Hey /n/

lurk moar faggot
christ almighty 4chan got worse once you newfags thought you could walk right in and start asking stupid questions.

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>noisy
>polluting
>dangerous
>but we still make them make them the focus of our modern cities and public spaces and transportation planning
>and people feel entitled to operate their cars without regards to anyone else's wellbeing

I don't actually hate cars, as mechanical devices I think they're amazing, and there are definitely lots of good things about them - but the complete and absolute dependence on cars (especially inside of densely settled areas) is a social trap and does a lot of harm on cities and populations as a whole.

>>909459
There are many poor deluded souls on this board, most of them young, who think that all the world's problems can be solved by eliminating motor vehicles from it. Of course they're blind to the fact that they wouldn't have bikes to ride or any of the modern conveniences (including the computer and the Internet they're using to complain about the evils of cars and the people who own and operate them) without motor vehicles; the majority of us would still be living in rural areas, and rarely see cities or really travel much. Many of them would also not be here, having died of childhood illnesses that could have been handled simply and easily if there had been fast, convenient motorized transportation to get them to a doctor or to the emergency room.

Of course if any of them actually manage to get married to someone some day, their car-hating attitude will have to change, just as soon as their wives say "Honey, I'm pregnant!". Then they'll have to be responsible husbands and fathers, and provide proper transportation for their family, and bikes will have to be secondary.

All that, plus it's also another dumb meme. Just ignore the subject and ignore them, they don't matter. Most people who are avid cyclists also own a motor vehicle because they know that you just can't ride a bike everywhere all the time, and there's nothing wrong with that.

>>909459
Why?

Because in Cities, they are curse. A fucking curse.

1. To accommodate them, cities sideline every single other form of transportation from walking to public transport, making all slower, harder to do, even impossible in some cases.

2. They make getting around cities worse, even if you are in a car. Seriously, traffic generally makes getting from point A to B slower in ALL cases.

3. They take up more space. For cars to flow efficiently, you need more space. In urban environments, that's at a premium and involves destroying large swathes of cities to do. The vehicles even take up more road space. Tell me, what's better, having 12 metres squared of road space to transport one person or 1.6 square metre or less per person? That's basically the choice between Cars and Public transport.

4. The pollution, oh God the pollution! I live about a Kilometre away from the most polluted part of my city and most of it is caused by cars. With a bus, your pollution footprint as it were is at least shared by 50-100 other people, meaning even for a half empty bus you're releasing less pollution per person compared to if everyone just drove. Less cars = cleaner air.

Generally, having less cars in a city makes a better city.

>>909468
>There are many poor deluded souls on this board, most of them young, who think that all the world's problems can be solved by eliminating motor vehicles from it.

I don't want to eliminate cars, I just want less of them in urban environments, they are a problem, just admit it.

>>909468
Most car trips made are less than 10 miles, which is absolutely unnecessary once you factor in driving in the city with gridlock. In highly dense cities, it's almost retarded to own a car. You can rent cars for the special occasion driving out of town.

Take Japan and Korea for example where everyone gets everywhere by transit. For them, even cross country travel by car is stupid when they can take high speed trains. How often do you hear people complaining about not having enough disposable income when they have to pay at least $200 monthly for insurance, upkeep and gas? Sure it has its time when it's handy but using it just a handful of times a month doesn't justify the cost. There's stuff like uber that I imagine would be cheaper if you don't use your car everyday

We don't hate cars. We hate cagers.

>>909459
>Why does everyone here seem to hate cars?
I do like my Car, but when i am riding my Bike then i seriously hate the stupidness some Cardrivers seem to have mastered in a perfect way. Best example is whenever i am riding a specific route where you aren't allowed to ride more than 30 kmh, then i clearly see no reason not to ride in the middle of the lane if i am clearly not below 25kmh, yet people keep honking the shit out of me and even try to pass me over. The funny part: thats right in front of a curve where it happens every goddamn time, just 20m around the corner and you are facing a goddamn traffic light which is periodically most of the times on red light. So there i am, knocking on the window and asking them if it was worth it passing me over, almost causing a crash, driving 20kmh above the speedlimit just to meet me there

>>909459
I love my cars, but I also ride my bike a bit. I wouldnt be able to have the job I do or enjoy most of the things I have without a car. I also like to argue with some of the lesser minds on this board who assume all cars and drivers are the devil. Some of the insanity that people of this board posts is truely comedy gold.

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>>909501
hey look everybody, heres one

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When /n/ says 'cager', they mean a specific kind of motorists. Not all motorists are cagers, but all cagers are motorists.
A lot of us drive at least part of the time, too.

>>909480
winner

>>909506
OP here, and thanks I was wondering about the whole "cager" thing.

>>909494
>on my bike coming home from work or class
>motorist passes by me: over a double line, over the speed limit, cresting a hill, around a curve all at the same time
>honks at me

death 2 all cagers, imo

>>909498
Well because all cars seem to have the intention of killing every cyclist they see

>>909512
>bicyclist calling other people entitled cunts

Hello pot, have you met kettle?

>>909511
yeah I can see you are dead,

>>909523
>comparing master race pedestrians to bicyclists
>master race pedestrains walk on the shoulder, always hyper aware of traffic, usually stop and move completely off the road when a car drives by
>untermensch bicyclists expect to be treated like cars, travels about a fifth as fast as a slow car, worse when going up a hill, rides down the middle of the lane, sometimes the middle of the fucking road, completely oblivious.
>master race pedestrians stay on sidewalks when traversing an urban area, only crossing the street at designated crossing zones
>untermensch bicyclist bobs and weaves through traffic, getting obnoxiously close to cars when doing so despite complaining when cars do it to them, goes on sidewalk where they don't belong, makes U turns in intersections and other cunty things, rare is the cyclist who signals properly

I could just go on and on. I do apologize about the use of entitled, I actually meant to erase that from my post but, y'know, day after Christmas, lots of extra booze laying around. Accidents happen.

>>909527
>pedestrians
>aware of anything

>>909511
If that were true thousands of bicyclists would die every day, instead it is maybe a couple hundred per year at most. Compared to 40,000+ dead motorists every year. Fuck off with your victim complex that has no basis in reality.

>>909533
>jaywalking is a crime
>Living in the Empire of Cages

>>909478
>Take Japan and Korea for example where everyone gets everywhere by transit.
False
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-oVNnrQx9o

>>909540
1) There are simply more drivers out there on the road
2) More people drive around than bike around for their daily duties
3) Cyclists are more cautious on average than full-time motorists

Nearly every single time I leave the house on my bicycle, I run into some altercation.
Sometimes it's fine; just some asshole yelling at you, might make me swerve and startle on a bad day, but I won't go down, normally. At worst, it's someone having a laugh by getting close to you, or throwing something at you, both which could result in direct, physical harm.
It's psychological warfare everyday that motorists simply don't have to deal with.

Despite the statistics, no one gets shaky when they hop in the car and freak the fuck out cause they're probably gonna die.
However, many cyclists have whole routes to avoid, have to take MUCH more precautions, end at the end of the day, end up being blamed for whatever harm comes to them no matter what. (Look at any comments section)

>>909657
that sounds fucking horrible - where are you ?

>>909665
NJ

There's a lot of us here. Every time I hear a horror story, I imagine it's one of us.

>>909598

That's very mature of you. Are you the same guy bumping the BSO thread?

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>>909459
>why
Because >>>/o/

>>909657
>>909665
>>909666

>live in DC
>hit and runned
>they catch the bitch
>go to court
>judge flips his shit on her (i think hes a cyclist bro)
>"we deal with over 40k cyclist/pedestrians hit by cars ever year" ~the judge

it definitely isnt a couple hundred, DC is 1/10 the size of new york and 40k is way way more than I thought, even if only 1/10 of those are fatal.

>>909726
>judge spouts bullshit
>anon believes it is 40k on a local level not national

holy shit you are stupid

>>909738

>literally millions of people on the roads each day in the dmv
>I'm sure most of the accidents are minor
>he's a judge that works in the field
>holy shit you are a faggot on the internet

eat more dicks

>>909666
>New Jersey

Sorry, but come back when you live in a state populated by actual human beans.

>>909468
Actually you wouldn't have motor vehicles without bicycles, you seem to have that switched.

>>909741
if it were true that there was 40k hit and runs a year in dc it wouold make national news thats how fucking bad it is, you literally couldnt go anywhere without seeing a few hit and runs. People dont treat their cars like its bumper cars at the carnival. This is how fucking retarded you are.513

>>909468
I think the majority of this board's problems could be solved by range bans to Colorado, Australia, and the Netherlands

>>909459
the only good cage is a death cage

>>910147
you forgot jersey too.

>>910293
I make $104,000 a year and I don't own a car. What now?

>>910345
You're not the boss of me.

>>909657
That sounds bad, but honestly I think its right--I usually do not think about it that way but I did that.

Last summer I started communting by bike to where I worked. About 10 miles one way. At first I did this on generally paved, at least smooth roads, but more and more I started shifting away to less trafficed places, technically more difficult paths, simply to avoid the cars. And even still when I got to places where I could not but be on the road with cars, there would be wierd situations where cars pull in front of you, edge past you to turn, whatever.

There is one stretch of road where, though marked with clearly as 'bikes may use full lane' cars would try to pass me still inside of the lane where I was sitting. I have thankfully never been in a collision, but there have been times where people passed by too close.

I have a good memoery for license plates, and I often watch out for the same cars later.

>>909459
>parking minimums
>sprawl development
>expensive but required in most places I've lived

I don't hate cars. I just don't like how society seems to believe that every aspect of daily life needs to revolve around it. There is no reason a town should be built where needing to buy a loaf of bread requires driving several miles to do.

>>909666
North or South? I want to know whether the Philly area or NY area has the shittier drivers.

>>909527
>complains about cyclists riding in the street
>then complains when they ride on the sidewalk because they dont belong there

cagers, everyone

>>910712
I live and commute in South Jersey and have never been shit on by motorists. As far as metro areas go, NYC has better bike infrastructure but philly drivers definitely hassle cyclists less (in my experience)

>>909459
>/n/.mov https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3nMnr8ZirI&t=22

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Both sides of the argument have a solution for both of their grievances.

>>909466
This, my mom is always driving to cvs when it two blocks away, I actually want to get a bike.

>>911004
He's riding a KHS track holy kek

>>911563
>two blocks
how long would it take for you to walk that distance?

>>911580
>>911563
I would not even get kitted up to ride 2 blocks. Walk it.

>>911581
>kitting up for an errand

homo

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>>909749
>People dont treat their cars like its bumper cars at the carnival.

Have you ever actually driven in a real city? People put extra rubber mats on their bumpers to protect from all the bumping.

>>909540
Numbers, how do they even work....
It's about 10 per day killed by traffic in germany alone, used to be 100eds killed per day in the 70ies in west germany alone. Savety regulations really work, yet IMHO thats still too many wrongful deaths, if you compare to the murder rate of appox. 5 per day in germany (2015). Now scale those nice numbers up to worlds scale and lo and behold: Yes, about 900 kills per day by traffic, and thats a very conservative estimate.

>>909540
>If that were true thousands of bicyclists would die every day, instead it is maybe a couple hundred per year at most.
But yes, 100s per day on a global scale.

>Compared to 40,000+ dead motorists every year.
Killed by whom? Cyclists? Hell no, killed by motorists.
****Thats the reason**** we cyclists and pepestrians fear and loathe those reckless and ignorant motorists AKA cagers.

>Fuck off with your victim complex that has no basis in reality.
True, currently cyclists are the safest on our roads. relatively.

>>911561
Motorcyclists have a totally different outlook to bicyclers. Motorcyclists often have a "I'm on the bike, so it's my responsibility to ensure my own safety, and if something happens that puts me at risk, I have to take some ownership of that and be more aware and plan ahead in future."

Bicyclers just want the entire world to revolve around them. I've never seen anyone who bicycles say something as honest as what motorcyclists seem to think by nature.

>>912051
YES!
I just about flipped when I started seeing these pop up. Reminded me of back when cars actually had rubber bumpers that could take a tap or two.

Then I did flip when I saw one on a Bentley Phantom that was boxed in too tight to get out on a city street.

>>909460
Why are you so upset? Relax.

>>912163
Yeah brosef mc brostein. Relax.

R E L A X
E
L
A
X

>just relax
>relax
>re

>>912127

As a motorcyclist and cyclist, I can say this is partially true.

>>909590
>i take everything perfectly literally

For a city of 30 million, Tokyo's traffic is fantastic when compared to the bullshit of NYC or LA

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>>912238
Tokyo has a giant subway system to take some of that load off the streets.

>>911563
That's an American thing though. I've heard stories from British expats saying their American neighbours literally drove next door to their house.

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>>912127
Thats because a motorcycle is highly visible, loud and can easily go over speeds of 100 mph to get through traffic. Of course its their responsibility to control their impulses and vehicle.
A cyclist can only go 30mph max for a short period of time if even that, are hardly visible, forced to ride on poorly constructed roads, dodge and weave, cars, pedestrians, as well as other cyclists that have no training or responsibility to others. Then looked down upon just for their transportation of choice. I rode both motorcycles and bicycles as well and bicycling in a city is without a doubt way more dangerous than a motorcycle.

>>912409
I rode both, going 100mph is a bit slow for any sportbike. 30mph is hard to sustain .

Bicycles are safer, healthier, and way less costly, not tickets, less fags on harleys revving their motor talking shit about muh imports.

Meanwhile all harleys mostly made in china

>>912409
100 m/h would be insufficient to even keep pace with all but the most extreme gridlock.

Even the frailest cyclists can easily exceed 30 m/h by at least 2 orders of magnitude.

>>912504
>Even the frailest cyclists can easily exceed 30 m/h by at least 2 orders of magnitude


Are you fucking high? What world do you live in where the average cyclist is riding faster that 30 miles per hour?

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>>912505
>falling for the si faggots nonsense

>>912505
I never said anything about miles.

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>>912409
>A cyclist can only go 30mph max for a short period of time if even that

I can hit 45mph on the velodrome with no lead out. The fastest women in the world on the track break 40mph. I don't think you could find a professional female rider who couldn't break 30mph on flat ground on a road bike.

I recently watched my friend Molly Shaffer Van Houweling go 28.7 miles in an hour. Which isn't far off of holding your estimate of top speed ..... for an hour. Certainly Wiggin's 33.8 miles in an hour for the hour record smashes it to bits.

I'm not the "orders of magnitude" guy... But you really should be able to find a cyclist who can go faster than 30mph.

>>912570

I can hit about 40 mph with a 53x11 on the flats with my road bike. I can hold this for a few miles before I burn out. I always end up running out of gearing with a 46t when in route to the trails.. I understand you think you are some eilte rider that 'knows' everything about biking but I think you are just weak as fuck.

^^internet brovado is pointless but amusing

carry on

>>912632
Not knowing /n/'s version of navy seal with 300 kills

>>912631
Oh look he posted it again.

>>909459
American-dominated board, hence the mindset of cars>all other modes of transport is the overriding belief. Pretty much this board is filled with fedora-tippers (they wear them under their helmets at all times). Euros on here don't hate cars half as much.

>>912570
>trying to brag about being friends with a female pro

top kek, get back to me when there's actually a decent standard of riding in women's cycling

>>910712
>>910757
Philly cyclist here, biking downtown is actually very easy and relaxed. Every office building downtown has bike racks and they are always filled, I'd say a third of people who work down there are biking in the nicer weather seasons and a lot of drivers are aware and everyone is paying attention. the suburbs are where it gets bad

>>912570
>>912631
Any able-bodied woman should be able to exceed 40 m/h by at least two orders of magnitude.

>>912570

>talking about top speeds on a velodrome in a thread about commuting

just delusion my shit up senpai

>>912507
>>912565
this is a goddamn american board, you communist faggots

>>909494
I'm not from yurop so it might be different. But here in 'murica, driving the exact speed limit is considered slow, and if a car drives below the speed limit, the driver should be executed. If you're a bike in the middle of the road hoooooooooooooooooooooo mama.

>>913275
I don't see a .us anywhere.

>>909468
You can't eliminate motor vehicles but many people could severely cut down on their driving per unit time if they got out and rode a bike. I own a car, use ~$5 gasoline per week and still get shit done. Also, about to be married and planning on letting wife do most of car stuff with kids and doing work commute + errands on bike. She is well aware of my resolve.
>TLDR; I agree with anyone who: thinks that getting rid of motorized transport would be impractical and level one retarded
> > &&
>>who: thinks that people could make the world a bit better by kicking the car addiction and riding bikes when possible.
>>909478
I don't know about Japan/Korea but your first sentence makes sense.
>>909748
Also true.

>>909590
Is that thing motorized, is going that fast even legal?