>>65419040 you know what i meant alberto they are not only competitiv but they have strong teams, like chelsea, arsenal, liverpool and manchester (although recently they are pretty bad compared to spanish teams)
>>65419129 By recently you meant the last 30 years? The PL is very good at selling their product. They have convinced the world that they have elite teams, when they are somewhat competitive at best. It's kinda like Apple convincing you that owning a macbook makes you a creative person.
>>65419407 maybe is not as competitive as i tought (like manchester praticly monopolizing the barclays championship) but is the only championship in europe that have so many teams with such a great history. 3 out of the 4 that i cited have more than one champion's league.
Because most of the best players in the Premier League aren't from England. Name the 20 best players in the Premier League (not just players having the best season, like Vardy/Kane/Alli, the players who are actually the best). How many of them are English?
>>65419614 Wrong again. Arsenal and Chelsea have 3 final appearances combined. So, no history there. Liverpool's mystique is all based on the late 70s up to the mid 80s, when it is true that they were fucking everybody's shit up. Man Utd won in 68, and then in 99, in a game that they lose 99 times out of a hundred. And then in 2008, a one year dominance from English teams that turned out to be a fluke.
And Chelsea has the one, so no, only 3 English teams with 2 CL or more: Man Utd, Liverpool and Nottingham Fucking Forest.
>>65419918 England has produced some really talented players over the last 15 years or so (Gerrard, Lampard, Beckham, Scholes, Terry, Ferdinand, etc.), but for some reason they never managed to make an effective team out of them. They'll probably do same thing with Kane, Sterling, Alli, Dier, and Wilshere over the course of the next decade.
It really is worrying that so many feel the need to constantly put down the premier league on this board. Why are you all so upset about some domestic league in England? The obsession is reaching unprecedented levels.
>>65420072 I counted those. Like I said. Outside of the mid 70s and late 80s, when it is true that they were fucking everybody up - hence the Liverpool and Forest trophies - EPL have never dominated, just like German teams haven't either. Bayern has been, and is, an elite team.
And if you look at the UEFA cup, it is even more telling.
Spin it all you like. EPL teams are not elite. Competitive, yes. Dominant, no.
It's more confusing when it's an American that does it. I could understand a Spaniard or a German talking shit, they've got national pride. But an American? We've never even won the CONCACAF Champions League, we're in no position to talk shit about UEFA.
>>65420359 liverpool owned europe in 2005 (and got owned by sao paulo, yay) manchester was by far the best team in 2008 is not because recently england is droping the ball that they aren't relevant anymore
>>65420359 >And if you look at the UEFA cup, it is even more telling
Liverpool won the UEFA Cup 3 times, Tottenham won it twice. But I don't know why the UEFA Cup is relevant, it's kind of a meme competition for teams not good enough for the European Cup.
>>65420359 >Spin it all you like. EPL teams are not elite. Competitive, yes. Dominant, no.
OP only said that they have "strong teams", you're the one arguing that they're not dominant when nobody ever said that they were dominant. And it's fair to say that EPL teams aren't elite right now (except maybe Man City), but they were elite and arguably dominant from 2005 to 2012, when there was an English team in literally every CL final except for 2010.
>>65420483 Competitive teams with deep coffers can have great years. Man Utd has been competitive for a long time. And on some years, they were elite. But that is not what we are talking about. What Italians team did mid 80 to early 90s, or the Spanish teams recenlty - CL and UEFA Cup - is dominating. They show in pretty much every final, and win them. English teams making 5 out of 6 finals, and only winning the one where there are two of them, says they are competitive. However, the elite teams seem to beat them pretty consistently.
>>65420428 It's not even that, you can't honestly tell me the 11 players on the field in 2014 weren't good enough to get out of the group? It's shithouse managing and players being so scared of fucking up and being turned into a scapegoat by the media that they just play safe sideways passes for 90 minutes/
>>65420596 Nope. I am probably older than you, and I remember when only the winner of the league got to go to the European Cup. UEFA used to be a competitive competition. And if you want to gauge how strong a whole league is - not the meme teams that you guys know from playing FIFA - UEFA tells you how strong second tier teams are.
>>65420844 >players being so scared of fucking up and being turned into a scapegoat by the media that they just play safe sideways passes for 90 minutes
This. First sensible post ITT. Players have had their lives made miserable by fucking up for England, they understandably dread it coming around. They can't turn down a call up so they do the next best thing, pass it around uncontroversially so blame is shared among the squad until elimination.
>>65421014 OP talked about the Premier League being the most competitive. Spain has 2 consistently elite teams, plus 3-4 competitive teams consistently. BPL has no consistently elite teams, and 4-6 competitive teams
How do we know that a Spanish tier-2 teams like Sevilla are better than BPL tier-2 teams like Tottenham? Because in the competition where they go head to head, one league consistently rapes the other.
I know it hurts to see your lovely Man Utd get fucked in the ass time and again by Spanish teams, but what can I say? it is what it is
>>65421027 Beckham after getting sent off in 98 and Rooney in 06 are the two biggest examples in my lifetime. They were hounded constantly by both the press and fans for months after it happening and they couldn't do anything right. Rooney has never been the same player for England since then, probably in big part because of that treatment. People forget how good he was for us between 04-06.
It's to Beckham's credit that he didn't let it affect him at all, he's pretty much the only key player who consistently played better for England than his club in my lifetime, winning several games for us single handedly.
>>65421027 southgate, lampard, rooney, gerald, gazza, robinson, green, beckham. there's loads. the press get on their case for a bad national team performance or a high profile mistake and suddenly their every kick is scrutinised and criticised. much safer to be competent but not flashy or particularly good t b h
>>65421178 >OP talked about the Premier League being the most competitive.
I'm pretty sure he meant competitive in terms of the title race, and it definitely is relative to the other top leagues (La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A, Ligue 1)
>How do we know that a Spanish tier-2 teams like Sevilla are better than BPL tier-2 teams like Tottenham? Because in the competition where they go head to head, one league consistently rapes the other.
The competition where it makes more financial sense for English teams to ignore it in favor of their domestic league because a higher EPL position pays much more than a deep Europa League run? The competition where that isn't an issue for teams from other leagues because their tv deals are so small/uneven by comparison? That competition?
>I know it hurts to see your lovely Man Utd get fucked in the ass time and again by Spanish teams, but what can I say? it is what it is
Pretty much every other league gives their european qualified teams favourable fixtures and breaks before CL and euro matches. The PL is backwards in this regard. Also the fact that the Europa league pays peanuts, and when teams are pushing for the CL spots, it's an unnecessary distraction from the league. That said, the PL has dropped in quality considerably over the last 5 years or so and teams like Madrid and Barca have way more talent.
>>65421469 >Cute theory. So, I am to assume that Man Utd lost home and away to Athletic on purpose, because it makes more financial sense to lose a competition that you are already in, than win it.
Honestly? Maybe. Any money they could get from the Europa League is virtually insignificant to a club that big, and it's not like winning the thing would have carried much prestige with it. Better to focus on the Premier League, we see English clubs do this all the time.
And they had a pretty good season otherwise, maybe they were focused on the title race. Or maybe they just didn't match up well against them or weren't expecting to face such a challenge so early in the tournament, shock defeats can happen in knockout competitions.
Premier league is fucking shit now srsly just watched the man utd Chelsea match and the quality of football and intensity were both fucking shit no wonder Leicester are top of the league now cos the players these days just dont play with any quality or willingness to win the ball
It's true that the best players in the Premier League aren't English, but that's sorta common in the top leagues >In Spain, nobody in MSN is Spanish, Real Madrid's only good Spanish players are Ramos, Isco and Carvajal >In Germany, the two top scorers are an African and a Pole
The standard answer is the shitty coaching mentality, which is partially true, but another reason that gets overlooked is that the weather is bad and Britain refuses to spend money on indoor infrastructure.
Lots of foreign players in the EPL and super-deep squads don't help the national team, especially since they don't tend to play together.
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