> HHG FAQ - http://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
> Official HH 7th Edition Errata (Updated January 2016): http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/fw_site/fw_pdfs/Horus_Heresy/Horus_Heresy_7th_Edition.pdf
> Other official downloads: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads#horusheresy
> Crusade Army List: http://www.mediafire.com/download/1lprm5vd99yafa3/
> Isstvan Campaign Legions: http://www.mediafire.com/download/deadtdf0y47k59k/
> Mechanicum Taghmata Army List: https://mega.nz/#!LFwTjQ7B!mF0eVOY8P1MPT0a-QSXypXo_ZfskhYynD41PrkaTbD8
> 30k/40k Rules: https://mega.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ!EVh0GZZS
> 30k/40k Rules and more (torrents): https://kat.cr/usearch/%22Forge%20World%22%20heresy%20user:epistolary/
> 30k Black Library: https://mega.nz/#F!0RlxDZQC!qAu9BaubWa3KeihJRmOcsg
> 30k Xenos Homebrew - https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Xenos_in_30k
Loyalist Traitors, Traitor Loyalists edition
Because most of loyalist legions have excellent relationship with Horus.
Other than that, they are soldiers.
Like in ancient Rome, legionaries trust their warmasters more than a distant icon that stay away from war.
Because the marines in 30k are far less indoctrinated than their 40k counterparts and have a much broader set of values. Not all of them value Imperium, Primarch, Legion, in that order. Some may value the lives of their squad mates or the marines under their command over any of that, some may feel their primarchs are taking their legion in the wrong direction. Then there are plenty of other values to consider. Are their relations with Mechanicum or rogue Trader forces that could sway them? Do they value their personal skill at arms or their professional calling as a soldier, warrior, knight, apothecary, or techmarine over what some distant Imperium or primarch wants? Have they maintained some minor aspect of religion from their homeworld that they carry with them into being an astartes? Not all of these apply to all marines in all legions, but they could certainly apply to many.
Iron Hands: Using weird shit the legion habe stored away, or just thinking Ferrus was weak and Horus is a better choice.
Blood Angels: Bloodlust
Space Wolves: Either disliking the new direction the legion has taken, dislike of Russ or plain bloodlust
Imperial Fist: A crusade splinter which were given a undoable quest and now are miffed or just Imperial Fist embedded within World Eaters and becoming sympathatic.
White Scars: Being White Scars
Raven Guard: Pre-Corax guys
Dark Angels: Being Loyalist
Ulramarines: Those who like being lord over a system
Salamanders: Jumping ship because Vulkan died or deciding dieing for a distant emperor is shit lets make our own country.
R8 my list /hhg/
Sons of Horus legion, 2000/2000 points
Praetor with paragon blade, cataphractii primus, Pride of the Legion - 170pts
15-man Tactical squad with Vexilla - 210pts
15-man Tactical squad with Vexilla - 210pts
10-man Fearless Veteran Tactical squad with plasma gun, heavy bolter, sergeant with power weapon and Rhino with dozer blade and twin linked bolter - 290pts
10-man Cataphractii Terminator squad with 2x chainfists, 7x power fists, 2x heavy flamers, sergeant with lightning claws, and Spartan Assault Tank with armoured ceramite, flare shield and dozer blade - 760pts
Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought with Kheres pattern assault cannons - 180pts
Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought with Kheres pattern assault cannons - 180pts
Praetor rides in the spartan with the terminators and jumps out on enemy HQs, with the spartan's heavy weapons and the terminator's chainfists doing most of the anti armour. The two dreadnoughts provide AA in case it's needed, but otherwise run around after the two tactical squads. The veterans run up to grab and hold any central objectives early game. If I go up to 2500 points I'll get a pair of Sicarans and splash out on artificer armour/power weapons for my tacticals.
Hmm, points cost on Praetor doesn't add up. Also I hope you are aware that the relics from book 4 are 'optional' and technically require your opponent's consent.
If doing pride, I'd rather be bringing 10man veteran squads with sniper.
Nvm, forget what I said, points cost is fine, forgot that the blade is cheaper for termineggers. People don't usually go for that option. Give the dude a lightning claw and digital lasers and you can pretend he's not-terrible-abaddon.
Hmm, I see what you're saying about the 10 man veteran squads. Issue is I love the idea of having both vets and tacs, but vets otherwise take up a highly-contested Elites slot that I'll probably end up filling with an Apothecary detachment when I upgrade to 2500 points. What Rite would you suggest taking, if not Pride?
I guess this would be the appropriate place to ask this:
Ws Horus more interesting a character as the Champion of Chaos Undivided, or would he have been more interesting having fallen to one of the 4 Gods?
The biggest change in the latter would be Horus not being dead post-Heresy, which would be a big game change, but its doable considering the Gods clearly don't mind resurrecting their favourites, and for some of them it plain doesn't matter if you die.
Well then, maybe take 2-3 squads of 10man vets as troops and 1 20man tactical+apoth, or something like that?
As you are playing SoH you can always add Maloghurst and field vets or reavers without the need of a RoW
Dark Angels : Im not even going to bother answering that
White Scars: lodges, being left in the dark, and horus/khan bro-mance. I find it funny that Omegon is the one that stops the traitor scars from winning.
Raven Guard: There is a symmetry between RG and Night Lords. Alastor Rushal and Kasati Nuon swapped legions. one can assume they weren;'t the only ones.
Iron Hands: those undead robo-men are heretical, so maybe having to kill loyalists to survive. ( they're in 2 short stories, one called riven, the other i cant remember but its in Meduson)
Blood Angels: kill loyalists in a bloodrage, and say fuck it, I can't come back from this.
Imperial Fists: no idea, but if there is a Barabas Dantioch there has to be a reverse right?
Ultramarines: theres like 250,000 of them. Statistically theres going to be some traitors, especially considering how far-spread they would be.
Salamanders: no idea. maybe a slow slide from renegade, to traitor.
Also true, but then that bumps the Termies in to the final elites slot, and from what I've heard Maloghurst is a bit of an "eh" HQ. I dunno, I'll have to think about fiddling with the rites and HQs, I get what you're saying about having half my Troops as tacs with the Pride RoW being a waste.
Hmm.. you can run pride and have everything troops. Or run Maloghurst and run the teminators as elites, add the two dreads and you have one elite slot left (remember, you have 4 in 30k). Or run Horus and have everything as troops.
I think you should look at Maloghurst as a more durable Delegatus that allows you to run 2 RoW at once, rather than a weak Praetor.
>Horus alive post heresy
This seems to break the very core of 40k.
And how does Horus potato-fy Empy but not
a) finish him off
b) die after
>Horus falls to one of the gods
Barring Malal (which wouldn't make much sense anyway without a big phony "What have I done?" heel-turn)
This could be interesting a take, but there could be issues with Horus having once been the big chaos champ to now be one of the gods bottom bitches.
So yeah it could make him a chump.
It'd fuck with the gods power levels too, but honestly, chaos has always seemed too balanced and ordered anyway. Having the powerlevels be unbalanced might make a more interesting story.
You might be better off asking /tg/ as a whole though.
I think Horus surviving Terra requires him to 'not inexplicably lower his shields' so a duel never takes place.
Think of any other reason why the traitors are fought off.
Perhaps the Thousand Sons didn't fall to Tzeentch and come to reinforce. Horus would then be the Tzeentch champion, which makes some sense since ambition is a primary 'vice' associated with Tzeentch.
Perhaps rowboat shows up.
Perhaps Perturabo could not figure out a way to break Dorn's defensive plan.
Perhaps the Emperor fries himself blowing the traitor fleet out of orbit and into the warp.
pretty new to 30k but whenever someone posts about using normal tacticals, alot of anons people automatically recommend using veterean tacticals.
But how do you fill out troop slots then ? Is there something i'm missing here or is there a way to make vetearans into troops ?
>terminators as troops
Wait, really? How viable is this?
Ehh, some of their stuff is ok. I used the Chinaman for 6 Legion jetbikes and a Contemptor. As flawless as any FW casts are, and FW quality resin.
If you're calling anon a faggot because he's not supporting FW, that makes a little more sense. But you cant really judge your fellow anon based on that. Maybe the guy has been ordering FW for years, but recently took a pay cut? That happened to me, which is why I started selectively usung recasts or used kits.
Stop spamming faggot at people though, I get that its a thing, but that doesnt mean its mandatory.
Yeah, it's because he's not supporting FW. Not to be a hypocrite, I haven't bought anything from them yet, just the BaC set fron GW, but I've been salivating over their stuff for some ten years now. The guy in question has 4 different Legion armies, how's he short on money even if he's been buying from recasters? So "faggot" is an appropriate response if you ask me.
Actually, I bought Autillon Skorr, but not directly from FW since the model's limited availability, so not sure if that counts.
30k was designed for 20 man Tactical blobs. Kit out the Sgt with Artificer Armor to tank anything that is AP3+ and a Powerfist. The uptick in suggesting Veterans as troops and PotL is partly attributed to the arrival of B@C. At 2.5-3k point games PotL is rarely used over the Legion specific RoW.
Issue here is that SoH unique rite, the Black Reaving, is kind of average. It's more restrictive than Pride of the Legion with less bonuses. Where Pride just means you cannot have allies, the Reaving requires you to take a master of the signal, requires you to have more Fast Attack than Heavy Support, does not allow you to take fortifications, and requires you to take an additional compulsory Troops choice. Where the Reaving just means you may take Reavers as troops and your infantry gains rage when charging into ongoing close combat, Pride allows you to take Vets and Termies as troops. Until it's fixed I can't see many Sons of Horus players taking it simply because Pride has far less drawbacks and frees up the more contested Elites slots in Veteran/Terminator heavy lists.
You make valid points, but SoH are designed to be a small elite force army. PotL definitely works better for them. But then again SoH are one of the weakest, if not the weakest, legions out there right now. Hopefully their tweaks in the updated redbook.
This. For Justaerin supposedly being the best terminator elite of any Legion they seriously suck balls. They either need a decent stat hike. I'm talking higher WS/BS/W/ or vastly reduced starting unit tax.
I'm a little confused with SoH and Rites, simply because they replicate 2 of them almost out of the gate.
Pride is neat, except Maloghurst gives you Reavers & Veterans for free. You lack the Terminator contingent of course but I thought people tend to run Pride for Sniper-Vets.
Similarly, army-wide access to Dreadclaws takes a big bite from Orbital Assault. Legion Pods are obviously far cheaper, but Dreadclaws do a lot of work and are a far better delivery for melee units.
Angel's Wrath is crippling in its limitations, and Armored Assault just doesn't do a whole lot.
So if you want to take Maloghurst, Reaving is really the only one left. Masters of Signal aren't a big cost...
Yeah the issue with Reaving is that it is super restrictive before they decided to give rites big game changing bonuses.
Coils of the Hydra is pretty fucking restricting in either your army list or your mutable tactic, but you get huge bonuses for doing so
If Reaving was redone to be similar in power scale, it'd make SoH much more attractive
Apparently the new Rite in Retribution represents the Sons after they've ninja'd all the good kit from the Mechanicum. Their bit on the long road to Terra, with all the ammo and pimped out armour that they can get their hands on.
I've heard rerolls to hit the first time they open fire. Not sure how else they could represent it.
I'd still love for Reaving to focus on Bikes and Fire Raptors rather than Reavers. We already have Mal doing that, and it ties into the whole sudden-strike thing.
> beep beep, best Legion driving through
Plz anon I can't wait
>40 transport capacity
>massive door melta
>4 weapon hard-points
>bolt cannon/whirlwind launcher on the roof
>2 void shields
>looks like frag launchers on the door
really? its kinda pointless on the other weapons bar the flamer, which is overpriced IMO. 10 guys, 2 with HB, is 14 rending shots, 6 at str 5. good times. They come with suspensors, so they can run around capping objectives
>but its still 25 points for st 3 ap6 rending
Pretty sure the frag missile is S4, but what does that matter, when you're mostly aiming for those 6s? And it's only 5pts. more than the HB. But yeah, forgot that snipers are shit against vehicles now. Forget I said anything.
I've been so divided on whether I wanted to do blob Iron Hands to get the most mileage out of Inviolate Armor or use their RoW to spam Land Raiders. Now it looks like I'll be able to kind of do both at the same time! Plus it's a big ass tank for Castermen Orth to drive around in and run people over with.
You can as a matter of fact give them chaplains.
So how do allies and Rites of War work?
In one paragraph it says you may only have one Rite of War per army but it also said allies may have their own rite of war. Is an allied detachment technically a different army or how does this work?
Also, Word Bearers can have Daemon allies. Can you also do it the other way around and have Daemons with Word Bearer allies?
I understand it that allies can have their own RoW or the equivalent if using it doesn't require the model to be the Warlord as well. Pretty sure the Praetor has to be the Warlord for you to take RoW, so he can't be in an Allied attachment and have RoW. But if another model can have RoW and doesn't need to be the Warlord, then they could be in an Allied detachment and give them his RoW.
Or so I've understood it.
>not a massive fan of the 30k track style
What is this faggotry?
You could always get a Phobos and convert it into a Spartan. Seen many conversions online. The two hulls are practically identical in size. Just extend the front and tweak it a little here and there, and it should be golden.
I can deal with it, I jut prefer the 40k style tracks.
I was going to replace them all with these but now all the tanks come with molded on tracks
I forget, can you use dreads (of any size) in ZM?
I feel like pic related would be rape, but would be extremely limited in movement and probably ambushed and hit from behind.
Also, is there any real change to power rankings in ZM from normal play? I know it doesn't matter much, but I'm still wondering
Also, the rules more or less say that it has to physically fit in the space as you have it laid out; so if there's a very narrow door and it can't make it through, well, it can't make it through.
well, the board is pretty flexible and a lot of people just build their own ZM setup since the actual FW boards are crazy expensive if you want enough pieces to customize it. generally a contemptor can get most places just fine, and since some of the missions involve locking/breaking down doors it's a setting they're actually well suited to
>Not fair, Kaedes Tex is in a realm all his own.
This is ture.
>Also, is there any real change to power rankings in ZM from normal play?
As far as legion rankings? Not a big change as far as tiers, since 30k doesn't have an objective 1 through 10. But I will say that RG are arguably #1 thanks to Kaedes Nex(absolutely sickening in ZM), army wide infiltrate/outflank, praevian with infiltrating fleet castellax, and Mor Deythan (infiltrate, scout, fatal strike, especially in cold void for better rending ). That and they scale down really well. To be fair RG are the masters of low number sneaky beaky ded killy warfare.
IW are good because it's hard to make them flee and trap them for auto kills. Plus tyrants if used well will lock down whole sections.
AL can do well on board positioning but their unique units aren't as killy and in zm you do not want to be stuck in one place in a protracted fight.
IF because they were half designed for zm combat. Warders are actually good there. Plus in cold void BS5 fury of the Legion is brutal. And teleporting th/ss tartaros.
Thanks - Raven Guard seem to be really good as a legion, from what people are saying.
Fists, I'd expect.
Any advice on how the DG fare?
The standard long range Heavy Weps, I guess they're a bit less useful with the tighter battlefields?
Their flamers get an upgrade, being Shred but also gets hot (not mandatory), they have some of the best yet non-overlapping Termies available. The Reaping rite of war heavily encourages heavy support fire and nifty use of Radnades. Disadvantages are for the most part they dont have any real bonuses to melee outside of rad-nades and circumstantial uses of the Scythes use of the sweep attack. Hopefully their shouldn't be enough enemies left standing after the first couple turns of fire if you did it right.
I play BA in 40k and haven't dabbled in 30k much at all. Could you explain the bloodlust bit and some of the character of the legion in 30k? I feel the BA codices haven't really developed them much. Neither did the BA quadrilogy.
>Deep within the psyche of every Blood Angel is a destructive yearning, a battle fury and blood-hunger that must be held in abeyance in every waking moment. Few battle-brothers can hold this Red Thirst in check unceasingly -- it is far from unknown for Blood Angels to temporarily succumb to its lure at the height of battle.
>There have been incidents when the Blood Angels have been stationed on distant worlds where members of the local population have gone missing only to turn up later drained of blood.
>Those affected by the Red Thirst often have pale skin, and a potent urge to drink the blood of their enemies that can emerge at any time during combat. This genetic curse has also been passed on to their Successor Chapters, such as the Flesh Tearers, Blood Drinkers, and the Angels Sanguine.
Is anyone else that's new having a bit of a lull in planning how they'll build their armies until the weekender releases all the new RoWs and toys? I desperately don't wanna be a Pride of the Legion BaCbro
Would love to make a combined force of Dark Angels+ Loyalist DG and EC
Sadly I am a college student and therefore I can only dream about forgeworld
Headhunters and resin upgrades for plastic Cataphractii this week.
The heads look weird as fuck with those teeth/fangs/horns whatever that is supposed to be.
Looks a bit like a scorpions tail.
Not seen any conversions, but the Hydra Knight from Kabuki is pretty sexy.
Swap the weapons for spear/plasma blaster and you're set.
Now do the same for Indomitus suits.
Read fear to tread
Shows how they roll
They love using anvil with descent of angels hammer
Prone to being head strong
Their wardens (chaplains) and sanguinary guard are super rod up the arse as a reaction to that trait
Can be very hierarchical bit with some humility / compassion
Basically emperors children pre heresy but combined with Reasonable Marines - Flesh Tearer founder is a Chapter Master (10k marines)
You can use them to look good and add an extra attack for your Paragon Blade, sure. Alternatively if not going for 2 cc weapons anyway it's fine too.
I wouldn't get a single claw if I had a pistol or something on the side. If you are playing Sons of Horus I guess go for it, they seem to have a thing for it.
Seems fine on a consul, praetors have this dumb thing called a Paragon blade though and ap2 at ini value is very rare so yeah...
Guys, we can use headhunter squads to sew dissent, err, I mean sow descent in our enemies.
How does something this comically bad make it into marketing material?
Is attitude over ability a FW thing too? Was there not a second or third set of eyes checking this for errors? Or is vocabulary just too hard.
I know its a bit nitpicky, but its not like its just a spelling or grammar mistake. Its two completely wrong words in the banner of a piece of marketing material. Come the fuck on.
Ehh not necessarily. I bought two BaC boxes and didnt create a single tactical marine with them. 3 terror squads, 2 tac support squads, and a veteran tac squad.
Not every RoW supports blobs.
Sow is a female pig. It is alsoan alternate spelling for sew.
In the case of the FW flyer text, sew would have been the better choice for clarity's sake. Why use a word with two meanings when you can just use the spelling that fits your context.
Descent is wrong but sow is right.
You don't fucking sew dissent
You sow dissent
You don't knit treason into the fabric of society
You don't fucking croche your spies into the hearts of your enemies
You rip them open and PLANT a seed of treason
I was thinking claw/boarding shield
verb: sow; 3rd person present: sows; past tense: sowed; gerund or present participle: sowing; past participle: sown
plant (seed) by scattering it on or in the earth.
"fill a pot with compost and sow a thin layer of seeds on top"
synonyms: scatter, spread, broadcast, disperse, strew, disseminate, distribute, drill, dibble, put in the ground;
"the field had both British and German mines sown in it"
disseminate or introduce (something undesirable).
Only that we are only getting the Legion rules, wargear and Rite. We are *not* getting any unique units, characters or the Primarch's yet.
In Blangels case I think you're getting 2 Rites of War: Can't remember the exact names but they're named after days, something along the lines of 'Day of Sorrow' and 'Day of Glory'.
One is a defensive siege-style, hold the walls of Terra. Other is an offensive, Jump-rush paladin-light aggression list.
Definitely getting Iliastus Assault Cannons, probably some variant of Glaives Encarmine.
LA likely some variant of Furious Charge along with an honour/inspirational rule, and some Legion perk for using Jump Packs.
Overcharged Engines seem likely, either as LA or purchased wargear.
>You don't knit treason into the fabric of society
>You don't fucking croche your spies into the hearts of your enemies
I don't, but the Alpha Legion probably does. Their skills are diverse and often used in unconventional methods. I can totally see a power armored bad guy threading two Imperial Administrators together. That would be sewing dissent.
>Any advice on how the DG fare?
If you sneak in their RoW(hello delegatus 2.0) to give move through cover(no dangerous tests) on their destoyers and bikes they're suddenly blazing fast and tough. They're similar to IW in that they are less spooked by the amount of pinning in zm.
>How about IH?
Involatile armor is good everywhere. Just beware void missions because rending. Anything that has additional resistance is also always good. I had forgotten about immortals. FnP 5+, T5 from shooting, and option for chargers(great for reaction fire) does make for a solid ZM unit. And they aren't afraid of no void.
Elites are scoring if you're attacking but then troops don't. Though elites become the mandatory.
>The following Rite of War can be used by a Legion Delegatus being fielded as the army’s Warlord. It represents the officer selecting a small but potent strike force of chosen warriors for the prosecution of a specific objective. It can be used in any mission, but is particularly appropriate for use in smaller scale games, such as the Zone Mortalis missions provided in The Horus Heresy Book One – Betrayal and The Horus Heresy Book Three – Extermination, and the Strategic Raids missions in The Horus Heresy Book Four – Conquest.
>Rite of War
>particularly appropriate for [...] Zone Mortalis
>Remember that FW has said several times that RoW are only usable with the base AoD chart
No they havent, all of the campaign specific FOC can be used with RoW with the exception of the Onslaught/Castellan/Leviathan ones that explicitly say you cant use them with RoW.
So, After about a year of doing iron hands, i'm moving on to a traitor legion.
I know it's supposed to be a massed infantry just swarming the hell out of the opponent.
so should i bother giving them transport, or just GET HARD AND FOOT SLOG IT.
also, kharn is epic.
I think assault marines would be a good troop choice or at least some despoiler squads, I never see WE done justice its just always a bunch of tac or vet squads, fuck, BaC has made low point games very boring to watch
>BaC has made low point games very boring to watch
HH has always been boring to watch at low level points, everyone's taking blobs of tacs or tacs in rhinos or veterans in rhinos, nothing has changed that.
What's a good loadout for a transport storm eagle? I got 10 terminators that need a transport and I don't want a spartan, so been looking at a storm eagle. Keep it cheap or pimp it out?
a better picture of the painted mastadon, Anybody speak german?
The description is not particularly helpful. From what I gather, the shown weapons are fixed, as there are no options mentioned and each weapon is called out by name. It has a rule that looks like it amounts to move through cover. I haven't read any of the other HH rulebooks in German, so I'm not sure if the deflector shield is a localized name for an existing rule or if it's an entirely new shield. Either way, it has one. It also looks like it has armored ceramite, but the phrasing leads me to believe that it might just be fluff saying that it is armored in thick ceramite plating. It does also have firing ports, which is surprising considering space marine transport.
the deflector shield is probably the two void shields, that's those brass nubs on the top behind the driver,1 per shield layer as shown on imperial titans.
thanks though, firing ports is pretty interesting
You may be right. I have absolutely no idea, as I haven't read many rulebooks in German. The language is easy, but figuring out what GW decided to rename when localizing and the figuring out what the hell they decided to name it can be rather difficult. Hopefully there's a native speaker around here, or at least someone who's read enough of the 30k/40k German rulebooks to recognize that word. The only one I've actually read cover-to-cover was the 6e Tyranid codex, which is far from helpful here.
WS9 BS6 S6 T6 W6 I8 A5 I8 Ld10 Sv2+ Inv4++
Sire of the Blood Angels: allows all units to use his Ld for morale tests, hit and run for jump pack troops, makes Sanguinary guard troops.
Flying monstrous creature like rules, HoW, Strikedown, Furious charge, Rage maybe.
Blood sword: S+1, AP2, some fancy rule like blind or soul blaze.
Mastercrafted inferno pistol
I'm guessing something like this.
For BA rules we'll probably get a mixture of gotta-go-fast and charge bonuses like rage, FC etc
I don't like how GW is slowly creeping into HH territory
>buy 2 from chinamen
>play leviathan FOC
>fill one with tactical marines
>fill one with Templar brethren/terminators and Sigismund
>watch opponent shit themselves because they don't know which is which
Only good in transports able to take 10 of them at once, which starts to get pricey. 5 terminators are just going to get swamped. I've had 5 terminators just shot off the board in a turn by FotL tacticals.
Yes, pretty much. The daggers do look neat.
Speaking of terminator, I'm looking for a way to use the BaC ones.
I was planning to run a 5 men unit with combiweapon and power axes. Led by a forgelord with rads. So I get S6AP2 vs T3... how viable is that? Delivered by Stormeagle.
>the alpharius model is actually just a bunch of tiny cabal in PA
>You need at least the AC.
Is AA melta that prevalent? I've been a bit hesitant to put AC on low to medium AV vehicles that can be easily enough cracked with non-meltas.
I agree on the MM. With the Machine Spirit I can aim it at hard targets while pouring missiles at soft ones.
>guilliman opens up Alpharius armored corpse
>goes back to his camp
>his armored patrol comes back
>land raider full of Lernaens
>look out over bastion as Ultramarines retreat off world
>see not just one Alpharius watching, by three
FUCKIN AL SHITS
Yeah exactly. Convert a few plasma blasters for them and they could be pretty neat
I'm sure plastic Chaos terminators would work fine for more Chaotic forces. Indomitus was in use at the time (though ruleswise is the shitties of them all, thanks to latest FAQ) and the suits don't seem to have anything that would be out of the ordinary. You also get reaper ACs on them and a set of combi and power weapons.
I'm just curious as to when the traitors started getting so damned spikey and baroque. Seems like up to and after Terra they looked almost identical to their loyalist fellows besides the Gal Vorbak
>I'm just curious as to when the traitors started getting so damned spikey and baroque.
WB and EC started right after Istvaan, everyone else went full chaos when they assaulted Terra as the DG were already plagued, the 1ksons turned to dust and the WE had Demon Angron.
Helbrute and DV box Chosen spikey would probably take hundreds of years of Warp exposure. Regular CSM box could happen in HH, I think. I mean, most of that is just cosmetic. Chaos stars, horns and trim added to armour. Simple stuff, if you ask me.
Also, wasn't the siege of Terra pretty depraved with daemons and civies being turned into drugs and shit? And Vengeful Spirit was a pretty chaotic ship. Or so I've understood. So having traitors who've bone off the deep end doesn't seem so far fetched.
Take a darkwing instead as a DT. It won't use up your FA slots.
Also consider the cost of a Forge lord vs just giving them fists instead to ID all the time anyway. It's cheaper and doesn't use up your consul. If you want to supplement their melee go with s chaplain.
Or chain fists for S9 armorbane.
I really don't have those problems. My FA slots are quite free but my elites are cramped. And I wonder what is my best option for my mandory HQ.
I will go with Maun, but the presence of Corax denies me its warlord trait...
it doesn't, it's basically an assault ram that can't fly
>drive up to obstacle
>fire melta at obstacle
>massive engine drives though obstacle
>reach enemy wall
>fire melta at wall
>jam ram in wall
>hydraulics force half melted wall apart and deploy troops into fortification
>extra guys run in the back and straight through into the fort, like a seige tower
I disagree, things like spikes, horns and metallic details are added by the marines or their artificers while things like crazy faces, nubs of bone or anything organic is the effect of the warp.
Remember that some traitor marines are more like renegades than chaotic. Some NLs are still uncorrupted but would have spiky armour for hanging skins and skulls off. I can't refer to any other legion as there is little lore on this topic but I imagine there are still some AL are uncorrupted and some IWs only use chaos as a means to an end rather than being full chaos zealots like WBs or totally corrupted like the god specific legions.
I love that FW made the Reavers look like proto-CSM.
>as the DG were already plagued
Plagued on the journey to Terra, thanks to the Legion's biggest Asshole over here.
Before that, they were mostly okay
He does look pretty boss though
Only those that were traveling with Typhon. The other half that were still with Mortarion, hadn't turned yet but eventually would when Mortation finally comes to terms with his own sorcerous abilities.
As far as I knew the DG grouped into one big fleet, killed their Navigators and trusted Typhon to guide them, who got them all becalmed in the warp and buried under the destroyer swarms until even Mortarion had to submit to the pain
Just check the remains of planets. If there's nothing but blood, World Eaters. Chem weapons? Death Guard. Bats and flayed people? Night Lords. A bunch of wizards came by and reduced everything to dust? Thousand Sons. Trenches and decimation? Iron Warriors. I'm not sure what Sons of Horus leave behind, but I know the Alpha Legion leaves nothing but a mess.
Eh, it's more First Captain Asshole locking them in a gay club and raping them until they all like cock, or are too broken to say otherwise.
But yeah, it's meant to be a pretty tragic thing, their greatest strength of endurance turned against them and causing them to suffer, as the primarch who hates psykers and undead (the main constituent of the armies of the xenos on his homeworld) saw his legion becoming horrifying rotting monstrosities, and the legion that was perhaps the most unified and singular in its ideology and operation undone by betrayal of one of its own.
The intro to the Death Guard bit in Betrayal sums it up well.
>Sons of Horus
a little bit of everything
a completely indecipherable shitpile, the planet possibly doesn't even know they've been at war
raped corpses and cocaine
temples and sacrifices
But wouldn't they expect you to expect that?
>A little bit of everything
I thought about that. Can't believe I forgot about the WBs and ECs.
>a completely indecipherable shitpile, the planet possibly doesn't even know they've been at war
Seems 100% accurate.
For the Mortis Contemptor Dreadnought, Forgworld sells a Cyclone Missile Launcher, but the listing says Havoc Launcher. Which is it?
Is a Mortis with 2 Kheres Assault Cannons and a 'Havoc' launcher (195pts) better than say a Sicaran with Lascannons? Either would serve as my Anti-air.
Also, rulebook not next to me, but can the Mortis fire all 3 weapons as its a walker?
It's coming, brother. I just know it. It would probably be a breath of fresh air for /tg/.
>yfw there's a 30k Dawn of War
Ok, just making sure. So FW has it misnamed.
I realize that its not as great for AA duty, but still good otherwise.
Can Walkers fire all 3 if needed, assuming it goes on ground clearing duty?
Okay about the whole Albion is Britain or Albania thing
What's your view?
Because I found a random quote - but can't source it to a novel - about truth and a bodyguard of lies
Now this is noted as saying of Old Albia M2
Google shows that quote is one of churchills
So the death guard were British after all
Hey /HHGen/ I have 10 BaC Cataphractiis on the sprue and two Cataphractii special weapon kits. I dont want to add them to my Night Lords army because no one makes a cat themed Cataphractii shoulderpad for proper Atramentar.
So what Legion has the best (non specific) Terminators?
The issue is dusk raiders were described as being from Albia
And the wiki and lexicanum says they came from south east Europe
This despite the stuff about the emperor coming to the warlords dressed in white and red (like a football hooligan in a st George flag) and the whole north atlan and Ironsides etc
I think internet Albanians and heritage Albanians have pushed the idea - like atlan refers to Atlantis and the double eagle flag and so on
Old Albia was said to be in northern Atlan wilderness, and was a source of Legionaires for the Death Guard, Iron Hands and Night Lords (and possibly the Emperor's Children in small numbers, as they took from all the planet's nobility, and the clans of Albia weren't destroyed)
Confusingly, there's also Albyon, mentioned in Outcast Dead (their leader was said to drink human blood)
>makes a cat themed Cataphractii shoulderpad for proper Atramentar
not read the night lords stuff, u wot m8
but to answer your question, imperial fists, +1bs with bolters, assault cannons, storm-shields and deep strike
It's a minor fluff point and incorrect anyway.
Atramentar are the NL first company terminators, one guy had a big cat like animal engraved on his shoulder pad. This was personal rather than a legion marking.
High Elf White Lions and (White Lion) Chariot comes with big lion shoulder pads. I think Puppets War makes some animal shoulder pads, they might have something to fit that bill, though I suspect they're more for your typical indomitus, so I don't know how they'll fit cataphractii.
variant scheme shown in book 3, they show an assault legionary and an assault terminator in it
I can't claim credit for that terminator though, it's in my reference folder for when my BaC arrives on monday
some 30k legions don't have a defined colour scheme. I've noticed it most with Fists and Ultras.
There's nothing wrong with having all yellow IFs or IFs with yellow head and pads with black bodies or a single yellow arm and the rest of the armour being plain ceremite.
Well, he's definitely seen some shit, yikes.
AL: FW paints them all Turquoise, books describe them as Amaranth (which is a red magenta). Fully intend to have squads in both colours, should provide an interesting contrast.
also, anybody know where this chest piece is from?
>IF scheme is definitely black with yellow per HH right
I haven't got the pic of helmets, vambraces and chest pieces (I think), but it's important to remember that there's very little standardisation in the Legion's markings - Yellow is the primary, but for elites, veterans, specialist units, various fleets (and the IF had the biggest legion fleet of all), the forces under individual commanders and anyone with enough prestige could all have differing heraldry, markings and colours
That looks pretty sweet, though I think a more shield-on angle would help it look a little less like a Justaerin (especially as they can't have shields)
I have seen it before in Chapter Master.
Man, that's a gorgeous kit, and not even too heavy on the scorpions
Ah thanks, that's the one I meant, though both are great - the only thing uniform in the uniforms of the great crusade was the lack of uniformity
ahh, that's the only problem with the marine range, it's now soo big it's hard to find the bit you need
yeah I've been meaning to pick it up for ages, sexy models, pretty generic, MKIV librarian WITH HELMET,
Red I think - contrasts well with the white and green.
Normally heavily shadowed though
>it's now soo big it's hard to find the bit you nee
And that's not even counting a lot of cool 3rd party stuff
Holy shit that was fast, thanks guys. That's what I was going with but I felt unsure, so I wanted a better opinion.
Also, one more question:
Since I'm doing death guard as a traitor legion, what should I do for a loyalist? All of my current armies are stationary and shooty, in both 40k and horus heresy, and I would like to diversify. What legion should I pick to branch out?
I thought Legion mostly stuck to Amaranth, which certainly not a dark purple, but I could have missed a passage in memory, it's certainly not unlikely that it includes tones between the blue/turquoise and amaranth.
Fluff about the AL colours and symbols. The gist seems to be 'do whatever you want'.
As a knight player, I'd tell you no, it doesn't, but be aware that any opponent that knows you're running a Household *will* kick your shit in if he has half a brain. 30k offers so many hard counters to knights, it's not even funny.
Yeah they say amaranth quite a bit in legion, but there's a part where they straight up call the armor purple. I just reread it fairly recently so it stuck out in my mind
This guys got the right idea
The colour swatch amaranth purple is this
The plant has green tinged purple leaves
>Don't fists have Latinos in their ranks?
Crimson Fists only became Latino after they stopped being a fleet based chapter and adopted a few standard recruiting worlds.
What are some knight hard counters? No one around me has a knight so I've never faced one.
There is indeed, however that colour is called Amaranth Purple, rather than strait up Amaranth.
They're both gorgeous colours though. Just received a bottle of Amaranth Ink to try it out. Mixed 1:1 with Lahmian Medium to turn it into something a little more like a translucent paint, as inks are usually tricky to get even coats with. So far, test swatches look nice and intensely coloured.
Sicarian and Venator are regular choices, but Contemptor-Mortis and Deredeo are also very common. Any flyers will rend knights apart, as will a sarge number of superheavies (Cerberus in particular). Tyrant siege terminators and Fulmentarus strike terminators are also nasty. Really, there are a lot of options.
In a pinch a big melee tarpit can hold the knight in place for the rest of the game, as he won't decimate them fast enough, even with Stomp, assuming he isn't a Castigator.
Pretty much. The key is surrounding them, so you can pile on hits outside the shielded zone, at which point you just need to get past the mediocre AV12.
Another thing is the Venator and the Cerberus, both of which can force anything hit by their main gun to fire only snapshots for a turn, which will handily lock down a good number of knights' shooting entirely and make the rest awful.
In most games under 2k it's also very tricky to take a AA knight without compromising your hitting power against ground targets, making Flyers very troublesome.
So do you put destroyer squads in the backfield and let them soften up targets with rad missiles to make it easier for your melee-dedicated units or do you have to equip them to get in the thick of things with some of their shorter ranged weaponry ?
They are close ranged units, legions have enough long ranged fire power, they cost too much for a lot of people though.
If you really want to us them keep them close to a dedicated melee squad, get them tom charge first to absorb any overwatch then have your dedicated CC squad charge in to mince the remaining T3 marines.
They dropped in on the roof and killed everything down to the mold in the basement.
That's only if the palace was valuable for whatever reason. Otherwise it would just be a crater.
High enough. The army is basically built on Terror Squads; Preferred Enemy, Infiltrating Veterans with Volkites. Throw in an Artificer-Chainglaive wielding Headsman and you have a good mix.
Outstanding Rite of War too. I'm told that there's some grief getting Sevatar to work properly because he can't deploy with the units he actually wants to be with? Not sure on that one.
Curze is obviously great as well.
Only criticism is that you tend to have so many Volkite weapons that you don't have anything left for anti-tank..
the guy did a really nice marine too
I'm doing a more traditional color scheme
this is mine
charcoal shoulders and a snot green shoulder
You stepping on my turf?
Master of the Blood Angels, The Angel
Ws 8 Bs 6 S 6 T 6 W 6 I 8 A 6 Ld 10 Sv 2+
Jump Infantry (Character)
The Blade Encarmine: S +1 Ap 2 Instant Death Shred
The Mantle of the Blood Angel This armour provides Sanguinus with a 2+ Armour and a 3+ Invulnerable save, in addition Sanguinius gains the Relentless special rule
The Liquescimus Infurno:
12" S 4 Ap 3 Assault 3
12" S 8 Ap 1 Heavy 1 Melta
The Gift of Baal: Sanguinius May use His jump pack in the Movement phase and the Assault Phase
Sire of the Blood Angels: All models with the Legionne Astartes (Blood angels) special rule use Sanguinius' leadership instead of their own, in edition all models with the Legionne Astartes (Blood angels) special rule in Sanguinius' gain the Rage special rule, or, if they already had it the Stubborn special rule.
On The Wings of an Angel: Sanguinius moves, following the rules of a flying monstrous creature, if he joins a jump infantry unit then the unit and Sanguinius must move like a normal jump infantry unit, with the exception that they may use there jump packs in the movement and assault phase.
Psyker (Mastery Level 1): Sanguinius generates powers from the divination table but instead of generating the Prescience power through psychic focus he instead gains the Warrior Of Precognition power (though may still exchange for the divination primaris as normal)
Precog Warrior: If Sanguinius is in a challenge then he may discharge any or all warp charges (aside from those generated by other psykers) to reduce the opponent's to hit rolls characteristic by one for every warp charge, to a minimum of 1. (e.g. If Sanguinius applied three charges during his turn then his opponent attacked him in a challange that turn then he could reduce one roll by three, three rolls by one ect.)
The Sicaran is better. They are literally meant for AA with ignoring jink saves.
Contemptor is cool, don't get me wrong, but the Sicaran will earn its pts back quicker; and can if super lucky, penetrate a Spartans flare shield too.