>>45209471 I suppose more or less the same as in Scandinavia nowadays. >Shit is only slightly better in certain cases >In other cases (quality/price and diversity of food) it is way worse >Everyone thinks their country is the best
>>45209471 If you're the type of creative, self motivated, social person who thrives in a reputation economy, you probably spend all day doing fun things with your friends and working on cool and interesting projects that will win you more acclaim.
If you're the type of person who doesn't want to live in a panopticon society, you probably spend all day trying to attract as little attention as possible, since all barriers between public and private life are gone and anything you say or do can be recorded and used by a mob of your fellow citizens to socially censure you. This goes double for people who hold opinions that are unpopular.
Anyway you gotta post the pasta
Book links: >Eclipse Phase PDFs http://robboyle.wordpress.com/eclipse-phase-pdfs >Eclipse Phase hacking cheet sheet http://www.mediafire.com/view/?axe1vs35muk4juh >Eclipse Phase The Stars Our Destination Scumfleet book http://www.mediafire.com/view/?212xtz521lnnn85 >Eclipse Phase NPC File 1 http://www.mediafire.com/view/?wr5ruqjkj1pkkcx >Eclipse Phase xls Character sheet https://sites.google.com/site/eclipsephases/home/cabinet >3 new adventures for your use in convenient PDF form http://awdaberton.wordpress.com/about/ >Various Eclipse Phase fanmade resources, and links to more http://www.aleph.se/EclipsePhase/ >An Eclipse Phase yearblog full of items, locations, NPCs, and plot hooks http://www.farcastblog.com >Zone STALKERs http://gaxtrope.net/eprepo/ZoneStalkers/Zone_Stalkers%20%2809052014%29.pdf >Morph Recognition Guide http://www.mediafire.com/download/j4bjbba89kw8v0y/Eclipse_Phase_Morph_Recognition_Guide_%286098716%29.pdf >Advice for new players and GMs http://pastebin.com/C56FW2vj
You'll also constantly be asked to vote by mesh on political issues you don't understand or have any stake in, since Titan is almost entirely a direct rather than representative democracy. If you don't educate yourself on these issues you may also be punished.
>>45213095 Probably pretty cosy, or frightening, depends really. I imagine that, much to the disappointment of the Log Cabin Holiday industry, there's more of a market for experience playbacks of nice, safe log cabin trips than for people actually going on them. All it takes is one exsurgent infected pack of Hulders bursting through your door while screaming "ÄR DENNA STUGA BOKAD?!" and suddenly that sort of tourism isn't in this season!
>>45213528 >Hulder are engineered for survival in the Titanian wilds. In silhouette, their bodies resemble a long-legged great auk, though viewed up close, the resemblance to a bird ends. Hulder have no feathers, but rather smooth, rubbery charcoal or black skin covering a thick layer of nano-augmented blubber. What resembles a thick bill from a distance is actually a seamless protrusion of the face, packed with sensory augmentations. Hulder stand 2 meters tall and weigh on average 135 kilograms. Their sensory organs, webbed feet, and ﬁngers are all cybernetic.
>Hulder can only tolerate temperatures hospitable to baseline transhumans for short periods of time. In the open, they must balance their bodies’ chemical reservoirs with other hulder and caribou once per month or with a chemical reserve pack. A typical band of 2–6 hulder and 10–20 caribou can go about a year before having to visit a hab or a station like Huvudskär to replenish chemical reserves.
>>45213630 It's a comparatively simple and no-frills life. It's a way of isolating themselves from the chaos of the solar system at large, and generally not have to deal with the dangers/politics of it.
Plus it's fun and you get to be a weird space bird thing.
>>45212012 >>In other cases (quality/price and diversity of food) it is way worse Why would that be the case when everyone has Makers? Caviar isn't anymore complex to make than noodles. In fact, it might be simpler.
>>45214019 Not really, no. Feels like, for some people at least, the very existence of anarchists in the setting is entirely unrealistic, couldn't work, a sign of the developers obvious biases, and so on. If the anarchists were the all conquering heroes that everyone else was trying to emulate, then perhaps I'd go "well, this is a bit Mary Sue-ish". As it is, they're a relative minority in the outermost parts of the system.
The book does spend a fair bit more time describing the Autonomist Alliance stuff, but I think that's partly down to necessity - most people aren't going to need an in-depth explanation of how a capitalist society works, because it's going to be pretty close to their own experiences.
>>45213630 This is the same setting where people make exact mental copies of themselves and send them to die before merging the experience of death with their continuing consciousness. Being a cold flightless bird is pretty tame as far as fringe ways of living.
>>45213934 It's out by Saturn, it's always dark out there.
What faction (excluding the obvious winners; the TITANs) has the best waifus?
>>45211974 Hulder morph. They live on the surface of titan with similarly fucked up looking caribou. The caribou 'graze' in an AR simulation, in reality nano-feelers in their mouth and snout scoops up carbon and ice and shit from the planet surface and refines it. The hulder joins them all together every day, including himself, to top off chemical reserves.
>>45212012 They're autonomists, tho. Beneath the technosocialism glaze, autonomists. Unless I'm incredibly mistaken, autonomists are basically NEETs but with no way to be cut off as long as they perform occasional repairs, and even on Titan, everyone else will do it - they can live there, but just won't have any rep.
>>45213296 I kind of want to do a game with the "No muse because I'm a goddamned paranoid" trait. Normal citizen except for the lack of an AI (or fork as an AI. Is that mentioned anywhere? Your alpha/beta/delta/gamma because fuck you I'll put it through a blender as a muse?). Who'd be eternally distracted, forever taking notes and generally working like a motherfucker.
And probably get himself afflicted with Watts-McLeod and try todevelop mutli-tasking.
>>45213847 Ultimates: Resleeving space marines, who are really fucking ugly.
They probably leave the ugliness in soley to fuck with the genetrash. Although the concept of genetrash is weird in a setting like this. Makes you wonder if the developers left it in, like so many things, so they can say "tolerance=yes! Look how dumblolrandomstupid the nazi expies are!"
Am I the only one who finds transhumanism and posthumanism as explored in Eclipse Phase as disgusting, wrong, and terrifying? Like, seriously, send me the fuck to Jupiter. I would burn your gross tranny fucks from orbit.
>>45214115 Anarchists and Brinkers and Isolates and Autonomists are something that could easily exist given EP levels of tech. YOu see their proto forms today. But they're basically glorified beyond any reasonable level. If you're not a futa neotenic neo-A, you're nothing. The further you are, ideologically, from anarchism and the neo-economy the authors espouse, the worse of a person, objectively, you are.
That said, I really like Kiviuq's void monastery, and the idea of a ringer who has no hab and just floats on the rings playing the modern version of EVE online all day while he gnaws on asteroids.
>>45219676 I can understand the jovian position. They cut back on the really insane stuff in the writing, though. They leave most of it in the nonclemature - the odd heavy handed crack about gender roles/stereotypes, and the constant change of any figure of speech that's used commonly and has a male component to a female one. 'Modern relationships' where one partner has a pile of lovers. Etc.
Though places like that check-out hab with whole-body apoptosis in the outer system piss me off. It isn't left as a 'wholly good' thing like the others.
>>45219676 If you play a lot of the stuff in A Time of Eclipse off as an exaggeration, which it pretty much is, it's not nearly so bad. Most people are happy with the chromosomes they are born with, most people haven't resleeved more than once, etc.
I really don't see where all the vibes like >>45219684 was talking about are coming from. Maybe because I tend to skip around in the books a bit looking for fun toys, but most factions come off as pretty sane. You got your bioconservatists, who honestly seem perfectly fine. In a world where people are augmenting themselves left and right you would certainly get people like that. The space amish if you will. Then you got various mega corps that are portrayed no real worse then most futurist cyber settings. The TITAN related factions are vilified assumed.
To methe more anarchist/isolationist/ect groups only seem to get more character and painted in a better life simply because those types of groups are fertile ground for your average murder hobo players.
>be Martian glitterati heir >live in new shanghai >have rights to the estate of old futurist musician >one song is this dignified, groovy old number, about Mars >lobby to make it Martian anthem >how David Bowie's Life on Mars became the consortium/Martian anthem
>>45219765 TITAN lovers are villified. The most info we have on exhuman factions are snippets - a group of cannibal pirates, the people who hate MeatHab after ir chased them off, and that the Hulders were originally an exhuman beast.
BioCons aren't given the same sort of airtime or coverage. The fact that they're doomsday preppers waiting on the TITAN return is barely touched, and the idea of them being stuck in Jupiter crying softly as the glorious overlords pass them by is enhanced. All the negative aspects are enhanced and made to resemble modern day horseshit. Even the ultimates have their nazi leanings played up and made comical. Even Venus, the people who run an underground railroad, are basically a pack of hypercorp slavers despite claiming independence.
Not to mention things like religion. Notice how, except for Jovian Catholocism, the religions disliked by the devs died out nearly completely? Even Islam was toned down. The game matches with their personally expressed views on the forums.
I would not know anything about that. As a rule of thumb I try to keep the politics of a creator and their created content separate. Plenty of stuff over the years I have learned has been made by complete idiots/people with some fucked up views and has sadly diminished my enjoyment of said things a bit. I just find I enjoy things more if I know less about the people that make them.
http://eclipsephase.com/psi-revamped And for those interested, this is a really good revamp of the psi-system. Doesn't change the mystery and clears up plenty of problem sleights, or combines them. And they made psychic stab a viable option, which is crazy.
>>45219902 Probably a wise choice, then. Like high school english ruined movies for me, and my degree ruined the glorious mysteries of economics, reading the forums started me examining everything they wrote and finding it sync to their views. Dampens the fun.
>>45219902 >I try to keep the politics of a creator and their created content separate That's a damn good policy, and I commend you for it, but its damn near impossible with Eclipse Phase. The setting itself feels bent towards their politics. Even something like Extropia, their "middle ground between the capitalists and anarchists" faction/polity are portrayed as exploiting indentures (which is a bad thing by the devs point of view) and for exploiting both sides of the line
>>45220036 Honestly, the gender politics (much like in real life) is fairly easy to ignore and doesn't really go into made up snowflake genders, at least officially My problem is the politics. The further left you are (and the more you line up with the authors politics) the better a polity the writers present you as. It says a lot that when they tried to salvage the Jovian Republic (the right wing, bio-conservative faction) they had to hire from outside the dev team
>>45220099 Kinda proves my point, they have one, its weird even by the standards of transhumanity and theire entire schtick is trying to have their cake and eat it by being neuters with erogenous zones Really its the perfect morph for space-Tumblr, all the oppression points of being specialgender, but they still get to get their rocks off
Huh. Brian Cross, a 4th ed designer, wrote for them. That explains a *lot*. And Adam Jury, too.
Rob Boyle is your standard white dude, but he IS best mates with Randall, AKA, Captain Embezzlement who nearly sunk Catalyst by using company funds for himself.
Okay, so they're all ex-catalyst lunatics and FanPro. And while not directly involved with the embezzlement that I can see, are still mates iwth Bills and supported Randall during the bullshit claiming he had done nothing wrong.
>>45220099 There's also a few anarchist collectives similar, and one who is detailed as seeking to "Genderfuck transhumanity by any means necessary".
Nigger you can change your body on a whim. Fuck off.
>>45220159 ALL QUEER All Queer is a network of anarchists that pinpoint their gender and sexual identity as outside of the confies of straight, binary norms. An outgrowth of radical queer groups that countered oppression before the capability to resleeve created a massive social shift, All Queer argues that biases still exist against people that have non-binary gender identities or sexual orientations outside of the mainstream. More than just countering phobia and privilege—in both autonomist and capitalist societies—All Queer opposes assimilation and instead promotes the idea that all of transhuman society needs to be—and is well on its way towards being—thoroughly genderfucked. All Queer activists have been instrumental in designing morphs, bio-mods, and psychosurgical hacks that explore a wide range of sexual biology, orientation, and practical activities.
Behold, the founder of Extropia and grandest proponent of its economic system!
PETRA THIEL A venture capitalist and hedge fund manager, Thiel invested in numerous hypercorp start-ups and played a key role in expanding transhumanity’s presence in the solar system as well as capitalizing on breakthroughs in various transhumanist technologies. After founding Extropy Now, Thiel brought in other investors and hatched the plan to establish Extropia. Thiel has infamously claimed that the inner system is a lost cause, pulling most of her investments from non-Extropian corps (burning several bridges with former hyperelite allies) and increasing her stakes in numerous Extropian technology corporations. She has recently taken an active interest in extrasolar exploration, but remains a visible fiurehead and active participant in Extropia’s affairs. She has raised some controversy by claiming that the male sex is no longer needed in transhuman society, arguing that male aggression and patriarchal tendencies are a detriment to our continued development as a species. She also regularly criticizes other autonomist tendencies and has had several heated public arguments with Carson Tucker about the uselessness of being part of the Autonomist Alliance.
>>45220073 How did MRAs enter the equation? EP seems to be super duper pro transwhatever and that anyone who disagrees with their slimy genetic hell utopia is a big mean stinky transmisogynistic problematic bigot.
I was asking how many trannies under the assumption that the dev team was entirely tumblr tier SJWs and gross horse-faced trannies.
>>45220241 Actually, looking through the book shows that I'd have to copy paste huge sections of every few pages to outline them all, so I'll stop. After this one.
With the Bugis leading the way, the Glitter scum embraced experimentation and have taken exploration of alternative gender and sexual identities to a new level, going further than many other elements of scum and genderqueer anarchist culture.
I like Eclipse Phase as a notion, and I think it does personal horror better than Vampire, but jesus. Fucking. Christ. Some of it is so heavy handed it's fucking stupid.
>>45220269 The dev team are three white dudes who used to work with Randall Bills, the bloke who nearly sunk Battletech and Shadowrun and has presided over a steady downward slope in quality and popularity. The MRA thing comes from http://eclipsephase.com/regarding-mras
>>45220269 >How did MRAs enter the equation? Same way they enter every equation their a part of: my being cunts I'm sympathetic to some of their points, but by fuck have they made it all but impossible to have a rational discussion about them, even in real life In the case of EP, they started cropping up on their forums, naturally clashed with the rather left wing fanbase there, and in the usual MRA style being flaming, shitposting and other wise being asshats. Posthuman Studios banned them, people (especially on /tg/) got assblasted over "freedom of speech" and the whole thing was a clusterfuck The ban might have been heavy, but ultimately its Posthuman's forums, they have to moderate them and it was obvious the MRA's weren't going to stop
>>45220397 Make them human, and try to understand something from their point of view So, taking EP as an example, I personally think stacks and the idea of digital immortality is awesome. But I can appreciate that others might believe that copying 'you' onto a stack then having your original body die is still a death, and some other being that says its 'you' carries on, and would have immense problems with that Come at your points from the other side, imagine you have to form arguments against your own beliefs
>>45220397 By showing the good with the bad. By not playing up every bad crony-capitalism aspect of the modern US and Russia, and using it as a slap in the face (The jovians proudly unveiled 'Reagan Cylinders', inefficient and expensive space stations with not enough radiation shielding, for example. They also renamed all their moons/stations after American presidents like Bush) to folks you don't like. By pointing out their prepper notions towards the survival of humanity, their constant watch for TITANs and the way their entire culture is geared towards being ready for fighting them.
Going with anything other than "hur dur these are bad". Hell, they're even technically responsible for the Autonomists continuing to exist. They nuked a hypercorp ship and its rep as a very subtle "Go home" when the Inner System was gearing up to kick the living daylights out of the Autonomist Alliance.
Wouldn't the gate crews be confused if a Pandora gate opened from the other side? Their defences would naturally go nutty, but if you had a pack of transhuman survivors from Earth fighting a rear-guard action to force a few hundred people they'd been keeping alive through, it'd make an interesting start to a campaign. Or mid point.
Play through the fall, play through survival, then the machines turn up, you all manage to escape by the seat of your pants and find yourself staring down a dozen floating murder-balls with miniguns that are telling you "Welcome to Saturn!". Then you have to integrate.
The Republic is the only place in the Solar System where you actually own your own body. In the Inner System it can be seized if you ever fall into debt, while in the Outer System it can be appropriated by the collective by vote, or if your reputation takes a dip. The Jovians are the only people who actually treat it as an inseparable part of your person.
As unpleasant as permanent death is, it's an order of magnitude better than what's waiting for you in the rest of the Solar System: forcible uploading, forknapping, brainhacking, simspace accelerated psychotorture. None of those are possible in bioconservative communities.
The Republic is the last place in the Solar System designed for people of average intelligence and capabilities. Anywhere else, a baseline human is going to be unemployable and superfluous. According to the corebook, the human average is 10 COG, the transhuman average is 15 COG. Being even one standard deviation below average intelligence in the real world is associated with living a worse life by basically any standard of measurement (see Murray et al) and in the accelerated future that's only going to be worse. Cognitive upgrades can cause serious mental damage and in the worst case scenario basically constitute overwriting the patient's brain with a new and different person.
>>45221134 The Jovians are the only faction that takes the possible return of the TITANs seriously. They're the only ones who have a plan if they come back.
The Jovian populace isn't subject to bioconservatism against its will. In Rimward they mentioned that the state security apparatus actually has trouble suppressing bioconservative terrorist groups because they enjoy widespread support among the populace. They don't think the Jovian government goes far enough in suppressing transhumanism. If you believe people have a right to self determination and to decide what technologies will be allowed in their communities, you have to contend with the fact that Jovians by and large don't like transhumanism. When anarchist terrorists kill Jovian soldiers, they aren't freeing people from a tyrannical government, they're killing citizen soldiers drawn from a population which genuinely believes that its government is just.
(This pdf is a little outdated but it used to get posted all the time around here. The idea was to make a Jovian character who actually stands up for her country, unlike that cringing uncle tom Tio Silencio)
>>45221476 You can conceivably make any biomorph into any other biomorph, but at some point you run into a ship of theseus problem where if you're recycling a Hazer into a Neo-Mammoth you aren't so much transforming a body as you are junking it and using the reagents to make something else
>>45221567 Indentures. /epg/ fanon is that with almost all jobs capable of being done by easily copyable dumb AI, the only profession open to indentures is prostitution
>>45221134 I'm a leftist and love the idea of a more realized jovian republic in this vein. Its also cool to play up the Classical era themes in the republic, which are both generally positive and alien enough to contrast with the contemporary american-esque stuff. On the other hand, I need somewhere to produce a space generalissimo, and mars just won't cut it
>>45221980 I mean, as >>45221296 points out the actual population of the Jovians is usually more biocon than their military/government. So it wouldn't be any small leap for a radical (or pretending to be radical) general turned enough of the civilians and army over to his side and took over.
>>45222244 I've still never seen ultimates as nazis. They're vicious authoritarians with a superiority complex, run by warrior philosopher-kings in the name of a cult figure, which could be argued to be fascist, but it seems just as close to a plain cult that's preoccupied with war, or a vaguely villainous knightly order
>>45223027 We get 2000 pages on political settings, and 50 pages on "titans are really mysterious and so are exsurgents".
I want to know more about the Yazidis. They're grade 3 psi users who aren't murderous loons. That alone has huge potential. Nomad techno-tribals in a hostile warzone that treat titan-relics as fauna and flora - and vice versa.
>>45223110 Because very few people have a) actually played the game and b) there aren't very many things to talk about, except comparing different versions of the fluff that the Dev's say is mutable. Like the TITANs and Pandora Gates.
>>45223123 Or even more gate crashing. I'm surprised more isolates aren't hunting for a system with multiple worlds and going through with gear, a shitty tin can space ship and settling on those gateless planets.
>>45223260 The main problem with that is that the corps control most of the gates, and they're also not very big. You'd have to find a gate in space, in a system, and assemble a space station piece by piece on the other side as well. Because like hell you're gonna be able to make an entire exit vehicle to get a tin can into orbit.
>>45223973 Freelancer. In autonomist habitats you live like everyone else. In Extropian habitats you're still a step above indents and selling your labour like everyone else. In PC habitats you might starve, but you're still way above a contract slave.
>>45227822 Extropia I like because the devs are a little more clever than we give them credit for. It's obviously a reference to The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, with people trying to create an anarcho capitalist society free of government coercion. And like the Loonies in The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, the Extropians are the stooges of a recursively self improving AI that secretly controls everything they do from behind the scenes
>>45214019 >capitalism - a system where private individuals owns the means of production and make profit by selling the produce for more than the cost (wages ect) of making it >rep economy - pretty much reddit up/downvotes What are you smoking?
>>45230218 Not really. The ones people survive tend to be. There's at least one in orbit around a dead star. It's just a set of hab-modules with a shitty science station, some buddhist monks and a project ozma psycho-prison where they send people to be infected with the exsurgent virus and suffer eternally.
>>45228633 It says in the core book that missions to earth are a quasi-routine thing, anon. Smugglers, reclamators (Interest: reclamator blogs), hypercorp fruitcakes, anyone who decides to ride an LLA mass driver. There's at least one functional sleeve facility.
>>45230531 Yes, but there is a general split in moral thinking that causes very great conflict in people with strong moral convictions.
One school of thought is that the best morality is that which purports that individuals have the right to not have things inflicted upon them.
The other school of thought purports that individuals have an obligation to give something of theirs up (time, effort, property, civil liberties, etc) for the desired betterment of society. In order to ensure this, the other school has to enforce these things, essentially infringing upon the prior school of thought. This is the cause for conflict.
As for which school of thought has more proof behind it, that remains to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, but I've been leaning more towards the former rather than the latter (I'm trying not to get too political with this or anything).
>>45230628 Yes, but I'm pointing out that what you're calling moral isn't moral. What is moral is what leads to survival in your community. What survival for your community is fundamentally questioned in Eclipse Phase, because your community probably includes a futa neotenic who just loves big hairy men who look like the developers, four octopii prostitutes and a newscaster who is a reverse mermaid - fish on top, lady on the bottom. If going machine preserves their mind states, then you've got a moral responsibility to do it.
>>45219706 They could still play the game, just play it as a Jovian. If anything there real world attitude would make them a better roleplayer. I mean you don't have to use all the weird transhuman stuff, you can just play a regular human.
Although, honestly, a lot of the stuff in the "Roleplaying Game of Transhuman Conspiracy and Horror" assumes you'll be playing a character that's on board with the transhumanism aspect.
You could play a game of Eclipse Phase where you're the huddled survivors of the Fall, living in a cave and shunning technology and hoping that the nanomachine swarms don't find you and disassemble your fleshy body, but most people wouldn't assume that's the sort of game you're planning to run if you said "Hey, I'm running an Eclipse Phase game!".
It might be briefly interesting for the player, but character concepts that reject core premises of the game rarely work out well.
>>45235301 Man. The Jovians aren't slave owners or rape magicians. Mr House was looking to save humanity, the PC just wants power and wealth. The NCR as the Titanians is.. different. The fundamentally different ideologies sort of puts them aside. If anything, the NCR would be the LLA. The Legion would be the PC or possibly the Morningstar Constellation. House would probably be the Titanians, but he doesn't really have a fit because he's sort of a cross between the Barsoom, the Brinkers, the Ultimates and the Extropians. And the Jovians too.
I am the very model of a Singularitarian I’m combination Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian, Aggressively I’m changing all my body’s biochemistry Because my body’s heritage is obsolete genetically, Replacing all the cells each month it’s here just temporarily The pattern of my brain and body’s where there’s continuity, I’ll try to improve these patterns with optimal biology, (“But how will I do that? I need to be smarter. Ah, yes…”) I’ll expand my mental faculties by merging with technology, Expand his mental faculties by merging with technology, Expand his mental faculties by merging with technology Expand his mental faculties by merging with technology
And with our new technology, renewable clean energy, Remove our pathogens and overcome hunger and poverty In short I am a Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian I am the very model of a Singularitarian In short he is a Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian He is the very model of a Singularitarian
Knowledge in all forms music, art, science and technology, Our brains and bodies all precious and any loss a tragedy Important recognitions and insights are what we should retain While we destroy all of the useless information that remains And when a person dies we lose a profound pattern tragically, And the part of ourselves that interacted with them lit’rally Religious folks may rationalize that death is really something good (“Something Good? Something GOOD? Eh?) I think they’d change their minds if Singularity were understood I think they’d change their minds if Singularity were understood I think they’d change their minds if Singularity were understood I think they’d change their minds if Singularity were understood
I create and appreciate all of the knowledge that I know Toward greater order even though complexity I know may grow In short I am Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian I am the very model of a Singularitarian In short he is a Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian He is the very model of a Singularitarian
The purpose of the universe is that of all our human lives Since no aliens have come forth this much we can now rationalize We’ll spread our thoughts with nanobots that know how to self-replicate Through solar system, Milky Way or anywhere we designate Ideas are our products that will solve the problems of our fate And new ideas for the problems we can’t yet articulate Let’s leverage all our knowledge from the returns that accelerate (Returns that accelerate? Sounds familiar. Ah yes, the law of accelerating returns by Ray Kurzweil, of course, OF COURSE!) So the outcome of universe is something we can contemplate The outcome of universe is something we can contemplate The outcome of universe is something we can contemplate The outcome of universe is something we can contemplate
The singularity is near but I won’t be indifferent In case something should go awry I’ll do my bestest to prevent Because I am a Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian I am the very model of a Singularitarian Because he is a Transhuman, Immortalist, Extropian He is the very model of a Singularitarian
(Yes! Singularity! Woo hoo! Singularity is here! Singularity is near! Singularity!)
>>45238924 Would people develop it? You're introduced to it an early age, and it's capable of - indeed, designed to really - adapting to work in the users best interests. Considering how much work your Muse is supposed to do for you, and how integral it is to day-to-day living in some places, it might be something you'd want to get treated fairly quickly.
>>45239309 Well, it's only been 10 years since the fall. Plenty of folk could have, easily. Rescuees, brinkers, isolates. The quality says an 'invasive role', so you can't even carry it on your person, which makes me wonder where invasive starts.
>>45244259 They're also not campaigning to conquer the solar system, not slaving, practicing a rough sort of gender equality, and they do use all of those, just in significantly lesser amounts and tehcnological levels until they're proven 'safe'.
>>45239414 It's only been ten years since the Fall, but Muses are described in the core book as "a lifelong companion for most people less than seventy years old" - so even people who got screwed pretty hard by the Fall will have likely had a Muse prior to the Fall, and had a Muse for quite some time prior to it as well.
Though I think that brinkers and isolates probably would have a better time abandoning their muses, yet much of the brinker/isolate lifestyle is generally predicated on using the same advanced technology that got subverted during the Fall in order to survive in places where they can be left alone. If you were prone to rejecting technology related to the Fall, you'd be unlikely to adopt a lifestyle that requires it. Still, phobias are funny things, and no doubt there are people who might develop it, I just cannot see it as a particularly common or likely occurrence due to the age of the technology.
>>45251005 Sorry; I was trying to establish who would be more likely develop it and why they'd develop it, not deny that it exists as a thing - it's hard to answer the question "At what point does Musophobia kick in?" if we can't discuss how it might come about and who the small percentage of people who suffer from it are. I really didn't mean to come across as that dismissive - I wanted to try and establish reasons why people might develop it, so there's a slightly more logical chain to work out what may or may not be acceptable.
So I don't feel it's possible to give a good answer to the question about whether or not a given phobia sufferer would accept a household AI based on it's invasiveness without considering what levels of technology would be considered invasive. And, part of that to me, is pervasiveness and familiarity. I'd consider that the high technological requirement to live a Brinker lifestyle would mean that they'd be less likely to develop it, so one that did develop muse phobia (and didn't have it treated...!) might still accept the household style AI, because the invasiveness of a household AI is more likely to be within their threshold of what's acceptable. To me, it'd be more believable for a character to accept a household AI as a Brinker because their fear falls more on the "intelligence in their head" than the "invasive role in their life" part of that particular and/or statement.
For somebody who falls more on the fear due to invasiveness section, I'd imagine that these phobics would be more likely to live lifestyles that reject technology deemed invasive, in much the same way that people with phobias see their behaviour changed based on their fear. To me, it comes back to the question of what might be considered invasive, and that's going to depend a lot on other factors. If you want to portray it realistically, those factors need considering.
So could a character deal with an AI answering their questions? Yes. Maybe. No. It depends.
Some of my best characters have been randomly generated, I dunno - sometimes you have a better image of how to play character when it's already a set case, only the details left to fit and tinker with.
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