issue with traditional 4c Gifts in my experience. If you build too much around Gifts then eventually almost every card in the deck revolves around resolving Gifts and you just have a pile.
WUBg Gifts doesn't really revolve around the combo, at least the way I've built it. Pretty much a slightly slower Junk deck filled with meme rhinos.
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>>45356341
What? How the fuck could someone be so idiotic as to infer something so asinine from that statement? No you fucking retard, the point was that you'll recognize names in the top 8 because those names will play in more events.


The people who have bought lottery tickets a hundred times are far more likely to have won the lottery than someone who's only bought a ticket once or twice, that doesn't mean the lottery is won with the skills you've acquired in past lotteries.
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>>45356459
Your probability of winning the lotto doesn't increase the more you play, the amount of money you spent has though

>skills you've acquired in past lotteries
literally what
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>>45356364
No it's the exact opposite. Pro Tour players should be winning basically any games against the LGS-crowd, but they don't. The top 8 in PTOGW was full of second-rate memers. I mean, fucking Frank Lepore? PT top 8? Seriously?
People aren't complaining they don't have a high winrate in Modern, they're complaining they don't get to make interesting decisions for better or worse.
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>>45356459
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

This is why someone could be as dumb as that. He ignores the players who don't top 8. He doesn't see Patrick Chapin attending every PT, but as soon as Chapin makes top 8, he'll say he got lucky. He ignores things that disprove him because it takes time and effort to disprove yourself, while focusing on the things that prove him right.
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>>45356489
>Your probability of winning the lotto doesn't increase the more you play
Wow how can anyone be this stupid? You're telling me that someone with 1000000 tickets has the same chance of winning as someone with 1 ticket?
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>>45356422
They had JtMS on 15 before the game started.
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>>45356512
Playing once ever week, or playing a lot at once are two very different things

Obviously one has a higher chance of winning than the other, and I wasn't talking about this one
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>>45356512
you either win your you dont, its all 50/50 chance
>>
I have a UWR midrange deck. But I'm taking a break from Modern, and I suggest you all do the same.

I'm playing yugioh now!
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>>45356537
Now THIS is bait.
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So I'm doing this thing, I just love Phyrexian Crusader and my meta is full of zoo and decks that have a difficult time removing this card from play.

What other sort of cards go in? A couple removal spells and some pump?

Also I am disgusted that I have a non-Conflux Noble Hierarch.
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>>45356564
aww shit son we got some bugs n thugs
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>>45355948
>Eldrazi literally beats Vintage decks.

It's 2 turns slower than Bazaar Dredge. Also, link to them beating Vintage decks? I find it hard to believe that it beats Shops only because Mishra's Workshop isn't even Legendary and a single Lodestone Golem shuts down the deck.
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>>45356498
Patrick Chapin doesn't top 8 a lot because he's always been a better Brewer than player. This is true across all formats, not just a modern thing.
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>>45356489
are you retarded?
Like seriously, do you have some kind of mental deficiency you're not telling me about? Because if you truly are disabled in every cognitive capacity as it seems, I promise you have my utmost sympathies, but if not, you should probably kill yourself

>>45356498
I'm honestly not sure whether you're rebutting me with sarcasm, or agreeing with me.
My own argument was (implicitly) that there's a confirmation bias when arguing for the skill-intensity of Modern, in seeing those common pro player faces at events being in the top 8 at several events being a result of their skill always (or significantly more often at least) putting them in top 8 of each individual event, rather than simply playing several events and being recognized when making it, but ignored when not.

>but as soon as Chapin makes top 8, he'll say he got lucky
This is the part that's tripping me up, because I don't see why someone who is arguing for the skill-intensity of a format would say that a top-level player got lucky when he made top 8
Unless this is a veiled dig at Chapin in which case it went way over my head, and I thought Chapin was still one of the pros sitting at the cool kids table? All I heard recently was that Ajani thing and that seemed innocuous to me. Why wouldn't Chapin appeal, after all.

Also I thought only Winter PT was Modern? Standard looks fine to me. Kinda low-power but I didn't see it as particularly braindead (I never really played Standard except the jankiest of tier 3 Séance decks in Inn/RTR, all hail Trostani populating Craterhoofs)
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>>45356557
nah mate it's this ancient form of linguistic voodoo called a_______ joke

Autism is a natural shield against its manipulative ways, but someone boring and neurotypical might have smirked at it instead of going straight for the memeplay
>>
Ban Eye of Ugin, problem solved.
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>>45356430
I haven't played MODO for half a decade, and even then I just drafted. How's gauntlet mode work? You get handed any deck for which you own the cards? Or the (too cool to be true) option of just getting a random tier 1 or 2 deck from the format and playing it against another player who got a different one?
I think a gauntlet would probably work better if you could pick the deck you're playing and want to play against, but that might have a long queue time
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>>45356564
I fucking love Noble Hierarch. I just wish infect wasn't such a fragile deck and so overplayed in my meta.
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>>45356656
>See? Bannings are essential for a healthy format! :^)
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>>45356623
I was agreeing with you. Chapin was just the first name to spring to mind when it comes to players who are considered good and attend event after event yet very rarely top 8.
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>>45356701
Well. Bannings have been necessary since alpha to have a somewhat fair meta. I don't see a reason why WotC don't just ban the cards that are trouble-makers. They certainly didn't hesitate to remove splinter twin from the format entirely.
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>>45356529
While you're not exactly wrong in what you're saying, you're misconstruing the analogy. It was implicit that you're ignoring every week they're not winning, and looking at whether or not a person has won the lottery at all in his lifetime. This was probably because it honestly could've been what you're saying, since the wording was ambiguous.

Essentially you're not looking at whether or not the lottery ticket owners win more percentage-wise each "drawing" of the lotto, you're looking at whether they have won more over the course of an entire season (or lifetime in the case of the lottery since that shit is NEVEREVER.jpg, but really any timeframe that creates a gap in total attempted lotto wins between the known entity grinders and the nameless faceless masses who just play when SCG is in town).
>>
Does anybody saved the shoop of Thought Knot Seer with a mustace and a hat one?

I need it for SCIENCE.
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>>45356702
Okay, I just don't think I understand why the "other side" would say Chapin got lucky if he got in top 8, as opposed to him getting in the top 8 would be a result of his high level of skill, by extension arguing that a high level of skill is more important than variance when trying to make top 8.

Wouldn't him saying a skilled player making top 8 was just luck undermine his point? Or at least not further it?

I'm really sorry if I'm being stupid or obtuse I just don't think I get it senpaisama
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>>45356701
They are though, as long as the correct things are banned.

Like, is there anyone who doesn't think e.g. Legacy is better off having degenerate shit like Earthcraft banned?
>>
>Ban
Eye of Ugin

>Unban
Ancestral Vision
Ancient Den
Birthing Pod
Bloodbraid Elf
Chrome Mox
Cloudpost
Dark Depths
Deathrite Shaman
Dread Return
Glimpse of Nature
Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Preordain
Punishing Fire
Rite of Flame
Second Sunrise
Seething Song
Splinter Twin
Stoneforge Mystic
Sword of the Meek
Tree of Tales

>Reprint
Wasteland
Rishidan Port
Force of Will
Stifle

>Legality Changes
Cards legal in Modern are either:
1) A previously or currently standard legal set starting from Mirrodin up to the present day
2) Cards printed in a Modern Masters set
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>>45356809
temple is more problematic than eye
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>>45356842
No it isn't, shut up. Eye of Ugin essentially generates 2 mana every time you want to cast an Eldrazi. It's entirely possible to "generate" 12 mana on turn one with it in Modern.
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>>45356842
Banning Eye benefits Control decks more.
>>
>Forsythe tweets he's playing the PT Gauntlet with Burn

>says Chalice tilts him hard

Sharpen that ban scythe...
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>>45356664
You get allocated a random deck that went 7-3 or better at the latest PT and then get thrown into a three-round Swiss.
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>>45356057
Or dredge, only processors could do something near it.

>>45356605
Lodestone is a 5/3 non-haste, and the deck barely plays spells, shops is made and tunned with 1 job. And only 1 job. Genocide unfair magic players. You play spells? Fuck you. You play on curve? Fuck you. You cheat spell costs? Fuck you.

Compare eldrazi, it plays creatures, yes cheap and nearly free, but creatures. Hell dragonstompy will take a huge nigger shit all over it because it can drop'n'pop a trini or similar ASAP.
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>>45356595
RACIST! THAT DOES NOT REFLECT TGE VALUES OF WIZURS OF THR COAST AND IS PROBABLT ILLEGAL AND YOUR PROBABLY WHITE IM SO TRIGGERED REEEEEE
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>>45356422
They're playing with a share mana pool, clearly.

>Jace: no. no. good heavens, no. no you can't cast that. no. double no. n-o-p-e.

>Gideon: COME AT ME BRO. COME AT ME BRO. DOESN'T EVEN HURT BRO. ARE YOU EVEN TRYING BRO. DO YOU EVEN LIFT BRO.

>Nissa: ok, plant a lotus, channel for 19, leylines are in place, aaaaand...

>Chandra: FIREBALL!!!
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>>45356564
I'd rather get bricked by Crusader than get Chaliced for 1.

Deflecting Palm.
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>>45355948
>The whole post
LMAO MODERN NO SKILLZ ALL IN MULLIDUDE AND SIDEBOARD, LMAO OP CARDS, NO SKILL AT ALL!!!
And then we have this pearl:
>Modern is a skill-intensive format
Lolno.
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>>45356972
If you'd finish reading that sentence he said that the skills Modern needs aren't related to actually playing the game; it's more about picking the right deck and knowing when to mulligan.
>>
Neat.
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>>45356997
Then you can play any other magic format and do exactly the same anon.

Oh. But also needs you to be good.
>>
I just want money so I can buy Legacy MUD and not torture myself over this shit
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>>45357019
You don't play much Magic if you think that other formats are as hand/mulligan dependant as Modern. The questions are 1) how much of your deck do you see in the average game, and 2) how many decisions do you make along the way. This is only bearing in mind decks that make top 8 regularly.

>Modern
1) ~10 cards since most games end on turn 4
2) Little to none

>Standard
1) Probably 20-30 cards in the average game because the format is slow
2) Not all that many

>Legacy
1) If you're running Brainstorm/Ponder/Jace/Top, you can see most by the time the game ends
2) Depending on the deck it varies from little to none, all the way up to dozens

If you're both only seeing a tiny portion of your deck, a game between you isn't a comparison of decks, it's a comparison of hands.
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>>45357003
>ban eye
>hand is still possible with a second temple
>ban temple
>hand isnt possible without simians

eye is totally the problem and should be banned
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>>45357079
Eye leads to the most explosive draws. Dumping a bunch of 2/Xs onto the field turn one is a really really strong play.
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>>45357074
>Say that other formats need you to be good at deckbuilding and sideboard building and have skill, while modern is only good at mulliganing and picking the broken deck of the day
You're retarded anon.
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>>45356605
Shops is packed with tools to beat the hilariously unfair decks of vintage, that don't work very well against Eldrazi. Chalice, for example, is basically a dead card, since you can't possibly lock anything important out before they've played it.
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>>45357130
>Chalice, for example, is basically a dead card
Well it's funny you should say that because Chalice is a 4 of in Eldrazi too.
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>>45357148
Because it fucks fair decks.
If most of the field is other eldrazi the might not run it.
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>>45357148
Chalice just assrapes Modern due to the pressures of the format demanding you hug your curve low to the ground, there just hasn't been a deck as good as Eldrazi to take advantage of Chalice.

The format definitely deserves to be assraped by Chalice, but at the same time we're ill prepared to adapt to a Chalice-resistant curve since Eldrazi can just steamroll you for slowing down even a tiny bit. Card should be benched for a few years at the very least so that the cardpool can grow to handle it.
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>>45357181
The card just shouldn't be legal in Modern. Wizards doesn't print land destruction anymore because being prevented from playing the game is "unfun", yet Chalice and Blood Moon are allowed to run rampant.
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>>45357099
Poor choices vis a vis deckbuilding and sideboarding have more of an effect per-game in Memedern than comparative choices in literally any other format

you're retarded, anon
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>>45357219
>but muh fair decks that use Chalice

Seriously what decks legitimately need Chalice right now other than Memedrazi?

At least with Blood Moon you can play around it by not fetching like a greedy shit, playing around Chalice means making your deck worse.
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>>45357229
>per-game in Memedern
Hahahaha.
HAHAHAHAHA.

Okay, okay.
Go to a legacy event without graveyard hate, it'd be fun!
Or better, better, go to a vintage event, you got this eh? without grave or artifact hate.
>>
>>45357251
>Seriously what decks legitimately need Chalice right now other than Memedrazi?
Affinity because Chalice for 1 on turn 2 after you've already cast all of your 1 mana spells shitstomps half the field.

Oh look, the OTHER deck with fast mana can abuse Chalice of the Void too!
>>
My problem with Chalice stems from the fact that Modern is already bottlenecked uber hard on cantrips. Chalice on 1 simply fucks a ton of decks out of card draw. Tell me, in what format is that even remotely fair or pleasant to play against?

Knowing Wizards, they'll ban Chalice in April but leave Eye and Temple wide open for play.
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>>45357258
>Affinity
>playing Chalice

>wasting card slots and mana when you're already able to circumvent interaction using Cranial Plating and/or Arcbound Ravager to shuffle damage and ignore the declare blockers step

Nigger you fucking what

>>45357280
bottlenecked on cantrips?
How about bottlenecked on 1cmc.

The only decks that could feasibly ignore getting shut down like this are the Cascade combo decks. Living End might have a chance, fight draft chaff with draft chaff and all, but Restore Balance? Yeah nah that shit's fucked.
>>
>>45357258
Are you trying to imply that hate against broad archetypes like "graveyard" or "artifact" is a nobrainer in Legacy and Vintage? Because if so, then you're a fucking idiot. For like, twenty reasons you mongoloid, but here's one that should make you kill yourself:
You lose if you aren't packing that shit in Modern too (and much more dramatically, too) so even if eternal formats have braindead sideboards, Modern is at minimum (and there is not a single way you could ever in any way deny this) just as braindead wrt. sideboards as the other formats.

Additionally, there's significantly more choices to make in sideboard slots in Eternal formats than there are in Modern, but I think having to actually know anything would be too much to ask from you, so I'll give you a pass on toddler-tier logic. You'll probably catch onto that level of thinking when you get out of kindergarten.
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>>45357302
So you're saying if I choose to not pack sideboard artifact hate at my local vintage event, I'm going to do just fine? You're saying that if I AVOID packing artifact hate, my opponent will SIDE OUT his powerful artifacts and I'll get a free win?

Boy howdy, I sure can't wait to get assfucked by Black Lotus and friends!
>>
>>45357302
>Not packing grave hate and artifact hate in vintage
This is what happens when you don't pack load of artifact hate in vintage
You lose.
This is what happens when you don't pack loads of gravehate on vintage
Daddy dredge teams up with every degenerate combo deck and they do a gang bang on you.
>>
>>45357347
No I'm not saying that you inbred illiterate howler-monkey.

Even if you were right (and you aren't, but let's suppose we're in bizarro world where you're not the stupidest mongoloid in the world), and picking your sideboard takes NO skill whatsoever in Eternal formats, even if this were true, then you would still be a fucking moron because Modern requires the EXACT SAME anti-archetype hate, meaning it cannot in any conceivable notion of logic be LESS braindead than the Eternal formats, because the (non-)arguments you posited for Eternal formats being braindead exist in equal proportion in Memedern. It is either equally braindead, or more braindead.

With even the simplest of understanding of Legacy/Vintage, this would then by extension mean that any of the myriad factors (far more diverse metagame both in terms of how they function and thus how to beat them, as well as speed and resilience of the different decks functioning within their own engine archetype, far more maindeck tools to deal with linear strategies, far better card filtering and thus decrease of variance in drawing your sideboard cards allowing for more strategically important considerations than "lol Stony Silence auto-win gimme 4x dat shit aww yiss", and other things that would be blindingly obvious if you didn't have shit-for-brains) even if that is only the most minute, most infinitesimal of influences on sideboard decions, each of those factors individually would make your shitty garbage format more braindead wrt. deckbuilding and sideboarding.


Essentially you're the stupidest of niggers and you need to go shove a cactus up your vagina.

>>45357447
>hurrdurr there is only one possible choice to counter a given archetype durrrr
>murrrr I am smart wow rest in peace is so good in my 4c Loam I'll beat the dredge nazis for surrrrrrr
>>
>>45357464
Lmao memedern kiddo is buttgenocided isn't he?
>>
>>45356859
>>45357079
>>45357097

see, you guys are the reason people say /tg/ sucks at magic

Watch me do the Eldrazi trick with some old fucking cards that are all legal:
Darksteel Citadel, Memnite, Memnite, Frogmite, Frogmite, Frogmite, Frogmite.
Am I now going to magically win and be the new bully on the block? If so, why isn't anyone fucking playing this?

You suckers go all "whaaat, 3 creatures on T1!!!" while this is a risky fucking bullshit move you can only do if your follow up seals the deal.

And that follow up is entirely and solely fueled by Eldrazi Temple. Eye says fucking nope to colorless mana. Temple is the sol land with no drawback that enables them to seal the deal with TKS.

Without Eye the whole tribe dies. Without Temple we just won't see T2 TKS and T3 Smashers anymore.

You guys cry over WotC killing diversity but you want to eradicate a whole new tribal deck.
>>
>>45357464
>>hurrdurr there is only one possible choice to counter a given archetype durrrr
Yes. There is another way of countering dredge, degenerate combodecks (that need gravehate AND spell hate, because spells and recurring them is broken in vintage) and shops.
Win t1 before they get to shit all over everything.


Oh wait. That kind of deck is also dogshit and the only deck that can win t1 in vintage without being a meme-tier joke of a deck is storm getting a godhand.
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>>45357464
Here's what I'm getting from you:

>magic takes no skill
>sideboarding is easy
>building a sideboard isn't hard
>muh vintage artifact hate
>muh vintage graveyard strategy
>hurr durr nothing in this game takes skill, just put in 4 RiP and 4 Stony Silence

You're a special kind of absolute fucking cancer, aren't you
>>
>>45357514
"One way" means one card you nigger, not one avenue of interaction
>>
>>45356430
If you're new to Modern, then you probably shouldn't be jumping into the gauntlet to become familiar with decks.
>>
>>45357531
No, that's what you were saying you fucking mongoloid.
>"Poor choices in the 75 are more impactful in other formats than Modern"
>LMAO XD HAHAHAHAHA. Okay, okay. Go to a legacy event without graveyard hate, it'd be fun! Or better, better, go to a vintage event, you got this eh? without grave or artifact hate.
>"You're implying Legacy and Vintage take as little or less skill than Modern, which there is literally not a single way possible for Legacy or Vintage "
>lol u sure are dumb nigger wow you are absolute cancer
>>
>>45357508
>Without Temple we just won't see T2 TKS and T3 Smashers anymore.
wouldnt see them without eye either, buttburglar
>>
>>45355746
Dat irony
>>
>>45356430
Griselcannon is pretty simple.


You want to get Griselbrand into the graveyard, and then get him out with Goryo's Vengeance. Then you draw cards using Nourishing Shoal exiling Worldspine Wurm until you can Through the Breach a Borborygmos Enraged (powered via SSG +/- mana rituals) and then start chucking lands for the kill.

Or something like that.
>>
>>45355096
>the sky is falling! The sky is falling!
>>
>>45357569
Double or triple temple, cocksucker

>>45357508
Banning temple would remove Eldrazi from the format which would be a bit sad, no one wants archetypes to just disappear
Banning Eye makes it less consistently explosive and oppressive, without killing it completely
>>
>>45357601
double temple is less likely than eye + temple
>>
>>45357626
double temple is more likely than eye + 6 mimics/endless ones
>>
>>45357626
Yes it is.
You'd still see it occasionally though.

No one's saying either Eye or Temple ban wouldn't neuter the deck, but Temple ban completely removes the stompy plan while Eye removes the "lel nice 2/2 for 1 here's 4 2/1s for 0 :^)"
>>
>>45357258
>Go to a legacy event without graveyard hate, it'd be fun!
That's not what he was saying, obviously if you play a deck that isn't playable then you can't win, but in legacy has more variance on in game skill.
>lol no you just die to grave hate
Only if you play dredge. That doesn't happen with lands, ANT, reanimator or fucking zombardment, which are all better graveyard decks.
>>
>>45357646
no one cares about that
>>
>>45357508
The difference between Citadel into 2 Memnite 4 Frogmite and Eye into 4 Mimic into Temple, TKS, is the hilarious amount of damage Eldrazi outputs before anything else can happen. Tribal decks like Merfolk and Goblins is fine, and even to an extent Eldrazi is okay too. But when you have 25 power on board turn 2, I tend to draw a line. Sure, Affinity can shit out 10 power on turn 1 (2 Memnite, 4 Frogmite), but it's not completely unstoppable. Eldrazi literally just steamrolls with the amount of fast mana it gets, and it doesn't help that Eldrazi has the most broken tribe mechanics (I'm looking at you, Annihilator).

I'm for banning either Eye or Temple. Taking one down would not completely wreck the archetype but it would still give Eldrazi enough of a broken leg to allow other decks to play again.
>>
>>45357660
no one cares fag kill yourself

ban eye end of story everyone else is retarded
>>
you know how to really impact modern in a positive way?

ban bolt

no, seriously
>>
>>45357716
Reprint Price of Progress and Fireblast, makes Eldrazi an outwin for Burn
>>
>>45357590
It was the Grixis version with Jace and Emrakul rather than the Grishoalbrand version. I understand what the deck is trying to do but in terms of knowing what hands to keep and when to "go off" I was fairly clueless.
>>
>>45357716
wew lad
>>
>>45357533
>One card
>Enough to hate out any deck in vintage
Lmao

Using 1 RiP will make any unfair grave-abusing deck rape you.
Using 1 artifact hate is not worth it.
>>
>>45357727
I am totally in for the Price reprint

making people lose to their $$$ manabase feels like snorting coke
>>
>>45357508
Here's the difference. your hypothetical affinity deck is dumping a hand of vanilla 1/1s and 2/2s. The Eldrazi deck is dumping 2/1s that get the power and toughness of any colorless creature that you play. Your scenario swings for 10 damage the next turn. The Eldrazi deck swings for 20.
>>
>>45357734
do you know how many interesting creatures up to 4 mana would be playable that have a toughness lower 3 or lower? bolt is the reason why modern is stuck in the cantrip/aggro game.
>>
>>45357660
yeah I was thinking of the colored ones while writing and you're completely right that Eye is very helpful for them, but that's as they're currently built

The thing is I think that the Eldrazi decks could adapt, partly at least.
In a situation where you only cast one Eldrazi, Eye or Temple do pretty much the same thing (except when you've got Urborg out of course).
Eye's main advantage is in being able to shit out several creatures a turn allowing you to play nothing but action, while Temple has the benefit of not being worthless in multiples.

There's a fair point to be made that Eye's inevitability through its ability, as well as the lack of card selection in Modern makes Eye's drawback negligible and Temple's benefit just as negligible simply because you probably won't see two Eyes or Temples in the same game. In this situation, Eye is far more powerful.

I think with Eye ban, the decks would start playing less creature-heavy decks. Eye devalues everything in your deck that isn't a creature, maybe with Temple not giving that huge boost to anything with the Eldrazi type just means they include other cards?

You're 100% right that the Eldrazi decks as they currently are care more about Eye than Temple though and would have a better time surviving with Temple ban rather than Eye.
My leaning towards Eye ban being better for Eldrazi Stompy as an archetype is mostly conjecture. I think the decks would be able to adapt but that thought is nothing but muh feels at this point.
>>
>>45357716
>Ban
Eye of Ugin
Eldrazi Temple
Cranial Plating
Blood Moon

>Unban
Bloodbraid Elf
Stoneforge Mystic
>>
>>45357801
>ban cranial plating
affinity is incredibly weak post sideboard

>ban eye
>ban temple
we only need eye banned

>unban stonforge mystic
NO.

>>45357508
the affinity creatures have no value in themselves. its gg after a pyroclasm or any sweeper. eldrazi creatures have value when etb or dying or casting, plus they are 3/3's and 4/4's and the robots are 1/1's
>>
>>45355096
What the fuck are you talking about?
>>
>>45357735
are you this fucking retarded
Rest in Piece is one card
I am not talking about one physical piece of cardboard, I'm talking about one fucking card as in "this card does this thing"
Modern's hate is very uniform. There's no Containment Priest, no DRS, no big decks that care about Grafdigger's Cage, no deck where you can afford Tormod's Crypt, no situational tutors like GSZ that allow you to just run Ooze if your deck can support it, etc.

You have far more options (and far more tradeoffs) to make in Eternal.
>>
>>45357801
>ban Blood Moon

If you want greedy mana, go play Standard.
>>
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>>45357786
I forgot the drawback of Eye that it doesn't actually produce mana for anything but creatures, but that's fairly obvious and is part of the comparative devaluation of creatures when your Sol land is Temple instead of Eye, but you never know in Memedern: you might get jolly fellows like >>45356161 replying and widening the normal distribution
>>
>>45355446
Loam decks are the biggest memes in modern
>>
>>45357921
>Rest in Piece is one card
Why yes, I want to not use my snapies, wills, cruises, etc...
>>
>>45357935
My gripe with Blood Moon is that it often ends games from the moment it hits the battlefield, how many other three-drops do that?
>>
Pack Rat and mutavault are going to be the next two cards that spike immensely in the coming two to three months. Screenshot this, familia.
>>
>>45357716
>what is infect and affinity and all the other creature decks

the majority of decks that play bolt are fair/interactive decks this ban would make the meta even more linear
>>
>>45358244
If we're including reduced cost cards? About half the Eldrazi deck.
>>
>>45357776
Bolt also stops a lot of aggro strategies too, losing it would make the likes of Goblin Guide, Swiftspear and Wild Nacatl more dominant than they already are.
>>
>>45358319
Agreed, which is why almost everyone thinks that some combination of Eye of Ugin and Eldrazi Temple should be banned too.
>>
>>45358244
It ends the game against greedy decks that refuse to respect Moon.

The only time it's degenerate is if powered out turn 1 on the play, and I think only one deck exists that would ever try doing that. It's fringe at best, too.

You know what else is degenerate turn 1 on the play? Chalice of the Void for 1. You know what deck does that? Diamond Stompy. It's far from a fringe deck.
>>
>>45358454
>Diamond Stompy
desu it's bad dragon stompy.
>>
>>45355234
>implying it wasnt
>>
>>45358454
I think my favorite part about playing legacy is spending a grand on duals, then always fetching basics.
>>
>>45358964
Gotta respect those Wastelands.
>>
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Why not simply reformat modern to use the legacy card pool minus the reserved list?

simply paste the reserved list into the legacy b&r list and use that for the modern format.
>>
>>45358964
So I can get into Legacy without spending $$$ on duals, right?
>>
>>45359003
Wasteland beats legacy
Basics beat wasteland
Therefore, basics are greater than legacy
>>
>>45358255
mutavault already went back up to RTR-THS price levels.
>>
>>45358454
The problem with "just fetch up basics" is that some draws just don't allow for that. You could have the nut draw and still have serious questions of whether to mulligan or not because of how oppressive Moon is.

It feels fairly redundant to point at colourless Eldrazi as a way of showing that Blood Moon is a fair card because both of them are broken to the point where they shouldn't be allowed in modern.
>>
>>45359017
FoW would be a 1000$ card
>>
>>45359043
Try to build back to basics control
>>
>>45359071
So you can't keep a speculative hand because it folds to blood moon? How is this oppressive, that's just you get punished for greedy hands sometimes
>>
On one hand I like that there is a super high power level deck, but I hate that there is only one super high power level deck

Modern general I believe we have been asking for this for a long time
>>
>>45359122
I wouldn't class any hand that lets you play a fair game of Magic as being a "greedy hand"
>>
>second Engineered Explosive arrived in the mail

Now do I main deck them to out-yomi Eldrazi Chalice on 1?
>>
>>45359167
Your hand that can't beat a blood moon is. You kept it even though it loses to something. It's possible that it's still fine to keep, but if you lose to blood moon that's on you
>>
>>45359152
Before the Twin ban we wanted Twin gone and Pod to come back. Now that Twin is gone we want Eldrazi gone and Twin back. At this point I don't think even Pod has enough strength to beat the Eldrazi menace. You either play Eldrazi or you lose to Eldrazi.

Bring back Cruise, Burn is hero we need now
>>
>>45359073
it would be a viable reprint in modern masters without disrupting standard. lots of things would.
>>
>>45359276
>Before the Twin ban we wanted Twin gone and Pod to come back
literally nobody asked for this in a serious post
>>
>>45359276
I still think Treasure Cruise Delver vs Pod was the best Modern has ever been.
>>
>>45359276
>Cruise
>in Burn

Might as well just build Delver all the way, it's the better TC deck than Burn with less Bolts.
>>
>>45359316
Compared to the metagame from the past 4 months? Fuck yeah it was.
>>
>>45359316
I dunno about best, but I came a little every time I drew three cards for a single blue mana
>>
>>45359043
Goblins is fun as shit, and has had a couple top 8's recently, but you kinda fold to anything with Deathrite Shaman. Merfolk is kind of a thing, though you still have to shell out for force of will. Burn has gotten better since Eidolon of the Great Revel was printed, but it's still not amazing. Monoblack pox is fun if you hate people. Death and Taxes is a legitimately good deck.

You've got some options. They basically all are going to require wastes and ports, though, which are almost as expensive as duals.
>>
>>45359359
Twin was only banned in January
>>
>>45359316
I actually think modern peaked just before Khans came out. Cruise Delver vs. Rhino pod was fun if you played either of those decks, shitty for everyone else.
>>
>>45359409
Goblins generally runs plateau or badlands to help shore up the shitty combo matchup
>>
>>45359416
The metagame wasn't particularly great prior to the twin ban either.
>>
>>45359017
99% of the decks people currently have would become trash.
>>
>>45359439
True, but it's entirely possible to put together a workable mono-red list. Plus the duals that goblins would consider tend to be the cheapest, and you usually don't run a full playset
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>>45359043
You could build an Enlightened Tutor deck like I did.

Solidarity High Tide is also an option.
>>
>>45359461
they aren't already?
>>
>>45359375
>Play pauper tron
>all demn cruises
>all demn cards
Sublime.
>>
>>45359504
Trash as in cannot compete with the Legacy field, not as n "lele i am le pro player your dek sux xDD".
>>
>>45359490
Spring Tide is better than solidarity, but it might be a touch more expensive.

In any case those 10 guru islands will break the bank.
>>
>>45356893
What a fucking idiot
He shoulda known better
Woulda done better with affinity or infect
Fucking tool
>>
>>45359507
anon they banned cruise in pauper

I would know, I play Angler Delver
>>
>>45359522
PT Gauntlet is a thing on MODO right now where it gives you a random deck from the pro tour
>>
>>45359526
I know, I know.
I'm still sad. I miss drawing cards. All of them. I miss nearly killing myself to milling my ass out just by drawing so fucking much
>>
>>45359518
Burn, affinity, infect, storm, scapeshift and basically everything but BGx gets at least 1 cheap card that makes the deck significantly better
>>
>>45359518
i don't see how that is any different from the current plan for 'shaking up' modern every few ban cycles.
>>
>>45359490
How does this win? I'm interested.
>>
>>45359544
I regularly hit single digits in my library without cruise, I don't know how I could stop myself from decking myself for more cards

thought scour is my waifu
>>
>>45359587
looks like rest/helm combo. activate helm of obedience for 1 with a rest in peace active, none of the cards actually go to the graveyard since RiP exiles them, they exile their entire deck.
>>
>>45359587
helm of obedience + RIP makes the other guy exile his entire library in one shot.
>>
>>45359587
From the looks of it, activating Charbelcher (Land Tax gets out a lot of lands over a grindy game) or playing the ol' RiP/Helm combo.
>>
>>45359490
No isochron scepter for the old school Scepter-chant lock?
>>
>>45359624
>>45359490
Also, don't forget Cursed Scroll when you lock up the game.
>>
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Is this worth speculating over?
There is an ENDrazi deck that seems to be topping a few Modern Dailies easily and it runs 4 of this.

Also, is mono green stompy viable in Modern?
>>
>>45359490
I'm curious, how are your win rate and match ups? I can't imagine you're able to beat Miracles.
>>
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>>45359600
>long game against mono B control
>20 cards in deck, 21 in exile
>he has 12 cards in deck, 28 in exile
>Everything is answered. Everything. Creature? Answer. Boardwipe? Answer.
>Win via pic related whittling him down
Now this is magic.
>>
>>45359634
I might go back to running that instead of the Cursed Scroll. The Scroll is cute with a hand full of plains, but I can't think of a situation I'd tutor it and not Ghostly Prison, Humility, or Belcher.

Scepter is huge bait for Abrupt Decay though.
>>
>>45359678
>draw nothing but lands in the grindy lategame
>win with 6 swings of an unflipped delver
pauper is true magic
>>
>>45359724
If vintage is the samson option, legacy is an arms race pauper is a guerilla war.

>Play monoUcontrol
>my win con is decking the other guy out and countering everything I can
>it fucking works.
>>
Is the Eldrazi deck really all that powerful?

Built a colorless proxy version to test with a couple of friends and they were both able to consistently beat it with BW Tokens and GR Tron.

The deck just seemed to run out of gas easly and I encountered a ton of mana flooding.
>>
>>45359665
it was
i used to play it
i could beat burn, zoo, fish, most control and infect
i couldnt beat tron or affinity and chalice at 1 or 2 fucks it up big time
its still a fun deck you can build for like $60, but i dont know if it can win
>>
>>45359679
I think the scroll is better desu, mostly for the inherent risk of getting 2-for-1'ed so easily with the scepter package.

Also, you don't necessarily want to lock up the game, it's more that you want to buy time to power out your win cons, and efficient use of resources is key in achieving that goal. Getting decayed is not part of that plan imo.
>>
I'm glad I'm on /tg/ after all
>>
>>45359757
>Angler Delver mirror
>turn 15
>angler counterspell dispel deprive dispel
>pass turn
>they play angler
>sit there for a few turns drawing more cards
>critical attack
>swing with angler
>angler blocks
>back to square one
>>
>>45359813
>Play 12 sister soul sisters saprotoken and midnight combo
>one of them sticks vs delver
>>
>>45359808
Top kek, where was this? Mind sharing a list, fellow miller?
>>
>>45359763
i think the 24 mana recommended is too much
i flood sometimes at 22
i guess the idea is that you pop your ghost quarters, and they kill your eyes/temples
your supposed to kill them like turn 4 tho
im testing 2 conduit of ruin and 2 ulamog, but its hard to play most times
>>
I wish they'd ban fetch lands. That'd slow the game down to a more comfortable level.
>>
>>45359850
I built the GW gond deck recently, it's almost like twin when you get the opener of
>forest forest pilgrim guard gond

Some people legit don't see it coming, or they don't understand that it's a combo until I sit there and make 50 of them
>>
>>45359788
I understand Tron, but how was Affinity hard?

The deck runs artifact hate, right?

Also a chalice at 1 will trip you up a bit but a chalice at 2 is unlikely.
>>
>>45359409
>>45359043
Don't be fooled by the lack of duals, DnT is fucking expensive, I think its in the range of 1700$. Waste, Port, and Karakas are a lot of money. Vial is a lot more than it should be, and so is sword of Feast and famine.
>>
>>45359490
What's the remainder of the sideboard? I have:

2 Pyroblast
2 Canonist
2 Timely
1 Elspeth
1 Cursed Totem
1 Batterskull
1 Pithing Needle
>>
>>45359869
nigger eldrazi doesn't even run fetches why would you want to slow down non-eldrazi decks right now
>>
>>45359851
Xmage, and it wasn't me playing Lantern.
The guy just started going off in chat and he hasn't stopped yet
>>
>>45359863
Yea, Turn 4 didn't happen too often.

The Tron deck was always able to recover from any land destruction, and 1-2 bombs can end the game quickly for you.

The BW Tokens deck had a harder time but it was able to stabalize itself with its removal and token blockers. Eventually you'd get in a swing with lifegain and it ends the game, even with ratchet bombs being used.
>>
>>45359914
>Make 50 trillion of them
>They wipe
>Still have 50 trillion+ life

it's funny how hard delver tends to fold to having huge HP, losing that tempo is hilarious. Also the fact lifegain is 'viable'
>>
>>45359674
The worst match-ups are probably Miracles and Oops/Belcher.

The plan against Miracles is to Needle his Top and then try to push through a Helm, Humility, or Belcher with Orim's Chant.

Zorb+Humility makes it really hard for him to actually kill me, and I'll probably land RiP at some point, so he can only cast his Council's Judgement once.

If he gets CounterTop right away I'm probably hosed though. That's what the Seal of Cleansing in the SB is for.

>>45359790
When Scroll Rack and Land Tax are online I can draw 4+ cards per turn, so I'm not that afraid of losing CA.

>>45359927
The sideboard is
2 Pyroblast
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Seal of Cleansing
2 Timely Reinforcements
1 Ivory Tower
1 Porphyry Nodes
1 Pithing Needle
1 Cursed Totem
1 Solitary Confinement
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Batterskull
>>
>>45360002
I lose to the reality acid deck more often then I would like to admit, just blinking the lifegain dude to 40 life is too much
>>
>>45359944
b-b-but they're so expensive, they must be to blame
>>
>>45355948
>I did poorly at the PT watch me cry
>>
>>45360030
When does Solitary come in? Seems like it would be really hard to do anything useful when you can't draw any cards.
>>
>>45359976
I can't imagine someone on xmage playing out a game vs lantern. As soon as I try an "unfair" deck, people drop.
>>
>>45359916
well they can kill you on turn 2
turn 2 is when you can get your avatar of the resolute to block the inkmoth
there was really no affinity in my meta, so my hate was unravel the aether, beast within and creeping corrosion at 2,3,and 4 cmc. i could be dead by then
and if i wasnt, they clog up the board with too many creatures and you only have 4 rancors and 4 creatures with trample
not a good matchup
>>
>>45360081
If I have Scroll Rack and Land Tax it doesn't matter.

I used to run it main, but I got stuck too many times with only Land Tax when I cast Solitary. I had plenty of cards to discard, but no spells to cast to make me actually win.

It's probably better in the main as a catch-all though.
>>
Hoping to not set a shitstorm:
How we can "save" modern? I mean, is there a way to improve the format? To make it more skill intensive, enjoyable, fun ?
Do you think that some unbannigs can help the format?
I play magic since a year. My first deck T2 Sidisi whip. Moved soon to Modern with Ad Nauseam. Now I'm playing Grixis control, Affinity and Merfolk. I'm doing really well at locals, old players tell me that my skills grew exponentially despite the lack of experience but I already feel tired.
I always feel like I win/lose just for topdecks.
>>
>>45360084
Why not stall and run Fracturing Gust then?
>>
>>45360127
you literally cant stall
you only win most games because your faster and if you curve right
most of the time they get you with infect from inkmoth, and gust costs 5 while corrosion is at 4 and the life gain is irrelevant due to infect
sometimes you dont even make it to 5 mana
>>
>>45359665
Endbringer is to go over top of other Eldrazi decks.
>>
>>45360124
Modern needs ways to 1) generate advantage over time, and 2) stop aggressive decks.
>>
>>45360230
Well in that case run 1-drop artifact hate.
>>
>>45360124
I say we need to unban everything and let the format run wild. With the new Eldrazi decks in format, unbanning artifact lands might be the best thing for the format.
>>
>>45360124
I think we should unban
>Sword of the Meek
>Jace
>Ancestral Visions
>Bloodbraid elf
>Stoneforge
>Splinter Twin
>Summer Bloom
Reprint
>Counterspell
>Wasteland
>Force of Will
>Baleful Strix
>Innocent Blood
>Cabal Therapy
>Fact or Fiction

Basically, make it mostly fair legacy, with slightly worse manabases.
>>
>>45360278
>unbanning artifact lands
all the cards on the banlist that can and should come off, and you go full retard.
>>
>>45360321
If Null Rod were printed in Mirrodin Block, I wonder what things would be like.
>>
>>45360278
So the problem with Modern is that it's too aggressive and the only new decks that can come into existence are ones which are faster than existing decks suck as Eldrazi being faster than the rest of the format, AND YOUR SOLUTION IS TO SPEED UP AFFINITY?
>>
>>45360275
natures claim is your best bet and its bad for aggro as they gain 4
you should probably board melira, but that isnt really a solution, you should have it for infect
its almost unwinnable as your a fair aggro deck and theyre an unfair one, the only way is if they draw poorly and you have a perfect curve
you have to accept that its a loss and try to focus on decks you can beat
infect and tron are better matchups
>>
>>45360316
WotC doesn't want Modern to just be "slightly worse Legacy," and that's one thing I agree with them on. Modern, at least in theory, should be a format where the cards that aren't good enough to see legacy play, but are no longer standard legal get to shine. Otherwise there's no real reason to play Modern over Legacy other than price.
>>
>>45360341
Null Rod do nothing to the metagame.
>>
>>45360362
You say that like speeding up Affinity is a bad thing.
>>
>Turns combo
>gimmicky combo win
>PURE BLUE sideboard package [/
spoiler] at sorcery speed [/spoiler]
THE KING OF COMBO
Scapeshift and Ad Naus may have spell priority, but they don't have 15 counterspells postboard.
>>
>>45360316
>Strix
>Meek

my Tezzeret is all hard and erect now if you know what I mean
>>
>>45360341
It would have helped in block/standard, but it probably wouldn't have been enough. There was tons of artifact hate floating around that Affinity could have easily just slotted in to blow it up, and then continue on their merry way. Modern wouldn't really be any different.
>>
>>45360409
>Affinity is the only deck that even comes close to competing with Eldrazi decks at the pro tour
>Let's make Affinity better, guys, that'll fix Modern!

Remember kids, don't eat the lead paint chips.
>>
>>45360316
If you're reprinting Force of Will, why not just unban all combo pieces? You should be aiming to shrink the ban list as small as possible.
>>
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>>45360368
More than just Nature's claim exists.

Also who cares if they gain 4, your creatures are bigger and will outlast their cheap artifacts.

Personally I think the matchup isn't that bad, but I'd have to test it out myself.

Certainly not as one-sided as burn vs soul sisters.
>>
>>45360316
Add Seething Song to the unban list and you have a deal.
>>
>>45360316
No Pod?
>>
>>45356184
That is an amazing game. Reminds me of the game I managed to beat an ulting Liliana with my MUD deck after scrabling back over like 12 turns.
>>
>>45360471
natural state isnt that bad, but you cant use oxidize as you need enchantment kill for tokens and probably worship now which costs 4 (no natural state)
and i think unravel is best because it gets rid of wurmcoil and they get no tokens, and batterskull
affinity can even stabilize after creeping corrosion if they played right and didnt go all in
its by far your worst matchup. then tron, then infect
>>
THINKING OUTSIDE OF THE BOX HERE
why don't think make cards restricted in modern?? Every format has it and most other tcgs too, for a good reason; some shit makes a deck viable but is degenerate as a 4 of. I'd be down with eye of ugin as a 1 of, seething song as a 1 of, hell even T.Cruise, Bloodbraid and Splintertwin seem perfect as singletons.
All parties win with this model, why do they refuse to implement it??
>>
>>45356184
>tfw I love interaction
>but due to how shit Control is, the only way I can express it is to have a shitton of removal in my aggro deck anyway

And then I get cockblocked by Chalice on 1, and while everyone else is bitching about how aggro is the niggers of Magic, I'm here taking it up the ass for trying to prove that no, aggro is not all like the fucking Eldrazi bullshit, stop trying to typecast it all as uninteractive garbage you wannabe blue mage punk shits.

Seriously.

Just.

Fuck the police.

For real.
>>
>>45360627
Seems reasonable
i just dont wanna deal with jace as he would make control matches take even longer
>>
>>45360697
Give up.
Plan pauper.
Rev up dat monoB pauper.

or enjoy rakdos being semi-viable for once. As a tempo-control deck!
>>
>>45360627
Because
A) it's retarded
B) only Vintage currently uses it within the context of Magic; Standard hasn't had to restrict a card since back when Magic formats were called Type whatevers. Like, we're talking back when Magic had a magazine and all the important information was in there and Necro was still a card.
C) Vintage only uses it because it's a format where you get to play whatever you want save for dexterity and ante shit, so instead of banning anything that isn't dexterity or ante the most it can do is restrict or else it goes against the spirit of the format.
>>
>>45360697
as someone who played Ancient Tomb + Chalice for years

Chalice is fair

the only decks that have to worry are greedy burn and delver variants

all the removal that matters has 2cmc
Chalice is not supposed to be a lockpiece but a roadblock
it just happens to be a lockpiece if your deck is badly built
>>
>>45360814
>Fair
kek

I'm sure the Eldrazi are fair too, right?
>>
>>45360814
Ancient Tomb would be broken as shit in Modern though.
>>
Break out the shitbrews that have no chance of ever actually winning a game
>>
>>45360862
Burncuck spotted
>>
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>>45356045
Its actually not surprising that a modern deck beat a vintage deck, Vintage is such an insular format that its meta is shaped to beating its previous meta, I've played so many games of vintage where when you play the requisite counter magic to deal with opposing combo decks you just lose to shit like D&T and Tribal Fish.

And no, Eye doesn't compare to lotus ramp. Thats just not true, even statiscally, Eye is only ever 2 mana unless you have Urbog, but we're talking turn 1-2 here, Lotus is always 3 for free plus you didn't use a land drop, so best case is that lotus 1 land is = Eye + Urbog, but i can Lotus + Land T1
>>
>>45360814
Nigger please, that roadblock in Legacy is a fucking brick wall in Modern. Call it a symptom of a greater problem but the foundation of a huge number of decks in Modern is 1cmc.

Modern right now can't handle it, it's not as bearable as it is in Legacy.
>>
>>45360893
BW Tokens actually.

Doesn't stop Eldrazi from being broken as shit though.
>>
>>45360897
How would a Vintage deck lose to a Modern deck other than flooding out or being mana screwed?
>>
>>45356184
Holy shit that fucking tech
Time for a Helm buyout
>>
>>45361017
Turn 1 Chalice on 1 isn't inherent to Eldrazi, any deck can run SSG
>>
>>45361017
mud is a slower stax and tax based hate deck where most of the hate is directed to other vintage cards
eldrazi can get past some of the taxes and kill on turn 3,4,5, while stax grinds out games
Dredge, Storm and Oath should beat Eldrazi tho>>45356057
>>
>>45361017
the combo decks would win but the control is based around the tempo of the combo and the format in general. FoW doesn't do shit vs stompy.
>>
>>45360627
Modern is already a coinflip, restricting cards would just mean the variance would go off the fucking charts.

It works in Vintage because Vintage has the absolute most degenerate card advantage that has ever existed in the history of the game, so your ability to draw into your 1-ofs isn't just the heart of the cards.
>>
>>45360697
This is sort of like a Swede trying to prove all Black people aren't rapists by getting raped by Black people
>>
>>45360083
Playing the shit out of lantern right now.
This is the best deck to tilt people or find which one are the dumbest.
>Against affinity
>Guys drop is whole hand on turn one
>Proceed to stabilize and have full lock on
>5 turn later, 4 mill rock on board + another ensnaring bridge
>He send me "Now what ?"
>"You'll draw nothing. And either i'll mill you or will recur a pyrite spellbomb 10 times."
>"Ok go ahead"
>"You'll not conceed ?"
>"No"
>"Ok" Proceed on leaving the game

Nigger you're on Xmage, no money or points on the line why would you be so mad about it ?

J U S T
U
S
T
>>
>>45360700
That's what time limits and slow play penalties are for, Anon
>>
>>45361198
So, you set yourself up a win condition of "be the most patient," and then immediately admit you have no patience?

I'm glad you at least left the game right after. You were very honorable to concede right away. Too bad you lost.
>>
>>45361221
yeah well i played against a control deck that was tuned against tron and eldrazi last night at modern
he went to time every round, no ties tho and there wasnt any slow play
if even 1 jace was allowed i can image all those would have been ties
>>
>>45360897
>Eye is only ever 2 mana unless you have Urbog
I once got 10 mana off an Eye in testing
2 Mimics and 3 Endless One, all cast for free on turn one with an Eye
Obviously that's unlikely as fuck, but it illustrates the point, and I actually lost that game, because I was on the draw and the GR tron I was testing against had a pyroclasm

Obviously Lotus is the better card, because you can do way more broken things than cast some creatures fast, but statistically Eye can generate more mana.
>>
>>45361198
>Playing Lantern Control on Xmage

You weren't the winner that day, anon.

Just like every Twin player that I had make their tokens on their own.
>>
>>45361196
if by "by getting raped" you mean "but keeps getting raped" then yeah.

Such is life playing Sligh decks.
>>
>>45361174
Vintage decks also get access to the best tutors.

1 Vampiric Tutor, 1 Mystical Tutor, 1 Demonic Tutor and you have a playset of Ancestral Recall.
>>
>>45361272

I have patience, it's just pointless on Xmage to try and be a dick about it when you admit you can't win and I will win in the next X turns.
it's just redundant, because he can just F9 the turn while I ned to be always alert of the draws and recurring things.

If it's a competitive event with prizes, yes I'll do it since it disavantages him, i'll win first game using most of our time for the match. And if we goes to time, i'll have the match.
But on Xmage with time being split, and people going full 1h30 clock time, wtf is the point, I don't need the win, I know i won the game at that point. If he wants to be a dick about it fine.


>Caring about losing on Xmage
>>
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>>45361341
>being so butthurt on a game with no prizes.
>>
>>45361371
Except vamp for ancestral is not great, and mystical is unplayable. Mental Misstep is a hell of a drug
>>
>>45361435
>Playing infinite combos on Xmage

You deserve what you get.

And yes, I would make you play it out in a tournament, faget.
>>
>>45361512
On a tournament, i really don't care you make me play out.
It hurts you more since I am wasting OUR time on a match I already won, leaving you with little time to win game 2. Either leaving you with a draw if you're fast enough or a loss if we don't finish the second game.

And lantern is much faster IRL than on Xmage or MTGO where the clunky interfaces makes it a pain to recur thing from graveyards or activate abilities.
>>
>>45361512
You can't make someone play it out once they've demonstrated a loop.
>>
>>45361512
Go back to the EDH general please
>>
>>45361572
Lantern Control isn't am infinite loop, you can make them play it out.
>>
>>45359461
So like after every new expansion?
>>
>>45360562
I kinda forgot about pod and Ge of the restSZ, sure add them and the combo pieces. Should also reprint daze too, if combo is gonna be that good.
>>
>>45361375
I'm glad you don't care that you lost. That's big of you.
>>
>tfw no 2cmc Memory Lapse colorshift for White
>>
What's the best version of Skred?
>>
>>45363154
They're all equally bad.
>>
>>45363197
Which means they are all equally good
>>
>>45363222
True, either way it doesn't matter which build you play, you'll lose anyway.
>>
>checking prices again before I go home for the weekend and buy a few cards I'm looking at
>Archangel of Thune had randomly shot up $10
It's out of standard and I have a hard time imagining it sees play in legacy, so what modern deck needs Archangel of Thune so much that the price is going up?
>>
>>45355096
>>45355948
MODERN IS KILL

What a fucking baby.
>>
>>45363474
Chord decks.

Pod players just don't know when to give up.
>>
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>bought Lord of Atlantis 7ED because art is better than the clownfish of Timeshifted
>realize the white borders and incorrect rules text trigger me more than shit art

fucking reprint pls
>>
>>45363531
They ain't reprinting anything with the old "it affects every player" formatting unless it becomes a represented draft archetype for a future Modern Masters. It's a no-go in present day card rules text design, deemed to be unintuitive to newfags.
>>
>>45363505
Are those still popular? I thought everyone was buying Eldrazi and Affinity after last week.
>>
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>>45363531
>Not realizing that that is the original art
>Liking modern borders
>Not liking white borders
You couldnt be more of a faggot if you had 10 dicks in your mouth
Get fucked child
>>
>>45363531
better bust out that sharpie senpai
>>
>>45363578
Kiki Chord is a deck.
There's also Abzan Company which is where the Melira Pod fuckers congregate.
>>
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>>45363596
>implying this fucking hard
Original art =/= good art.

I do like the white borders, but not when it's the only card and everything else is black bordered. That's my problem with it.
>>
>>45355234
>Two skyscrapers designed to withstand a plane impact both collapsed in an identical manner to a controlled demolition after being hit by a plane
>>
>>45360063
He came like 10th.
>>
>>45362619
Not that guy but this is trying way too hard.
>>
>>45363724
So the 9th best loser?
>>
>>45363197
>>45363244
So if I played this at FNM, would I be the meme master?

Creatures: 8
4 Hangarback Walker
3 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
2 Batterskull

Instants and Sorceries: 15
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Skred
2 Faithless Looting
2 Magma Jet
3 Slagstorm

Other Spells: 14
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pyrite Spellbomb
4 Mind Stone
3 Blood Moon
4 Koth of the Hammer

Lands: 22
22 Snow-Covered Mountain

Sideboard: 15
4 Dragon's Claw
3 Pyroclasm
3 Molten Rain
2 Pyrite Spellbomb
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Blood Moon
>>
>>45363708
>>>/pol/
>>
>>45363768
>Skred
>No Reckoners
>>
>>45363768
you can't just run skred without boros reckoner
>>
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>>45363668
Melissa Benson is a great artist and most of the original artists were much better than what we have now
Her lord looks much better an doesnt have that shitty 7 on it
>>
>>45363873
That is nice art. clownfish a shit, and doesn't fit with the rest of the merfolk
>>
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Is it time for MonoB Pox?
>>
>>45364139
>lords
>fitting in with the rest of the peasants
>>
>>45364368
On a couple occasions I have thought about getting my lords of Atlantis altered to look like Namor.
>>
>>45364368
>fishlords
>not peasants
>>
>>45364331
Never saw the appeal to this

How do you win if you keep screwing your manabase over
>>
>>45365996
life from the loam
>>
>>45365996
You play a very low-curve mono-black deck, so that your lands are significantly less important than your opponents'

Or you do what>>45366160
said and use life from the loam.
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