Let's Have Another Painting Thread!!!
Warmachine/Hordes Books, No Quarter, & IKRPG
>textuploader <dot> com / 5f980
PP Youtube (gameplay tutorials, tournament coverage, and announcements)
List building at
The Giant List of Podcasts and Blogs
Table of contents for all NQ issues
Lexicanum Iron Kingdoms Lore wiki:
The best thing I have to actually take the image is my Nexus4 camera though. And that is pretty terrible. Well, I'll give it a try nevertheless once I get home. We need more OC in here.
Why do I get crushed hard constantly? Are there any tricks I'm missing with this or am I just getting fucked on rolls? Yesterday I put carnage on and trampled my gladiator through 5 weapon masters assuming I'll kill them. Then I proceeded to roll like shit, only killed 1, then got decimated by free strikes.
>Also do keep in mind that models you touch during a trample do not get to make free strikes
Wait, what? In the rules it seemed to imply that anything which survives the trample gets a free strike.
Oh fuck I just checked and the next sentence after what I was reading would've saved my ass that game.
Okay, here's one more trample trick: You know you can only move over small based models with a trample, right? But you make attacks against every model you touch during the trample. So if you for example trample across 3 Gun Mages (small base) and end your trample in B2B with a Boomhowler (medium base) you cannot trample any further, but you do get to make trample attacks against all 4 models.
bit of an oldie, before Harbinger was fully built.
In your expierence, what model/unit (barring 'casters and 'locks) have given you the most trouble on their own?
As a khador player, it has always been my friend's Shredders, he usually just sends 4-6 at my blocks of guys and ties them up. They're not hard to kill, but they are major inconvenience when I'm trying to capture a point.
Any model with recursion can be a major pain in the butt.
Recursion is stong in any game system, and quite often it isn't taken into account of just how powerful it is.
I'd say any Khador clamjack; when it puts its toe in a zone, they're really hard to shift.
Kayazy are horrible; if you don't have things that ignore defence, then its almost impossible to deal with 11 dudes that are def19, but on the next turn acrobatics through your lines and remove almost anything (POW12 kitchen knives thanks to gang)
Widowmakers, wow. OP plz nerf.
even the lowly manhunter; if that dude ever gets to your line he just fucks things up srs.
Eliminators are a very nasty pair.
You have one decent opening to get them at range before they make contact. Knock out the grunt and the leader has to take a test.
Otherwise your up shit creek.
def17 base in melee, worse if you can spare iron flesh on them, oh but there's a downside to iron flesh -1SPD, so no charging or running. unless you cycle it.
Not like they need iron flesh anyway.
So I have the opportunity to pick up a Convergence army on the cheap, but I've never played with or against them before. They seem much more dependent on list construction any of the other factions though, from what I'm reading. Anyone use them, or have any advice? I dig the models, but I'm leery of just dropping in.
No, just take anything you think looks kewl.
You need everything, but there isn't much to get.
Then you can have all the fun, because it is a nicely balanced force.
They won't ever get any new releases though.
He's fun to play and is at least interesting as the first cross faction caster. Cryx and Cygnar players don't know how to have fun though. I play him with a bunch of Mercs and he's a blast.
In the context of tactics though? No one gives a fuck about Warmachine Tactics.
I haven't really painted much Warmachine lately and I think I've shared everything on here already, but here you go
Oh, well all right then.
That Prime Axiom is making me moist, I love the model and the rules. And the Puncture rule that keeps showing up seems like a wonderful fuck you to heavy ARM infantry. Still trying to figure out what caster I want.
Tactics is what got me into the tabletop game oh god don't hit me
>Tactics is what got me into the tabletop game
It's fine, it's just not a good game that failed to deliver on its promises. Welcome to modern video games
Dawn of War got me into table top games
It does have a pretty cool version of disruption though. Instead of the current rule disruption stacks and each instance of disruption on your jack is one less focus that can be allocated to them
posting my work in progress
though I cant see it getting much better than this.
sorry for shitty camera
I also started painting this Dwarf for a Kings of War army. Wrong game system though
It's not terrible. Give everything a wash with a black or brown wash. After it's dry, clean up the high points leaving the shadows that are created. It's not difficult and makes it look ten times better. GW makes quite good washes out of the bottle.
Looks good so far. Get a brown wash that you like and hit all of the gold, red and tusks. The black skin already looks dark enough so I think you're good there. You can then do some highlights on armor
It'll add a lot. I use the Citadel Argax Earthshade or whatever the fuck it's called. It works really well for armor and red colors. You may want to water it down a tad for regular cloth depending on how dark and dirty you want your dudes to look
Like the faggot son or the feminist progressive liberal daughter, you're the family member nobody wants to see but unfortunately has to knowledge exists, ever hoping they suffer some kind of fatal accident because we were too naïve to abort you in your infancy.
Yeah when I said everything I meant everything-metals, cloth, rope. I do a super heavy wash also. You just have to clean it up afterwards. Here's one of my gladiators.
And the GW technical paints are pretty good too. I used the blood and the cracked earth paint on my Skorne.
Elves reporting in. I've finally finished with the primary paint jobs on all of 'em, now it's mostly touch-ups and basing. Took forever, though it's my fault for having so many Houseguard to get through.
No regrets though. They were on sale and I like their design.Not sure when I'll have disposable income again, but there will be more elves involved.
Thanks man. I really like how they turned out. Now they just need some solid releases to get me more motivated to finish them. I have a whole Fist of Halaak list to paint too.
And a pMorghoul beast list, with only two beasts finished. Maybe the Desert Hydra will be fun to play with, I'm not sure it will be competitive though.
The fetish wasp usually fucks my shit up, and its only 4 points.
This lot is no worse than the usual lot.
I bet they are all just as nice IRL as the rest.
There's at least 2 PGs and even hungerford passes through apparently.
Moaning on the internet isn't a reasonaly barometer of how well a game is received.
I wonder if the anon that posts "ded thred ded gaem" in every fucking WMH thread isn't one of the PGs (or hungerford) just for topkek.
Funny thing just happened in the forums:
One faggot asks, whoa if you use an offical PP spray template for a 6" spray then u'r cheating!! (because overmeasuring)
The usual troops pop in and say yes of course, imprecise etc
then out new pal hungerford pops in, and ill translate this one: "pull your head from out yo ass, it's ok to use the template"
Hey guys, newb here, I was wondering when new units and models are released, do I need to get the latest book for it, or is there a master list that's updated?
If so, which books should I get to look at the full gamut of Legion units and such? Are the new units compatible with the other books and the main Legion book?
>I wonder if the anon that posts "ded thred ded gaem" in every fucking WMH thread isn't one of the PGs (or hungerford) just for topkek.
Can confirm, I do it all the time. I occasionally post dumb stuff just people argue and bump the thread.
This has been a thing forever. I'm surprised people still don't know this one
Hungerford is awesome btw
It's an expensive enough hobby, I recommend going here and downloading what book you like from your browser.
> textuploader <dot> com / 5f980
Put a . in where it says dot then remove spaces. Put it in the address bar and check out the list below. Most models are out but usually they have to be announced on the site as to the date. The Warmachine official hobby book is No Quarter which is as slow to come out as my now openly gay cousin.
You don't need the books to play the game, faction books and expansion books just provide fluff. All model data is on the cards, which come with each model. The only book you might need is either Prime/Primal for rules, and the PDF free on the PP website.
Model releases are whenever PP feels like it/gets it shit together. We're in a weird situation right now where models from newer books are coming out before models that have been announced at least a year ago.
So i played a game last night for the first time with Nemo 3. Loved it. had a full unit of LightningSwords Infantry with UA and WA, and the captain poking around at the back. Dunderhead and Stormclad. 35pts and all was going well, but I feel that i needed a buff to my tardpit / shielding unit, I was thinking an arm buff from Jwarcater? but what other option do i have to buff def or arm from solo's?
Gladiator is really a heavy killer, in a pinch tramples work and you can also slam stuff into/through infantry. It's better off leaving the anti infantry duties to nihilators and incindiarii though
Last game I played was against Menoth with these fucking annoying cunts that can be sacrificed so the Nihilators never get to trigger Berserk. And even then, they were like 14/18 because of Defender's Ward. Literally niggertits. Like, how the fuck is a 12/16 at base small infantry even fair.
>Gladiator is really a heavy killer
To continue, doesn't this imply that I'm bringing heavies purely to kill heavies? Are there heavies that are good against infantry? If infantry is good against heavies, why ever bring a heavy that's good against heavies? Especially when their heavies are behind a wall of infantry.
>Watching 50pt battlereport on Youtube, Cygnar vs. Skorne
>Skorne list is varied, but has a good pile of heavy warbeasts
>Cygnar brings two Stormwalls, journeyman, full forgeguard and pNemo
>Stormwall with 5 focus proceeds to remove units every round
I have yet to come against lists with two colossals, but fuck that looked painful.
Well the only reason errants are disgusting is because of the in faction defender's ward. Base defense 12 arm 16 is a pretty terrible statline except against blasts. You can take Nihilators with pXerxis and put defender's ward on them and get 15/15. It's relative. Take some Incindiarii and set em on fire and watch as they ironically burn to death.
Well I don't own too many models, but the 2 infantry units I bought were nihilators and incendiarii, who were in the same game but on the other side of the table. Perhaps my almost complete lack of enemy faction knowledge is the problem then. And at the time I was using pMakeda so they did indeed have defender's ward. They got eaten alive anyway.
What, really? What are you using the rest of your army for? If you want beasts to kill infantry, you can try out Molik Karn or some Sentinels. What you should be doing is having your infantry clear the enemy infantry so your heavies can kill their heavies and/or caster. I really can't say enough about Incindiarii, they're really great.
Yeah the Incendiarii did a lot of work last game I played. I think I'm just being too impatient in trying to smash things with my heavies. I just want to trample over the infantry, land in front of a heavy, and punch it until it dies.
Depends on the heavy you're talking about. I don't know about Skorne, but with Legion a Scythean 'can' be used against other beasts, but prefers to go after infantry because of Chain Attack: Bloodbath. Carniveans are also good in melee against bunched infantry because of Assault+3 initial attacks. However, the Neraph is not good at fighting infantry or heavies. They're good for hunting down solos or lights. Zuriel is also good for going after infantry as opposed to armor.
Every piece has it's strengths and weaknesses. Many will be good at one role and suck at another. Well rounded pieces do exist (ie. Carnivean), but are often expensive in cost as a result.
Well I generally bring a gladiator and bronzeback to the table because point for point they seem super powerful, but maybe that power is at its best when focused on enemy medium/heavy beasts. I guess I should stop trying to build so one dimensional and smashy, but I'm lacking a lot of models. My last game I used:
And that's it. No Agonizer, no Handlers, no MOLIK FUCKING KARN, no solos, just damage. Then I ran my gladiator over weapon masters, rolled shit dice, killed none, and lost shortly after. I need a Cyclops Raider/Brute, Krea, all kinds of stuff still. Then I have to paint it :(
Mhm. As much as the regulars here like to stick themselves into one or two lists per faction, each faction has a bunch of options to handle different situations. You 'can' play HULK SMASH with your Skorne, but you might have some difficulty using it against certain lists. But you can also play that 'with' a bit of infantry clearing to balance things out.
My theory is that if I run other titans with a bronzeback, I don't need fury management because they can't overheat in the first place. I can run gladiators as hot as I want and leech from the bronzeback, and he keeps the gladiator in line. And if I don't need the fury management, that makes the handlers look worse.
I'm going to come up with a list from scratch for pMorghoul or pMakeda. The only other warlock I own is Naaresh who's eeergrgehrgggrhgh. To be honest I was avoiding using Molik Karn because I couldn't be fucked with all of his abilities, but if he's as good at infantry slaying as I initially thought he was, then he might just be the perfect heavy beast to throw out in front of a gladiator who can clean up the heavies. Unless Molik can just charge and clean the cunts up anyway with a huge combo strike. Him and Morghoul could probably chew infantry to pieces.
>Morghoul (OBLITERATES infantry)
>Molik (kills infantry/heavies)
>Gladiator (kills heavies
>Incendiarii/Nihilators (just good)
>Something else I don't even know FUCK
Sounds much better.
>. I mean, it's two points.
two hordes points, which is really 4 points due to PP's errection for that side of the game
How could I add on to my budding Khador army for the most fun for around $50-100? Mainly looking for fun, not tournament competitiveness.
So far I've got Butcher1, Butcher 2 is in the mail, Scorcha, a Devasator, Spriggan, the jacks that came with the starter box, a war dog, winter infantry/their UA and Kovnik Joe. Also some Eliminators.
I'm really thinking of ordering Butcher 3 (I love the guy's rules), to use with my current lists, but I'mnot sure if I should actually expand more with other units/jacks. From my understanding, it seems like I can just replace my current warcaster with Butcher 3 and let him loose while the rest of the army does what they do. I dunno.
Oh, also have a conquest on the way.
you forget that the choir all need to sing the same song, so they really cost twice as much
Because he is just a killing machine, use Energizer almost every turn to get the BG to where ever you want. Feat when you're within 5" of your target, Silence of Death, Doom, Blade, Win.
You don't understand how an almost impossible to stop nonlinear 18"+ assassination, coupled with an incredibly hard to assassinate vengeance relentless charge unit is not that fun to play against? Or he can choose to wipe out your army and then feat and camp? Playing against B3 isn't playing warmachine, it's playing assassinate or die. Nobody wins scenario against him
Could it be that you're just an idiot? I don't lose often to B3. I just have to kill him before he kills me. If you play scenario against him you're going to lose, almost every time.
Pendrake Peeps models
Ok so the consensus is that butcher is way too good for casual games, so in his place what could I buy instead to flesh out my khador more? What are some other staples or jacks that I will use quite a bit?
Can someone tell me what model this is though?
I think it's a khador but IDK
>Iron Fang Pikemen with Black Dragon get 2 of 'em.
2 of what? The pikemen or UA?
Also, what's with the pikemen? Are they black dragons or pikemen? They seem to have 2 pictures. Are they a dual it?
So, UA's add special rules to a unit.
So you've got your basic Iron Fang PIkemen unit, that have their own rules.
Then, you can add a UA to them to give them extra rules.
The regular UA or the Black Dragon UA. The fluff of the Black Dragon UA is that they're a specific kind of Iron Fang.
They're the same unit either way, the UA just gives them some extra rules.
Thanks, I got that part. When I look at the kit online though, there's Iron Fang Pikemen and Black Dragons that are the same kit. Do I need to choose which ones I build or are they the same unit, different looks? Sorry, just confused.
Father Lucant, Divinity Architect (*5pts)
* Corollary (3pts)
* Inverter (8pts)
* Inverter (8pts)
Transinfinite Emergence Projector & Permutation Servitors (9pts)
Transinfinite Emergence Projector & Permutation Servitors (9pts)
Optifex Directive (Leader and 2 Grunts) (2pts)
Optifex Directive (Leader and 2 Grunts) (2pts)
Reciprocators (Leader and 4 Grunts) (9pts)
Attunement Servitors (2pts)
Enigma Foundry (3pts)
For an infantry heavy B3, of course. Is it teching against him? Nope, it's ADR.
But anyways. Watcher means that an aggressive Lucant pretty much prevents B3 from coming in: if he ends within six inches of Lucant, an Inverter is going to walk over and punch him in the dick. Even better, Watcher doesn't expire until I make an attack, so I can dance around all I please.
TEPs remove pretty much any infantry from the table, including Black Dragons on mini feat.
Lucant's feat is quite good at preventing the rest of B3's army from accomplishing much, especially with good servitor placement on the TEPs(placed properly, they can prevent even reach charges in certain areas.
Now, B3 can push a flank super hard to kill a TEP himself, but if he's on one flank, that's fine with me, because it lets me start to work on those scenarios. I can clear out shit every single turn, he's only got one turn to make the magic happen super well.
Ruin is honestly pretty fun, and I really enjoy Vlad3, especially with Sprayponies.
Old Witch is great too, and also works well with Sprayponies and what you already own.
Nothing wrong with playing B3, but he is pretty dang powerful, so might not be right for your group if you prefer to keep it casual.
They're essentially different units.
The core unit is the same ( Irong Fang Pikemen ) but the unit attachments (Officer and Standard or Black Dragon Officer and Standard) give them different rules and make them play quite differently.
The two UAs have different models, and people usually model the whole unit slightly differently in order to make the difference clearer
If it's triple Clamjacks I can just swap to a Cipher instead of a TEP and muck around with my other stuff as needed and then use rough terrain to bog the Clamjacks down. I can just slam them back with the Inverters and then hit them with a rough terrain template so they go absolutely nowhere.
And B3 still can't come in and play.
Hmm well you get 1 unit in the box that you can interchange. That's why I said two, the FA of IFBD is 2 and the vanilla is 1, i would take two BD over the vanilla but that's just me.
Nah they don't do tons of damage but are super tanky and hard to remove. Nobody should have a problem with them. One thing to remember is they can trample and slam without actually opening up.
I only play in ADR events at this point man, so of course I think of it that way.
And it baffles me that so many events don't allow it, considering how much it helps a lot of the weaker factions.
But I have a Synth list that can pretty handily kill B3 paired with this, no matter his list, but that's not what you were asking for.
Pretty good. He hits like a heavy warjack for far less points. You can throw him on a flank and let him threat quite a bit. Counter Charge can see him do some nice gotchas as well.
Would it be possible to run pScorcha with 3 jacks and widowmakers? I'm looking to increase my army size for a League that I'm currently in for when the time comes, though I've only got a budget of around $60 at the moment. I was figuring to get Widowmakers and a 'jack of some sort (likely a Grolar).
Possibly, though ideally you'd want to try and squeeze Andrei Malakov in there. Khador doesn't run 'jacks well, so putting one of the 3 'jacks on him instead will lighten the load on pScorcha. Or, skip the third 'jack, pair off one of the two existing 'jacks with Andrei, and use your remaining funds to get something else too.
>I thought WMH was a game where you could pretty much bring anything and it was still balanced. That's kinda what drove me to start it up.
Nope. If you don't bring the right tools, then you will probably get your ass handed to you.
The good news is that all the factions have plenty of tools.
The bad news is that some tools are better than others, so you will use those all the time.
Secret Agents. Where every player represents a different group. Cygnar, Khador, Cryx, Legion, Circle. Everyone has to pretend to be as normal as they can be though to avoid suspicion.
Or they could all be Khadoran spies in some secret Cygnaran unit thingy. And everyone thinks they're the only spy in there. And the player characters are the only people actually in that unit.
Like others have said pirating is fun I'm running that right now. You don't have to worry about nationality or language all that much and everyone can make just about anything they want.
I've also done a guild of Monster Hunters working under Alten Ashley. It's a lot of fun because you can include careers from Unleashed too and it isn't a huge deal.
Pretty much everything in the game is better than Blythe. Also, these guys are Mercs too
/tg/ I want to build a warmachine army with cryx's goreshade lord of ruin list and I'm looking at what units to get. Bane riders are an obvious choice, and I was planning to get either bane knights or thralls depending on which one I like the look of more.
My question is this:
Are mechanithralls worth adding in as well? Or are two units enough as long as I throw in some jacks? Should I include the unit attachment if I put in a unit of them?
Heirophant. He needs to camp, and it makes ignite cycling a lot easier on him, as well as his assassination runs. The only focus-intensive jack I run with him is a Reckoner, plus reclaimers make easy targets.
proof nigga. We don't buy yo shit.
dis ain't battle college.
Although, having said that, it's plausible. Don't trust russians with nothing.
Look, for example, leave a crimea lying about, and BAM russia takes it.
So I've noticed that folks very rarely run Battle Engines - are they that bad, or are they just not as good as other options?
Still gonna run a Storm Strider, but it makes me wonder if I'm not gimping myself.
yeah yeah soon.
The thing is, it's so vague and baseless, it could be anything, so really, what can the pleb do but "assume"
At least PP know what the pleb expect/want, the question is; do PP want the same thing?
I find it a pity that PP didn't play around with battle engines a bit more before dropping colossals.
I really think that game was fine before colossals, and they haven't really added anything interesting to the game.
Ret's Cricket isn't bad either. The problem is, most of them have the armor and health of a light, the cost of a heavy, and weapons/equipment that want them to get uncomfortably close to danger. They can be useful, but for many they're just too niche to justify.
Tier nerfs; hell yeah i agree.
The first tier lists in forces books were blatant "buy more models" pushers.
Which could have been good if PP had pushed for larger sized games 75 then onto 100 etc.
Pushing up the ante and all that.
But they didn't, they seemed to forget that they are supposed to sell models, and brought the game down to a nice little 50pts.
They could have still worked it with 3 lists even 4 lists becoming the norm, but oh no, have to listen to the competitive players. They're the one bringing the money in...Oh wait, no they aren't !
The newbs and the collectors are the ones that will spend moniez 4 toy soldiers.
the best ones are menoth, to some degree cygnar, the croc one of course, and the convergence one.
Something they have in common, they are autonomous.
If BEs had a way of boosting, they would be decent, but as it stands, a heavy WJ/WB is usually better.
So EE isn't getting nerfed?
RoW isn't getting nerfed?
It was probably you who told us "menoth and trolls salty" but if you can't give even a slight bit more, there isn't much we can talk about.
I mean the only thing trolls and menoth have in common is tough and self sacrifice.
Is it a nerf to self sac? and /or to tough?
So question - what's your favorite model from your least favorite faction?
Convergence I usually find repulsive, but for some reason I love the Fridge.
tough question. I suppose the faction i like the least has to be skorne.
But there are a couple of lovely models. the elephant heavy warbeasts are great, the pterodactyl too.
I'll settle for the gargantuan it's a beauty.
I haven't posted any false rumors. Only thing I've posted in the last few threads is that any rumors you've heard are bullshit.
If you believe anything you're a fool.
No credible rumors have come out, just trolls trolling trolls
They're not bad, they're just specialist. To get the most bang for your buck you'll be building your list around the Battle Engine.
It also doesn't help that nobody local to me seems bothered to read specialist rules. No cavalry, no artillery and no battle engines because they're they don't run identical to infantry.
I suggest asking your group very early in your writing process what they want to play, and treat the party as important as individuals when writing content. Beyond that, we'd need much more specific details to offer advice.
PP's announcing all these resculpts and we still don't have models that were in books that are years old.
That's part of the reason this game is dying. A model being a book doesn't mean shit when we won't actually have it for years.
What models are missing that aren't in the latest 2 books they're working through now with sculpts? Their system is to let the artists do what they want for the most part, but I'm drawing a blank for anything missing that isn't from the newest books they're sculpting through now.
Not the other guy here. They've not said they're doing a new Hordes faction, but they have said they would like to do a new Hordes faction and specifically that they want to explore more of the world.
The community has assumed for a long time there will be more Hordes factions just so there's equal number between WM and H. There's really no obligation for them to do that since everything crosses over, and all new WM factions after the big 4 have been in the fluff since the original Witchfire Trilogy.
To wet your appetite some, the last I heard from Doug Seacat was early last year where he hinted that Pendrake has just returned from the continent to the south known as Xu. All we know about Xu is it's the most likely homeland of the Totem Hunter.
Conceded on Inflictor, and the Indictor. The Grolar is just about to release, and using that alongside the Reliant gives strong implication these warjacks are all dual-kits with resculpted older model. That's not relevant.
The Mad Dog and the Rager are both from the latest WH book man, that's not exactly years old.
Demons in Iron Kingdoms are called Infernals. They've shown up for a long time now, there's some real cool art of them in the old Monsternomicons. We've been told no by the devs though, but community is still hopeful. They would be difficult because they don't fit into the WM or H style of things, they're far more alien and the last time PP wasn't sure they could fit one faction into the existing system (Skorne into WM) they wrote a whole new game around them (Hordes) and brought forward their plans for something else (Cryx) to replace them.
Yeah. I actually want to try out one or two indictors, and I also want a guardian that's not the terrible metal version. But, maybe in six months or so. Make it an even three years.
I was happy waiting for the more recent warjacks once it became clear they wanted more dual kits. When they came out of nowhere with a plastic dual kit I was pretty blown away by the quality (it probably helps the Stormclad is my favourite warjacks and the old model was balls). Now they've started resculpting all of the first gen character heavies at the same time and I can see there's a lot on their plate but I'm excited for every months releases.
infernals would have been good. Because they have been an integral part of the lore for a while.
How they would or should be translated into an "army" is another thing.
Maybe they shouldn't be armies, but "allied" units and solos with wicked ass powers
This is a thing. A lot of players seem to think that any given army has to have minimum WJs and all the infantry.
But it's just wrong. You don't have to have minimum WJs, in fact having 2+ WJs makes a good force every time, because you have to build around your investment, and in doing so you create a balanced list that will never get one rounded...Well unless you killbox yourself and let the opponent score 3CPs
I know you're a troll but Warhammer is legitimately the worst game right now. GW thinks they can get another 5 years out of me with their half assed rulebook?
Yeah. Bye Bye forever retards.
I have no personal experience with Slingers, but I've seen them used to decent effect with eHexeris, or as a cheap throw-away unit with Mordikaar.
Units you could get good use out of with any Warlock though? Nihilators, Incendiarii, the Tyrant Commander + Standard Bearer, and (obviously) Paingiver Beast Handlers.
Nihilators, imo, are the best of Skorne's single wound troop options. The other options aren't bad per se, but I think they're more niche.
Incendiarii are just obscene. They can erase swathes of enemy infantry with 6 3" AoEs with Continuous Fire, can threaten heavier targets (or Warnouns) with Combined Ranged Attacks, and are even decent in melee in a pinch.
TyCom + SB is a good tool box unit. There's not much native Pathfinder in Skorne, so being able to dole that out is incredibly helpful. Standing up Nihilators that made Tough is always good, and an extra 2" of threat on Incendiarii is also nice.
PGBH don't really need an explanation. They manage your fury, and make your beasts hit harder. Nuff said.
Hope that helps!
Its disconcerting when I hear rumors from reputable sources that my faction is going to get knocked out of the comparative scene by errata.
Take with a grain of salt
>Warders lose Weapon Master
>Mountain King is required in order to get discounted lights in EE
>No changes to RoW, but sr2016 terrain rules nerf of pretty hard
>Bradigus tier losses the free fury on turn one
Get fucked trolls, salty tears indeed
Keltarii are our best jam unit, and the Minions' Croak Raiders/Gatormen Posse can hit pretty hard while being self sufficient, just remember to bring a Taskmaster solo.
Steer away from Karax, Slingers, Reivers, and Rhinodons until you feel comfortable with the faction tool set.
I'm really excited about the Seplicur, that we are never getting. I have been flirting with the idea of throwing it in with my favorite castor, gaspy2. It poops out McThralls and has the potential to mat fix, which can supply mat and so fixes that lich doesn't. Plus Gaspy can keep it safe from infantry with the clouds. I just don't know how to make it work
I know this may seem like the ultimate betrayal, but can Warmachine models be easily kitbashed with 40k models?
I play necrons and recently discovered how kickass the iron lich models look.
I want my Overlord to have a bit more personality, then I saw Asphyxius and his cool floaty robe and soul pit.
My idea was to have the Overlord summon his Rez orb from the pit below him. On mobile so I can't provide a pic at the moment.
Still a ways to go, but getting there. Haven't painted anything Cygnar before, but its been fun.
You are so wrong that it hurts. Trolls are piss poor at unit damage buffing outside of e madrak. Warders without weaponmasters are just worthless. Not enough attacks to fight infantry, not hard enough to crack jacks. If battledriven got changed to what cinerators have it's fine, but loss of weaponmaster is unacceptable.
Ok, so you are a faction fan boy
Also, Battle Driven + Krielstone = p+s 13. If they aren't you're doing something wrong.
And again, I'm just passing on what I've been told from my source who is usually right about this stuff. Take it with a grain a salt.
If I'm right though, and they do get nerfed, I'm going to give you so much shit.
If your Warders aren't starting out at 13 you're doing it wrong. You play trolls, play them correctly.
I also said they get UP to 18. Of course they don't start out there. Do you into reading comprehension?
I feel like you really only need 2-3 Wreckers and a Warden. I don't see any use at all for a Subduer. If anything just magnetize one to be a Wrecker/Warden and then have two perma-Wreckers.
Subduer is great. I would actually argue it's better than the warden. Warden's bit redundant since sac pawn to monsterosities are pretty common.
Subduer is amazing for trading heavies or assassinating
Working on my slightly converted Reznik 1. I didn't like his tiny head so I used the extra Gravus one from my other conversion, and sculpted a face grill onto it. I also bulked up his legs a bit and filled out his waistline where it was kinda hollow. It's not done yet, I have to wait for the wash to dry.
stahp, just, no. Don't do it.
Post "soon" "next week" "salty tears" etc etc.
If you can't give anything slightly better than vague on vague street in vaguetown, then don't bother.
If you didn't post the possible implications of an errata that might be coming sooner rather than later; then we might have actually been suprised by the news when the errata does drop.
Many things are already hit too hard. Everyone and their dog seems to get a damage buff these days.
Look, warmachine prime, take a Repenter; that's a giant robot which wields a solid steel flail which probably weighs a fucking ton. It is POW 13. That is VERY stong.
Now a crusaders inferno mace POW 18; it is the force of being hit by a train at full speed.
now we still consider POW18 to be decent, but anything up to POW16 is considered "pillow fisted"
The problem isn't warders, it's all the damage buffs on all the things.
It is not wonder that the meta went through high defense and now into multiwound high armor.
Because the charge bonus die was supposed to make any model decent when charging, but now in this weapon master meta; every one has that bonus die all the time.
Do you even know what cinerators are? Because they sure don't have battle driven.
If they had battle driven you might even see them on the table.
Warders have high arm which gets higher
reach and weapon master, on usually pow 13.
Do you realise how powerful pow13 weapon master is supposed to be?
>you are a salty fanboy.
The portents were right ! We were warned! Brace yourselves for the incoming salty tears, this isn't just a river of tears, not even a sea of tears. No this is going to be a fucking tsunami.
i cordially agree with this person.
I hope it is true, and I shall also rub it into every troll player's face.
Bane thralls could also lose weapon master though; They are a 12dude unit (so not elites, elites are 6 dude units) stealth, dark shroud, tough, auto get up, fearless, not living, can be repopped by tartarus, goreshades.
Errants could also lose weapon master; Also a 12 dude unit. Fearless, pathfinder, can't be targeted by spells, quick work, ARM16 (full plate+shield) blessed xbows and self sac. They sure as hell don't need weapon master on top. Knights exemplar have weapon master for good reason.
I play Cryx AND Menoth and I would WELCOME such changes.
What's the point of resculpting the really top heavy huge jacks and leaving them in metal where they're still going to be massively huge, top heavy and likely to fall apart even with serious pinning?
It's only 5". The Indictor is SPD4., so that's up to 9" away from your current position, if:
The opponent doesn't block your WJ
The opponent doesn't move out of the indiction area before casting/chanelling spells.
Also: two of them ? You would pay for 2 heavy WJ kits just to try something which probably won't work?
The book is legit because it is SPD5 with a 10" bubble. 11" is maddy is standing b2b.
That's way more effective than an indictor.
It's passive bubble allows you to run or charge. That's 13" or 12", or in Durst's lists where I was thinking about taking them, 14" and jam with the feat. They have their uses. Plus you can engage the spellcasters with the jack, or Reckoners, or flameguard so they can't walk away to cast.
>Bane Thralls lose Weapon Master.
It's funny, I had this exact same conversation the other day. I don't care too much about Trolls getting nerfed so long as everyone else gets brought down, or up, to a similar level.
The game shouldn't have one faction that wins every event and that everyone has to tech for.
It will never happen but Bane Knights and Thralls should get knocked down to FA:2. Maybe FA:1 for Knoghts
Are there any legitimately good Warmachine channels? Where the banter is fun instead of being all matter of fact. Beasts of War and Miniwargaming, the Cooler lack genuine charisma and that one pretty Khador girl. Do you think there is a need for a fun gaming mini's channel?
So your idea of reducing punch power is to take out the damage from the least damaging wraponmaster in the faction. Ok. Ok whatever.
That's why I said "change to" implying that it's not the same.
Jesus Christ, can anyone actually fucking read for a change?
The problem isn't always the Banes themselves. I mean, they're nice infantry, but they need a lot of polishing to get where they are.
Like, a caster that can give them a +5 Swing and fix their MAT6 is sort of the problem.
Really, only denny does that, and I think people usually take ranged units over banes with her. Gaspy doesnt fix their mat, unless gaspy3 but same issue, banes dont always make the cut with him
Tartarus "tax" has to be considered
Selling out of MtG. Currently have some Skorne bits and pieces. Name me some essential units for Skorne and tell me why. Also please provide a couple of good well rounded 35 point lists. I really want to get into this game but always lose because I'm too impatient and send my beasts in. Pls help me /tg/, I want to grind people out.
This list should include most Skorne staples:
Supreme Archdomina Makeda (*5pts)
* Molik Karn (11pts)
* Titan Gladiator (8pts)
Cataphract Incindiarii (Leader and 5 Grunts) (9pts)
Nihilators (Leader and 9 Grunts) (8pts)
Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 3 Grunts) (2pts)
Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
There's nothing in this list you won't use in most of your lists. It's a good starting point, though I currently lack the time to explain why.
To be honest, this is almost exactly the same list I came up with last time after getting sick of losing. The only difference is I used pMorghoul and brough an Agonizer with my extra 2 points. And out of interest, is your explanation basically just "MOLIK FUCKING KARN"? The main reason I wanted to start getting some use out of him was because of a Menoth player using those Errant cunts who can sacrifice to prevent Nihilators from doing anything at all. But since side step triggers on hit, Karn can chew through regardless.
Out of interest, how would that actually work? Do I resolve side step after he chooses who to side step or the other way round?
>The only difference is I used pMorghoul and brough an Agonizer with my extra 2 points.
It will play quite differently with Mak2. She supports the infantry way more.
>And out of interest, is your explanation basically just "MOLIK FUCKING KARN"?
Not only that. Molik is more of a constant threat you keep on your enemy while the rest of the list does the hard work.
>The main reason I wanted to start getting some use out of him was because of a Menoth player using those Errant cunts who can sacrifice to prevent Nihilators from doing anything at all. But since side step triggers on hit, Karn can chew through regardless.
Incindiarii also work very well. Being lit on fire is one of the few things Errants are not immune to.
>Out of interest, how would that actually work? Do I resolve side step after he chooses who to side step or the other way round?
The attack gets resolved completely (including the self-sac) and then you side-step.
I think you're onto something.
Cryx starts with an amazing advantage, by default: they are (almost) all undead (fearless and not living models)
So, in warmachine prime, they had a slight drawback to compensate, and you can still see it, cryx gets 1pt less in MAT and RAT compared to an equivalent living unit.
So living elites get MAT 7, whilst cryx elites a mere MAT 6.
It explains why mcthralls are MAT 5 too
But fuck that right PP ?! Let's just remove the slight drawback for cryx, give them all the toys for cheaper (darragh wrath, withershadow combine) and more efficient (bile thralls 6" autohit purge, necrosurgeon heal 1D6 or pops up to 3 mcthralls)
Then we can wonder why cryx hits the podium in almost every single tournament.
you hit, you side step.
then damage, then he decides who actually dies.
But molik has reach, so even with 2" sidestep, you can still hit the initial target again if need be.
You can only side step on initials ofc.
Also, molik karn needs a ficking good nerfing too. Even if it means buffing some shitty things in skorne.
It's such a pity to have an entire faction depend on one OP character warbeast.
>you hit, you side step.
>then damage, then he decides who actually dies.
That is incorrect. Side step triggers on hit but is resolved after the attack.
"When this model hits an enemy model with initial or special attack that is not a power attack, it can advance up to 2" after the attack is resolved[...]"
give him some bait, let him over react, then kill him.
and or use some of the following:
>arm lock prevents models from being pushed
actually any model that contacts another model can't be pushed any further
>some models can't be moved anyway
antimagic, the covenant, orin midwinter, a few spells. Any spell hate helps against butcher 3
>Don't kill one dog, kill them both in the same turn or don't bother.
Anything that fucks around with focus
Butcher3 lost against haley2 on turn2 (was it turn2 or turn1?) in the finals of the WTC
The book is so good it's always in a list.
I bet we get as salty as trolls if PP ever nerfs the book.
The problem with the indictor that I conceive, is that it's hard enough engaging spell casters with WJs as it is.
No one is going to let a SPD no reach heavy get anywhere that matters, let alone engage spellcasters.
Oh it might be fun if it ever happens, the look on the druids faces when they can't just push it, or battle mages, or hex hunters...
But it won't happen often enough, and you'll regret not having a reckoner with hymn of shielding instead.
Apparently, Durst's feat on WJs with shields is overkill. As in, it works fine on, say Reckoners who also have a nice def bonus.
I don't like Durst though, he has a fat ass. Yep. Don't care about stats, I don't want a fattie in my army, so I won't use him.
Conversely, although I'm telling you how bad the indictor is, I'm going to get one, and use it, because it looks really cool.
>Good or bad idea?
Good in general. I find it a lot more fun.
>How's the community? Growing, dying?
Depends on where you live.
>Seems much cheaper to play.
Not really. I'd say a bit.
>How's the faction balance?
Not perfect but really good. Player skill is 1000x more important than faction choice, but imbalances exist.
Cryx has disadvantages man. They have almost zero ability to dig past a front line. They're hugely dependent on their war noun to get anything done. They often have terrible defensive stats. They can pretty much only do one thing, which is dude spam.
Cryx have a shit ton of tools, yes, which is why top players play them. But you need to understand the lists to win. If you look at a lot of events, you see plenty of cryx in the bottom as well when less skilled players get their shit shoved in.
Is there some stuff to fix with them? Sure, but it's not like every tool they have is broken and unbeatable.
So, you need to make caster choice first. Caster choice has a huge, huge effect on how lists work in coc, more than most factions. Even the exact same war jacks do very different things with different casters.
Generally faction balance is good. There are issues, but they're on higher levels of play. The issue I think most new players have is that the game has a huge number of gotcha style tactics, things that you can defend against, but if you don't know about will kill you. Stuff like pKreoss pop and drop, or snipe feat go, things like that. So just be aware that if someone randomly kills you, there was likely a way to prevent it, you just didn't know how to do it.
I would go so far as to say list building is 50% now, knocking some off luck and skill. Luck had gotten so manipulable that people rage more than ever when they can't get the right roll.
The things you can bring can mitigate luck so much, that it doesn't matter how much how well you can pilot a niche unit. The game has gotten huge.
The nickname for the game is Magic: The Miniatures for a reason. You make a crazy list that dials things to eleven, borderline breaking all the rules and then pilot that list to victory.
Sure you can fuck up the piloting,but if you have the basics down and a solid list you can go really, really far.
There's some salt and grumbling as a result of it.
Should be minimal salt. I don't mind list chicken as much as other folks do. I just wish the game were quicker and took less time to rerack.
I love list building. I enjoy seeing if ideas work out on the table and I got into the game because of how combo centric the game was.
My biggest issue is that fiddy pts takes an ungodly amount of time to resolve for what is a largely known outcome.
There is also the huge stigma against scooping that I frankly do not understand why it never carried over from Magic... I'd love to play again and rerack to see if I can guage things better the second time around, but the opponent always gives me a "No no no you can win still!!" When I know the odds are super stacked against me. But that's whatever.
I hate dice. I absolutely hate dice and unknown ingame outcomes. I only tolerate it because this is one of the minis games where I feel I have the freedom to take a list concept and play it out in the table to see how it churns. I figure dice are always there to prevent "optimal" list construction where everything is known and builds become more and more homogenized.
Actually now that I think about it... There is salt. It's just against dice and the clock.