>there are men living today who flew into battle like thi

>>61029381
I wonder if all the shit and piss that would build up affected their vision

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>>61029381

>ball turret
>if the turret got damaged and unable to turn it would take hours to get the guy out
>the turret could take damage and fall off the plane
>it was the first thing the fighters would aim for
>if the landing gear got fucked the plane would crush the turret upon landing

>>61031622
>if the landing gear got fucked the plane would crush the turret upon landing

There's a story about that. Guy got smeared down the runway.

>>61031622
Why didnt they build an escape hatch into the fuselage?

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>>61029381

>>61032150
because life is cheap

>>61031996
>>61032150
Did the pilots have comms with the gunner? Imagine having to explain to him that he will be killed upon landing.

>>61032150
the turret doesn't go anywhere. The only way in or out is in the OP's pic

>>61031622
I hear ya

>>61032310
NZ with some feels hitting truths

>>61032150

Because if you have to bail during battle you're completely beyond fucked anyway.

They barely do any damage to me when I'm coming up behind a B-25 at 950km/hr in a Me262, preparing to unload 4x30mm armour piercing shells at a distance of 400m at it.

>>61032310
But surely it would cost less than training a new gunner. Aircrew got issued parachutes and those cost 2 grand a piece today, probably cost more back then.

They barely do any damage to me when I'm coming up behind a B-25 at 950km/hr in a Me262, preparing to unload 4x30mm armour piercing shells at a distance of 400m at it. In War Thunder.

>>61031996
There's a poem about it called "Death of a Ball turret Gunner"

>>61032150
>>61032395
>The Sperry ball turret was very small in order to reduce drag, and was typically operated by the shortest man of the crew. To enter the turret, the turret was moved until the guns were pointed straight down. The gunner placed his feet in the heel rests and then crouched down into a fetal position. He would then put on a safety strap, close and lock the turret door. There was no room inside for a parachute, which was left in the cabin above the turret. A few gunners wore a chest parachute.

>>61029381
And when you die
they clean you out of the turret with a hose

>>61032907
>>61032990

Ausfailia does it again.

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>ywn be a german soldier riding a zeppelin bombarding and shooting the enemy
JDIMSA senpai. Why does the guys with cool technology always lose?

>>61032360
Yes. There are multiple stories from air crews about explaining that they'd have to make a belly-landing when the turret was non-functional.

From what I remember, either the gunner was completely silent or they could hear him praying to himself until they crash landed.

>>61032360
Yes, everyone was aware of the situation.

>It was while Rooney was attached to the 8th that he witnessed a death terrible in its inevitability. A call came in that one bomber's ball turret gunner was trapped. Operating in the bomber's belly, ball turret gunners rotated their plastic "cages" for maximum target capability. On this particular aircraft, the rotational gears had jammed and the gunner could not return to a position where he could exit into the plane.
>The bomber was losing altitude fast and would have to make a crash landing. Everyone --crew, observers, and especially the ball turret gunner -- knew what was going to happen. The pilot ordered the crew to ditch everything to keep the plane in the air for a few more precious minutes, but still the wheels could not be brought down. "We all watched in horror as it happened," Rooney writes in "My War." We watched as this man's life ended, mashed between the concrete pavement of the runway and the belly of the bomber."

>>61032941
all evidence to the contrary
>no hatches

>>61033202
Scary shit. I'm claustrophobic and afraid of heights so this thing is basically my nightmare.

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>>61033307
>some faggot with a carabiner shoots the zeppelin
>sone other faggot does aswell
>lose height
>die a horrible death as the helium catches fire

this is why steampunk cant be real.

>>61033202
>by the shortest man of the crew
manlets btfo

>>61033202
>The gunner crouched in a fetal position within the turret with his back and head against the rear wall, his hips at the bottom, and his legs held in mid-air by two footrests on the front wall. This left him positioned with his eyes roughly level with the pair of light-barrel Browning AN/M2 .50 caliber machine guns which extended through the entire turret, and located to either side of the gunner.

>>61032395
Some turrets were retractable. I do not know what models. All had access from inside the fuselage in addition to the hatch.

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>>61033606
>helium catches fire

>>61033783
>The right foot operated a push-to-talk intercom switch. The turret was normally electrically powered in azimuth and altitude. An emergency hand crank could be attached to reposition the turret from inside the aircraft fuselage. In the event of a power failure another crewman would use this to crank the turret into the vertical position to allow the gunner to exit.[1]

>>61029381
My grandad was a tail gunner of a Lancaster bomber during ww2, not as spooky as the ball trurret but still pretty fucked when you're the first target of enemy fighters

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>>61033202

My grandfather flew a spitfire in WW2, but hell if I could every clamber into anything like that turret.

A cockpits fine, gives you more a sense of "going down with the ship", even if you're a rear-facing gunner, they shared airspace with the pilot so you could at least share some goodbyes.

In a turret like that it's nothing but pure solitude for the many hours you're in the air, nowhere to stretch or move, and you're vulnerable in so many ways.

They say Air Force is easy mode, which is true now, but holy shit, being in a dogfight in WW2 must have been something else.

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>>61033971

>>61032941
>it would cost less than training a new gunner.
every plane vs the few times it would have helped

>>61034227
>>61034276

Eerie. Must now listen to Empire music. Kudos on your old mans old man, Aussie brother

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>>61033606
>helium catches fire

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>all men who flew into battle like this are dead

>>61034281
Helium is a noble gas retard, it was the iron oxide

>>61034281
Hindenburg used hydrogen.

>>61034281
That was hydrogen. Aren't German school s. Supposed to be good?

>>61034281
Hindenburg wasn't helium.

This will be you when on an airship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwh07fYNdCY

>>61033343
And shit licking assholes today think 2 women kissing is real courage.

>>61034281
The Hindenburg didn't use helium.

>>61034276
Most of the shooting between individual bombers and fighters lasted seconds, and was over in the time it took to read this.

>>61034281
you are the reason why people call /pol/ a containment board.

>>61034473
Those budget cuts really did their number didn't they Ivan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=botILUc2eRo

>>61034473
Fucking russia. Why do you always have to make nightmaremode shit.

>>61031996
Wasn't there a movie about it?

>>61034473

I can't help but feel bad for the men who flew like this but survived to live out a long life.

It was probably like nothing they even imagined, but there they were, thousands of feet in the air, their feet dangling free, the chill of the heights, the scope of the horizon

And after battle they never saw anything like it again, and even if they lived to the age where commercial air-travel became prevalent, it was a final, empty, hollow experience, a shadow of the heights they once saw

>>61034281
that's hydrogen you stupid kraut

>>61032990
I know it's shitposting, but
>B-25
>ball turret

>>61034714
>Most
E.J Murray survived his.

>>61034845
People tend to matter less to a government when you have enough of them.

>>61034473
>bomber made of roofing iron with bombs ductaped to the bottom
never change Russia

>>61029381
Read Catch 22.

>>61034961
The effective range of the guns/cannons used by both sides, and the closing speeds of the aircraft limited the available firing time.

>>61034281
> German Education

>>61034854
12 o'Clock High? Classic plane wreck in opening shot.

>>61035493
I don't get the point of what you're saying. Only really relevant to bring up in 1v1 situations, where there's chasing and jinking, rather than constant evasion and target switching

>>61033971
you should probably go inhale a tank full of that flammable helium, germancuck. Save Ahmed the trouble.

>>61034281
you're muslim aren't you

>>61034276
>being in a dogfight in WW2 must have been something else.
Didn't the torpedo planes and dive bombers at Midway almost get completely wiped out?

>>61034589
Yep. People today including myself have no real idea what that even is.

Having the guts to go out in that thing knowing ur chances of coming home were slim. Like the sherman tank crews who would climb into a tank 5 minutes after the blood was washed out of it from the crew that died in it that morning.

just unbelievable and the saddest part is, it will happen again.

>>61036199
Battle of Britain

>>61034281
you cant be a native german

>>61033971
sorry meant to reply to >>61033606

keep on freedom strong bb

>>61036199
iirc the first wave of torpedo bombers got rekt and accomplished fuck all, but the next wave of dive bombers did the trick

>>61032990
Warthunder good game mate but Russian ufos are amazing

>>61034872
pretty deep anon.

>>61036926

That Russian bias, though.

Anyone have the webm of the russian plane that had a bunch of paratroopers just on top of it, and the procedure of getting them off is just the plane tilting and they all slide down the wings?

>>61033606
What kind of a retard would write "helium catches fire"?
This is literally like that episode of Archer. Holy shit.

>>61037396
nvm found it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ-CmHc3bSg

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Old 80s tv show with a pretty good story about a belly gunner who gets trapped in his pod:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMm8TKNfJCE&index=15&list=PLAy1A_f9ghNR8uEULc16c29ZmobioniVv

Kiefer Sutherland and Kevin Costner star.

>>61037713
I guess when you drink vodka for breakfast you can do things like this.

>>61033202
At least it was only manlets

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>>61034473
>plane tilts upwards
>fall out

What the fuck. Why is this thread the exact same as this one almost? Posts are the same but with usernames.

http://sheekyforums.com/thread/61029381/politics/there-are-men-living-today-who-flew-into-battle.html

>>61038609
>he doesn't know sheekyforums
It clones 4chan threads and puts them in that weird pseudo-forum format.

It has no real users, it's some guy's weird experiment or something.

>>61038973
That's freaky.

>>61038973
its to trick people into putting advertising on his site so he makes money off of other sites' traffic.

>>61037337
Spits and most US planes including the p47s and bearcats are amazingly better than their soviet counterparts but the russians always fly in a ball so the dumb US/UK pilots get destroyed. the bias is real from their incompetence in ground forces tho

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>>61033606

That bastard!

>>61034878
>b-25
>ball turret

topside, sure
perhaps he meant b-24j (?)

>>61039457
That's pretty smart if it's true.

>>61031996
Wait. If the landing gear got fucked up, why wouldn't they just land the plane on its back? The ball turret guy wouldn't get crushed.

>>61034473
NO!
NO!
NO!

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>>61039695
yeah

>>61038537
>what is seat belts?

Also, this bomber was not supposed to fly high as B-17 or B-29, so there was not so cold.

>>61039743
yea, just land a b-17 upside down, no problem.

The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner
Randall Jarrell, 1914 - 1965

From my mother’s sleep I fell into the State,
And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

>>61039743
It would probably blow the fuck up and kill everyone.

>>61040104
>so there was not so cold.
Unless it happened to be winter...

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>>61040313
Was just about to post this

>>61030659
It's not an Indian bomber, so they're fine.

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>>61039743
whens the last time you landed a plane that big on its back without fucking it up and killing everyone?

>>61039743
>land a plane upside down

Are you stupid?

>>61039743

DUDE

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>>61033697

>>61034854
there was a movie where the guy drew a cartoon landing gear and wished it into existence. shit was cash

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What balls those flyers had.

>>61034281
and you call american edu bad
jesus christ hans

>>61039743
>land the plane on its back
I like u, Canada.

>>61031996
>>61031622
>>61039743
>american engineers dont just give the guy a parachute and make it so he can release the back door from inside the ball

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>>61040529
Yeah, that was bad. People had many layers of fur coats and used goose-grease on faces to protect from cold. Courageous people.

later the put turrets behind engines of Pe-8 so they would heat the gunners.

>>61029381

>tfw great uncle my dad was named after got short down in WW2 while flying in a British Flying Fortress
>family donated his medals to be on display in the local airport

>>61040104
>not so cold
anon it is chilly at 5,000 ft on a summer day in TX

>>61040834
I've never flown a plane. It's kind of why I asked. Does it just get insanely hard to steer? Does the pilot pass out? Would it just crush everyone but the ball turret guy? I'm genuinely curious.

>>61039743
Came here to post this. Just invert the bird.

>>61041981
It would honestly probably blow up, aircraft are not designed to land upside down, especially WWII aircraft with their rudimentary fuel systems.

>>61033202

maybe you could open the hatch and do a back roll out while wearing your parachute....beats going down

>>61041981
Planes don't work upside down unless they are little barnstormers

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>>61034872
Those feels...

>>61040761
DESIGNATED

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>>61032990
WAR THUNDER IS TIGHT! FUCK YEAAAA BRO. I BROUGHT DOWN 3 B29S TODAY WITH MY ME262, RIDDLING THE FUEL TANKS WITH MY 4 30MM AUTO CANNONS, RIPPING THE FLESH OF THE CREW MEMBERS, PEIRCING THE PILOTS SKULL, SEND THE METAL RECKAGE IN A FLAT DEATH SPIN INTO A FIRERY ONE WAY TICKET TO HELL.

>>61033202
>>61042495
>hey do you think we should make a little more room in the ball to keep a parachute, seeing as there are so many potential problems that end in certain death
>nah it'll be k

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>>61042923

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>>61043052
This is what the ball gunner needed. This is now a jetpack thread. Meme power, check dubs.

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>>61043223

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>>61043223
B17 is based fortress

>>61039512
LEL

>>61041981
a plane the size of the b-17 would be very hard to turn upside down, never mind keeping it stable enough for a safe landing, and the big tail rudder would be in the way, it would hit the ground and send the front of the plane right into the ground (most likely) killing the pilot and other members of the crew as well. belly landing the plane normally is hard enough.

>>61033166
I remember reading that several years ago in high school. Didn't the guy at the end basically get turned to mush by getting hit so much and when the plane landed they used hosed his remains out?

>>61039743
>these are the ideas people on weed come up with

>>61032941
escape from what? the only think that could happen is they would get blown away by bullets or flak. no chance for escape so no escape route needed

>>61033606
>carabiner
>helium

>>61032990
war thunder is a shit game for babies that find DCS traumatic and triggering

>>61034473

Top kek. Is that a slavic squatting turret?

>>61033606
G-German education?

>>61044180
It's the poopdeck.

>>61041758

Shit, I wish I had pictures of it.

My dad was pretty good at making dioramas out of plastic models when he was a kid.

He made a scene with a shot to shit B-17 on a bit of tarmac, using balsa wood painted silver for the struts underneath the skin, and sculpting bullet holes with a heated up needle.

The ball turret was in bad shape and he was able to get a blood splatter effect with streaks running downward all over the inside of the turret.

Even the props on one of the engines that got blown out were feathered.

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>>61029381

i bet the landings are fun

>>61032242
>my first lover

Unrealistic as fuck

Dirty whores of her generation still have the good sense not to be open about it, especially in front of family

>>61044254
dont forget cotton balls to simulate engine smoke on that dead engine

man i miss my dad

>>61041758

Imagine opening that up to get the guy inside and its just intestines and brains everywhere

>>61029381
>living today

not many, they are a quickly dying breed unfortunately

>>61033202
The ball turret was also retractable in the B-24, but not the B-17.

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>>61033606
I wish Pilot's Love Song had been longer.

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Interior view towards the rear of the B-17.

>>61042739
BOMBING

>>61039457

What a kike

>>61045253

Tbh if I'd been alive during WW2 I'd probly want to die soon before seeing the world turn into even more of an orb of faeces than it already is.

>>61038186
ya know i was going to bring that up and then started watching a movie. tks

i remember him drawing the tire and it became real

Who the fuck would climb into a ball turrent to defend this degenerate civilisation?

>>61044177
U mean DCS A10C?

I love that sim. Wish i could afford the hotas stick and throttle but goddamn it just costs to much.

>>61046253
it wasn't this degenerate 70 years ago

>>61039743

lol

>>61045937
There were a lot of people who suggest that they had that reaction, never spelled it out and their saltiness was chalked up to ptsd.

>>61046253
imagine being cramped inside there for 12 hours

>>61034854
Memphis belle

>>61046906
Nah from what I remember in memphis belle the ball turret gunner survives

>>61045571
so why exactly couldn't they access it from the inside of the plane?

>>61031622
>>61029381

Sometimes anime would save them if the plane took damage. This is why we have to elect Trump.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItnJbsljcE4

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>>61034281
Really now?
Turk detected

>>61047201
Only one hatch. If the ball jammed in any position other than perfectly aligned with the hatch that was that.

>>61043459
>tfw the future never came

>>61033697
>>61038306
being in a ball turret took serious balls.

we all know that lanky beanpoles have no balls.

>>61034281
Ahmed detected

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>>61039743 >>61040834 >>61041708 et al

>>61041783
Even under this conditions we defeated germany...

>>61048238
long time ago islamic arabs were leaders in science. then they went all wahabi allah ackbar and into darkness

>>61029381
balls of steel

6'3" master race, thankfully would never have had to do that

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>>61034872

>>61041745

>losing a war to birds

>>61045642
Harbour

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELUP-oZQKM4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKdLbEQ6Dv8
Staring Ronald Regan bitches

>>61033971
>helium catches fire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRMQ0RWB1Us

From my mother's sleep I fell into the State,
And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

>>61045143
From my mother's sleep I fell into the State,

And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.

Six miles from earth, loosed from the dream of life,

I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.

When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

>>61041745
>Thinking there was enough room to store a fucking parachute in there.

I got baited by an aussie shitposter again, didn't I?

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They could make the ball turret detectable and with own parachute, so if they needed to make a crash landing the ball would land on its own parachute.

>>61029381

I guess I can take comfort that no matter how bad the decision I make in life, it won't be one to have me crammed in a small glass ball on the underside of a giant flying target heading for a war zone.

>>61041758
I can only imagine how fucking pulverized that guy must have been.

>>61034473
>Implying those idiots even made it to 1919
Good joke Ivan

>>61049075
btfo

>>61053302
That's more expensive than paying the family of the man inside.

You want to know what's scary about the increasingly automatized future? Humans are cheaper than a lot of things.

A lot of dangerous high fatigue situations are easily done by humans.
It's cheaper to get organic robots to do the task than constantly repair inorganic ones.

>>61029381

roger that

>>61053672
What about muh feeling?

>>61053788
Welcome to capitalism bitch.

>>61034473
I can't stop laughing holy shit

>>61033388
well fuck.

>>61053451
They washed his body out with a hose.

>>61053827
>capitalism
>Not total war having massive oversight because time is of the essence
Eat a dick commie

>>61032150
Been inside one at the palm springs air mesuem. The turret actually was enterable from the fuselage in the B17 at least.

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You should see how Muslims fly.

This is for you, y'all.
>From my mother’s sleep I fell into the State,
>And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
>Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
>I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
>When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

>>61040761

Nice one, Jap.

>>61047887
This is probably retarded but couldn't you like, bash/cut through or something?

>>61054398
It wouldn't really matter would it?
If the turret is fucked, then you're dead.
If the plane is fucked, you're still fucked, just a little later than if you were splattered along the inside of the ball.

>>61038306
what a pathetic attitude, grow up.

>>61054600
Well if the plane is landing then you've got a decent chance if you're not under it.

>>61054738
I suppose some poor fucker at some point was stuck in a turret in a plane without landing gear and was subsequentially swished on landing.

But I doubt there were enough cases to change the design of the turret.

>>61033307
shut up chile

>>61054908
see>>61033388
That's why I asked if you could bash or cut through or something unconventional as a last resort.

The thing looks pretty fucking solid so I don't know that it would be possible.

>>61054936
You mean Texas, bud

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>>61055053
no this is texas

>>61034281

>german "education"

>>61055043
People die in war.
And war is a business.
It's just a bunch of numbers.
Can our numbers supercede theirs?

That's it.
Yeah, maybe some people die unimportantly.
But that's just how maximizing efficiency works.

Human lives are cheap compared to rehauling the fleet.

>>61055187
As edgy as that is, it's not really relevant to what I was talking about.

>>61034457
AY YO HOL' UP

>>61055247
What I'm saying is that making it possible to bash through to the hatch is not worth the structural weakness of allowing it.

>>61055366
But I never thought about if it was worth making it bashable.

I thought about whether it could be penetrated from inside if the need arose.
Not saying they should design it for that to be possible.

>>61041472
oooh shit i remember that movie. was a long time ago, thanks for the memories

great scene, was glad the guy made it.

>>61055481
It seems that it wasn't.
Once you go into the ball turret, you go out via the hatch or you go out via hose

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>>61032150

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>>61033606
This post kills the chemist.

>>61031622
that was in amazing stories the movie. the guy trapped drew the plane with wheels while he was trapped and then he saved himself because magic.

true story it was in a movie

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My grandfather is one of these men

>pic related

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>>61033606
>>61039743

>>61055771
>you only exist because a German missed

I know that feel.
My great grandfather killed a Kraut officer in hand to hand combat and took his pistol, sword, and arm badge

>>61029381
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItnJbsljcE4

>>61048404
>we

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>>61039743
>why wouldn't they just land the plane on its back?
Why wouldn't they just make a plane without wings?

>>61041981
It's physics.

The plane can't fly on it's own. That's why it needs wings. Even rockets have wings. Anything designed to fly in our atmosphere has wings.

Wings produce lift. The only thing keeping a 32,000kg behemoth in the air is lift. You take away the lift, the plane is no longer a plane. It is a brick with propellers. The wings are not designed to produce lift from above, so when you turn the plane over, the carefully designed flying apartment building will quickly and rapidly start to drop altitude and with how unmaneuverable an aircraft of that size is--enter an unrecoverable dive.

>>61055509
>>61041472
>>61055931

>>61034281
>>61033606
Refugee engineer detected.

>>61032907
How's The me 163 in battle though?

I was lucky enough to not only see a working, flying b-17 once, but also go inside the thing. It was absolutely amazing to see it in person, although I'm certain it much smaller than I remember, as I was something like 9 when I saw it. I disctinctly remember wanting to get inside the ball turet because it looked like I would have fit perfectly inside it. Going from the upper level to the bombing/gunner level was awesome, and they had the bombing bays open too. Side gunner positions were near, but the tail gunner seat was sectioned off so I never got to go in it (like the ball turret). If you ever have the chance to see one, take it.

I've still got the t-shirt somewhere. Damm shame it crashed a while back, it was one of something like four that could still fly.

>>61056149
I saw a Galaxy once when I was a kid.

Not really related to the thread at hand, but still.
The ladder to the cockpit really stuck out to me.

>>61034281
>mfw only 1/3 of the people on board died from this

>>61055631
horrific

>>61056285
Fuckin war, mate

Still better than WW1 tho.
What a god damned fucking hellscape

My grandfather was a mechanic that never left Britian as far as i was told but somehow ended up with a bunch of captured items including a Nazi flag that sadly my grandmother sent to auction before i was born.

>>61056234
Hit up your local airfields web site, the smaller it is, the more likely theyll scrounge up strange aircraft to show off and draw in money. That's how I managed a ride on a Ford tri-motor. I miss those days.

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>>61056149
Pic related, found the shirt. The pin-up on the side of the plane was hot as Fuck too.

>>61053672
Not necessarily true. You know it costs over a million dollars to train an f-18 pilot. There is a reason they invented ejection seats.

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>>61055924
That's fucking badass.

My grandpa too came very close to be killed by krauts. He's was the only one of his crew to survive the war. He got a really bad case of the stomach flu and got to sit out of one mission to bomb Germany. His crew's B-17 got shot down by flak on that mission. One bailed out but later died of typhoid in a POW camp. So crazy how one bout of the diarrhea is responsible for my existence

>pic related, his plane and dead crew

>>61056544
Apparently he was a total shit father to my grandfather, so my grandfather gave away the Luger to the first guy who had any interest in a gun collection. Totally free. Just a fuck you to his dad about getting that gun.

I still have the sword and armband though.
Real weird shit, to be honest.

>>61055187
War is not about numbers, it's more than that. You can kill the enemy all day long, perhaps double his kill count, and not achieve your objectives. See Vietnam and Korea, some of WW2's battles, and several of Napoleon's campaigns.

If your violence isn't directed at an outcome, it's truly worthless

>>61056705
But it's still numbers.

Russia only won at Kursk despite having more than twice the casualties because they had the supply to sustain it.

It's always just numbers.
The power of the Soviet Union in WW2 proved that.
Tactics be damned. We have more men.

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>>61056149
>>61056490
neat
i jelly
i got to see a P51 fly around at an airshow, was pretty cool
they did a fly by like this too, however this isn't my pic

>>61043459
"A World Without Niggers"

>>61056544
your grandpa was a fucking braindead faggot and he most likely terror bombed the fuck out of german master race cities killing thousands of aryan women and children for his kike overlords.

fuck your grandfather and his gay ass airplane.

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>>61056937
kek

>>61031622
Theres actually a story of this happening during one of the first night time bombings of germany. I believe it was the 100th bomb group

>tfw your great uncle was a test pilot for the army air force and died in a fiery crash when testing a classified project
i heard army test pilots in ww2 were pretty hardcore though

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>>61054908
The Sperry design with the gunner inside the turret itself was the best option because the previous remote operated design that had the gunner in the aircraft using a periscope to aim caused vertigo and induced more drag on the aircraft.

>>61056937
No joke, he actually participated in the Dresden bombings.

And what was he supposed to do? Germany declared war on us faggot. We wanted nothing to do with the European war.

Plus fuck hitler in the Nazis. They were the worse thing to ever happen to the white race. How many white russians, brits, french, danes, nords and serbs did they kill?

The germans fell into the classic divide and conquer jewish lie. Their hated enemy was other whites. If they didn't try to kill their white neighbors and just liquidated the jews, no one in Europe or North America would've fucking cared.

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>>61054128

OW

>>61056937
The fucking Krauts had it coming to them. God bless America, and never fuck with the Eagle.

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>>61056937

>>61040313

jesus

>>61057246
Here's another from an earlier worse war
>Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
>Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
>Till on the haunting flares, we turned our backs
>And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
>Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
>But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
>Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots(4)
>Of tired, outstripped(5) Five-Nines(6) that dropped behind.
>Gas! Gas! Quick, boys! – An ecstasy of fumbling,
>Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
>But someone still was yelling out and stumbling,
>And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime(9) . . .
>Dim, through the misty panes(10) and thick green light,
>As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
>In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
>He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.
>If in some smothering dreams you too could pace
>Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
>And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
>His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
>If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
>Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
>Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
>Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,
>My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
>To children ardent for some desperate glory,
>The old Lie; Dulce et Decorum est
>Pro patria mori.

>>61056802
Thinking like this is why the war in Afghanistan went on for over a decade, and was ultimately pointless. Same can be said for Vietnam.
Just kill more of them and surely we'll win! It doesn't matter where we fight our battles, or how. It's a very rudimentary, almost childlike understanding of conflict.

Politicians weren't / aren't willing to take the steps necessary -- hard steps -- to achieve their goal. They fucked about with their politically correct "hearts and minds" bullshit, which dragged the conflict on and on, and ultimately cost the lives of many more servicemen than were necessary. After all the most moral way of conducting war is to end it quickly; with superior, brutal displays of violence. But:

A war is always about goals, you don't go to war for no reason. It's a very political act. It's undertaken to enforce a political outcome on an opponent(s). And it's best done with the political goal in mind at all times, in every decision, and with the maximum level of force behind it.

One battle at Kursk isn't the norm. That cost Russia dearly and probably fucked with their supply lines for days. It was also an important battle, and the lives expended there were important; it was the right place to battle.

History is full of weaker foes overcoming superior forces. The Battle of Thermopylae, the Battle of Arcole (in fact many of Napoleon's battles), arguably the Vietnamese during the Vietnam war, and many more.

>>61056937
I hope his gramps rises from his grave and slaps you like the bitch you are

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>>61057501
This is now a war poetry thread:

plato told

him:he couldn’t
believe it(jesus

told him;he
wouldn’t believe
it)lao

tsze
certainly told
him,and general
(yes

mam)
sherman;
and even
(believe it
or

not)you
told him:i told
him;we told him
(he didn’t believe it,no

sir)it took
a nipponized bit of
the old sixth

avenue
el;in the top of his head:to tell

him

-ee cummings (who is redpilled af btw)

>>61057532
>Politicians weren't / aren't willing to take the steps necessary -- hard steps -- to achieve their goal.
That's it there.
The Soviets didn't give a damn about how many men died so long as the battle ended up a W.

We care.
Americans care.

Americans would have won Vietnam if they didn't care about their lives or enemies.

As you say, History is full of weaker foes over coming superior forces, but it's due to the superior force not willing to do what it takes.

>>61029381
>Grandfather flew as a ball turret gunner.
>There was access into the hull via the ball
>It took so long to wriggle around it isn't even worth trying to get a parachute if you're going down.

>>61057656
I used to think ee cummings was a faggot.
Until I grew some fucking taste and learned how to read.

>>61048404
>we

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>>61057673
Or the smaller force could just be plain BETTER you fucking autist.

>>61057656
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Glcg95L4JK4

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>>61057766
He is definitely an acquired taste. Once you figure out his style though, he is really great.

This my favorite by him:

Jehovah buried,Satan dead,
do fearers worship Much and Quick;
badness not being felt as bad,
itself thinks goodness what is meek;
obey says toc,submit says tic,
Eternity's a Five Year Plan:
if Joy with Pain shall hand in hock
who dares to call himself a man?

go dreamless knaves on Shadows fed,
your Harry's Tom,your Tom is Dick;
while Gadgets murder squack and add,
the cult of Same is all the chic;
by instruments,both span and spic,
are justly measured Spic and Span:
to kiss the mike if Jew turn kike
who dares to call himself a man?

loudly for Truth have liars pled,click;
where Boobs are holy,poets mad,
illustrious punks of Progress shriek;
when Souls are outlawed,Hearts are sick,
Hearts being sick,Minds nothing can:
if Hate's a game and Love's a fuck
who dares to call himself a man?

King Christ,this world is all aleak;
and life preservers there are none:
and waves which only He may walk
Who dares to call Himself a man.

>>61046329
>know nothing about DCS
>Get A-10 bundle with Kamov Ka-50
>start up the Ka-50
>buttons everywhere
>Everything in Russian
>confused by beeping sounds
>hit one lever
>more beeping sounds
>helicopter explodes

>>61057673
A lot of is down to strategy, good tactics, and generalship, too. It's about things such as who has their supply lines closer, who has the terrain advantage, placement of troops, who has more morale, who is better fed, who is better equipped, etc. A lot of this is down to superior planning and leadership. If anything in this delicate system of war fails, if there's what Clausewitz called "friction," your army's chances of success are diminshed.

Are all of Napoleon's victories just down to sheer luck? No. Many aspects of his life certainly are attributable to luck, but not his generalship. He was an extraordinary man with a huge talent for field leadership.

No one understands war these days, it's just numbers and killing, or hearts and minds. In the end, the apathetic belief that war achieves nothing actually ends up costing more lives.

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>>61039743

>canada

Every time.

>>61057949
Nice, Kipling has so many great war poems.

>>61034281

Don't you have the Fernsehturm to clean or something.

>>61057958
Buffalo Bill will always be my favourite.
It was his first poem I got and then retroactively went back and understood the rest.

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>>61029381
>grandpa joins the army corps of engineers
>spends most of his time bartending in Italy

No idea how he managed that

>>61058379
is his name yossarian

>>61058457
kek

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>>61029381
My grand father is on the far right. Drafted in to WW2 and prior to that was a civilian pilot. He had some medical problem so they wouldn't let him fly, and instead stuck him with supervising people packing parachutes. You can see that he really didnt give a fuck, as underneath the huge NO SMOKING sign in the rear, is a guy smoking. I wonder how many air borne embers burned tiny holes in chutes sending paratroopers to their deaths?

>>61032150
You could get into the ball turret from inside the plane, it just had to be in a certain position. The ball turret could also be dropped from the plane but it took about 20 minutes to do and once again the turret had to be in a certain position.

>>61057532
>the Vietnamese during the Vietnam war

>america wins war against north vietnam
>americans head home

>north vietnam invade south vietnam after america is gone

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>>61058703
>is a guy smoking
two guys smoking. Besides being stationed in England he also spent time Morocco and Saudi Arabia. When in rome...

>>61058457
wait i've been taking cough syrup for a cold and im not thinking straight. What does that has to do with catch-22?

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>>61034473
>Comrade Stallin we do not have a transport plane, only bomber....
>Ride on the wings

>>61056826
Was it a real p-51 or was it one of the cheaper scaled down kit ones?

>>61036926
I always wanted them to put in a Old 666 as a premium b17, no bombers but double the 50 cals

>>61042923
>tfw i barely have one jet plane
>tfw its the p 80

>>61059392
At least they have parachutes

Why the fuck isnt this posted yet?

http://youtu.be/rsgHrAIRXKI

>>61060456
Because its some retard playing with a keyboard or game pad instead of a mouse.

>>61059392
fucking russians

>>61055964
>The plane can't fly on it's own. That's why it needs wings. Even rockets have wings.
Rockets use the wings as stabilizers, not for gaining altitude (lift) as a plane does.

>>61033606
Lolno. Even the Hindenburg only caught fire because the Hydrogen (not Helium) it had mixed with just enough air due to a freak leakage before the accident.

>>61053963
>captain, where's bill?
>Got rekt, had to hose his body down
>Grab a towel, you're next in line jonny.

>>61039743
>another retard in my country.

God damnit why are there so many of you and why do you keep breeding?

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>>61040761
The only way to conquer an enemy is to make him your sincere friend.

>>61033388

holy fuck. that's grim.

>>61032242
>that's so validating!

Things that a child wouldn't ever say to her grandma in this situation #25

Dulce et Decorum est

By Wilfred Owen

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs,
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots,
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of gas-shells dropping softly behind.

Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound’ring like a man in fire or lime.—
Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil’s sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,—
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

NOTES: Latin phrase is from the Roman poet Horace: “It is sweet and fitting to die for one’s country.”

>>61059392

They didn't fly so good!

>>61034281
You deserve two million more

>>61058030
Kek

>>61039743
Jesus fucking Christ, Canada

>>61033606
>>61034281
Stop ruining my dreams about german education.

>>61029381
DESIGNATED
E EE
T T S
A A I
N N G
G G N
I I A
S S T
E E E
DESIGNATED D
E E E
S S T
I I A
G G N
N N G
A A I
T T S
E EE
DESIGNATED

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>>61033388
holy fuck.

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Late in the thread here, but my great uncle was a ball turret gunner on a B-27 Liberator. He was a little guy about 5'5" He flew with the 15th and was in the raid of Ploesti.

He had some good stories, he was credited with 1/2 of a kill on a BF109 that was attacking from below. Along with the tail gunner. Not every crew officially tracked kills but guys tried to keep score. There were no gunsite cameras like they had on fighters so it was hard to "officially" credit a kill to a gunner, it was mostly an honor system.

He said what scared him even more than fighters was FLAK because there wasn't anything you could do about it. He had shrapnel from an 88 shell hit his turret and damage his right gun. the gun probably saved his life. He was never wounded but it was one hell of a job. The guy had balls.

and as other's correctly posted, there was little room in the turret for a parachute. And he said it would have been nearly impossible to bail out anyway from the ball.

>>61074085
>Ploesti
so he took part in operation tidal wave?
i ve heard that it was one hell of a waste,and a big failure for the USAF

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>>61074085
Oh I put in a typo.. its a B-24 not B-27. Sorry guys.

>>61074257
Yea it was early in the war for the Americans. the tactics weren't totally developed, they came in low and the Germans were very prepared.

His plane got shot up a bet, nearly all of them did, but no crew members were injured in that raid. In fact only one crew member of his plane was slightly wounded in a raid by an exploding 20mm shell (he assumed, he didn't see what hit them) His plane was really blessed I guess.

>>61056544
>I'll get by

Those poor bastards

>>61057209
Fuck you, Hitler united the Germans and tried to help the other European nations, the Jewish influence was too much for him, but don't blame the guy that tried to save us you fucking idiot. That's like blaming a firefighter for dying trying to save more people in a burning building. Do you realize how stupid that sounds? Yeah, totally fuck that guy for saving people in that fire.. what a dick.

If it wasn't for him wouldn't have the awareness of the issues we face today. Because of him we know our enemy. I swear, we're fucking Americans! We love sovereignty and liberty and freedom! If anyone should understand Hitler's plight it'd be us.

>>61033697

They're only short because their massive balls held them down.

I'm pretty sure some of the cold war soviet bombers didn't have a ball turret that you could get out of.
And those things flew for a very long time.

>>61056802
Russia won the Kursk tank battle because Britain had cracked the Enigma and Lorenz ciphers and gave the Russians the German battle plan.

>>61041758

See the chunks in the bottom?

>>61057878
During Putins visit to Serbia?when we held our military parade. He gave a speach of how Yugoslavian partisans and chetniks played an important role by tieing up 57 divisions of germany. So yeah "we"...

>>61055509
Which movie?