Has there been a rational argument presented by liberals why we should let 11 million illegal immigrants stay?
The only response I get is
>wow, really, just wow
>no human is illegal
>it's too much work
Because if you don't want 11 million people who don't pay their fair share in taxes yet disproportionateley take advantage of social programs and society, drive down wages, and take jobs that dont require an education or a unique skill from tens of millions of unemployed americans you are a racist.
>import low class labor
>new voting bloc established
>politicians, businesses benefit
In that context yes it is rational. Because it would make sense if they just came out and was honest about amnesty
Trump owning poor little Jeb!!!
Trump destroying Colonel Bernie Sanders in Iowa!
>tfw I'm worried the emperor is going back on his promise to deport the beaners because he hasn't talking about them going back in months now
>Bu... but they're human beanz!
>How can you break up families!
>They're just here for a better life!
They don't actually have any logical points; only irrational appeals to emotion.
counting down the days until he brings that one out
Most of these people are productive members of society that overstayed visas or are family members of citizens. They have committed no crimes, only broken civil laws and regulations. Helping to improve the Mexican/Latin American economy and fight the drug cartels, as well as ending NAFTA will stop the flood of migrants across the border. However, raiding 11 million people's homes, arresting them, and deporting them is not only physically impossible it would be incredibly expensive and devastating to many local economies that depend on migrant labor.
>doesn't need federal gubment to mass arrest people
We deport half a million a year every year. We were able to deport over a million in 1954.
Maybe try being less of a faggot and read something.
I had a small interaction with a white liberal lady from Portland.
I told her I was Mexican and voting Trump, she started harping on about compassion
thats it, just "don't you have compassio? what if they were your family?" etc
>YOUR PARENTS WERE IMMIGRANTS
>HOW CAN YOU BE SO HYPOCRITICAL
>the crops will rot in the fields!
I love this one because it's when liberals take on a free market position that they usually hate. Americans won't do the labor for less than minimum wage? ENTITLED LITTLE SHITS
Literally the thread is making fun of how there isn't a "rational" debate from opponents of a mass deportation plan. I think if you did the slightest bit of research you'll find there are many reasonable arguments against attempting to mass arrest 11 million illegal immigrants. Everyone who has responded to me thus far is just ignoring my argument and doing exactly what they are making fun of: blowing off an argument with cognitive dissonance.
Man you fucks are idiots
Illegal immigrants aren't qualified to receive social welfare,
The cheap wages they get from harvesting food is the reason your fruit doesn't cost 8$ for a tomato
If you're all so pissed off about illegal immigration then repeal NAFTA, we destroyed their agricultural base in order to ship our shitty industry there, (There's American jobs for ya) so of course they are gonna come here.
Obama has also deported more illegal immigrants than all other US presidents combined.
But you fucking idiots want to spend more of my tax dollars to build a fucking idiotic wall.
Illegals do not take jobs from American, do you know anybody that wants to be a fucking hotel maid or work in fields?
No, you don't.
Kill yourselves you fucking idiots.
>Illegals can't receive social welfare
Found the lying beaner!
>If you're all so pissed off about illegal immigration then repeal NAFTA, we destroyed their agricultural base in order to ship our shitty industry there
Yeah because you fucked their economic advantage of cheaper produce in the ass by continuing to allow illegals to make American produce competitive. NAFTA should have fucked American ag in the ass but you like to have your burgers and eat them too.
I like the common argument of
>the illegal wages are why produce is cheap
Which is absolutely true, but then many will turn around and also argue
>raising the minimum wage wont lead to significant price hikes #feelthebern
>if they can't afford to pay a living wage they shouldn't be in business
Huffington Post isnt a source.
Neither is forbes or The atlantic.
As a matter of fact, none of your sources are actually legit sources. They're just left-wing propaganda sites.
Baby's first shitpost.
>"According to the Department of Homeland Security's (DHS)"Yearbook of Immigration Statistics," the last president who deported illegal aliens at a slower rate than Barack Obama was Richard Nixon "
>It was Obama himself who created this image of the strict border guard. Under Obama, ICE exaggerated its numbers by counting people caught at the border and immediately returned as deportations. No other President used that method (Border Patrol deportations are usually counted as "returns"). Therefore as data for comparison the pure deportation figures under Obama are as valid as his promise that people who liked their health insurance would be able to keep their health insurance.
get bent shill
>Illegals do not take jobs from American, do you know anybody that wants to be a fucking hotel maid or work in fields?
I was just in Europe recently. Do you know who they have cleaning the streets, working as janitors, etc? It sure as hell isn't Mexicans, I can tell you that.
That's only families with children, so technically that welfare is for the American babies. I'm no mexican, I'm a Euromutt thank you very much. My other point still stands, keep sounding retarded.
This doesn't even make sense, your grammar is atrocious. Speak English please so I can understand your argument.
Step 1) cut benefits
Step 2) defund sanctuary cities
Step 3) make it impossible for them to get jobs, followed by these jobs being replaced by automation or Americans who actually pay taxes
Most of them will self deport. We can actually save money if we do all of these things.
Got it. You're just using Mein Kampf as a source, so anything I provide is just 'false' and anything you believe on faith is 'true.'
Last time I checked, the news was a source in so far as it gets printed with verified sources checking facts. If you're too reich to be wrong then I don't think there's any point in us having an "argument." Which begs the question.. are you just on /pol/ to be continually reinforced in whatever it is you believe, much like the liberals you despise, because they refuse to even think about what you've said?
I'm no shill. I just hate idiots in my country.
Which country? Isn't this board always fucking screaming about how the EU is some immigrant sanctuary? They sure probably are taking up those jobs.
You're right, many would argue that and they would be retarded.
But then again we are a country who has to adhere to our corporate overlords. If you're not against the wage gap, then I vote to just give them all right over all of our money and we just admit to the slaves we really are.
Unless you think trickle down actually works? I kek to that, a million times kek.
>beaners sign deal to get access to American market
>cheap labor in beanerland means cheap produce
>Americans continue to illegally hire beaners to work cheap on farms
>American market fucked for beaners because they are producing cheaply too because illegals
t. native drunk
Has there been a rational argument presented by /pol/ why we shouldn't let 11 million illegal immigrants stay?
The only response I get is
>wow, really, just wow
>those humans are illegal
>they don't work
their "rational" arguements are as follows:
>mexicans work so they will make the counry richer
not since they require more state benafits and since they raise unemployment by flooding the market withh more laborers
>they do jobs americans wont do
i can go into any ghetto in america and find you 100 black people, who will pick cotton, sing slave songs, call you master and let you call them niggers for 1000$ per hour. there is no job americans wont do, there are jobs they wont do for 8$ an hour.
other then that there is no debate over the 3 main subject you should be discussing:
1.keeping undesirables out.
most mexicans are not rapists and thieves, however you should have a system that roots them out and sends them back. even if you let in 100 million a year, make sure those 100mill are not rapists.
2.what is the correct immigration policy? how many should you be letting in and under which circumstanses? also, what do we you with the ones already here? how do you decide whogetts to stay? blanket amnesty will keep the criminals in...
3. the drug cartels are violent and should be kept out of american soil.
You clearly have no idea how NAFTA works if I am understanding your argument. NAFTA cut government subsidies given to the Mexican agricultural industry so the cost of their own produce skyrocketed. This was in order to establish factories for American industry and force Mexican farmers to provide cheap labor in those so we could have even cheaper products (meanwhile Mexican government gets money from said corporations).
This is simultaneously coupled with the shift from industry here to agriculture, hence all the beans working in our fields.
America produces most of our for, we don't bring it from Mexico.
NAFTA = America wins, and Mexico loses.
And fuck Canada, because your silly country doesn't even matter.
How will anyone debate with you when you say shit like:
>They have committed no crimes, only broken civil laws and regulations.
hurrrr they didn't do no crimes they just broked the law.
Your entire post is just bullshit. Your first three sentences are red herrings, that they are productive (maybe, you haven't shown that they are a net benefit), your retarded no crimes but broke the law statement. Then the argument that we should allow illegal immigration because helping to improve central/south america would be better, where you tacitly agree that illegal immigration should be stopped.
Finally you get to an actual argument on why no illegal immigrants, that it is "physically impossible", and your reason why is that it would cost 500 billion if you follow Trump's vague plan (so this in itself is not an argument against illegal immigrants, it is an argument against Trump's plan). But illegal immigration costs the government 100 billion per year, so even the quick two year deportations in Trump's plan will pay for itself quickly.
No, that's not what happened at all. I gave my rational argument; no one responded except for a guy who told me I needed "sources" so I laid out a few articles to talk about.... Of course, I got no response.
You and a few others now tell me my "sources" aren't really sources, but still refuse to bring anything to the table. I have fulfilled my obligation by laying out my argument and providing my sources as I saw fit. If you can't bring a counter-argument and and continue to just insult me instead I'll go ahead an conclude you don't have the intellectual capabilities to have a rational discussion.
It's a line of double think that permeates a lot of the leftists I encounter personally
>workers rights are highly important
>we should have an underclass of people paid less than what we deem is a livable (minimum) wage for our benefit
>they should also be incapable of reporting any mishaps at the workplace or abuses because of their illegal status
Or those who argue for amnesty
>look at all these taxes that we receive from illegals that they don't get back, its a net gain for the economy!
>we should actively hurt the economy by letting them receive the welfare benefits and making them legal citizens
>Americans wont take the jobs because they pay so low!
>we should make them Americans that have their accounts scrutinized by the IRS thereby competing themselves out of the market
>or proving our entire premise false
>many are paid in cash to avoid being sought by the IRS
>their only crime is being here nothing else (despite felonious tax evasion)
>US shifts from industry to agriculture
>Mexico shifts from agriculture to industry
>millions of illegal immigrants flood the US for work in agriculture
Shifting away from manufacturing towards agriculture is deindustrialization.
Big business won. Mexico won. The US lost.
You're right, we are not an industry based economy. We are an information and skill based one.
Of course we are going to deindustrialize, we don't want to deal with the shitty work and the shitty environmental repercussions.
And thanks to those millions of illegals, you're produce is affordable.
How again does the US lose?
If you'd rather be slaving away in some coke manufactory or some steel mill, be my fucking guest.
The US loses because there are tens of millions of citizens who don't have the skills or the capacity to thrive in a service economy. You forget that less than one in three Americans even has a 4-year degree.
Furthermore, most Americans own very little. They won't benefit from the higher profits that accompany outsourced manufacturing, because they don't own any stocks or bonds. All they have is their labor, and that is being slowly devalued, as jobs are outsourced and job competition is imported. So since manufacturing is leaving, agriculture is all that's left.
That's deindustrialization. It's fine if you don't want to work in a factory or a steel mill, but remember that there are tens of millions of people who have no better options, because they simply don't have the capacity for white collar work. Without steel mills and factories, they end up working at Walmart.