When did you realize that you were so deeply entrenched in 40k that you didn't even care how lazy and stupid just naming them "Space Marines" was?
Marines are traditionally used for projecting force, or in normal people speak, going places and fucking things up, as opposed to the army that is geared more towards holding and defending territory.
Normal marines make landing from amphibious vessels, ships, planes etc so space marines is a pretty self-explanatory term.
If you want to go down your route, you have to sperg out over literally everything.
Yes, cannon are by definition guns that fire projectiles using explosives, but if you have a bigass weapon that uses plasma to wreck shit, calling it a Plasma Cannon lets everyone know that this is not a fucking plasma pistol, plasma rifle, plasma slingshot, plasma pea-shooter, it's a motherfucking cannon and it's going to blow up bigger shit than the previous denominations of plasma weaponry.
That impression would be correct.... if not for the 3/4ths of fans NOT getting that impression, and giving more money to the bits of 40k that take itself too seriously over the past 2 decades.
I'm completely fine with the idea that 40k is completely pants-on-head retarded.
I don't expect anyone to know what it means when I draw Khornate symbols on the coffee cups at work.
I expect faces and palms to collide when I tell of the all-psyker party.
When I say that "It's red, so it's faster. Because it's red" I'm fully prepared for bewildered looks.
Then again, it can also be attributed to car culture. I mean, go google "Red ones go faster" and, while of course, you'll get orks, and tropes, you'll also get "Do red cars really go faster" related search.
Of course, this is again given evidence when "personal stories" cite insurance companies as charging higher premiums for red cars, as well as more speeding tickets, which can be attributed to red being a more eye-catching colour.
Marines during the Age of Sail were soldiers stationed on ships. They were used primarilly for boarding actions, and were also the first men onto the beach during landings. This role means the name "Space Marines" is a perfect descriptor of their usage in combat, and was in use in Sci-Fi for a long time before GW used it in 40k.
Stellar Infantry implies a different job. Would work for the Guard, but not Astartes.
The Imperium is often rather simple when it names things. Lasguns are laser guns, meltas melt tanks, etc.
If idiots are more likely to buy a red car than the red cars will have more accidents than other cars of the same make and model. If the insurance companies see a correlation between red paint and increased accident numbers, they will increase premiums. They don't care about why red cars get into more accidents, only that the correlation exists.
That is, if insurance companies really do charge more for red cars.
Adeptus Astartes sounds better than anything anyone here can come up with tbqh.
DID YOU MEAN THE EMPEROR'S ADEPTUS, ASTARTES, HIS MIGHTY ANGELS OF DEATH INCARNATE??
When playing roleplaying games set in 40k I never refer to them as Space Marines. They're Adeptus Astartes. I'll accept my players talking about them OOC by "Space marines", but not IC.
I'm going to have to go ahead and say that that is actually worse than Space Marines. It's about as pretentious as you can get without adding a third word.
>Adeptus Astra Telepathica
Do you even 40k?
Honestly before anyone is allowed to read a 40k codex or buy the miniatures they should be sat down and forced to read a mixture of classic sci-fi like Dune, Foundation, etc. and 70s/80s comics like Judge Dredd and Nemesis the Warlock.
>They're supposed to be colonial marines from aliens
No, thats the Imperial Guard. Marines are Starship Trooper seen through 2000AD lens and a good dose of heavy metal.
Honestly, discovering 40k has prompted me to really read/watch the important sci-fi stuff. I've slowly been reading through Heinlein, Asimov and Judge Dredd so as to educate my self.
I'm actually reading Dune ATM.
I think that after people play D&D for a little bit to get their toes wet, they should definitely read
The Dying Earth
The Elric Sage
Conan the Barbarian
To a lesser extent, they should also be familiar with Lord of the Rings, Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, and to also brush up their Homer, Dante, and really to read just about anything else they can.
It's a wonderful thing how going through the inspirations of a game can actually enhance playing it considerably.
I can't recommend those just yet, because I still need to read them. But, I keep hearing about them, so I might as well bump them up in my reading queue.
Speaking of Three Lions, the Lyonesse Trilogy also deserves some mention.
>it's a pretentious sounding name
yeah, like the United States of America is sooooooooooooo pretentious compared to America.
and the United Kingdom is sooooooooooooo pretentious compared to Britain.
you're just finding reasons to spew shit out of your mouth just for the sake of argument. There's no objective reason for this, you're just being a troll
A person who is skilled or proficient at something.
Greek name of Babylonian goddess of war, Ishtar.
Adeptus Astartes: Dog Latin for "Person who is good at war"
The term is "Adeptus Astartes", and it is only mortals such as yourself who say "space marine". Does it serve to strike slightly less terror in your heart when you hear the sound of bolter fire?
It's pretty accurate then.
The Adeptus Asartes are in fact good at war, so good that a single company can clear a planet's population.
Hell, I'd even say the name is undercutting their skill.
Not that anon, and not arguing that it isn't pretentious, just providing translation. In fact I'd say that all the High Gothic names are intentionally pretentious as it's the language of the "higher classes" in 40k.
Adept of a non-existent god? Doesn't seem very relevant.
>, so good that a single company can clear a planet's population.
If you're reading a marine codex or you're talking a planet of pacifists. Otherwise, marines die to literal stone age savages, which you can read about in the Chaos codex.
US is the official name, America is incorrect.
It exists, rather than some faux-Latin name for a future setting which was never given a reason for using Latin.
Its the same as anime that arbitrarily use Spanish words for no reason.
Why would the wizard of athiesm name his servants "good (religion I'm trying to make everyone forget)s"?
It makes no sense. It was chosen solely because it sounded cool to the dork that sorted the mail.
>cool anons think not liking something makes them even cooler
youre honestly like liberal faggot feminists. becoming a part of a group you dont like just so you can complain about it to everyone else in the group
dont fucking play if you dont like it. or is it that when you dont shoehorn yourself into groups that people wont talk or hang out with you? gee i wonder why
Claiming an entire language is pretentious. You know exactly how fucking stupid you are.
Let me guess, you think Estados Unidos sounds pretentious, too? After a while you have to realize it's not the words that are the problem, you are just that damned autistic. Shit son, you might be the source of all autism in the universe.
its really too bad people only associate spanish with shitty illegals
spanish is pretty much the closet language to latin still spoken. its just latin 2.0
that makes it pretty cool
I don't know if you're just genuinely stupid, or if you're just so immensely butthurt about someone saying something from 40k wasn't great that you're blinded to what should be common knowledge.
Space Marines are, effectively, toys. They're little toy soldiers that eat brains and spit acid in a game where there's green fungus guys who can make things happen if they believe hard enough and will do things like painting their vehicles red to make them go faster.
It's pulpy, nonsensical, and is often considered to be more of a parody than an homage to its sci-fi origins. It's not high-browed, no matter how much people may try to pretend it is after deluding themselves that it should or can be taken seriously.
Now, using a foreign language to describe something is common form of "Puffery," very often seen in restaurant menus.
Latin, being an archaic language used primarily in scholarly circles, is often misused in an attempt to provide things with a degree of gravitas that really doesn't suit them.
To take a somewhat bastardized form of latin and use it as a name for toy soldiers that are 50% pauldron and 60% exaggeration of their capabilities really is pretentious.
About a decade before Warhammer 40K even existed.
>"Hey, look, that guy is playing with his robot toys again."
>"THEY ARE NOT ROBOTS AND THEY ARE NOT TOYS! THESE ARE "ADEPTUS ASTARTES", AND THEY ARE WARGAMING MINIATURES!"
Did I trigger an unwelcome flashback for you?
EVERY SINGLE ROMANTIC LANGUAGE AND INFLUENCED LANGUAGES ARE PRETENTIOUS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE FUCKING NORMIES REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
i always thought it was funny that one of the most famous things from dune is the god emperor (which is from the fourth book) but even dune "fans" rarely read past the first book
>People are seriously pretending that the faux-Latin Gothic GW uses isn't "pretentious"
It's intentionally both pretentious (now, when they pretend it's super serious) and flawed for comedic effect and the aura of lost grandeur it presents (originally).
Mementumus moriartes, my amicusates. Gloriates awaits if you tranquilliatus yourself. In the grimdark of the far future there is only mendosatus latinusum.
Its a reference to the type of archaic language used in Gene Wolfe's The Book of the New Sun you swine.
Not that guy, but sure, that's what names in 40k are like. Pretentious, butchered Latin. That's intentional, but that doesn't make it good. If anything, it's intentionally bad.
Fuck, some of the most retarded things 40kids do is take the dog latin seriously.
This is what happens when you start as a small wargame couched in pop culture references, and then become a massive cash cow built on the same terms but reliant on the idea of them for your IP.
This is why Space Marines and Imperial Guard are no longer called Space Marines, or Imperial Guard.
Man, I have met 40K fans who believed that he concept of a god emperor was one of 40K's great innovations. You know the sort; they talk to you all wide eyed and breathless: 'he's not just an emperor but a god!' as though the concept is just a mindblowing twist.
>i know for a fact you havent read the last 3 books
I haven't read past the first 20 pages of book 1
I got 2 presents for my 15th birthday: a Dune omnibus and a Lija Bailey: Detective with a Robot omnibus. I found Dune boring and dug into Asimov
youre an idiot
its fine if you didnt read it or dont want to but dont say its dry after 20 pages you cock sucking nigger
youre lying just to talk shit about one of the greatest sci-fi works ever?
also iv read most of p k dicks stuff and plenty in the dune sage is weirder
I like legio astartes, with space marines being the coloquial term for them in low Gothic. The are the marines that operate every where from planet to ship to moon to the stars in the sky, while imperial guard or imperial army being so much more defined by the fact that they are seen as a land based force; being transported but vulnerable through the sky above; the strength being boots on the ground.
Within the guard you have all the deferential military services (marines; paras;gi;mech inf etc) but space marines are really those that do it all and are equipt to do it all; and are equipt and trained for everything and anythingthe galaxy can throw at it.
With the meat grinder that 40k is; I tend to think that the majority of battles are served by long tooth pdf we. On crusades, regiments that have trained for ten+ years and now the troopers are of age to go get turned into mince meat Co queries back a few planets and settling as they go; colony of the fittest kind of thing.
White shields being really only called into service when a planet is attacked; not so trained, or settled in the head of being a soldier.
I also like to think that first founding home world's are run amok with geneseed mind you so take it with a grain of salt. Take ultramar that place I like to think the scholiums pretty much every attendee has geneseed implanted and ig they wash out then two is removed; net gain for the chapter and the Imperium, as think of how much is lost in forays where the geneseed isn't recovered a shit ton; marines wouldn't really be part of the picture in 40k if the practice of only harvesting the seed from dead marines took place; yeah that shit happens but it's not the only source.
And yeah ok if we go with genotypes don't all match for applicants that is no real excuse; your saying an apothecary with a techmarine + 30k pre schism mechanicus couldn't work out a single positive /negative match machine? This was still the Era of innovation under the E
Wasn't Warhammer 40k kind of supposed to be cheesy schlock given rules for large scale conflict? Like we've got Space Elves, Space Marines, Space Werewolves, Space Vampires, Space Marines with gothic architecture on their fucking planes, lil grey space men with japanese mechs, Space Orks, Xenomorphs, an army entirely comprised of the T-800, psychics, Space Vietnam, and we used to have Space Dwarves. I think the first major mistake GW made was trying to treat this game's story like it was this seriously deep and meaningful plotline.
That's because the estimate are really hard going; as plot in terms of people and actual personalities ( which most books have to keep thing moving ) turn into a homage to a single character that survived; him being omniscient after that book and the grand finally. It then turns into more of a geopolitical with theological overtures is it right to make war against the entire universe to enforce your understanding of right and wrong? To shape societies from their children until their deaths with only the concept (or maybe not even that in some cases such as the Idahos waking to take the place of the last and the fishspeakers).
Turns people off bruv gets to deep and heavy; and has a glacial plot line, good reads though.
iv never heard of someone not liking them or stopping at them
the only reason people dont read them is because the 2nd and 3rd books suck and they think they are going to get more of the same if they keep reading them
I read while at work; found them interesting.
But I can see why some people can't be fucked; shit 3/4s of my school couldn't be fucked reading an assigned book that you could smash out in a day; half a day if it was interesting. That being over almost a whole fucking year; the age of the screen has bemolished the age of imagination and art; tv and movies now being the highest form ( video games soon to steal their spot as soon as vr takes off)
It's fine though because Dune's author is as much of a cunt as GW when it comes to this shit. He wouldn't let Iron Maiden call one of their songs "Dune", so they renamed it to "To Tame A Land", apparently the lyrical content was still allowed though.
I guess it has nothing to do with the fact that the Imperium is based almost entirely on the Roman Catholic Church huh? The fact that they, the basis for the faction, spoke latin couldn't possibly have anything at all to do with the naming conventions, regardless of how bastardized it is.
So they entierly missed the point that the Emperor is not a real god and that he is written intentionally to cast doubt over his divinity? He is at best a WIP god, but even then GW originally threw several theories out there to make his ultimate destiny ambiguous. Hell, I seem to recall reading that Rick Priestly suggested that there is a chance that the Emperor doesn't do anything at all and all those souls they feed him are wasted feeding a psychic houseplant.
These people seems like the kind of people who would join a cult if they didn't have escapism.
Still Space Marines, just now they're listed on the webstore as Adeptus Astartes: Space Marines, and the codex cover says "Codex Adeptus Astartes SPACE MARINES". Blood Angels are also a "Codex Adeptus Astartes" so it's safe to assume any new Space Marine codex from now on, vanilla or variant, will have it as well (though I don't think there have actually been any since those two).
The Cult Mechanicus and Skitarii books have the same thing going on; they're both "Codex Adeptus Mechanicus [army name in big letters]".
Oh, and the Eldar as well. Codex Eldar: Craftworlds and Codex Eldar: Harlequins. Dark Eldar are the odd ones out because their current codex came before the other two.
I think GW is shooting themselves in the foot with the unique names because the names will just sound like nonsense to those that are new to the setting.
With a clear name people have a better idea of what the factions are all about and if it meshes with their own interests.
>the giant superhumans that are essentially nothing but legend to the imperium, who defend all of humanity once it goes to shit, are pretentious.
>cites the inquistion and crusades as attrocities committed in the name of religion in the last church
>proceeds to have a crusade and found the inquisition
the emperor is kinda silly
>he thinks the toy soldiers are real
Is that your mental deficiency?
Do you actually believe space marines are out there?
Because, no, they are not out in space, nor are they anything like the Roman Catholic Church except in the most superficial manners.
They are toys from a silly game where the entire joke behind the Imperium is literally that they're supposed to be as pretentious as possible in the most ridiculous ways, up to the point of some of their ships having skyscraper-tall cathedrals on the outside.
I'm actually having a hard time imagining anything more pretentious than "Do you know what would give an air of prestige, tradition, culture, and importance to that ship? If you put a cathedral on it."
You realize it's a joke, right? Even Penny Arcade did this one.
I think you need to calm your ass down a little.
>people are mad that 40k is cribbing off of every sci-fi book and show out there
You realize this has always been their thing, right? They used to be pretty proud of it. And I'd honestly be surprised if people didn't know about Dune or Judge Dredd, especially since the later had a great movie only a few years ago. Most people don't get as immersed into 40k and can recognize how stupid yet awesome some of these things are.
I tried Dune when I was maybe fourteen, but I couldn't get into it. Maybe I'd like it more now.
Calling toy soldiers "toy soldiers" isn't pretentious.
Calling toy soldiers "Furieux Combattants de Plastique Que Je Tiens dans ma Main"?
If you're not French, in France, or made out of chocolate, it's a bit pretentious.
I'd suppose because names are at the front of it all, on the face of any given army or character - in the case of "Space Marines", the face of an army which is in turn the face of the entire game and setting. Though in that sense one might consider it appropriate.
>one of the greatest sci-fi works ever
It's a soap opera script about dicks. About giant, talking dicks. The protag is a giant, talking Mary Sue dick. It's not even GOOD, let alone great.
>When did you realize that you were so deeply entrenched up your own ass that you didn't know 40k was a little silly until JUST NOW?
>This is what happens when you start as a small wargame couched in pop culture references, and then become a massive cash cow built on the same terms but reliant on the idea of them for your IP
Exactly this. The game was originally a sci-fi mash-up universe with all the bits from all the universes the authors thought were cool. Except now they have to pretend it's not, even though the Imperium couldn't be any more Dune if they tried.
"Oh no, dude's giving logical reasons for using a language I think is pretentious. Better call him autistic."
Go fuck yourself, kid. You know what the Roman Catholics, whom the Imperium are based on, would do? Put a cathedral on a ship. You're not saying anything to prove me wrong, just spouting opinionated garbage and calling everybody who disagrees with you retarded.
lol muh cultural appropriation. Go back to tumblr please. They're not calling the "toy soldiers" Adeptus Astartes. They're calling the faction in the lore that. You are actually so fucking stupid it's hard to fathom how you're even alive.
>Put a cathedral on a ship.
Really? We're not talking about "in" a ship, we are talking ON a ship. On the outside. At a scale where each window is about the size of a football field.
You can go ahead and be further pretentious by trying to say that there's logical reasons behind why they should be pretentious, but at the end of the day, we are looking at a toyline based around bastardizing any and everything they can get into contact with, with lore that does to science fiction what Twilight did to vampires and werewolves.
Calling them "pretentious" for giving their goofy-looking space marines a latin-esque sounding name is being rather reserved.
It's such a rape of science-fiction that it has to be called science-fantasy.
So here's the thing.
What Roman Catholics would do doesn't matter. What anyone thinks of the lore of any fictional world in the context of any aspect of the real world doesn't matter.
The Imperium isn't Roman Catholic, their imagery notwithstanding. The Imperium is a fanatical cult dedicated to a mythologized human with the powers of a god, and it's completely fictional. hate it if you want, but hate it for the right reasons, not 'muh Catholicism' or 'muh notions of reality' or anything else.
Warhammer is not trying to be realistic in the slightest, and only occasionally gives a passing nod and wink to the laws of reality. It violently sodomized ideas of reality, decorum, and realistic aesthetics, then torched the poor bastards and marched on towards highly stylized visuals, exaggerated-for-the-purpose-of-awesome game world axioms and fuck your bullshit sensibilities.
If you don't like it, that's fine. Just dislike it for reasons that actually apply, and not reasons that make you sound like your idea of fine dining is a 128 color box of Crayola crayons.
Copyright is insanely convoluted these days, isn't it? It started out "hey, this guy made a thing, so he can sell it or copies of it" and has turned into some sort of legal-political-ethical Gordian knot.
Fundamentally, I believe in the rights of creators, and think they are worth protecting. Still though, in my country (the US), those rights have been extended into legal fictions so far that someone that writes a piece of software can sell LICENSES to use it (not copies of the thing itself, mind you, but a terminable privilege of use!), as if copyright contains within it the right to tell people how they have to use a thing once they buy it. Not even the Jews tried to charge people for reading the Old Testament. It's an obscenity.
I'm not hating it, I actually love it. But " The Imperium is a fanatical cult dedicated to a mythologized human with the powers of a god" sounds an awful lot like what Catholics do with Jesus.
>I think having one aspect that sounds similar means they're the same thing
Nigger, really. Did the apostle have power armor? Were the Jews a kind of psychic space elf? Did the Romans shout 'WAAAAAAAAGGGGHHHHHH!!' every five seconds?
Ironically the Imperial Guard are the real "space marines" of the imperial forces (with felinids and other people from catachan being a sort of hyper-muhreeny muhreen force within the imperial guard) and space marines are actually Space Paladins, which technically are actually called the Astartes in game but GW could have named "Spaladins" given their general laziness.
I'm sorry, but just because I said they are based on and heavily influenced by the Church does not mean I said they ARE them. Also please explain to me WHY their basis doesn't matter? It's actually pretty important to understand the basis when trying to figure out motivations for things, which is exactly what we're doing here. Please sit down before you have a heart attack.
>Please sit down before you have a heart attack.
>I don't know what's going on here, so I'll just call him mad.
Poor guy. You sound all tuckered out.
I don't know how to make it more obvious that I am shitposting.
I never said you were mad, just a little excited. I worry for your safety my friend. I'd feel incredibly guilty if you died over something I said and you weren't even correct in your objections.