New First Aid kit thread

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Picking this one up next week to keep in my car/for when I go skiing

>two rolls of sports-tape
Good for when applying bandages
>natrium-chloride eyewater
>two rolls of gauze, 7.5cm x 4m
>piece of cloth that can be used to create whatever its called the thing that you can make to support a hanging arm
>nitril gloves
>small fabric balls for wound cleaning
>bandages in varying sizes
>burn gel
>scissors and tweezers
>adhesive bandages
>wound cleaning compound
>small splints for fingers, wrists and arms

>>676636
>Using Epi-pens on someone with
Should an Epi-pen be used on a penis that has been hard over 4 hours due to medicinal intake?

thank you in advance. You have about 53 minutes left to answer this.

>>676643
>piece of cloth that can be used to create whatever its called the thing that you can make to support a hanging arm
That would be Cravats (Triangle bandages) and the thing is called a sling

>small fabric balls for wound cleaning
I would suggest you use these only to clean minor wounds. With larger wounds, upon arrival to a medical facility (Hospital, trauma center, Stocked Ambulance) the wound will be cleaned thoroughly anyways.

>small splints for fingers, wrists and arms
I would add a larger splint. A standard sized SAM splint is 36' long (about a meter) and would work great for a leg splint

I would add a fair amount of 4x4 gauze pads (10-25) and a few more rolls of gauze. This is for smaller cuts, abrasions and the like. Things you are more likely to see in a camping trip or a minor car accident.

All in all, not a bad pre-made kit.

>>676644
Uh, no. Go to a hospital. Have them deal with it. You already messed up taking in that medicine. Do not add more shit to the pile by sticking your dick when it is full of blood.

>>676648
This is stuff that will be used to treat smaller injuries I come across at the mountain where I go skiing. Larger injuries will have to be taken care of by the ski patrol at work who have access to way more kit than I could carry in my backpack, in particular vacuum-splints, oxygen and those things. It may also be used for temporary treatment after car accidents, as I drive a lot on heavily-populated roads during the winter here, and accidents do happen quite a lot.

I have been thinking about adding more bandages, pads and rolls, and if you think that might be necessary then I'll get some

I'll consider the split for the leg, but not sure what the necessity would be as an injury that would require a splint for the leg would also most likely require an ambulance. Out skiing that would mean the ski patrol show up with more suited kit, a scoop and a sled before transporting the person to the ambulance pick-up point, while in a car accident the ambulance would just get there by itself.

>>676655
I have 0 experience with ski patrol, so I cannot comment on how quickly they respond.

The splint consideration is there because for only slightly more space than the arm splint you can have something that will work for legs, arms, and can be cut (then wrapped before use) to be used as a smaller splint.

Yeah, maybe 10-25 is too many. But in my experience, the 4x4 pad is the most versatile item in any first aid kit of this size.

>>676658
Where I'm at - pretty quick, I can assure you.
After all, I am one

Had a girl today, ski teacher, who had been trying to help get a snowmobile belonging to the compant that manages the teachers unstuck and gotten her leg sucked in with the belt... clear fracture with slight wrong position

Also had four broken wrists yesterday... beginner snowboarders & hard surfaces don't mix

>>676663
Ouch. I understand the second, every week there would be a new Skateboarding kid and they would always have wrist problems.

>>676663
I'd concur. Biggest delay is hearing there is need rather than response time

Source: has used ski patrol and gotten the 'ride' on the toboggan.

Oh great, now there's two First Aid threads just because two EMTs got in a hissy fit and one of them decided to take his ball and go home.

>>676672
I wasn't one of the two EMT's over there who got butt tickled. I genuinely want to help people.

Okay bro, hope you're here.

There's 2 questions.

1. What is the physical fitness test for being an EMT like?

2. If my budget is like 50 bucks, what should I build or should I buy a pre-made?

>>676819

1) Little to no fitness test. Be able to deadlift a fatass patient on a stretcher. That's about it.

2) Build. Unless your needs fit specifically with what the kit was intended for, it is better to build.

>>676636
>epi

Lol. you can't get it without a doctors prescription, or stealing from work.

I hate Ricky Rescues that want to carry the whole box with them. The longer I do this the less I carry. You're lucky if I have a pen to write with at this point. Next year I may not care whether or not I wear pants.

Here's mine:
>2x roller gauze
>2x triangle bandage
>2x ace bandage
>band aids
>tweezers
>nitrile gloves

I can do most things with this and what resources I can find around me.

SAM splints are nice but bulky.
I'm not gone long enough to need antiseptic (usually just a day).

>>676644
According to the idiot RN in the last thread it should be.

>>676839
Yeah, I feel you.
Not bad, a solid minimalist kit to be sure. Is it in a waterproof container/bad/sack?

+1 for not wearing pants. Silkies FTW.

>>676844
I keep it ziplocs right now till I find something the right size but not too bulky.

>>676846
Fair enough.
When in doubt, Freezer Gallon, press the air out.

>>676839
I almost never wear pants. I telecommute, and teleconference.
Remember that y'all the next time you are in a teleconference.

>>676854
I have never had the opportunity to have a teleconference. But I will not be wearing pants when I do.

Alright homies i'm talking venom. Some horrible bug/reptile has fucked me. I have been stung/bitten. As was said in the previous thread "sucking out the poison" was for movies only. Then there was light discussion about whether to TQ an extremity or disperse it through the body.

What do.

>>676965
If it doesn't look bad, take a lot of benadryl. If it looks bad, go to the fucking doctor.

>>676965
A tourniquet will only damage the limb. Do not use one when bitten or stung.

Sometimes, depending on what bites you, there's only one option. You sit down on the ground with you feet in front of you. Now put you head down between your legs, and kiss your ass goodbye.

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Bought this premade kit and added some stuff. It has:
-Gloves
-Antiseptic Creams
-Wound Wipes
-Eye Irrigation
-Some Meds (paracetamol, ibuprofen)
-Gauze
-band aids and some larger patches

I only bought this kit for a small hike i did a while back, but i want to add to it. I need something for a 5-7 day /out/ trip where im not close to any civilization. What do you recommend OP?

>>677032
Get to four rolls of Gauze. You can use 'Primed' Gauze which is rolled gauze that is vacuum packed. It's smaller, dense like a hokey puck, but it's also in water tight packaging.
Gauze if your best friend.

Get a small box of 4x4 gauze pads, those things are great for cleaning wounds, packing and placing over minor abrasions.

Get a water proof container for it. A Ziploc bag will work, or a dedicated first aid container will too. But most of the important items for trauma are easily damaged in water.

Get one more triangle bandage. One is enough for an arm sling, but with two you can stabilize the arm to the chest. Or get a shemagh and use it for the stabilization.

I would also buy a box of XL nitrile gloves, and get used to putting them on. And taking them off without contaminating your hands. A box of 50 is about $4 USD.

>>676965
I have no idea man. Snake bites aren't my thing, and there are too many contradicting opinions and schools of thought.
My best advice is to not panic, keep your heart rate low, and seek help. This is not something you can slap a bandage on and be fine for the rest of the trip.

>>676838
It depends. Usually it's like OP said "Be able to deadlift a fatass patient on a stretcher." I used to work with one volunteer/paid EMT who needed a crutch to get around. It was funny watching patients' eyes bug out when they saw him lurching toward them.

However some municipalities have Departments of Public Safety rather than separate PD, Fire, and EMS. Some DPSs have all their responders cross-trained as police, firefighters, and EMTs; so they have to meet strict physical standards.

other faggot lied and never rated it
i have a standard motorbike first aid kit in my bag should do the trick in most cases.
> sterile bandage strips (10 cm x 5 m): 2 pc
> sterile compressa (6 x 6 cm/100 sheet): 1 pc
> hand sanitizer tissues: 4 pc
> gloves: 1 pair
> adhesive tape (1,25 cm x 5 m): 1 roll
> scissors (stainless steel, 110-150 mm): 1 pc
> iodine (or something like that) (30 ml): 1 pc
> bandaids (6 x 10 cm): 2 pc
> hygenic facemask (for cpr): 1 pc
> surgical mask: 1 pc
> first aid in pictures: 1 pc
> inventory: 1 pc

>>676636
No list to post, but a general question.

In your professional opinion, is patriotnurse GTG or full of it? Seems like she knows her shite, but I've never gone beyond Red Cross certification and Combat Lightsaber in the Army.

If not, what / whom do you recommend for "unconventional wisdom" regarding ditch medicine?

Thanks in advance

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>>676965
As with most things in life, the answer is that it depends; there is no red pill for most topics. It depends on the exact species that envenomated, time to get help, proximity to medical aid, venom potency, animal age/time of year, and wound location and depth. Obviously less venom can be injected into a knuckle than in a thigh muscle. I'll refer to snake bites, but many things also apply to other animals.

General rule of thumb is to avoid tourniquets (TQs) in an envenomation if at all possible. Damaged tissue needs oxygen to survive and eventually heal. A TQ might cause an unnecessary amputation. Many times snakes only make 'dry' bites and try to save venom if possible for something they can eat. Venom takes energy to produce.

Realistically the goal is not to let it circulate, which is why you should stay calm. Kill whatever caused the envenomation and take it to the hospital so they can identify it for antivenin purposes. Stop moving if you can, to decrease heart rate. Keep the affected limb lower than the heart, and apply direct pressure to an artery above the wound.

But since you asked about letting it circulate: The human body has a volume of distribution of approximately 5 liters, so letting it circulate theoretically might dilute the venom to a lower concentration in the wound and surrounding tissues, leading to less damage. For most envenomations though, the mindset is to try to avoid a TQ and use less drastic measures, unless it's extremely venomous or access to medical treatment will be prolonged. You'd hate to find out that you lost your leg to a TQ, because you spazzed out over a garter snake bite. See >>668243 for how hard it is to ID a snake while sitting calmly in front of a computer.

>tl;dr: Think of tourniquets for envenomations as a last resort instead of a go-to treatment.

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>>677478
Snake bites can be highly variable in appearance and effect. Venoms are complex cocktails of proteins with effects that can be primarily neurotoxic, primarily cytotoxic, or mixed effect. If exact species is unknown, even closely related species can have radically different venom effects. So YMMV, and a TQ can do more harm than good.

If bitten by a primarily neurotoxic snake (generally an elapid, like mambas), tissue necrosis is rare. You'll might have any or all of the following effects: muscle paralysis, nerve paralysis, and muscle tightness (tetany). At the hospital,they can put you on a ventilator if needed to keep you breathing while your body clears the venom. You might walk out of the hospital in 2 weeks with nothing but a cool story. Alternatively, the only reason you might end up losing a limb (absent infection) is that you cut off the blood supply with a TQ.

Primarily cytotoxic (usually hemotoxic) snakes (generally a viperid, like rattlesnakes) or those with combination venom effects can cause tissue necrosis. Depending on variables, you might not have any necrosis (due to dry bite), or necrosis that leads to a partial or full amputation of the limb. Thus the TQ might lead to an amputation of a limb that never needed to occur.

Ultimately, you are the one on scene and have to make the hard decisions. All you can do is arm yourself with information about the animals you'll realistically encounter, and make the best decision possible when the time comes.

Sorry for the long posts. While the question seems simple, it's a complex issue with so many variables.

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>>677480 is a continuation of >>677478

>>677380
It's not bad for a one person kit. Like a broken record, add a few things of Gauze, and more Gloves.

EMS tip- If you don't want to have blood on your hands, double up on the gloves. Gloves are like Murphy's little assholes- they always break when you need them to stay together the most.

>>677471
I personally don't like her because she tore MainePrepper's heart up and that didn't help him one iota, but she seems like her medical knowledge would be gtg.
+1 for CLS, it is a good system. What year did you get the cert?

>>677478
From my background- it is safer to loose the limb than it is to let the venom circulate and hope it will be less effective diluted. Life> Limb.
With a TQ and modern medicine, the time to loose a limb has far surpassed the short window it used to be. Now, it is not unheard of for someone to have a limb cut off from circulation and 8 hours later reach the OR, to then regain full use of it.

>>677652
Oh yes, MainePrepper. Thought he was on convalescent leave for his head? Get well soon. Good to hear she has her technical knowledge down, though.
CLS 1998? Taegu, Korea; ETS'd 2000. Now just the kids boo-boos and some occasional light triage on the livestock.

>>676965
>>677478
The method recommended in the book is that you don't cut off circulation to the extremity, using tourniquets for venom is not medically sound.

>>677652
>It's not bad for a one person kit. Like a broken record, add a few things of Gauze, and more Gloves.

hmm i was hoping you will say something small the kit is packed almost full a couple of pills or some quick clot powder or bandaids might still fit in there but an other roll of gauze will probably not.

>>677652
You don't lose the limb from the tourniquet specifically, you just lose the limb from the venom being trapped in it.

Do not apply a traditional tourniquet. You can apply a lymphatic tourniquet, which only excludes surface venous flow and lymphatic flow. It should be a wide material, and loose enough to slide 2 fingers under.

Treatment is to get to an ER as soon as possible.

About 25% of venomous snake bites are dry bites.

Several thousand people are bit by venomous snaked every year. About 5 die.

In North America rattlesnakes cause the most deaths. Copperheads are almost never fatal, but account for the most bites.

>>677745
Quickclot is really only called for when you have a Severe bleed, where the blood loss is a more important issue than the limb itself.

>>677722
Nice, but I would suggest you get a refresher course just because CLS has come a long ass way since 1998.

>>677761
I'll try to not cause a shitshow that the other thread was but do not apply a tourniquet to a snake bite wound if you can get medical attention at all. It's a veeeery bad idea, and given that the survival and full recovery rate are pretty high, so it's a bad idea to lose a limb to it.

>>677921
Okay, I guess I will default to the knowledge presented here. No TQ's for a snakebite.

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Okay I asked on the old threat but well...
What do you think of my FAK ? I use it when I go /out/, usually 3 - 4 nights in the wild.
Any sugestion to improve it ?
It contains :
On the outside pouch :
_Survival Blanket
_Notebook with my name, adress, alergies, blood type and other important informations.
_Pen

On the inside :
_Water Purification Tablets
_Bandaids (many sizes)
_Antiseptic Spray
_Bandages x2
_Gauze Compress x4
_Alcoholic Compress x3
_ "Sos Burn" Compress x3
_Surgical Tape
_Eletrical Tape

_Tweezers
_Nail cutter
_Small scissors (I have a bigger one with my leatherman)

>>678837
This is a really good example of an /out/ first aid kit. I wouldn't have 3 sets of the burn compress, but everything else is GTG.
+1 Anon

>>678939
Thanks man. I'll get rid of one of these burn compress, I definitely don't need 3

>>676636
I need to put together a first aid kit for my boat. It's an old 16 foot deck boat that I use on freshwater lakes for fishing mostly.

More likely injuries would be cuts, scrapes, getting hooked, and getting finned. I probably should keep some OTC medicine for motion sickness, heartburn, diarrhea, and some pain killers.

Possible serious injuries could be concussions, serious cuts/gashes, burns from a fuel fire, or broken bones. I'm not sure what to keep on hand for situations like those. It could take an hour to get to a hospital depending on what lake we're on and where we are on the lake -- we'd have to get the boat back to where we parked the truck and then drive the injured person to the nearest hospital, or drive the boat across the lake to where an ambulance is parked.

>>679399
I would suggest a lot of tiny rolls of gauze, so you can immobilized hooks in their place. You generally don't want to remove a hook in field, as it could cause more tissue damage.

Rehydration items too, and sun burn creams (Both Sun tan lotion and Aloe Vera for once burnt)
Concussions- keep the in the rest postion.
Cuts/Gahses- get a quality TQ (or two) and learn how to place it. Some rolled gauze, and maybe even on QuickClot if you think it will be a terrible bleed.
Burns- You want to rinse off the wound with water, then wrap it in a wet bandage. Get to hospital ASAP if the burn is much larger than your hand (with all fingers together, but not a closed fist) otherwise they might have internal body heating issues.
Broken bones- Gauze rolls and a Splint. SAM is king here, as the Cardboard splints will wash away in water.

Get a Space blanket, and if someone is loosing blood, suddenly becomes cold on a hot day, or general symptoms of Stroke, place them on their back, legs elevated and wrap their body in the blanket. Give them water, and if you have it, a little bit of gatorade (About 1 gal of water to one small gatorade is good)

>>679574
Is OP

>>679574
Thanks for the suggestions man. I'm not too worried about hook removal, I'm.. er.. 'somewhat experienced' with in-field hook removal. I hadn't even considered dehydration, hypothermia, stroke, or heat stroke though.

For most of the major injuries I suggested (concussions, broken bones, deep cuts) I was thinking about bad collisions with another boat or PWC or something. Hopefully my boat will never be involved in something like that but if I ever come across an emergency situation like that on the water then I'd like to at least be able to offer enough assistance to keep someone from bleeding out long enough to get them to an ambulance or something.

>>679587
Yeah, my main thoughts with Boats is always in the Sea. What happens when you run out of juice on your boat in the middle of the day, in the middle of the ocean, on the equator? You bake.
But yeah, for a lake, it is easy enough to swim to shore. And I have had some experience with in field hook removal too. That's why I stream fish now lol. I still have a scar on my butt.

>>679590
Yeah, I get where you're coming from. I mean, I'm in TX so the winters aren't THAT cold here but if someone gets drenched then there is still a real risk of hypothermia, having a towel to dry off with and a blanket + space blanket to wrap up in once you shed the wet clothes could be really helpful. Just last week I was out on the lake with a couple of buddies and it was around 55F with 15-20 MPH winds and gusts up to 25MPH. The waves were white capping and one washed over the bow of my boat and completely soaked the guy that was sitting up front. Luckily it warmed up to like 70F pretty quickly so he wasn't at risk of hypothermia but if it had been colder we would've had to go back in pretty quickly after that.

On the other hand, it DOES get very hot here, I've been out on the lake in 100F+ degree weather and it was terrible, there's a real possibility of heat stroke in weather like that. I always have a big bottle of 50spf sunscreen cream and carry plenty of water in the summer but it wouldn't hurt to bring a few gatorades as well.

>>676965
It's different depending on what bit you, but instead of a TQ you use a compression bandage starting at the most proximal end of the limb and go all the way to the bite. It's a good idea to mark where the bite is so EMTs can do there thing there without taking off the bandage if they need to.

As the others have said, the limb elevated (above the heart) if possible, stay calm and keep breathing, drinking water etc. Also try to kill and capture the thing that tagged you and take it out with you.

If you need to tab out on your own then you'll want to take it easy, nice and slow. If possible you're better off calling for help (distress signal/sat phone/mobile, not screaming) and waiting, but if it's not an option then do as described above.

A lot of it in my experience is a headgame. Try not to despair and just keep yourself calm, breathe normal, remind yourself you're gonna be fine, because for a lot of bites you probably will be if you keep it together.

Just to wrap up also, TQs should really only be used if the limb is pretty much fucked anyway or if bleeding is a priority over saving the limb.

>>676839
>>2x roller gauze
I always have cheesecloth for making coffee
>>2x triangle bandage
I have cheesecloth and electrical tape, same thing
>>2x ace bandage
see above
>>band aids
see above, i also carry a couple bandanas
>>tweezers
multitool with plyers
>>nitrile gloves
always have in abundance as a chemist

besides this, I have some isopropyl alcohol wipes in saran wrap with duct tape to keep it all together in one spot. haven't needed to touch it in years

so it's pretty clear that this has never struck me as a high priority, first aid and all. I never take tylenol or anything at home so i don't see a need for it when /out/

what would >>676636 say I'm surely missing and could really use? Gonna be going out west soon (rockys).... anything i should buy for snake bites or am I pretty much a deadman if a rattler gets me?

i was thinking about quick clot, how much does this go for, and is it just a meme?

haha thanks for any replies, it's good to be prepared

I'm a multinight backpacking /out/er

>>679747
>cheesecloth
>chemist

Do you not understand Sterile? Plus, cheesecloth is a horrible substitute for gauze.
So, I would add some gauze rolls.
Quickclot is for severe bleeds, where controlling the wound itself isn't as much an issue as blood loss is. It is worth the money to buy one or, very rarely, two, but you should buy and use gauze first.
Moleskin, for your feet. Rehydration items (electrolyte powders) and what someone said above for snakes, I really have no clue anymore.

>>679752
I guess getting some gauze couldn't hurt

I usually bring powder gatorade or something
i'm going to google moleskin, i can't remember what that is

thanks buddy

>>679756
Yeah, also, do you keep this in a waterproof bag/container? Something easily accessible is preferred.

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>>679399
>getting hooked

Got hooked in the hand twice last summer. Big high quality 3/0 crankbait hooks too. It is awful.

I don't agree with the "don't remove it right away" approach. These hooks have a lot of microscopic reactive junk covering them from fish mouths, manufacturing, etc. They also drag into the wound more debris from your clothes/skin. The longer foreign material like that is embedded in tissue the more your body will react to it with inflammation and edema which = pain = no more fishing.

Best way to get it out quickly imo is with a sterile and extremely sharp thin blade like a scalpel or double edge razor. Make a single straight cut down to the barb so it has a path and you can back the hook out. Wash out the wound and steri strip it closed. It will heal very quickly this way and it's usually the way to go.

>>679765
Now just imagine getting that in your mouth numbnuts.

>>679757
yea, I might make a point to get everything into one of those little plastic dividers. i have one for a tackle box, it'd be good to have a first aid one too if i can find one small enough.

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>>679747
>>>tweezers
>multitool with plyers

Not going to go well. Nothing can really replace good needle nose tweezers innawoods. Multitool can't pick up a 2mm Ixodes tick precisely by the mouthparts so it doesn't regurgitate Borrelia and Anaplasma into your blood, or dig out a splinter embedded in the bottom of your foot. A tiny $5 tool can keep you Lyme-free and mobile, no reason not to have it.

>>679897
He's got a point you know.
Though that is less first aid, and a little more personal care/hygiene

>>679779
first take out almost my whole nervous system and it probably wouldn't be that bad.

>>678776
B..b..ut the coghlans snake bite kit comes with a lymphatic turniquet.
Are you saying an outdoor company with the the prestige and reputation of Coghlans is wrong?!?!

>>679996
Yes. Yes I am.

>>679897
just use any knife blade...
even if the stinger breaks into your skin it will come out and won't cause much problems compared to the diseases you can get if you don't remove a tick fast enough.

>>680006
>>679996
Current recommendations include applying a lymphatic tourniquet if possible. This is generally only for very venomous snakes, not typically found in North America.

>>679765
why not just simply turn it out? unless stuck in a bone that is the simplest way.

>>676838
>deadlifting pt.
>not having electric cot that pulls up at the press of a button
>not having fire retards do the lifting

>>681064
Well, I can't always get the Hose monkeys to do it for me. And sometimes even when I can, I don't want to lol. Some of them can't even backboard someone right.
But not all companies or counties have the electric cot yet. Mine was only testing them out with the paramedic unit when I left. They are still very new in the States.

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Can someone please rate this? Preferably someone with training?

In the small pill bag i have some ibu and aspirin. Other single use pill packets are claritin, caffeine pill, emergency electrolyte replacement, histaprin, potable aqua tabs (back up for filter), and pepto. Everything else should be discernable from the picture.
My intended us is backpacking but I throw this kit in with other gear when hunting, fishing, mountain biking etc. I also bring it for certain tasks at work if need be.
I plan to take at the very least a red cross first aid class, or maybe a wilderness first aid class through rei. However, everything I have in the kit right now I am confident with.
Any suggestions/additions/things to remove?

>>681681
there are some nice practical ideas there but it's more of a convenience kit than first aid.

lots of stuff to reduce / prevent itch and irritation and pain less weight dedicated to save someones life.

still kinda like it.

>>681681
Draw an invisible line in between the moleskin and he band aids, and have it run down to the bag.
Double everything to the right of it.
And consider everything on the left of it on a "trial run' Where you should go /out/ a few times to gauge how necessary the items are for your comfort.

That being said, there are some of those 'comfort' items that may always be in the bag even if you don't use them regularly, and that is okay.

>>681706
well to be honest it shouldn't be called a first-aid kit
let's face it he is a hundred times more likely to get use out off his kit then i'm from mine. >>677380

i'm thinking about putting together a wellness pouch like that too that would go in my backpack separate from the first aid kit. it would have shit like sunscreen painkillers and anti-histamines and tick removal stuff in it.

>>681764
Fair enough.

>>681764
So you will have two kits?
A "wellness" pouch for all of the minor items, and then a FAK?
That's perfect. Means if you get into a bad situation, all of your wellness items wont end up on the forest floor while you search for your gauze.

>>681895
it has more to do with ease of packing and sorting stuff.
the first aid kit goes into my survival bag but not the welness stuff that only goes into my backpack or camp gear or if i go on a trip or fishing or anything.

>>681919
That makes a lot of sense.