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Westermarck effect
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Is Westermarck effect a meme, /sci/? Is there some genuine reason for me not to be attracted to my sister, or is it all cultural brainwashing?
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What you find attractive in the first place is largely defined by your culture. It's little surprise that the opposite is true.
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>>7838132
I'm asking if there is some proven biological reason, if any, for lack of attraction between siblings, never mind the effect of culture and upbringing.
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Social interaction is a product of highly developed brain functionality, both of which are poorly understood. So your question should be instead directed to psychology and social science majors and not actual science
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>>7838130
>those hands
Gross.
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>>7838135
>psychology
>science
you've done it now, mon
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> Is there some genuine reason for me not to be attracted to my sister
shes fucking ugly m8.
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>>7838134
Incestual sex produces a poor gene pool, resulting in low mortality rate in babies due to weak immune system, if there were any biological reasons, it would be that.
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>>7838144
Would you seriously think I'd actually post a picture of my sis in this cloaca? She does look a lot like this though.
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>>7838150
Post it :^)
There should be no reason not to be attracted to her if she's hot. Not to mention, you don't need to have babies just to have fun ;)
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>>7838130
Until your mid teens you are generally attracted to older people. Then a little later on you start being attracted to younger people.

Your siblings are generally the same age as you. (note that you can be attracted to people your same age, but it is the generational gap that truly excites. This is why boy bands get a million pussies wet. If no older people are available, you settle for your own generation.)
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>>7838155
Nope, won't happen. I will say that it's not easy being, well, this close with someone who is supposed to be "off-limits", or whatever. Back when we were in school, I wasn't even aware that there's supposed to be some sort of a biological barrier to this. Social stigma was there though. Things were starting to get pretty ugly on the home front right before I finally moved out.
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>>7838146
>Incestual sex produces a poor gene pool, resulting in low mortality rate in babies due to weak immune system, if there were any biological reasons, it would be that.
>derpa derpa derpa
There's two things it does:
Reduces genetic variation -- this isn't as big of a deal in the smaller scale for the vast majority of cases
Increases chances of expressing recessive traits -- recessive traits are generally the broken traits.

In-breeding has been used in farming for ages. Once you've gone through the initial cycles and culled heavily to eliminate as many recessive traits as possible, you're pretty damn good. Is it ideal? Not necessarily, but it's the fastest and surest way to promote traits that you want to keep.
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>>7838179
Well, the kind of forced selection (and issues that can result from it) we're talking about in animal husbandry is much more intense than simply a lack of an inherent barrier for inbreeding in free-living animals. Periodic, non-mandated inbreeding would hardly have any long-term effects whatsoever.
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>>7838194
It kinda does.

Without the cull phase, it increases rates, going forward, of double dominate and double recessive genes.
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>>7838169
Settle?

What's wrong with the idea of wanting to start at your current age, with your current age, whenever that sexual interest arises?

Maybe if you're washed media and all you see is "the pretty ladies on TV", but in real life, I'm pretty sure it's why hebophilia is so prevalent.

If you (as a child) let people tell you who's attractive, you will suggest yourself in that direction. If not, it comes naturally and that's where all the fuss comes into play.

>oh no, he's starting to like them at 12 already
Or
>he "experimented" with one of his little buddies

Is seen as this ridiculous, sodomistic start to a path that is anything but liking specifically thin, long haired, curvaceous, 18+ women. Because if she's 17 and you can't tell because it doesn't say so on the picture and you get attracted somewhat, YOURE A MONSTER!
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>>7838284
There is nothing wrong with liking someone your own age, it just is the minority of thought.
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>>7838179
>recessive traits are generally the broken traits

Any evidence or reasoning for this? I see no reason for this to be true
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>>7838172
> Things were starting to get pretty ugly on the home front right before I finally moved out.
shit son. tell me more
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>>7838135
>>7838140
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>>7838284
> muh slippery slope
if you're okay with 18, then why not 17. if you're okay with 17, then why not 16, why not 15, or 14, 13, 8, 5 ?
It's just more excuse for pedophilia that the specific line you're trying to blur just because you wanna justify your pedophiliac disgusting fantasies
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>>7838940
Well, the thing is my mother knew my teachers pretty well (our school in the same neighborhood as our block of flats), so most people (especially such an outgoing cunt as my mother) knew each other. So, one day the two of us came back from a film we watched after school, and both my mother and pops were waiting for us, and you could basically read on their faces what was coming. It wasn't pretty.
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>>7839013
I'm not sure if I get it. You and sis were coming home from a movie you watched and your parents suspected you had carnal relations with your sis ?
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>>7838130
is being attracted to someone the same as thinking they are attractive?
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>>7839025
No, they've been preparing this one for a while, the twats. By the end of high school we got pretty good at making it work, but eventually mother's "friends", our teachers, ratted us out. Basically, mother gave us (mostly me) a very ugly lecture on what kind of a horrible (non)human being I am and that I'm going to hell, and so on and so forth. Pops just sat there. Fucking beta collaborator.
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>>7838132
except the part where you are fucking wrong. GTFO feminist-tier trash.
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>>7839034
Well you will expect that from your parents. But I'm confused now that you said "By the end of high school we got pretty good at making it work". I thought you were only attracted to her and nothing happened. Did something happen between u and sis ?
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>>7839042
A lot happened, anon, and been happening for a long time. We moved in together almost two years ago, which was also incidentally the last time I've spoken to anyone from my extended family.
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>>7839046
Can you just greentext your story from more or less the beginning? It seems interesting but you're not making a lot of sense.
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>>7839046
Oh man. I cant imagine the situation you're in. How did you even make the first move ? Or who did the first move ?
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>>7839052
>>7839060
Fine, I guess I'll tell it to /sci/, whatever...
Basically, it all started with our grandmother's passing. Unlike the rest of our fucking clan, she was actually a very sweet and intelligent person. Raised during the war, tough as nails, but a good person. She really loved the two of us, more than our mother (who always somehow magically knew what's good for us, despite being a giant fuck-up).
Well, one day they found out she had liver cancer, or some such. She died a short while after, and she died ugly.
Sis was in a really bad shape, it just broke her.
One morning I caught sis with a kitchen knife in her hands, just sitting in the bathroom, staring at the knife. I took it away from her, and told her we'll spend the whole day together, no matter what.
We skipped school (this later became tradition) and went to see some fucking enema of a film, "300 days of summer", or something. I'm not sure what it was, but at some point things just started happening. One moment I was just cuddling her, and then she got really close, and I was pretty sure I knew what she'd wanted.
We never did anything like that before, aside you know, stupid shit when we were really little. Anyway, after that, we didn't kiss or anything for a while (I think she was scared), but we started "not-dating", going to the park, or watching a film, etc. Every chance there was a sleep-over party at some of our school friends' apartment, we'd go there, just so than we could snuggle and go to sleep together. She told me this was the only way she could sleep without nightmares.
Well, it wasn't all sunshine and shit, because my sis is really attractive in a sort of tomboyish way, and she's not a shut-it. By the beginning of 11th grade, everyone was dating someone, there condoms in every fucking toilet at school (along with syringes). Things got heated up, because she was constantly being hit on, and everyone knew she wasn't a lesbo or anything, so fair game then...
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f5
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>>7839106
Kek. I knew boys to fall in love with their moms and girls to fall in love with their dads and have logical reasons for that. But it makes sense that you two found each other to be the completing figure since the rest of your family is, well lets say not really relateable...
I always thought incest was one of the social taboos that made no sense. It's two consenting people above the age of 18 having sex. it's not wrong, immoral or even a bad thing. Although I really like that its a strong taboo that is frowned upon which is what makes it so fun.
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>>7839106
>>7839106
...I mean, by that point everyone in our class pretty much knew there was something going on between us, but the lads from adjacent classes in our parallel didn't, or didn't care.
I got into a fight with this massive motherfucker, a mountain of twat, I shit you not, he must've been on steroids or something. A fucking football player, played for the school too. I thought he was going to mess me up irreparably, tear me apart like the fucking Harbinger, and he did almost castrate me with his kick, but then I managed to get him in a jaw real good, and he just collapsed like the fucking Wall of Berlin, he did. Hit his face on the sink, broke his mug. There was blood everywhere man, and he wasn't getting up. I got REALLY spooked, I thought I killed that fucking div with my fist of the north star five figers death move.
It turned okay, by the time I shat myself twice, he suddenly started getting up, and he was laughing and shit. We made a ceasefire agreement, and I literally got to tell teachers that the guy fell down some stairs (we just watched Fight Club with sis). So it was all well, and I also got a (completely undeserved) reputation of being more adept in CQC than the Boss, so no one really fucked with me.
And also at this point, pretty much everyone knew I was dating my sis. But nobody ratted us out yet.
The THING happened when we were going on school trip to another city, to see the pretty monuments and churches and shit. No, it wasn't in Belgium.
We were riding on this fucking train, and it just took forever. Our class got spread around over three cars, and something must have been up, cause I got placed in the "first" car, and sis - in the "third" one. I didn't give a damn at this point, I just went straight to her car. At this point, it was actually pretty hard (like physically) for me to stay away from her, and she felt the same. At school, we even sat at the same desk now, because fuck conspiracy.
So, I went to her car...
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>>7839147
>>7839147
...And she was just standing there, in this ugly little cramped space between the entrance to the next car and the door leading to the rest of her car. There was a borrowed cigarette in her hand, and from the closed door of the car's train toilet, there was a rank of piss. It was romantic.
Like I stated before, my ability to care about anything was diminished greatly at this point in time, but so was everybody elses. Teachers didn't really care for what any of their pupils were doing, as long they were not dead or crippled.
So, everyone got drunk. Somebody was smoking hash in the toilet, that helped a little with the stench, I guess. Also in the car, there were a bunch of soldiers returning from their tour of duty, and they were completely hammered, singing their brigade's marching song at the top of their damn lungs, all in the middle of the night. I mention that because it's important.
So, sis stands there. The both of us weren't really drunk (we don't drink much), but when I get drunk I get really pissed quick, anything can set me off, it's a real menace honestly. People think it's alpha, but it's kind of pathetic, I can't even control it.
So, I see her (borrowed) cigarette, and I get real mad. I'd never touch her, of course, I'd rather stick my hand into a milling tool. But I start running my mouth, and I say some shit I knew I regretted.
It was kind of a tense moment in our relationship, mostly because there was this new girl in our class, hot (not my taste), she was into theater, or some shit, and she and they became pals with sis. They were just friends, but I wasn't thinking straight.
So, here I am, spitting some shit, and she's just looking out the window, like not even listening. So, I take her cig (which she didn't even smoke, and I toss the cig out the window. Nothing.
I continue to say something, I don't even know what. The very next second, there's a slap, so hard and fast that I drop my beer can.
The next second, she is on me...
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>>7838130
How can people find that girl in your picture attractive? Short hair, masculine hands, male-work-shirt, ..
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>>7838918
Recessive traits don't get bred out frequently so they are usually undesirable.
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>>7839224
Tomboys are cute if you have the body, face and attitude to deliver it. Otherwise it's really easy to become a repulsive bulldyke that looks nothing like a female.
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>>7839197
...The train was pretty packed at this time, and most sections of this car were filled.
These cars had a very distinct (and ugly) design, which is probably endemic to Eastern Europe, there's not much in the terms of privacy.
But the train made stops along the way, and on previous stop, a couple left a section that was only a section away from where we were. You see where this is going.
An empty section, stuck between our teachers' section and the one with the shitfaced paratroopers, in the middle of a night train, on a ride through the frozen forest.
I must have been thinking with my brainstem by now, because I've no idea how we got into that section. I was pretty much carrying her at this point. Things were out of control. She was kissing me, and driving nails into my back, her face right before mine. But it was her breathing that sent it over the edge. Really heavy, and a little raspy. She didn't even say anything at all, I just started pulling the sweater off of her.
We didn't do anything serious until then, like anything much at all. I lost my virginity way back (a nightmarish incident unrelated to this in any way), she was a virgin.
I didn't think about anything at this point. Like, even a little. I turned her around and made her bend over this table mounted into the car wall, and ripped the jeans off of her.
I put my hand over her mouth, and she bit into it pretty hard.
Thank god the Airborne and their leaden vocal cords, for the valiant service the state, because thanks to the loudest rendition of a marching song I have ever heard, I experienced the best moment in my life.

There's not much to tell other than this, really. In every hotel we stayed during the trip, I made sure the two of us stayed in the same room, alone. I borrowed some money, bought some condoms (which ran out very quickly).
We were totally inseparable by this point, and it was only a matter of time someone ratted us out. Soon after we came back, exactly that happened.
That's it.
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>>7839236
What does that even mean? Your statement makes no sense
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>>7839251
holy fuck, anon, u are god. In America, this sort of shit is unheard
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>>7839251
Kek. I would have totally defended you m8. Whata a great story you got there. I'm glad nobody is feeling uncomfy that both of you wanted the same thing.
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>>7839306
What do you mean unheard? Your trains are nicer, or something?
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>>7839339
Unheard of as in this whole story would never happen. Teachers and fellow classmates are all up each other's ass, generally. The state wouldn't let u skip class like that. When some kid gets in fight or hurt, it's really big deal here and the adults are very interested. Just this whole story, about you and sister being independent from everyone else, wouldn't be allowed to happen like you describe, here in the states- the rest of society would make a shit storm bout it
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>>7839358
I'm pretty sure it would if was in like Detroit or Baltimore, anon, no child left behind my ass. And frankly, my whole country looks like a white Detroit, so attitudes on this are more relaxed.
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>>7839378
What's your country by the way
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>>7839288
Dominant broken traits are bred out rather quickly. You simply can't survive in nature as well. So shitty traits get bred out and the recessive ones don't because they don't show up to cause problems as often, because they are recessive.
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>>7839378
>attitudes on this are more relaxed
spot on, I guess what say is true since all I know is small town on the coast where kids are really protected. Just the contrast between progressive West and old fashioned Eastern Europe not giving a shit was really striking for me. Like military people being loud and drunk on a train with a class of young people is not only looked down on where I'm from, it ust doesnt happen
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>>7839388
Take a guess.
>>7839400
Soldiers are commonly idolized here (if they are from a prestigious branch like the Airborne, at least), and the service is mandatory, so in certain times of the year, there are a lot of soldiers returning home, and as tradition dictates, they are all completely shitfaced and behave like brigands.
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>>7838130
What an ugly toe!
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>>7839251
You're Russian?
This sounds like the plot of a independent film.
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Not >>7839388, my guess is Russia
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>>7839432
>>7839439
That's right.
No future, no hope, no problem.
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>>7839444
This is why im a little envious of not being Russian born. I don't know much but from what I understand, people there have more autonomy from the state, the government just lets people live as they will, yet at the same time there is tradition of comradery associated with mandatory military service which doesn't really exist in the states. At least, these are the ideals I've perceived.
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>>7839488
Not really, it's an unstable clusterfuck bordering on failed state in the regions far removed from the capital, which is like another country entirely. It's not the worst place to live, and it has its advantages (like SJWs and any political correctness literally not existing, even online), but for the most part, it is a miserable, dangerous place, where everyone makes their own luck relies only on each other, and the government is treated pretty much like a natural disaster by the populace. Still, better than the 90s, that was a real-life post-apocalyptic dystopia. Still is, in some places.
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>>7839534
Hmm, well thanks for the posting OP. good day
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>>7838172
>I will say that it's not easy being, well, this close with someone who is supposed to be "off-limits"
go on
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Well you and your sister already share a last name, you don't even have to get married
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