Why every ancient creatures were so huge?? because of oxygen?

>>7782955
I recommend you Go /sci/

The Blue Whale is the biggest animal ever and it's alive

>>7782955
maybe
crocs are coldblooded too and can live without any food FOR A YEAR because of it

>>7782955
Because they're have small penis so bigger size will helpful to lure female.

>>7782955
theres a theory
some people says gravity was weaker back then and the center of the earth was less solid than today

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/less-gravity-on-earth-when-dinosaurs-roamed-because-all-mass-in-universe-was-closer.262645/

actually there is a theory

not sure if it's current but imo dinosaurs and trees got so big because of the oxygen concentration

maybe it had to do with temperatures too which was a bit higher back then as well and oxygen concentration but basically their hearts would pump less and that's how they could get so enormous

so it is no surprise that the mammals that did survive from then were tiny rodents due to teh sudden drop in temperature, ie oxygen concentrationm, imo

>I could tell this was a Japan thread from the catalog

https://www.quora.com/Why-were-prehistoric-animals-so-big-both-on-land-and-in-water

>The reason why Arthropleura and other Arthropoda could get to such huge sizes compared with the small sizes for this category of animals nowadays, is that oxygen levels were higher in the Permian. Insects breathe by diffusion through a tracheal system, they don't have lungs, so their size is limited by this. There are other theories regarding why insects became smaller, including the appearance of birds as predators of insects, particularly flying insects.

>Regarding the size of dinosaurs, it is speculated that herbivorous dinosaurs got larger because the increased CO2 in the atmosphere allowed for a superabundance of plants that were increasingly larger as well. The carnivores had to follow suit in order to prey on the herbivorous behemoths. The biggest land animal of all times was Dreadnoughtus, which weighed in at about 65 tons, as big as a 747. The biggest land animal today, the African elephant, is 5 tons.

>Interestingly, the biggest animal of all times is the existing blue whale, which weighs about 100 tons. The oceans and other large bodies of water can support the existence of very large animals, because water buoyancy counteracts the gravitational pull. The blue whale can get as huge, because it eats krill, which is one of the most abundant foods on the planet. There is no fossil marine animal that got as big as the blue whale, so perhaps the exceptional gigantism phenomenon observed during the time of the dinosaurs only applied to land animals.

Back in the Dinosaur era, it was because of high oxygen and temperature levels. Before that, it was due to obscenely high oxygen levels.

>>7782955
Because they're stupids

>>7782955
BECAUSE ITS [PREHISTORIC YEARS]

>>7782955
Who knows? (´・ω・`)

No Jews to hinder their growth back then.

>>7782960
So manlets are the men from the future.

>>7782955
>because of oxygen?
'yes'
and low gravity

Protoculture.

What if we increase Earth's oxygen now? How big will people get??

>>7782955
no humans to observe their growth in anticipation and jinx it

>>7782955
aliens

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>>7782971

>>7782971
About 3 inches taller. Also, spiders will grow to be the size of a house cat.

>>7782955
>because of oxygen
This is only important for insects

First spiders were as big as cats.

>>7782955
This question belongs on

>>>/sci/

During the Carboniferous and Permian periods, atmospheric oxygen concentrations were significantly higher than they are today. Prehistoric insects breathed air that was 31-35% oxygen, as compared to just 21% oxygen in the air you're breathing as you read this.

Atmospheric oxygen is the single most limiting factor on insect size.

The cells in your body get the oxygen they need to survive via your circulatory system. Oxygen is carried by the blood, through your arteries and capillaries, to each and every cell in your body. In insects, respiration occurs by simple diffusion through the cell walls.

Insects take in atmospheric oxygen through spiracles, openings in the cuticle through which gases enter and exit the body. Oxygen molecules travel via the tracheal system. Each tracheal tube ends with a tracheole, where the oxygen dissolves into the tracheole fluid. The O2 then diffuses into the cells.

When oxygen levels were higher, as in the prehistoric era of giant insects, this diffusion-limited respiratory system could supply sufficient oxygen to meet the metabolic needs of a larger insect.

Oxygen could reach cells deep within the insect's body, even when that insect measured several feet long. As atmospheric oxygen decreased over evolutionary time, these innermost cells could not be adequately supplied with oxygen. Smaller insects were better equipped to function in a hypoxic environment.

And so, insects evolved into smaller versions of their prehistoric ancestors.

>>7782960
I can tell that's bullshit just by reading the thread title

>>7782971
it depends actually
free radical oxygen is very very bad
it destroys cell-lining so we will live shorter lives

there is no immediate height growth but our hearts will pump slower since our bodies would get enough per pump thus the extra energy is stored, only over a long time maybe the body increase in usage but divided in relation to parts of the body that uses energy the most like brain and hands so "we" may not get like 30 meters tall.

dinosaurs did because they were in a pretty "simple" hunter/hunted dynamic

>>7782955
food
Earth had much bigger trees back then and plant life. Big herbivores mean big carnivores.
I recommend reading on multiple massive extinctions of life on Earth, and how it made good fuel for new life to develop.
>can;t wait to become fuel for some awesome plant

>>7782981
How long do you think free radical lasts in atmosphere? You don't breathe reactive forms of oxygen in, thery are side product of cellular respiration

>>7782983
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-radical_theory_of_aging

it's rather common

>>7782960
This is bullshit because dinosaurs were so big they should attract each other much more canceling the weaker hollow earth gravity out. Idiot.

>>7782957
>ever
Nope

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> not cloning prehistoric giant insects to bring nightmarish bug swarms across the world
This must happen.

>>7783153

Yes it is. The blue whale is bigger than any other animal on Earth, living or extinct.

It's got blood vessels you could swim down.

>>7783170
Arteries, not blood vessels.

>>7782955
Not necessarily. Cretaceous oxygen levels were comparable or even less than our own.

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Let me explain this to you in a way as simple as possible: Look at pic related.
Imagine every row of cups is an order of organisms
>bottom = bacteria or plants
>next tier : plant-eaters
>carnivores eating plants eaters
'bear in min that omnivores can fit on different layers at the same time)
Now compare the current polluted world full of humans with an uncharted completely uncivilized world.

>this will result in a much taller tower.
Now imagine every tier you go up increases the animal's size.

Why aren't there any big animals left? because humans hunted them down for either food or to protect themselves and recently started to fuck with several stages of you tower wich results in a smaller tower wich results in smaller animals.

The reason is that they are several million years old and space has extended since. Their skeletons are also more reddish than current skeletons because of that: photons coming out of them are redshifted.

>>7783170
Not true. It's only the heaviest, not the largest to ever have existed.

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>>7784556
Dinosaurs weren't as big as you imagine

>>7783170
Is this board filled with people this dumb

>>7783388
not because "their skeletons" are fucking rock or anything. yeah.

>>7784586
That's about as big as I was imagining, and it's really fucking big.

>>7783174
An artery is a type of blood vessel you stupid shithead.

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>>7784586

>>7784604
he's saying you can only swim down their arteries, not all their blood vessels, you shit for brains.

>>7784615
manlet

>>7784586
It's called using your imagination. Everything was fucking massive back then. Imagine how big the whales were if fucking lizards and bugs were the 10 ft big back then. Just because we haven't found the skeletons of some giganto-whales doesn't mean they didn't exist, retard. They're probably somewhere at the bottom of the ocean in who knows where. Or maybe they've degraded into sediment after millions of years or something. Think about it, we know more about apace than we do about the ocean so just imagine how much we still don't know.

>>7784615
Kek'd. You should remove the original heights from the pic though and post again.

>>7784626
go back to /x/

>>7784617
You're fucking retarded. Arteries are blood vessels. If you cam swim in their arteries, you can swim in their blood vessels. No correction was required.

Fucking morons on this shit board.

>>7784640
>what are capillaries

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>>7784630

>>7784650
>You can swim in pools
>what are kiddie pools and hot tubs
That's how retarded you sound.

>>7784655
Fucking saved.

>>7784660
np, this 16 hour shift can't go by fast enough.

>>7784650
Jesus fucking christ how stupid are you?

If someone says to you, "you can swim in bodies of water", do you reply "nuh uh, you can't swim in an 8 fl oz cup of water, it's too small"?

Fucking faggot

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>>7784684

The scene in Omen where the nurse injects the air bubble into the IV while the woman helplessly lashes about before she dies a very painful death, is what I imagine when that dude swims through the arteries of a massive whale.

>>7784635
Whales stayed the same size for millions of years? No you go to x fucktard.

Ancient creatures seem huge because huge animals tend to fossilize more easily than smaller animals of the same morphology.

Given the same conditions, a tiger would be able to fossilize more easily than a house cat because it has larger bones, its corpse is heavier and wouldn't be washed down river as far, it wouldn't be eaten whole/ripped apart by scavengers and thus its bones would remain somewhat contiguous, as opposed to having been eaten whole or ripped apart (owl pellet anyone?).

Many ancient creatures seem huge because it just so happens that being huge makes you easier to be seen, both in real life and in the fossil record.

>>7782957
>what is a argentinasaurus even?

>>7785391
What is your mum heh kidding only having a gab.

>>7785391
No. Stop. Its not even close.

Dreadnaughtus was only ~65 tons, while blue whales have been recorded at 190

Cause human kiled whatever that was big? Like emu or somthng

>>7785562
Height and weight are different thing, do you know?

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Megasloths though.

>>7784990
Yeah that's typical /x/ shit. Fucking weirdos who believe in ghosts, astrology and other paranormal stuff like whales staying the same size for millions of years.

>>7782955
Because humans killed all huge animals.

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>>7783167
>having to genetically re-engineer them an active respiratory system without screwing with their original structure
Sure.

>>7786433
I was expecting a picture of your mum.

>>7786410
If two organisms are comprised of mostly similar material, which organism will be larger?
One that weighs nearly 200 tons or one that weighs nearly 70 tons?

>>7784586

I don't trust these images. I was one of those kids who bought into the "Liopleuradon was 25m" meme. Only to discover it was actually only 12 and scientists were guesing based on it's arsehole bone or something like that. These huge renditions of dinosaurs and sea creatures are estimated upper limits. Of course brachiosauras has a complete skeleton, so I'll agree. But for shit like Argentinasauras or Ampthicoelias I believe it.

>>7782970
underrated toast

>>7782970
I never understood that shit.

>It's a power source
>It's a technology
>It's genetic
>It's also cultural I guess?

Growing up with Robotech broke my fragile little mind.

>>7783170
LE EPIC TROLE

>>7782979
>30% oxygen
>decay processes that couldn't keep up with tree growth rates
My god the forest fires must have been spectacular.

>>7782955
There are way more extinct species than there are species living today. If you wanted to choose any given living or extinct species at random, odds are the species you picked existed before humans. If you're just looking at the biggest most bad ass creatures ever, then statistically speaking they too probably existed before people.

>>7783388
I'm an archeological cosmologist and I can confirm this.

>>7783388
As a post doc in xenobiogeochemistry I can confirm

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test

>>7790153
>test
Can confirm. Does cause epilleptic seizures

>>7790153
Why have you done this to me.

>>7790077
>archeological
>paleontogy
Fuck.

>>7783388
Top kek

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>>7782955
I can't believe no one has pointed this out yet.

The obvious answer is that it's Moore's law!

All of the stuff that used to need a big animal to fit in can now fit into a much smaller animal.

>>7790619
>>7783388
>>7782960
I'm learning so much from this thread

>>7782963
But why is there deep-sea gigantism then ? I'm no expert but the oxygen levels must be low as fuck down there, no ?

>>7783174
>implying owls are birds

>>7784617
>>7784650
>it's got blood vessels you could swim down
doesn't mean you can swim down all its blood vessels, it only means that there exist some blood vessels that you can swim down.

>>7790619
Top kek

>>7782955
Jesus christ japan

>>7782962
>dreadnoughtus
>65 tons

lmao no

Is it possible that during those millions of years, Earth was going through some sort of period where it wasn't blocking as much radiation from the sun, and the life on earth was being mutated through successive generations more rapidly?

>>7787994
#gottem

>>7782955
>More food
>More oxygen
>2 Scoops a Day

Ez

>>7787994
>implying size means mass
Size is volume clearly.

>>7787971
My mum is expecting you to apologize for your rudeness.

>>7790619
Guess which child is alive today

>>7786410
omg you are retarded.

>>7790077
Do you not realize that archaeology is the study of HUMAN activity throughout history. Paleontology deals with life much farther back....

>>7782982
No trees then, at least not what we now consider trees. No grasses or flowering plants either, those all came much later. On land ferns dominated, some as large as the redwoods of today.

>>7782975
Fuck. That.

>>7785374
You have got to be shitting me.

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>>7783167
>>7787700
Could they build a bio dome that simulates prehistoric atmospheric conditions? I wonder if all insects would be bitter? Giant cockroaches, giant ants, giant spiders.

What effect would this have on other types of organisms and how would they interact? In response to giant moths and dragonflies will we see giant spiders that are big enough to prey on small children when they exhaust their food source?

>>7783352
extinction of megafauna goes back farther than homo sapiens though. We are certainly to blame for some species (new world megafauna are the most compelling example) but there are many ecological factors in play that effect their survival. For example: larger animals need more space, due to higher caloric requirements, meaning they will be more spaced out than smaller animals. Then you introduce an extraordinarily clever social omnivore to the ecosystem, these large animals not only have new predators, but are also losing their previously large territories,and feeding grounds along with it.
I did some research on this when I was an undergrad, but this is only applicable to Pleistocene megafauna, because that was when humans dispersed across the world

>>7784626
we only know more about space than our oceans because space is relatively simple compared to our oceans. Oceans are like hundreds of ecosystems all mixed together with no clear beginning or end, and we don't even have a great understanding of terrestrial ecosystems, which are much simpler than marine ecosystems. Space is just a bunch of waves and particles and not much matter. also space is comparatively uniform, so sending probes just outside our atmosphere tells us a lot about most of space whereas in the ocean, conditions vary quite a bit depending on location (both latitude/longitude and depth)

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>>7796081
It would likely take generations of selective breeding in this enclosed habitat, but it may actually work. As soon as you remove them though (once reaching the intended size) , they're probably gonna die

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>>7796572
didn't they already do this in a lab and get huge dragonflies on the 1st generation.

What I want to know is how big can they get. Is there a theoretical limit if you ignore oxygen limitations? Instead of 30% oxygen bump it up to 100% oxygen. If they grow big enough they might be big enough to surgically implant a breathing apparatus so they can live outside the oxygen bubble. Maybe they'll be big enough to carry people or small packages. (Amazon delivery drones?) If any escape to the wild they'll die after 1st generation as newborns won't have the breathing aid needed for our atmosphere.

>>7782975
Also, there will be no more house cats.

Bcz Denver the last dinosaur !!

>>7796588
Square Cube Law.They'd get too heavy at some point.And 100% Oxygen is bad for you,sonnie.Don't do pure oxygen kids.

>>7798606
Are exoskeletons worse for loadbearing at large scales?