TRAIL MEALS

>>656976
http://www.backpackingchef.com/

I'm a fan of the site. They have a lot of shit to dehydrate in it. I don't own a dehydrator, but I've made a few of their recipes. Easy on the trail, cheaper and better than those storebought backpacking meals

>>656976
You can dehydrate a ton of mushroom, veggies, and fruits. Then make all sorts of soups and stews. Add dough balls and make dumplings. You can make your own herbal teas too. You can dehydrate chicken, turkey, and fish.

>>656981
Thanks! I also got a book, written by the same guy, has all the same recipes and photos, as far as I can tell. It is definitely great info, I just wanted to see what else /out/ could come up with, since backpackingchef's recipe list is a little limited for what I want to do.

>>656987
I appreciate the help.

I'm looking more for meal ideas though, than general information. Just favorite beef dishes that may work from a pemmican base for the trail.

>>656994
I wish i was more of a improvising cook, especially when backpacking. I'm a protein bar, peanut butter, beef jerky kind of guy. But, I noticed backpacking chef they have instructions on dehydrating as well as recipes. So if you're a decent cook normally, it shouldn't be too hard to adjust your recipes to work with dehydrated foods and just use water.

>>657002
I wouldn't say I'm a great cook, but I like what what I make. The only issue is that I tend to make a lot of pan fried and sauteed foods, and those don't translate well to dehydrated because oils go rancid when dry stored (why jerky should be lean). I'm trying to find out now if there's a way to pack oils into vacuum bags and just add them on trail, but I still wouldn't be frying anything (I'm going BIB, because I won't necessarily be able to clean my Sierra cup every day if I'm away from a water source).

>>656976
bring bullion cubes

hell bring a stick of butter

>>657037
If I vacuum packed butter, would it hold at travel temperatures for six months? Maybe if I rendered it?

>>657041
That's called "ghee", google it, and yes.

File: Dehydrated Vegetables.jpg (3MB, 4777x5000px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 4777x5000px

>>656994
>I'm looking more for meal ideas though, than general information. Just favorite beef dishes that may work from a pemmican base for the trail.

Oh, I see now. Do you have any additives in your pemmican like berries or something? I'll assume not for now. General recipe info is just that though. Soups, Stews, Breaded Pemmican, Fried Pemmican, Pemmican Gravy, Pemmican Biscuits/Rolls,

Check out this video series on most everything about pemmican.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_vLuMobHCI
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr2d4As312LulcajAkKJYw

I have a cabinet full of dehydrated vegetables and mushrooms from my garden/store. I use them with just about everything. I even have powdered dehydrated stuff to use as seasonings or as an additive to flour for baking. Adding mushroom powder, green bell pepper powder, pumpkin powder and onion powder to biscuit dough recipes really gives them flavor and heartiness. You can do the same thing with the pemmican, just crumble it up and put it right into the dough while mixing.

Here's some pics of my own stuff with examples of some of the stuff I'm talking about and what it looks like. (reposted on this and other boards)

If you need to hydrate stuff for the next meal, put it into a warmed up thermos and add boiling water to it. Carry it around while hiking and when it is finally meal time everything will be hydrated. Carrots and mushrooms do really well like this. Seaweeds and pumpkin chunks don't do well so hydrate those 5-10 mins before making the meal.

I make baggies of powders and vegetable chunks for use in baking and stews/soups. Ramen without the flavor packet is great for this too when /out/.

>>657012
Rancidity is caused by oxygen so vacuum sealing fatty foods works really well to help prevent it.

>>657048
Awesome, thanks! That increased what I can make a hundred-fold!

>>657049
Just plain pemmican. Not only does it increase that variety of things I can use it in, but will also help it keep longer.

Thanks for the links, I'll check those out!

I figured that removing the air would probably be enough, but since I won't be able to just run to the store like I do now (I may be as much as two weeks away from a drop point), it's just incredibly important that nothing goes bad. I was even considering boiling bags of things like butter after they're sealed to guarantee they're pasteurized in the bag.

Anyone know if I should get desiccant packs for the dried food bags?

>>657059
>Awesome, thanks! That increased what I can make a hundred-fold!

If you keep it out of light, have it properly made, and have it properly vacuum sealed, ghee should last at least 3 months without a problem when opened and 9 months unopened. If you are opening up 1 container all the time then oxygen will get in and make it rancid. You may want to separate it into multiple containers so that you only have 1 open that you are using and the rest is quite oxygen-free still.

Treat it like you treat olive oil.

>>657059
>Anyone know if I should get desiccant packs for the dried food bags?

All my stuff is vacuum sealed. Any large pack you are opening and closing a lot should have a desiccant pack in it. This is because ambient humidity at the time of the bag/container being opened will get inside. Since the dehydrated food is lacking so much moisture, it can readily take on moisture.

One neat thing is that super dehydrated foods added into normally dehydrated foods will suck up some of the moisture in the container and you get a more even dryness between both.

I use a break bleeder and small/wide mouth mason jar vacuum sealers to vacuum seal my stuff without the need for electric.

>>657065
Sounds great! I'll probably make individual clarified butter packets for each meal that I'll need it for, so if it'll last six months or more in a vacuum bag in a drop box it'll be perfect!

I just found this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5Gc85akLsi0

>>657070
I'll be packing whole meals together rather than separate ingredients, so I won't need to worry about resealing them, but I guess my concern was more about any moisture still in the dehydrated food being enough for it to spoil. If you're saying that it shouldn't be an issue then I won't worry about it. I just don't know how much moisture it takes to cause spoilage.

That break bleeder is an awesome idea! Did you need any special adapters or a vacuum pressure gauge to make it work for canning jars?

In case anyone is following this for trail meal ideas, I've added beef stroganoff to the list of things pemmican should go good in.

File: Brake Bleeder Vacuum.jpg (1MB, 2044x2296px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2044x2296px

>>657109
>moisture still in the dehydrated food

If the food is properly dehydrated it won't have the moisture levels to go bad. Some of my stuff is over a year old and still good. The only time I noticed a change was with the Hungarian Wax peppers I dehydrated and didn't vacuum seal. It was amazing for 3 months then changed in odor to that of what you expect to smell from store bought red pepper flakes. It was a distinct change too. The vacuum sealed stuff didn't have this problem.

>That break bleeder is an awesome idea! Did you need any special adapters or a vacuum pressure gauge to make it work for canning jars?

You only need the brake bleeder, which comes with various adapters, none of which I used. I just inserted the tube into the tube of the line that goes into the sealers and twist tied them in place.

Tube:
http://www.amazon.com/FoodSaver-FAX12-000-Accessory-Hose-Clear/dp/B00T699C14/

Vacuum Sealers for Jars:
http://www.amazon.com/FoodSaver-T03-0023-01-Wide-Mouth-Jar-Sealer/dp/B00005TN7H
http://www.amazon.com/FoodSaver-T03-0006-02P-Regular-Mouth-Jar-Sealer/dp/B0000CFFS6

Brake Bleeder:
http://www.harborfreight.com/automotive-motorcycle/brakes/brake-bleeder-and-vacuum-pump-kit-69328.html

However, I found that the handle on the brake bleeder was utter crap so I removed it, and put an over sided keyring on it with some vinyl tubing. (pic). The reason I use a brake bleeder instead of the actual non-electric device is because it has a gauge on it. I seal all my stuff to just over 20Hg (20 inches of mercury). That seems to be a much stronger seal than my crappy cheap motor-driven vacuum sealer.

With those jar sealers, always use a jar ring on the jar after you have sealed them. Make sure the jar lid and jar rim are clean. You may need to slightly wet the rubber rim of the jar sealer to get a good seal. You may also need to stack more than one jar lid in order to get a good seal with some jar types. Just remove the extra lids when done.

>>657118
Absolutely fantastic information! Thank you for taking the time to share. Good to know that I'm just being paranoid. I'll make sure everything is fully dry before bagging it, and I'll look into getting jars and a bleeder when I get back from the trail in fall.

File: DSCN2166a.jpg (1MB, 3072x1536px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 3072x1536px

>>657126
>I'll make sure everything is fully dry before bagging it

Since you are making stuff you'll not be snacking on right out of the container, you can dehydrate them until they are cracker dry (10% or less moisture content usually). You then have the option of powdering them in a mortar and pestle, grain mill, or coffee grinder. Hydrating cracker-dry foods is still easy, it just isn't that good for light snacking, but you can still snack on them.

Sometimes letting a piece of carrot or seaweed hydrate in your mouth before chewing it up can stave off hunger for a long time.

>>657129
Thanks! I figure I'll be starting the day with a cup of coffee, tea or cider and then snacking on pemmican on the trail until I set camp for the evening and using the remainder of the pemmican for whatever dehydrated meal I grab out of my bag. So I don't plan of having a lot different bags open, but I want variety in the dinners so it's not so monotonous. I may also grab trail mix or snack bars when I'm going into town to get my drop boxes.

Aside from biscuits and breads, what might I want to powder vegetables for? Any other ideas for pemmican based beef dishes?

>>657150
>Aside from biscuits and breads, what might I want to powder vegetables for? Any other ideas for pemmican based beef dishes?

One teaspoon full can make a good cupful of soup stock. Just bring it to a boil and steep like tea. Think of it like a powered vegetable version of a bouillon cube. Just add salt to taste. Anything you use bouillon cubes for you can use this with. You can make sauces with them too, from savory to spicy.

Google, "powdered vegetables recipes".

>Any other ideas for pemmican based beef dishes?

You can further dehydrate Parmesan, Asiago, and/or Romano cheeses then powder them and vacuum pack it into individual recipe packets or whatever you are doing. Unopened these can last a very long time. You can use these as a seasoning as they are fairly strong flavored when compared to more common cheeses. Just hydrate them accordingly (like you would for those macaroni-n-cheese packets).

Have you made pemmican before and what recipe are you using? There are many different "modern" recipes that are not suited for longevity, unlike traditional pemmican.

Also, you make want to experiment with the last (#1) egg preservation method shown here,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUYgguMz1qI

>>657180
Okay, great! I eat a lot of "Linux soup". It's carrots, onions, garlic, potatoes and turnips ('root' vegetables! Bad joke, I know). Aside from some type of meat and fat, which in this case would both be from pemmican, I don't add anything else. Do you have a recommendation for dried veggie powder that would go good with that?

I don't remember where I got the recipe originally, but it was just an equal weight of dried beef and rendered tallow. It turned out slightly burnt-tasting, either because I dried it in the oven or because I forgot to presoak the heart before I dried it.

Cheeses are a good idea. I'll have to find out if it would be hard to make a white sauce from all dry ingredients.

Two year egg storage... holy crap. He doesn't mention though, if he was using washed or fresh eggs. Kind of sucks that it's a federal crime to sell fresh eggs in the US. It make them hard to come by.

File: DSCN2391.webm (3MB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 640x480px

>>657197
>if he was using washed or fresh eggs

Doesn't matter when hydrated lime is involved.

>Do you have a recommendation for dried veggie powder that would go good with that?

Spice mix: 1 part cumin powder, 1 part cayenne pepper powder, 2 parts black pepper powder (I use this on most everything that needs some pungency.)

Veggie powder mixes:

A: 1 part garlic powder, 1 part onion powder, 2 parts pumpkin powder

B: 1 part garlic powder, 1 part onion powder, 2 parts green bell pepper powder

C: 1 part garlic powder, 1 part onion powder, 2 parts mushroom powder

D: 1 part garlic powder, 1 part onion powder, 2 parts tomato powder

E: 1 part mushroom powder, 2 parts broccoli powder

Mix A is good for sauce thickening
Mix B is great for any meat dish
Mix C is good for white sauces
Mix D is good for red sauces
Mix E is good for cheesy sauces

Powders:

-Pumpkin: aka "pumpkin flour" great for replacing a portion of flour in your wheat flour recipes and great for adding body to soups and stews. Google "pumpkin flour" recipes.
-Green Bell Pepper: adds amazing flavor to just about anything.
-Spicy Pepper: I prefer Hungarian Wax. When you want spice this is great for both spice and flavor.
-Portobello Mushroom (pizza mushroom) [Agaricus bisporus]: adds nutritional value to anything without adding overpowering flavor.
-Oyster Mushroom [Pleurotus ostreatus]: great for adding a mush stronger mushroom flavor to things.
-Tomato: A little can go a long way for flavoring. Try using heirloom varieties.

I recommend getting a cheap grain mill like,

http://www.amazon.com/ABC-Cork-Victoria-Traditional-Grain/dp/B001D6KETC
http://www.amazon.com/Corona%C2%AE-Corn-Grain-Mill-Hopper/dp/B00838YC5A

Which does a course grind for cornmeal. It works well for dried veggies like the peppers in this video. For a finer powder, use an electric coffee grinder or expensive stone plate flour mill or the a stone plate for the Corona/Victoria mill,

http://www.nazko.com/corona_stone_kit.html

>>657369
I really appreciate the time you've put into your replies. I'm excited to try those veggie powders, it will be nice to have some variety. I'm going to save this all so I have it for when I start prepping everything on Monday. Thanks again!

OP instead of butter carry coconut oil.
Fat is literally the best calorie to weight food there is.
Coconut oil keeps perfectly fine without refrigeration.

Someone mentioned ghee in this thread, ghee isnt just butter, its CLARIFIED butter, that means its had the milk solids removed, also, making it yourself can be pretty dangerous, long term storage of canned or vac packed butter is extremely susceptible to botchelisim, which im assuming you really dont want. you should be able to find commercially packed tubes of ghee in indian supermarkets or asian grocers.

Dehydrated mashed sweet potato and mashed pumpkin are two of my favourites, plenty of tutorials on the youtube, dehydrated milk is good for adding creamy-ness and calories, you can go dehydrated coconut milk if your worried about spoilage, again, available at asian grocers.

A guy above me said coconut oil and this op speaks the truth, coconut oil is kinda one of those miracle ingredients in terms of its usability, fry in it, add it to thinks to up the calorie content, use it in baking by crumbling it through flour, basically you can use it in place of butter and oil in any of their traditional applications. im fairy certain you could just pack it in a lightweight screw top plastic container and have it be fine.

Just off the top of my head, heres some meal ideas for you op. Minestrone soup, dehydrated root veg, dehydrated mushrooms, peas, tinned tomatoes, some sort of tiny pasta that cooks quick, maybe cous cous, bullion cube and a spoon full of pemmican for meaty fatty-ness.

Chinese beef and vegetables, go for dehydrated broccoli, carrots, cauliflower, snow peas, make a sauce from soy, honey, pepper, siracha and whatever else you want, vac pac it in a little sachet or store it in a little bottle, rehydrate vegetables with your daily pemmican ration, add sauce, combine with some sort of dehydrated rice or noodle, maybe rice noodles cos they basically need to hydrate as far as cooking goes.

>>657992
I keep a huge container on my counter, it's been fine for months, coconut oil doesn't require refrigeration whatsoever.
You do want an airtight container though.

File: canning-butter-ghee.jpg (17KB, 400x315px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 400x315px

>>657992
>making it yourself can be pretty dangerous

http://www.preparednesspro.com/to-bottle-or-not-to-bottle-butter

No more dangerous than anything else you do to preserve foods. If something is sealed and bulging then don't eat it. Same applies to store foods.

As someone who home pressure cans and water bath cans most of their own garden/farm crops I can say that canning is super easy to do. So, long as you follow safety measures, use well maintain-ed equipment, and follow guidelines/proper recipes there's never a problem.

>>658105
Well shit...appreciate the link, consider me taught, allways a weird moment when a lifelong ideal or belief is shattered. Of course i suppose that method is dependant on boiling the butter, i dont think op will be able to do that unless he does it in jars...which means his butter is bulky and heavy.

>mfw i leave butter on the counter 24/7 for weeks at a time
>somehow i thought canning it was dangerous

>>658124
Canning it is dangerous compared to leaving it on the counter you mong. You still don't get it

When I hiked the AT I used packaged single serving items to improve my meals. I did a lot of backpackers pantry (because it's so worth the extra money when the only thing you want is food) but when I did the boring meals like Pasta Sides, rice and beans I would use single serving packets to make things taste better and even add calories.

Here's a list of things I used:
>Crushed Red Pepper - got from pizza places
>Parmesean Cheese - got at pizza place too
>Salt/Pepper - any fast food places have these
>Olive Oil - used this in place of butter, got it at places that do take out salads
>Mayo - great for many things but especially Tuna which I ate for a lunch snack all the time, got from sandwich places
>Ketchup, Mustards and Relish - I only used Relish for ghetto tuna salad
>Hot Sauces - got from Mexican restaurants
>Soy Sauce, Duck Sauce and Spicy Mustard - Chinese take out

I also find bouillon cubes to be too salty so I took the Ramen packets. Most of these things you can get for free. Some might require you to buy an item and ask for extra of one of the items. I loved this though. They weigh nothing, take up no space and can make a generic dinner taste like something different. One night your chicken, rice and veggie meal can be Mexican tasting and the next day it can be Asian tasting. The olive oil can also let you add almost pure fat without the mess or hassle of ghee which you were interested in trying.

How many meals are you doing per day? I wouldn't do more than one.

>>658158
Ok then how about instead of calling me a mong...you explain what im missing.

>>657911
>>657992
>>658002
I know it'll be easier, but I find butter a lot more palatable. Especially for foraged mushrooms. I think (but please do correct me if I'm wrong) that clarified butter should hold in vacuum bags for quite a while. There would be no air or light while packed in drop boxes. I'm going to look up botulism...

>>657992
Great suggestions! I didn't know rice noodles didn't need to be cooked, and with a peanut sauce, that'd even be a complete protein.

>>658105
>>658124
I believe the difference here is that canned butter is generally used for long storage, whereas open butter may go rancid faster depending on room temperature, but botulism risk would be minimal. I've had butter last for weeks in the winter but go rancid in a couple days during mid-summer.

Clarified butter though doesn't contain water. That's a big part of the reason it lasts longer.

>>658178
That's a great list! I have considered this for some things like catsup, mustard and olive oil, but things like mayo and butter tend to either be artificial (I'm allergic to corn syrup and refuse to eat margarine) or require refrigeration.

Just a hot drink in the morning (I'll already be boiling water to recharge my hand warmer) and a dehydrated meal in the evening, everything in between will be cold pemmican and the occasional trail mix or bar.

>>658297
I wouldn't say that it's definitive by any means, but I was able to find that botulism requires protein to grow and that the process of clarifying butter removes most of the protein. My guess is that most if not all butter-related botulin poisonings are a result of canning whole butter as opposed to clarified butter or ghee. Assuming that I clarify the butter myself, and am not just repackaging store-bought clarified butter, it would be pasteurized immediately prior to being sealed. The toxin is destroyed at 85F so cooking with infected butter should actually be safe, and the bacterium is destroyed at 115F so the "safe to simmer ziploc vacuum bags" may be a solution if I clarify, bag and seal, then boil the packets.

Thoughts?

>>658335
Oops... I had those temperatures wrong. That was Celsius not Fahrenheit. So that wouldn't work.

I could still boil packets in the water I'm using to rehydrate with though, since it would destroy the toxin then. Asuming that there's enough protein to cause a problem in the first place.

File: Proccessing_Time 00.jpg (3MB, 4786x5000px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 4786x5000px

>>658158
>>658124
It is called "pressure canning". You place the hot food into hot boiled jars, put the jars into the pressure canner, with hot water in the bottom of it, and put on the lid & tighten it down. Bring the pressure up to 10lbs [240°F/115°C] or higher (depending on your elevation) for x amount of time for x type of food. After th time has elapsed, turn the heat off and allow the canner to cool until there is 0 pressure, but not negative pressure (or it will suck the contents out of the jars). Openning the canner while it still has pressure can be deadly.

Here's some good points to look out for in shitty online recipes for "canned" butter:
http://nchfp.uga.edu/questions/FAQ_canning.html#33

Canning isn't dangerous in the slightest unless you are ignorant, stupid, have faulty recipe, have faulty equipment, or all the above.

When in doubt, use 10lbs pressure for 90 minutes if you are under 1,000 feet/305M elevation and 15lbs pressure if you are above 1,000/305M feet elevation. The only times you have uncertainty is with foods that are cut too thick or they are not liquidy enough. Butter doesn't have that problem. Examples would be large hunks of beef or pumpkin or pumpkin puree. The first two are simple too dense and should be cut to 1-2 inch cubes. The latter simply has to high a viscosity for proper flow and heat transfer to the middle of the product.

When animal products and mushrooms are involved, I always use 10lbs pressure and 90 mins to 110 mins (fish requires 110mins).

I use this manual with my pressure canners,
http://www.allamerican-chefsdesign.com/admin/FileUploads/Product_49.pdf

>pics related and have been posted on /out/, /diy/, & /ck/ in the past

Keep in mind, some people are just ditsy/absentminded/lazy and shouldn't be unsupervised around pressure canners.

>>658297
Heat+oxygen are the enemy for preventing rancidity of fats. Given enough time, fats can go rancid in the freezer. But, that normally takes years and poor packing methods.

>>658335
>>658348
You can store your stuff in whatever container you like then when you need to pasteurize it you can put it into a laboratory test tube. They can take up to 300C/572F or more. I wouldn't use them on an open flame, but double boiling them like you were going to do to your bags will be just fine.

>>658197
I'm not that guy, but the reason that "canned" butter recipes are dangerous, is that they call for the butter to be melted and placed in heated jars, which is not true water-bath canning. The problem is that the bacterium that causes botulism is difficult to kill properly with heat due to the spores that are produced. Butter is a low-acid food does it doesn't naturally have the low pH to help prevent the bacteria from flourishing.

The reason that improperly canned butter is more dangerous than countertop butter is that Costridium botulinum (the bacteria that creates the botulism toxin) is an obligate anerobe. An obligate anerobe is a bacterium that needs an extremely low or no oxygen atmosphere to grow. Improper canning provides the perfect low oxygen environment for the bacteria to grow over months to years, until the can is opened and you receive a dangerous dose of toxin.

By having the butter on the countertop you will use it more quickly which will limit bacterial growth, but more importantly it will expose the butter to an oxygen. The oxygen does two things: 1. helps kill off the botulism bacteria, and 2. will slowly oxidize the butter (causes it to taste rancid), which causes people to throw out the butter before dangerous levels of botulinum toxin are produced.

I worked in a microbiology lab for 3 years.

>>658335
The botulnum toxin is not destroyed by heat. The bacteria may be, but not the toxin itself.

>>658351
This anon gets it right about "canned" butter versus canned butter.

>>658297

You seem to have your hike figured out well. One good meal a day makes all the difference. More than one meal will just show you down more than any thru/B.A.S. hiker could understand.
Personally, I was just a big section hiker on the AT. I wish I could have done a thru hike but I couldn't make it happen because life was calling.
I see people on /out/ talk about thru hikes all the time but you seem to be the minority where the hike isn't the concern but the logistics.

If you commit to your own dehydrated meals then eat those. However, if I could offer any advice it would be not to plan too far ahead for food. You will get tired/bored/sick of everything you plan to eat after a month unless you can get enough meals together to change what you eat every other day. Me, like everyone else I met, planned on trail mix during day, cliff bars, etc... but by the 30th day of eating the same thing all you want is Sour Patch Kids and Snickers.

If you can, have a family member or friend send you meals at your resupply stops with only a week or two of notice. That will allow you to tell them what foods you can no longer "want" to eat so they can send you something else.

I planned on eating a food I researched to be "ultra light" and calorie dense. It was peanut butter, honey and corn meal I think. While it was calorie dense and didn't taste like complete shit, I couldn't eat it past a few days despite hiker hunger.

Ignore the faggots arguing about botulinum. They haven't ever been /out/ like you intend to go /out/. To even think someone is going to take a can of fucking anything for a hike for longer than a few days is laughable. Sure, some /k/ommando will try telling you about how you shouldn't care about the weight of your pack because Romans carried 60lbs of armor on their campaigns. What those /k/ommandos won't tell you is that they didn't carry weight through mountains.... where you will spend essentially your whole hike.

>>658431
Common myth. Here, be enlightened:

http://emergency.cdc.gov/agent/Botulism/clinicians/control.asp

>Despite its extreme potency, botulinum toxin is easily destroyed. Heating to an internal temperature of 85°C for at least 5 minutes will decontaminate affected food or drink.

85C is 185F and easily attainable/knowable when you heat it to boiling temps (212F for water).

The microbe spores itself is harmless to adult humans, but not babies under 1 year of age. Which is why you never feed babies honey since honey can commonly contain viable botulism spores. You only need to worry about the toxin and active botulinum, when consuming food.

But, seriously, if you are pressure canning correctly you don't have to worry about this shit.

>>658580
I used to hike with a 98kg pack, 60lbs isn't shit at all. It was only about 70ish miles to hike in to camp though, but the supplies would last for 3 months of good comfort easily. Pack weight back out was only about 79kg. Not that I ever do that now. Now I have uber knowledge and don't-give-a-fuck attitude. So, I don't even have a pack and only carry what fits in a few coat pockets.

>>658644
>85C is 185F and easily attainable/knowable when you heat it to boiling temps (212F for water).
you have to keep it at least 10 minutes tho.
gypsies in my country often go to carcass pits to get meat that was rotting for 2-3 days.
they cook it thoroughly and eat it.

>>658843
Eating old meat that is in open air is different. There are too many variables, but botulism shouldn't be a concern. Everything else can be a concern. The warmer the weather the worse it can be. Everything from mycotoxins to aerobic bacteria can be a problem with that. Most mycotoxins are not destroyed by heat.

>>658429
Would it be possible to add some sort of acid or other preservative to butter to make it hold longer?

>>658580
Thanks! I do a lot of walking already, and I tend to pack light, so neither of those are really a concern for me. I am a little concerned about diet fatigue, it's happened a few times to me already, and six months of that would impossible. Hense, asking for meal ideas. I think that if cycle through ten or so different dinners, I should be okay.

Room temperature butter for six or so months could be a concern. I think what I'll do is just pick it up as I go along. It's not worth the risk of cancelling the whole trip. I just hope I don't find a huge patch of morels when I'm three days away from a store...

>>658877
>old meat that is in open air is different
not really a decomposing body is ideal for botuli
just because the surface has air doesn't mean that 2mm under it does not hosts anaerobic bacteria.

File: 0105161227.jpg (666KB, 2048x1350px) Image search: [Google]

666KB, 2048x1350px

Update:
So after dehydrating 3lbs of mushrooms, 1.5lbs of broccoli and 4 bell peppers I have three tiny little bags of veggies. I know the whole point is to save on weight and space, but it's kind of underwhelming after all the work I put into it. I also just finished cleaning and slicing two hearts, I've got them in the dehydrator right now, and the fat is currently being rendered into tallow. I picked up some soup bones because I read that adding marrow makes the best pemmican. I'll add the bones once I've got the suet melted.

2 hearts - $20
Dozen bones - $11
10 pounds suet - $7

That's a lot of calories for forty bucks, but it still seems pretty expensive for what most people would consider garbage.

>>658644
>I used to hike with a 98kg pack
Things that never happened (that's 215lb fuckwad)

>Now I have uber knowledge and don't-give-a-fuck attitude. So, I don't even have a pack and only carry what fits in a few coat pockets.

More things that never happened

>>659489
>Things that never happened (that's 215lb fuckwad)

I'm aware how much it is. That is what I did 20 years ago. Nothing I'll be repeating even if my life depended on it now.

I've also killed over 5k deer in my life and caught at least 10k fish via pole. But, I don't hunt and I don't fish anymore. I was really big into that shit, but not anymore.

>>659481
> I know the whole point is to save on weight and space, but it's kind of underwhelming after all the work I put into it.

lol Yeah turning 15 pounds of carrots into only 2 pounds of dried carrots (86.6% weight reduction) is amazing.

>>659658
I've got two giant bags of carrots to do after the heart is done. Good to know they reduce that much. You usually blanch yours first?

>>659481
You need a garden for it to be cost effective. Otherwise it's only good if you can make something superior than is commercially available

>>659774
I have a garden, but northern hemisphere isn't great for fresh veggies this time of year. Mostly, I wanted it for the pemmican anyway, but this way there's other things I can make. Pumpkin pie fruit leather, for one...

>>659752
No, I never blanch, I've not seen a real difference for improvement for some reason. I don't use citric acid on dried fruits either.

I think one 5lbs bag of carrots reduces down to about 1 quart jar of dried carrot. I sliced mine at an angle so they'd not fall through the dehydrator grating. You can see them in >>657049 on the far right-middle side and what they look like in the jars right under the dehydrator pic


>>659774
You have the choice of getting the food that is organic as well as in bulk. If you get a business license you can get crates of stuff from the distributor's warehouse and pay next to nothing for it. I garden and that is what I do from time to time in addition to my own crops.

>>659774
Why? If you already have the dehydrator, it doesn't cost anything.

>>659658
>I've also killed over 5k deer

wtf is wrong with you. At least come up with a plausible lie. Let's say you've been hunting 25 years that would be 200 dear per year which is ludicrous.

Most professional outfitters wouldn't even guide 200 deer each year.

Unless you mean you're a long-term employee at a large-scale game farm and that's how many you commercially slaughtered.

The fishing statistic also beggars belief, but at least that one is marginally closer to reality even though it's still a bullshit lie.

>>66021
I poached them for family and friends as well as sell it. You can spotlight an entire heard at night and back then herds were close to 150 deer sometimes. You could easily leave a pile of guts about knee deep. That was before the coyotes moved in and now deer numbers are 10-20 in herds if you are lucky.

With fish it is easier since you can catch 100s of crappie and channel catfish in a single day/night with trot lines.

Things where different back in the 1980s. Now I wouldn't eat fish from the local water ways if you paid me.

>>660188
>food and energy are free

>>660333
I'd be eating anyway. And the extra electricity I use for the dehydrator would offset the electricity I'd be using for heating.

>>660333
You are buying fresh vegetables at a price five times as much as a commercial producer. You are wasting your time and money.

>>660217
this

I always get a kick out of anons talking out their ass. It's not like there is a single thing to gain.

>>659658
>10k fish via pole

>>660331
>trot lines

can't even keep your bull straight in one thread

5k-10k lying sacks of shit more like it

>>660547
>>660390
No, it is all true. Trot lines increase the number which isn't include in pole catching.

How old are you guys?

Update:
I just finished a batch of pumpkin pie pudding as per backpackingchef's recipe. One of my vacuum bags got a hole in it, so I figured I'd just taste test that one. It was excellent at home, if not a little sweet, but I'm sure it'll be a godsend on the trail. I think I'll try it with a gram cracker as a faux crust next time.

>>660894
Sounds delicious.

I've never had luck with vacuum pack bags. They seal correctly. But most of the time they get holes in them very easily. Even the dehydrated food sometimes punches unseen holes in them. Very annoying, but it is an easy fix at home, I just use canning jars. But, extended trail blazing with glass jars just isn't that suitable for most people.

>>660937
Lol. No kidding. I learned quick after that first one, to put the smooth underside of the pumpkin leathers on the outsides of the bag, and the chunkier bits between them. Not sure how that will work with some of the meals yet, but I'll figure something out.

In case anyone is interested, I found a pack of silicone placemats on Amazon that are BPA free. I didn't want to say anything until I got a chance to try them out, but they make awesome fruit leather tray liners.

>>660940
I went through that phase looking for good mats for fruit leather. Then I read up on plastic and silicon. BPA free or not, they are terrible for food. Same with the plastic vacuum bags. Doubly so when you add heat.

When I get around to it I'll be using some glass baking trays and testing out making fruit leather on those.

>>660981
They're silicone. I wouldn't be caught dead eating off silicon.

tl;dr silicone is glass

>>660995
Wrong shortcut, (ie.) Not (tl;dr)

>>660995
It was just a typo, also, check the citations in these,

http://www.theecomum.com/blog/eco-myth-busting-myth-2-silicone-is-totally-inert-totally-safe-not

>>661001
It's wrong, though. Silicone isn't a hydrocarbon. Perhaps some non FDA approved (industrial) silicone products contain it, such as gaskets, but silicone itself is a siloxane. Quite literally, the only difference between silicon dioxide (silicone) and silicon monoxide (glass) is that the extra oxygen molecule causes glass to be hard and brittle.

>>661042
I got that backwards. SIO is silicone, SIO2 is glass.

>I haven't slept well, I've been running that dehydrator and prepping shit back to back for three days straight.

>>661042
That's the myth though, the silicone isn't just 1 thing,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicone

You also ask two questions,

"Does this in any way, leach any kind of chemicals into my food?"
"Does each of the leach chemicals help improve or maintain my health?"

For me, it has nothing to do with anything else. If you wish to read about it in detail, you need to purchase it here, though it is rather expensive ($129usd),

>leaching of magnesium, aluminium, calcium, and platinum were found in foods baked on silicone bakeware
http://www.researchandmarkets.com/reports/c92251

Overview of it here, minus the conclusion,
http://fsrio.nal.usda.gov/nal_web/fsrio/printresults.php?ID=2730

>>661404
Sounds to me like you get a commission, otherwise you'd just provide a link for a pirated copy. Information should be shared freely, lest knowledge be used as a tool of oppression.

And frankly, I'm not worried about metals like magnesium and calcium. Those are readily absorbed by the body and used to perform normal functions. Aluminium may or may not be inert, and if they're giving me free platinum I'll take it. A few atoms here and there isn't going to harm me in any way.

What you should be worried about is the amount of glyphosate that makes it into the corn they put in everything. Glyphosate, by the way, causes autism.

>>661533
It is in book form they mail to you. I'm sure it is available elsewhere online.

I'm a farmer. I eat my own heirloom corn. I don't eat store bought corn.

You should probably give these questions some deeper thought in your life,

"Does this in any way, leach any kind of chemicals into my food?"
"Does each of the leach chemicals help improve or maintain my health?"

>>661540
I'll wait for the movie. At any rate, I'm not worried about it. It's still probably a lot safer than Teflon, and who knows what's being done to prepackaged dehydrated food.

Also, Update:
Mango banana pudding with banana chips. I'm going to have to start making bigger batches, because this stuff is amazing!

>>656976
How about dehydrated spaghetti sauce or similar sauces? They will be just like a fruit leather until you rehydrate them. You'll then be able to either carry pasta with you or make it (ex. gnocchi) at camp.

Dehydrated Sauce
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYBlYqg07BA

Dehydrated Sauce AND Pasta together
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9aoQ3xrzYEk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYxZN1xnSDk

Also, when you watch these vids on youtube there will be tons of ideas for you on the side panel.

What would you do on a particularly long trip, like several months where packing meals is completely out of the question. Assuming you could stop at small shops are the choices limited to dehydrated soups and trail mix?

>>662153
If packing meals is completely out of the question, how can you stop at small shops and resupply?

>>662232
Me again, just wanted to add that I no longer find anything interesting in sleeping in a tent or outside anymore, because I can't be bothered to give up my comfort of a hot shower and a WC and I also have a hairpiece that needs a whole range of accessories and also I have my lenses that give me great eyesight again which I don't want to be without, and they too are not made for taking weeks or months hiking through the bush with no supplies.

>>662232
these lads prep enough meals at home to last them through their trip. But they couldnt possibly prepare months worth of nummies, so while your out, without the tools of a kitchen, how do you prep meals then?

>>662018
Sweet, thanks! I was planning on doing a spaghetti sauce, but this will definitely help!

>>662153
So... like a thru-hike? Or hobo traveling, maybe? Not a huge difference, tbqh. I'm making up boxes of stuff to be mailed to drop points along the way. Would this not be an option?

File: 456456.jpg (19KB, 300x300px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 300x300px

>>662248
>But they couldnt possibly prepare months worth of nummies

For 1 person, 6 months of food is around 150lbs. 2 months worth would only be 50lbs. (plus about 18 gallons/150.2lbs of water, per month to rehydrate, but that can be collected on-site)

>Augason Farms 30-day Emergency Pail
>Item Weight: 25 pounds
http://www.amazon.com/Augason-Farms-30-day-Emergency-Pail/dp/B007NZMAPI

>No refrigeration needed, packaged for long term storage.Contains enough food to feed 1 person for 30 days.
>Provides 1,857 calories per day (300 servings) for complete nutrition.Each meal takes 20 minutes or less to prepare, just add water.
>Contains no high-fructose corn syrup, trans fats or MSG.Food is packaged in resealable Mylar bags with oxygen absorbers.
>30-day meal planner offers a wide range of appetizing combinations.45-day meal planner offers a lower calorie per day average to extend the number of days the food will last.
>Includes Instant Potatoes (30 servings), Macaroni (30 servings), Cheese Powder (30 servings), Creamy Potato Soup Mix (30 servings), Cheesy Broccoli Rice (30 servings), Creamy Chicken Rice (30 servings), Hearty >Vegetable Blend (40 servings), Oatmeal (40 servings), Maple and Brown Sugar (40 servings), Morning Moo's Low Fat Milk Alternative (80 servings), 30-day meal planner, 45-day meal planner, self-filtering water bottle and FireOn disk

2 of those plus regular pack weight (25lbs or less) would bring your pack weight up to a max of 75lbs. That is a hefty, not fun, but doable pack weight providing it is adjusted properly and you are in good health. Of course, there's always the option of only packing half of what you need and relying a great deal on foraging/hunting/fishing/trapping your calories. The latter is what I normally do.

All the OP needs to do is tailor it to his tastes, calorie intake, meal plan, and nutritional requirements. You need to remember, people have been doing this very thing for millennia prior to the discovery of electric.

>>662277
$~100/mo is pretty good, even at 1800cal/day. There's really no reason to not have a food surplus at this cost. Add a water filter, alcohol stove, tyvek bivvy, fleece liner and closed cell pad to this, and you've got a pretty good survival kit.

File: FireOn-Disk-Fire-Starter-Emergency-Heat-Source-Kit-096065c0-376d-48b1-b5a3-d90afd3532bf.jpg (123KB, 1000x1000px) Image search: [Google]

123KB, 1000x1000px

>>662297
I'd get one first and live off it at home for the prescribed amount of time, without "cheating." That's the best way to plan for a survival or emergency item. It may turn out to be calorie dense, but lack most nutrients you'd really need. It will take more than 20 minutes to prepare the meals when you are not accustomed to how to do it easily. I'm also betting you'll be feeling pretty hungry if you stick to their meal plan, which is in itself quite fine, but something a person needs to know, so they may better structure their frame of mind for "emergency mode" and not double dip the rationing system.

Something is better than nothing, but being experienced is better than being prepared and clueless.

Also, it seems there is something called a "FireOn disk" inculded in that, but I've no info on how many there are and how long one will last or how many meals 1 could make if they are reusable.

http://www.overstock.com/Emergency-Preparedness/FireOn-Disk-Fire-Starter-Emergency-Heat-Source-Kit/7924095/product.html

30mins of burn time per disc. You'd defiantly would need to test that out and everything. I'd go with a multi-fuel stove, one that can but gel, discs, twigs, and alcohol. Even if I had to diy one.

>>662277
>>662297
Im planning on cruising the trans canada trail on my mountain bike come spring time, weight constraints dont mean nearly as much on a bike do they?

>>662312
Which is why I said "pretty good survival kit". It wouldn't be as nice as what most of us already carry, but would be a great starting point for a beginner "prepper" for under $200.

>>662313
The most I typically do on a bike is about 80miles in a day to the lake, and I rest up there. I also don't have a great bike, so depending on what you've got, your mileage may vary. It can suck to pedal or even push weight up a hill, but you'll still get more distance per pound than you will when hiking. Check to see if there's a local bike tour group you can talk with, they'll get you set straight.

File: Bricks.jpg (38KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 480x360px

>>662313
>weight constraints dont mean nearly as much on a bike do they?

They mean the same thing, but it means you can carry more weight and not wreck your knees and back. Load up your bike and take it for a spin around your area. Then take that weight off the bike, put it into your pack, and hike the same areas. Then you'll quickly understand that a tool like a bike is a massive help (something to do with wheels I'd imagine...).

>>662336
Right, well thats reassuring. How common is it for people to hunt small game as they tour around, i really wouldnt have a problem wrist rocketing a squirrel for some protein.

>>662393
Probably pretty common. For a tour, you're probably poaching, which I don't really see a problem with when it's squirrels and other rodents and invasive species, but you might have to be careful about getting caught is places where even invasive species hunting is illegal without a license.

>>662403
Yeah, if you get hunting/snaring licenses in the areas you are traveling through it will help. After that it is all about whose property you are on. Catching squirrels with a rat trap is probably the best way to go. Someone that sees a rat trap in most contexts it won't be a problem, but snares, conibear traps, and leghold traps will attract attention. At least with a rat trap you can say you have it to set near you when sleeping so rats go to it instead of to your face to nibble because you have a crumb or two.

>>662556
In WA, the law actually states that mice and rat traps are excluded from trapping regulations. But they also say we can't hunt invasive species like western grey squirrels and nutria without a license. Bullshit imo, we should be giving rewards to people who kill this swamprats.

>>662565
>invasive species like western grey squirrels
>Washington state

They are endangered in WA, not "invasive". There are even laws protecting them,

>Western gray, Douglas', red, and flying squirrels are all protected species in Washington (WAC 232-12-011).
http://wdfw.wa.gov/conservation/gray_squirrel/

And a recovery plan to get their numbers back up,

http://wdfw.wa.gov/publications/00119/

>>662556
>>662565
>>662832

Ill be biking from ontario to british columbia, Im pretty sure all i would need is a varmint or small game license. But even then, on the trans canada trail there wont be anyone watching.

Although, if ever I did get stopped by some ranger type with said wrist rocket and no license, it would hard to tell him I wasnt hunting squirrels.

>>662832
My bad. I meant eastern grey. They're over growing the native populations that you listed and need to be thinned or exterminated.

>>662903
I don't know anything about Canadian law. In the states, each state requires its own license.

>>662903
>>663008
Yeah and it can be $40-$140USD easy and it is just for 1 license. Some states require several "stamps" in your license book for many thing even is all you want is 1 stamp to do 1 thing. Out of state licenses may or may not cost more.

Also, I think most states require that you have a special certificate for firearms safety for any non-fishing license. That includes trapping. In some states this certificate is given to you if you watch a seminar on firearm safety or after passing an actual exam.

This has to be done for each individual state. This is because the USA isn't technically 1 country. It is more like 50 smaller countries that loosely agree on some things and completely disagree on others. That's why there's a difference between federal and state laws. Some states make some things legal which are illegal federally, but can do so. It only means they lose ___ federal funding of some time normally.

>>663112
It's as much as $300 for an out of state fishing license. I intended to fish at every lake up the PCT, but it looks like I'm just doing crater lake (which doesn't require a license), and WA, because I'm a resident. Probably just as well, since there won't be a lot of time to stop anyway.