>>7783225 Nothingness exists as a concept. It describes the mathematical area that holds no matter. So its the part that fills whatevers left out of the finite matter. Which makes it an infinite space.
>>7783233 Occam's razor, my friend; infinity makes less sense than there is just a massive amount of finite matter, energy in an ever growing universe. Just because there is more space, doesn't necessarily mean that there will be more matter or energy to fill the space.
>>7783236 No, no, no. Wrong on so many levels. First of all that doesn't really answer his question because he didn't ask how space can exist without matter in it, he asked how space can exist (implying the only thing that can exist is matter). Space is not simply the absence of matter, this is a common misconception.
>>7783243 No, an arbitrary amount of finite matter makes less sense than infinite matter. Occam's Razor is specifically why the cosmological principle is used. The universe is assumed to be uniform. The universe is flat and therefore assumed to be infinite. Therefore there is infinite matter since the proportion of matter to space in our local space is greater than 0.
Also, the universe isn't growing, it's just stretching, or getting less dense. But it's volume isn't "changing".
>>7783272 It's unclear what "constant volume" means for an infinite volume universe, but yes I think it's inaccurate to say that the universe is growing. "Expansion" in this context simply refers to the density of the universe getting lower and can't really be analogized to a finite volume object expanding beyond that.
>>7783210 >there exist infinites in mathematics >mathematics exist within the universe either >the universe must be infinite to hold the information of an infinity or >mathematics exists outside the universe
If the universe can be delimited as a very small volume at the very beginning, and that it expended at a non-infinite rate over a non-infinite period of time since the Big Bang, then the universe is not infinite.
>inb4 hurr durr what about the empty space outside of the universe
Doesn't count you fucking bitch. The expansion of the universe since the big bang is an expansion of space-time itself. Outside of that expending area, space-time isn't even a thing.
>>7784256 >Outside of that expending area, space-time isn't even a thing. that you know of* (You know, because you don't know anything about it. You're talking complete shit if you say what outside the universe is or is not, by default. Here, there, and everywhere. Always, and forever.)
Let's put it this way. If the universe were somehow finite, how would that even work? What is going to happen if someone decides to travel nonstop in one direction forever? There couldn't possibly be some silly invisible barrier like in N64 games, right? There doesn't seem to be a way for this. So the universe is probably infinite in expanse.
>>7784263 Something outside of our universe is by definition something that we will never be able to observe or interact with. It is so pointless to speculate of shit outside of our universe it doesn't even deserve asking ourselves if "it could be real".
>>7784274 By a lot of modern scientists' opinions, you would be right... But I would like to remind everyone that most people have dreams when they go to sleep at night and the things in dreams can be interacted with at that time, yet they do not exist within the physical universe in which we live.
>>7784291 Don't need to, just need to send me a link to your article. Surely if you proved that dreams/consciousness signifies the existence of something beyond the physical world, you'd found someone to publish your great work.
>>7783210 We don't know. But the observable universe is finite and because we can't observer anything outside of it, it doesn't matter. All you can do is speculate, but it will never affect you in any way.
>>7783225 Because space isn't made of matter. It's just an concept
>>7783525 No it doesn't have to. Maths is an concept defined by people. Wikipedia page (and maybe mathematical papers if you really need) contains all information of an infinity in math. Math can't exists or not exists inside/outside the universe since it's only a concept.
>>7784271 Particle horizon is the boundary but you can never reach it since it always moves away from you at speed of light(or higher).
You don't know whether some future people will discover physical infinities which can be manipulated or interacted with. It is conceivable that nature might contain processes or objects most easily described as infinite which can be observed by humans in a finite amount of time.
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