Orcs have the largest population and are really good at Smithing, Fighting, and Cooking. Trolls only purpose in life is to Guard their bridge, clean it, accept tolls to make the bridge better, and punch goats. Goblins are Morons, Weak, and Small. The're childish, Innocent, and are favored by lady luck.
Goblins are the result of sperm wasted on the ground or on inanimate objects; this congeals deep within the Earth and forms goblins.
Orcs are half pig people, uplifted by the ancient Titans. Seen as greedy and fat, as well as savage. Many become religious extremists.
Trolls are space aliens left by the Titans, meant to inhabit and take over the world slowly over eons. (Trolls and Ogres are the same race however; Ogres are trolls that lost their healing powers and became retarded as a result)
>muh constructive discussion You mean a bunch of 3.5 fans saying PF is wrong and a bunch of PF fans saying 3.5 is wrong? There is no single correct answer. Everyone is right. Sure, you can explain how it works in your totally original setting do not steal, but most people won't read it, so you're only stroking your ego.
>>44868922 A troll is a fire-breathing reptile with four legs and two wings. A goblin is a fire-breathing reptile with two legs and two wings. An orc is a fire-breathing reptile with four legs and no wings. This is true in EVERY medieval fantasy setting. If you try to write a book that says otherwise, your words will disappear off the page before your eyes!
>>44868638 >Trolls Isolationist woodsmen and magical warriors. They're the guys living in the big log cabin in the middle of nowhere.
>Orcs Most developed and live in "forest/green cities". These are the guys who seem to be planting a forest when they say they're building a city. They don't like any of the others for various reasons, usually it's because they keep cutting up their buildings for their own homes.
>Goblins Primarily agrarian, country folk who live in mounds.
>Hogoblins Nomadic people. These people live in wagon trains. Also do lots of mercantile shit. Goblins claim they're all thieves and rapists.
>Ogres "Most Civilized" in that they do lots of blacksmithing and engineering of sorts and live in stone and wood towns. They don't get along with Trolls
In my setting, these people are all basically the same race, just different ethnicities of it.
>>44868638 >Trolls Noticeably larger than an orc and possess regeneration, may turn to stone in daylight. Most likely to be solitary or in very small groups. Intelligence varies widely but more intelligent trolls frequently enjoy riddles or sadistic games.
>Orcs Slightly larger and stronger than a human but not as large as a troll. Physically resemble early humanoids, but may have porcine facial features. Do not possess inherent supernatural qualities in most cases (but see warhammer orkz psychic powers for a very significant exception to this rule) Tend to live in simple social structures with modest populations absent external influences. Generally possesses intelligence of a 10 year old or developmentally disabled human. Enjoys violence and consumption.
>Goblins Significantly smaller and weaker than an orc. Almost universally green skinned with pointy ears and large noses. Voices are high pitched, tend vocalize aggressive growls or giggling noises. Frequently more intelligent than orcs or at least more creative. Social structures often complex and involve cohabitation with other species.
Thats the best I can do to summarize the vanilla presentation of the three creatures you mentioned.
Many settings paint Orcs and Goblins as related in some way, whether in really broad terms (D&D's Goblinoids includes Orcs in the classification) or in a concrete way (Warhammer and 40k basically treat them as varieties of the same creature)
Trolls are a type of genius loci, like giants. They typically are spawned from smaller locations than giants, who tend towards coming from mountains. Hills, knolls, and buttes can all host trolls.
Orcs can be a few things. In my settings they've been:
-A humanoid race most associated with the Green, one of the six essential Directions of the universe -One of the Fated Races, as opposed to the Unfated Race, humanity -Pretty much just regular, run-of-the-mill orcs
Goblins are pretty much whichever small humanoid needs to be named first. They can fill the same roles as Brownies, some types of Fairies, or even Gnomes.
In my group's setting, a Hobgoblin is just what you call it when one goblin gets on top of another goblin's shoulders and the increase in elevation and combined advantages of two goblins goes to their head and choose never to be separate again.
In fact, the older Hobgoblins have been together for so long that their bodies have started to grow together and become truly inseparable, sorta like a rat king.
You may have noticed that we don't take everything quite so seriously.
And as I'm sure I told you before; it's a semi-sponatneous generation. Your spermatazoa does not spring into goblins, and even if it did it wouldn't mean they would be willing to fight for you or something. I could see that working only for a Wizard who experiments with growing goblins in jars and urns, but its not exactly reliable nor usually smart to have a goblin in ones home. That's why Wizards invented Kobolds as their slave race.
Also >Implying there is anything wrong with Pig Orcs when the entire setting's backstory for most mortal races is being uplifted from animals; humans once being monkeys but then changed into humans by the Volcano God.
>>44868638 Trolls are a race and a part of civilization who are short lived demonic-looking big ass humanoids, who are crazy strong and regenerate like mad, but are being eaten alive by an inner fire, which is why they age so fast.
Orcs are just a name for a particularly gigantic and nasty species of boar/hog that can level buildings or used for crazypeople racing.
Goblins are a type of lesser faerie who enjoy stealing shit and are decent enough for stronger types of faerie to bully into doing theft work, basically like smart small feral dogs who if left alone would rather hide under trees and scavenge food.
>>44870150 I know it may be too creative for a lot of /tg/'ers who are stuck riding Tolkien's dead dick, but...
Elves are bird like creatures that feed on blood and have four arms, in addition to the wings. Dwarves are a proud agarian race, and breathe water and are unsteady on land, dependent on humans for metalworking items. Humans are just as humans of our world, but its important to remember that they're MUCH stronger and more intelligent than any other sapient races, who make up for it with the ability to breathe water, see in the dark, etc.
>>44868638 Trolls are vegetal-based creatures, spawned from swamps where ancient tribes sacrificed people to appease the "gods", actually one of the many fae forests around the continent before their retreat from civilization.
Orcs are ape-like, whose only goal is to destroy civilization. Savages which consume only meat and iron, said iron hardening their bones and scar tissue, which become cold iron. The oldest and biggest look more like rusty golems than animals. the fae's revenge against the civilization whose writing crystalized their stories into fixed forms and weakened the narrative powers they used to manipulate early mortals. And because cold iron is made from iron plus a pinch of blood from certain bloodlines, they are using the feared metal of civilization against itself.
Goblins are very like vanilla ones, messy, small, creative, a bit crazy, very fast learners. Their "economy" and sense of business is based around bartering for items which fit into the personal collection each goblin craves for, from shrunken heads to seeds, stones to poetry books. They are the descendants of an earlier fae revenge, which long ago changed thousands of babies much time ago for changelings. They behave much like children, because they were a distortion of children (small, very fast learners, messy, don't quite understand money)
>>44870372 Pic unrelated, actually, as "transgenderism is normal, though they may have different social constructs" isn't remotely original, its just standard /tg/ fetish crap, and was done better back in that one society which considered peacocks the essence of masculinity. Hell, Dwarf Fortress has been doing it for longer.
>>44870372 The problem I see with the Sunborn and Moonborn thing is that if there is no physical difference between the Sun and Moon born then it wouldn't nearly be as crucial to elven society as it's intended to be. Humans use male and female as designations that can be applied based on sight or sound alone. For the most part, nobody ever has to tell others their gender in order for it to become common social knowledge, leading them to alter their behavior accordingly. With the Sun and Moon born, the only difference physically between them is the clothes that it's acceptable for them to wear.
So I ask you: If an elf changes their clothes and consciously (to the extent that consciousness allows) alters their personality and behavior, would there be any possible way for them to get found out barring someone they know remembering that they used to be Such-and-such born?
>>44870598 >I dunno, I've not incorporated it into any campaign and likely will not (I'm not even the original creator), but I was thinking that moonborn are dark elves, and sunborn the regular light skinned variety.
I wouldn't even make it that noticeable. It's a tough line to tow because absolutely no difference between them doesn't make sense and too much difference between them makes it unsubtle.
The way I would do it is give them a slightly different skin color, slightly different eye color, or slightly different ear shape. The keyword in all of these is "slightly." It should be very difficult for non-elves to tell the difference but for elves who were raised in that sort of societal structure should be able to tell immediately.
>>44870681 >"transgenderism is normal, though they may have different social constructs" isn't remotely original, its just standard /tg/ fetish crap As for abrahamic, I was referring to the general idea of the household roles found in european/arabic society - so apologies for begin too vague.
>>44870681 >bi loli or shota is indeed fetish crap, sorry >implying elves haven't been described as youthful and feminine for years
>>44870714 At least four of their genderish analogs are still determined by their starting configuration of genitals; alabai and calalai, as the link indicates anyway, are equivalent to transgender male and female, and only one is actually ambiguous with regards to their original genitals (unless I misread it, the implication seemed to be that males or females could be considered as such)...
So the most transgendery authentic society *in the world*, whose population could be contained in Dallas, is still not even remotely close to planet of the superbi loli/shota elves.
Its also funny that they actually *are* generally adherents of an Abrahamic religion (and that the #2 country as far as transgender surgery, and #1 as far as government sponsorship of transgender surgery, is the ultra-puritan and ultra-Abrahamic country of Iran).
I don't think anyone would have a problem with there being a city like that. On the other hand, conscripting elves to be a society of beyond-bisexual transgenders is still fetish shit.
>>44870787 >As for abrahamic, I was referring to the general idea of the household roles found in european/arabic society
Calling it Abrahamic is necessarily implying that its... Abrahamic and somehow is derived from Abrahamic religion. Any kind of appellation that shoves the Vikings and most pagans into the Abrahamic category while debatably omitting Iran and the Bugis from the Abrahamic category is pretty damn goofy.
>>44868638 I don't really, because there is no real distinction between them in Swedish. Goblin would either be translated into 'troll' (referring to the small kind) or 'svartalf' - yes, it was translated as 'vätte' in Tolkien's books but that is partly not entirely correct and also doesn't really create associations Tolkien was going for - and troll would obviously be translated as 'troll'. Orc isn't a real word in either Swedish or English and was just a translation of Goblin.
>>44868638 In my setting, I have: >Auks (Orcs), auk/penguin-like viking raiders/traders/mercenaries from the south and north. >Krols (Trolls), brainy schemers and cruel pranksters with long and extremely-flexible bodies/limbs and crocodilian heads, whose huge, wrinkled visages almost always seem to bear a great, mischievous smile. >Kobblings (Goblins), small, gekko, pygmy-like tribes people who are basically not!Skinks.
And, just for the sake of completion: >Oakers (Ogres), gigantic creatures, picture the Mountain from GoT/ASoIaF with a scaly body and the head of a T-Rex and you'll get an idea of what these guys look like.
In my most recent setting dwarves the life God made from rock and dust in the universe, aping the cooling of magma in their lives. Younger dwarvew are hot to the touch and red-skinned*, whiled older ones are cool and brown-to-black. If they die, they lose the magic keeping their cores molten, and quickly cool no matter their age.
*like a tiefling, not like a native american
Elves in that setting are ethereal space-beings who are hard to sense at best. They are the life God made from the void. They're transparent, reserved, mysterious, and not usually relevant. Elves are mostly there to fill space, since hell, it needs something representing it.
Dwarrow have also featured, in more single-planet settings, as a humanoid race opposite the elves- where the dwarrow worship the earth-mother and live deep beneath the earth, the elves worship the sky-father, living in trees and, occasionally, a magically floating city. This parallels their standing as respective representative races of the Brown and the Blue- Earth and Sky, yes, but more loosely Material and Void. Based very loosely on Tengri religion, and as such both races tend towards the vaguely asian-looking.
>>44872473 Sounding kinda Thief Pagan there. >Builds your Roofs of Dead Wood. Builds your Walls of Dead Stone. Builds your Dreams of Dead Thoughts. Comes Crying Laughing Singing back to Life, takes what you steal, And pulls the skins from your Dead Bones shrieking.
>>44870150 Humans are just human. They're the control group. Many races, ethnicities, cultures, etc.
Elves are like magical supermodel aliens. Obsessed with beauty and longevity, live like they're art and artist, and are from another realm quite literaly. Their otherworldlyness is apparent by a certain naievety of things in the world. It's like they're floating.
Dwarves are like maggots or lice of giants quite literally, coming from underground. Magical, swarthy, greedy, they brew a skald into a beer to drink his talent. They dig too deep and deal with the demons of the underworld. They have great skill at crafts, imbuding their works with magic. One was so consumed by greed he was transformed into a dragon of gold.
Goblins and Orcs are (reasonably) civilized. Trolls aren't.
Goblins are a seafaring race, some of the best shipwrights in the world, which is surprising as their architecture is often slap-dash and barely holds together. Their society is primarily based around causing chaos, and as such they have almost no government worth speaking of. They usually end up as pirates.
Orcs are bigger, and usually keep to themselves. Their society is heavily based around the family, with the younger females going out to hunt, the males staying to work on crafting/farming/defending the village. Grandparents stay at home, doing household work and teaching the younglings how to be orcy. They came from the East, where they used to have an empire until fairly recently. Some of the tribes have become de facto extensions of human empires, and tend to join human armies in grenadier or heavy cavalry units.
Trolls are big and animalistic. They have little civilization to speak of. They're split into several genuses. Some are your normal, big dumb fellows. Others are strange, animal-like women who live as leaders of animal packs.
>>44868638 In DSA or The Dark Eye, it goes like this:
> Trolls 4 to 5 meters, large stubby noses, kind in nature, easy to bribe with sweets but stupid. They used to be a Highculture. Now they are a dispersed people guarding their last knowledge in cavemenlike paintings, from time to time their Shamans play a role in big events. With their low hair and round noses and primitive clothes they maybe resemble metalfags. Are in touch with nature and the world, presumed to be naturally ageless and possibly live forever.
> Ogres > 2,5 to 3 meteres, large man-eaters and gluttons, insanely muscley, a danger to anything and everything smaller than them. Easily controlled by mindcontrol magics, these guys are your typical fat lazy greasy boneheads always out for trouble. Live to see about 140 years.
> Orks 1,50 to 1,70 at the highest, black furry pelts and reddish skin, live in nomadic cultures and wage war on humans - sometimes - but ally with humans against larger evils - most times. They are a warrior culture physically much stronger, tougher and sturdier than men, but not as intelligent. Patriarchal Culture ( there is no word for "woman" in their tongue - they describe females as "Animals that birth Orks" ) They seldomly live 40 years.
> Goblins 1,30 to 1,50 at the most, red pelts and reddish skin, nomadic and or tribe cultures, oriented matriarchally, believing in the mother-swine-goddess, led by their female shamans. They are about as intelligent as humans if they're lucky, they trade and are generally nice people if you don't anger them. Usually don't live beyond 30.
Orcs - A race. Generally muscular and stoic. Had a good time in Rome, and a bad time in the Middle Ages.
Trolls - Formerly a race dwelling in Scandinavia, rivals to the Dwarves. However, they were cursed by a disease that causes them to calcify in sunlight. Now, half of them degenerated into CHUDs and the other half stored themselves in a primitive info-matrix which was later adapted into the internet.
Goblins - Clumps of raw Mortal unpleasantness. Born of our fornication and greed, growing like sadistic mushrooms in the abandoned places. Almost identical to the goblins from Pact.
Historically, a Troll was a malevolent creature in Germanic folklore, and a Goblin was much the same in Celtic folklore. The two occupy the same "ecological" or perhaps rather narrative niche, to provide a monstrous antagonist in folk tales.
Orcs were invented by Tolkien, and are his "take" on the idea of goblins. He also put trolls in his universe as a separate "race" than goblins, but this again is original to him, and doesn't reflect historical understandings of the terms.
>>44875023 Mythological monsters were seldom easily distinguishable from one another. It wasn't as if old Scandinavians had a definition for a troll other than a scary monster in the woods or anything like that.
In one of my settings there were only two natural races. Goblins and Humans. Humans were the most plentiful and built a large Empire over the continent. Goblins were magically/technologically more advanced living underground and lived longer.
For the most part Goblins were/are fascinated with humans and while the majority of mankind didn't know how advanced the Goblins were there was many trade agreements and alliances between the two.
Eventually some Goblins started modifying humans, mainly friends who they wished to give a longer lifespan too and protect from injury, these people became elves.
Eventually however a terrible war started with a evil known as The Great Beast. During this war Goblins modified some humans for combat and to survive the Great Beasts monsters. These became Orcs.
Trolls and Ogres are some of the Great Beast's monsters, and implying that they have anything to do with Goblins or Orcs is an easy way to get shanked/shot with a not-laser gun magical weapon.
Yes I simplified quite a bit. As >>44875119 suggests, these concepts were much broader historically. Modern culture has cannalised these mythopoeic figures into much narrower tropes, this process was not begun by Tolkien but his writing really open the floodgates, culturally speaking.
Depends on the setting. In general it's size. Trolls are the biggest, orcs medium, goblins smallest. Trolls are the brutes, Orcs are the Soldiers, Goblins are the peons.
How I normally do them, Trolls are big lanky fuckers, Big nose, hunched over pebbles and moss growing on them. Ogres are the bulkier fat versions. A little smaller but better in combat. Orcs, are Rock covered humanoids, tusks, muscular bodies. And goblins are sort of fucked up tiny versions without rocks on them, more knobbly and warty. Look like tiny trolls. The rumor in this setting is, if a goblin lives long enough it will become a troll. But they never live long enough.
>>44868638 Since this is one of those "DEPENDS ON THE SETTING" threads, I'll tell you how it works in my setting.
Trolls are 8 feet tall, lanky, green, asexual monsters. They're not sapient but they're damn clever (like apes). They don't have language or tool-making skills but they mimic sapient races around them so they sort of know how to use swords, armor, and bows. No one knows where they come from, they just seem to materialize out of thin air.
Orcs are a gray-skinned, tusked race known for their raiding habits. There are two major ethnic supergroups: One swept through notArabia then North notAfrica before finally settling in notSpain. They have a reputation as pirates. The other major group are the steppe nomads who constantly harass the Goblin kingdoms and occasionally breakthrough to Western notEurope.
Goblins are a race that defies easy description. About 60% of Goblins are 4 feet tall, with overly long arm, rounded heads, small mouths, pointed ears, and yellow/orange/red skin. However, Goblins are extremely prone to mutations including Insectoid Goblins, Goblin-Hounds, Tree Goblins, River Goblins, Winged Goblins, etc. All these different types and phenotypes of Goblins hate each other and would love a big ol' genocide to tidy up the family tree but the priesthood of their sole god preaches pan-Goblin expansion against all non-Goblins and has the muscle to force everyone to get along.
>>44878134 One of the most powerful ethnicities/subraces besides the "pureblood" Goblins are the Hobgoblins, the result of Goblins breeding with Humans, Dwarves, and/or Orcs.
>>44876153 If I included Haflings they probably would be a monkey-like race. I would leave their origins lost in the war. For them the war never ended and they still fight against the Beasts creatures and are the allies of any who would still fight the end of world.
On the other hand, become their enemies and they will slit your throat in the middle of the night.
>>44878422 Oh yeah its probably going to be chinese monkey-man like. Think of some sun wukong designs but a lot smaller. They probably would have a more bestial baboon form they temporary transform into when enraged.
>Man injures a Halflings daughter, finds himself kidnapped in the middle of the night and take to the Halfling's village he didn't even know was there. >Halflings settle things with personal combat, sucker thinks that's the easy way out. >hfw the Halfling changes in the middle of the battle circle.
>Troll Major Tallest creatures, large, usually covered in moss. Quite wise but very shy, will hide under bridges for shelter
>Troll Minor smallest of the giants but much stronger than the troll major, look alot like giant gorillas with horns from the head and large hands for crushing. Very stupid and used as ground troops by the giants.
>Orcs Shamanistic tribesman taller than humans, created via the corruption of elves by the dark god. Banished to the isthmus where most began to worship the animals of their new land, slowly forgetting the gods of the main land and creating a spiritual bond with the Ypotrylls of the region
>Goblins Created by the corruption of the dwarves, small green creatures that live in the mountains. large green ears. large noses, etc.
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