>>45327744 Oh look, it's Alpharius disguised as Perturabo.
Because of course Alpharius is so smart and unbeatable that he could totally pretend to be another primarch and fool even the emperor. And even if someone did see past his disguise, it was all part of his plan to fail so it's automatically a win.
Don't you guys know that Alpharius is perfect and never loses?
>>45329638 When Angron's not murdering people (so about 3% of the time) he's fairly likeable, albeit bitter
>Angron had laughed, the sound rich and true. ‘Such pretty lies! We fight for the same reasons men have always fought: for land, for resources, for wealth and for bodies to feed into the grinders of industry. We fight to silence anyone that dares draw breath and whisper a different opinion from ours. We fight because the Emperor wants every world in his hands. All he knows is slavery, painted in the inoffensive cloak of compliance. The very notion of freedom is a horror to him.
>You are free, Leman Russ of Fenris, because your freedom matches the Emperor’s will. For each time I wage war against worlds that threaten the Imperium’s advance, there comes another time when I am told to conquer peaceful worlds that wish only to be left alone. I am told to destroy whole civilisations and call it liberation. I am told to demand millions of men and women from these new worlds, to make them take up arms in the Emperor’s hordes, and I am told to call this a tithe, or recruitment, because we are too scared of the truth. We refuse to call it slavery.
>I am loyal, the same as you. I am told to bathe my Legion in the blood of innocents and sinners alike, and I do it, because it is all that’s left for me in this life. I do these things, and I enjoy them, not because we are moral, or right – or loving souls seeking to enlighten a dark universe – but because all I feel are the Butcher’s Nails hammered into my brain. I serve because of this “mutilation”. Without it? Well, perhaps I might be a more moral man, like you claim to be. A virtuous man, eh? Perhaps I might ascend the steps of our father’s palace and take the slaving bastard’s head!
At the very least, he has his ideals and he acts on them, which is more than can be said for Curze
>>45330372 >“What would you know of struggle, Perfect Son? When have you fought against the mutilation of your mind? When have you had to do anything more than tally compliances and polish your armour?” […] “The people of your world named you Great One. The people of mine called me Slave. Which one of us landed on a paradise of civilisation to be raised by a foster father, Roboute? Which one of us was given armies to lead after training in the halls of the Macraggian high-riders? Which one of us inherited a strong, cultured kingdom? And which one of us had to rise up against a kingdom with nothing but a horde of starving slaves? Which one of us was a child enslaved on a world of monsters, with his brain cut up by carving knives? Listen to your blue-clad wretches yelling of courage and honour, courage and honour, courage and honour. Do you even know the meaning of those words? Courage is fighting the kingdom which enslaves you, no matter that their armies outnumber yours by ten-thousand to one. You know nothing of courage. Honour is resisting a tyrant when all others suckle and grow fat on the hypocrisy he feeds them. You know nothing of honour.”
He was surprisingly good at laying the verbal smackdown, as well as the physical
>>45330553 But isn't he always whining about the nails? Sure it isn't a good thing, but hey - he is stilla Primarch. Emperor-sama should be able to pull them out somehow. I'm actually quite sad how the whole Horus Heresy played out. At least Big-E should have tried to get the nails out, instead of just going "Well, there you have an army of superdudes, do as you like."
>>45330412 Not him, but leading a worker's rebellion in the mines and factories of Deliverance is kind of old-school communist/socialist and and dismissing the Terrans that survived Battle of Gate Forty-Two to the Nomad fleets for being too oppressive/reminding him of the leaders he'd overthrown is a little bleeding-heart for a supersoldier
>>45330451 True. Well, until he shattered it, anyway.
>>45330495 They're both right (hell, Angron knows he's a slave >>45330398), but only one of them has literally got spikes in his head. Not to mention being more eloquent than Guilliman's "shut up, you're a dick", which notably completely fails to address any of Angron's points
>>45330372 I like the idea that Angron would have stood against the lunacy that was the Great Crusade if he hadn't been forced into it at gunpoint and made addicted to the slaughter. I mean, I'm not even a chaosfag and I can tell that the Emperoro's plan was pointlessly counterproductive in almost every way.
>>45330697 >Not him, but leading a worker's rebellion in the mines and factories of Deliverance is kind of old-school communist/socialist and and dismissing the Terrans that survived Battle of Gate Forty-Two to the Nomad fleets for being too oppressive/reminding him of the leaders he'd overthrown is a little bleeding-heart for a supersoldier That's not even socialism, that's just being nice.
>>45330925 He's kinda right. Angron always bitches about his nails, but the first thing he does is implanting them in his Legion. And then he just moans about "muh NAAAAAIIIILS!!!". I think he could have been handled better in the HH.
>>45330825 Say what you want for what they do to the rest of your life, the Nails do make you better at killing.
Given that that's all Angron has left, it's a semi-logical move - especially when you consider the force that was mustered on Bodt to await his arrival, a combination of bloody and somewhat mistrusted units whose assemblage was described by Sanguinius as "the Emperor is assembling a carnival of monsters for his amusement, though I doubt whoever he unleashes them upon will see the jest" - given that force to command, and tasked almost solely with destruction, making his men take pleasure in slaughter (the only kind of pleasure he knows personally) doesn't seem so retarded.
Not to mention the camaraderie >>45330878 mentions
>>45331312 True, from what the new book pics show it's not like the Bangles were much better.
Still, this was an unusually brutal selection of units mustered, including abhumans only just human enough to be allowed (yes, again pot-kettle coming from Sang)
And then Angron's just dropped into the command, no period shadowing the Emperor or other primarchs.
Implanting the Nails wasn't a good thing, but I can at least see some of his reasons for doing it. And it's more his entire deal he's bitter over, including having to screw people over, not just "muh nails"
>>45332508 I'm glad FW have said they'll be looking at the Solar War in the fairly near future, it'll be good to see Dorn get a bit of screen time as he's forced into a Warmaster-like role and hopefully he'll get a bit of development too - up until now, we've pretty much only actually seen him being angry: Angry at Curze for dreaming of the Emp's failure Angry at Garro for >implying Horus could be a traitor Absolutley blindingly angry at Pert and Himself for the results of the Heresy
>>45330372 Fucking awesome. I'm glad someone wrote this out, I generally avoid the Horus Heresy books but it's great that they addressed the fact that the Emperor was completely chill with the horrible society he found Angron fighting against.
>>45334718 >Emperor was completely chill with the horrible society he found Angron fighting against.
that's not true. Angron's homeworld agreed to join the imperium peacefully, why would he go down there a fuck up a world that accepted his invitation? Emps would have ended the slavery and shit, that would have came along with compliance.
>>45333976 >Betrayer seemed to indicate of course it does. Betrayer was written by ADB, and ADB's favorites can't have flaws that actually begin with them; everything is evil dad's fault and evil childhood's fault and everyone else who doesn't appreciate how great his favorites are is a big dumb meanie who's mean and dumb.
>>45334827 Again, I haven't read the HH books, but old fluff was pretty explicit that the big E let Angron's army die. If he had any sympathy for them, I assume he would have ordered the compliant slave lords to stand down and not kill the people who he had arguably arrived to help. He doesn't even have to destroy the whole society, just say "If you wanna be in the Imperium, you have to let all your slaves go and spare the rebels, or else we will end you." Does the HH series ever cover this, or anything else to do with Angron's homeworld's fate?
>>45335395 What else he can do? Just wait and let his homeworld get fucked by Emperor who didn't even read the the message he sent and instead sent a braindead savage furry just because the Emperor didn't approve his communication method? Oh, he already did that actually.
>>45335523 Instead of throwing a brick through the Emperors window with his message attached to it, didn't he basically throw a molotov cocktail through the Emperors window with his message attached to it?
>>45335560 Nigga. Magnus actually have no choice. There is a chance that the message get lost, late, unreachable, blocked, or tampered by Horus or his ally if he use the normal mean. And he need to deliver the message as soon as possible so the Emperor will have time to prepare the force to deal with Horus treachery. So he pick the fastest, unblockable, incorruptible method he can find. And the end justifies the means. Even it's mean tying the message on a Nuclear ICBM and launch it to Emperor's personal toilet.
>>45335423 I really like Dorn tho. Even bought a miniature resembling him. And the whole Iron Cage incident or whatever it is called, was on purpose to cleanse himself and his chapter of the guilt of failure. After all, if he was alittle quicker he might have been able to aid the Emperor rather than carry his shriveling body out of Horus' flagship. Btw, what happened to Horus' body? O.o
>>45335641 >And the whole Iron Cage incident or whatever it is called, was on purpose to cleanse himself and his chapter of the guilt of failure. Making him dumber than Pertu-"let's kill 1/10 of my legion for not being the best"-rabo
The Emperor could have avoided a lot of shit by picking out the Primarchs who hated each other and forcing them to work together until they tolerated each other.
Magnus and Russ could have been a great buddy-cop pair. Just put them up against some kind of really reprehensible enemy where the collateral damage doesn't matter whatsoever, like some kind of horrible furry-Draka Empire, and wait for them to come out the other side down half their virus bombs and drinking shitty whiskey.
>>45330372 >>45330398 >"You [Lorgar] kept that mule Kor Phaeron. Russ kept his kin-friends. The Lion kept Luther. Humans - brothers and foster fathers - saved and raised into Legion ranks. But not me. Not Angron, no. Did the Emperor teleport his gold-wrapped Custodians down to help me and my army? No. Did he free the War Hounds and order them to battle, fight alongside me? No. Did he save my brothers and sisters the way he spared and honoured the Lion's closest kin? The way he honoured Kor Phaeron? No, no and no. No mercy for Angron. Angron the Oathbreaker. Angron the Betrayer." I feel the books actually did a decent job making Angron vaguely sympathetic and slightly deeper than "MAIM KILL BURN"
>>45340685 Sig was meant to go with the fleet He met keeler and she prophesied he needed to stay since he had to be at the siege So he said no and sent Pollux - who turned out to be a genius and almost would have wiped out the ironbitches at Phall killing pertadumbo Dorn had a go at him for it and the said as its war I can't demote you due to morale Basically mehmet my son I am diasspoint
>>45344160 But at first he nearly dies to the Warlord Titan and Angron has to safe him, then Guilliman nearly ruins his ritual until Angron shows up and during the ritual he gets beaten up again and Angron has to save his ass again. He was a very good schemer and he was right about Erebus and Kor Phaeron being idiots who think that they can toy around with the future as much they like, but he wasn't that much of a great warrior.
>>45344672 Magnus didn't tell him shit. He barged into the Emperor's throne room in the form of some Daemonic entity using Tzeentch's power, destroying the Webway in the process, was mentally chastised for the Emperor for being retarded, and then got pulled back to his body without fulfilling his original goal.
>>45330697 But Bobby G shut him down pretty good. All Angron does is whine and ruin, he hasn't built anything, he hasn't improved life for anyone. Even fucking Curze turned Nostramo from a lawless hellhole into a pretty nice place to live
>>45344672 IIRC The Emperor dispatched Russ to just bring Magnus back to Terra, but Horus intercepted the order and changed it to annihilation. Russ already had a huge beef with Magnus so he gladly accepted the change.
>>45346926 >Russ already had a huge beef with Magnus so he gladly accepted the change. When will this meme end? Not only did he try to contact him through standard means, but when that failed he tried to contact him through Hawser (not realizing he was duped, but still) And during the battle of the fang Magnus said that when they fought beneath Prospero's skies that day Russ had "tears in his eyes and grief in his voice"
>>45346184 >into a pretty nice place to live Literally "Living in Fear: The Planet" And it went right back to what it was when he left.
I can't say he's done anything other than ruin, but I don't know that he actually can - the Nails really, really suck, and would have killed him fairly soon if he hadn't been demonified
I find G-man's response a bit weak though, telling someone whose entire past has been being shat on (and the literal brain damage) that he should just "get over it", while completely ignoring what Angron points out, that of all the primarchs he had every advantage, that's a bit rich
Angron encouraging the development of the nails within his legion, now that is a kind of hypocritical dick move, but on the other hand it did make his men more aggressive, and it was something the legion very much wanted - when he arrived he quickly became the pinnacle of warriorhood to his legion, uniting where before it was fractious, and they gladly accepted the Nails as a way to be more like their primarch. It's worth noting that, powerful as he was, even Angron couldn't have forced basically his entire legion to adopt the Nails, and yet they did
>>45347034 >the Nails really, really suck, and would have killed him fairly soon if he hadn't been demonified Curze was haunted by insane visions, and yet even he tried to do some good before he eventually went overboard. >It's worth noting that, powerful as he was, even Angron couldn't have forced basically his entire legion to adopt the Nails, and yet they did He still just said "say no more ", when the far more humane and kinder option would have been to refuse them, a la Ferrus telling his sons not to overdo it with the augmentics
>>45335635 >He had no choice He saw there were many powerful wards around the emperor and instead of just reaching out to Malcador or Rogal Dorn or someone else nearby he's just like "Fuck it these wards probably weren't important anyway" and SMASHES THEM TO BITS WITH HIS MIND just to send a simple fucking message.
>>45347088 >he far more humane and kinder option He was never going to do that, I'm saying he's not terrible, not that he wasn't a bloodthirsty son of a bitch.
It suited his methods and his sons wanted it - while it may have been somewhat hypocritical (though the marines did have the choice, as shown by the rare few left unmodified by Istvaan) it's hardly a stupid decision that's forced on the marines, as it's often made out to be.
And Ferrus didn't manage to tell his sons, he lost his head before he got the chance
>>45347299 >Be Angron >Have nails forced into my brain >Nails make me an ungodly capable fighter >Get given an army >They're good, but could be more powerful >They want nails to be like me and be better fighters >Give them nails, they're more powerful
>>45344636 It was a Warhound, not a Warlord, and the main reason why the thing almost killed him is because he was too busy trying to save his boy Angron, who got buried under a building for being too angry to fall back.
Yeah, Magnus kind of fucked up there. Why didn't he just order his Legion to surrender instead of shutting down communications and orbital defenses, leaving the Sons and the Spineguard to fight a hopeless battle?
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