>>61910953 >>61910979 nazis are centrist you take the far left stuff (socialism) with the far right stuff (nationalism) and you put em together and you land in the middle, maybe a tiny bit right leaning 2bh.
>>61912777 Anarcho-capitalists are but they aren't true anarchists. Anarchists are against all hierarchies they see as harmful, capitalism being one of them. Actually anarchy is socialist and a far left ideology.
>>61912626 >>61911755 He voted for Thatcher m8. You don't have to be a fucking full Nazi to be right wing. Joy Division have some leftish sounding songs, I.E. They Walked In Line, which is really just anti war. Most of their stuff is pretty apolitical but they're not liberals.
Also, when did they employ Nazi imagery? Wearing button down shirts and using monochrome?
>>61911074 You're kind of right on. Historians have often referred to National Socialism as "the extremism of the center" -- that is, property rights and the free market is left largely intact, yet everything is subordinated to the needs of the state.
>>61914972 >anarchy is socialist and a far left ideology Do you know nothing of the history anarchism. An-cap bullshit is literally a recent frakenstein's monster of an ideology with no real serious philosophers or seminal works behind it.
>>61916237 >Every single right-wingers is intolerant and bigoted Seriously, listen to yourself for one moment. Don't respond to me. Don't think of a reply. Just go back, reread your post, and think about the logic behind what you are saying.
>>61916539 Oh yeah? When was the last time the Log Cabin Republicans spoke at a Republican National Convention or had any input whatsoever on the Republican party's opinions? Oh yeah, never. Also they endorsed Romney in 2012, so >self-hating gays who believe Abraham Lincoln was gay and that's why they're gay Republicans
>>61916034 It really is scary how popular culture can lead you to being such a dumb fuck, yet make you think the things you say are so self-evident that you are convinced you are right. Anarchism has never been rightwing, even the individualist like Stirner hated the left and traditions. Also, libertarian has never mean extreme capitalist, it was a phrase used by anarchist(left) when the word anarchist became too hot to handle. Hang yourself m8
>>61916943 You seem to be mentally incapable of realizing that a person can hold conservative views on one policy and liberal views on another. Have nice afternoon, bigot. Please look that word's definition btw
>>61917156 I know what a bigot is, but it's okay to be a bigot to righties. The ones who support it, like Libertarians, use homosexuality as their "look guys, we can be liberal too!" buzz topic to attract young people who are naturally liberal, and then they turn around and say poor, homeless elderly people are lazy and don't deserve a basic income or health insurance or food.
>>61917620 Sounds like a shitty place. I bet you felt a great deal of brotherhood and camaraderie with those people too. That's how they get you.
>>61917838 The working class is deluded and lied to by corporate conservative news entertainment, and their confirmation bias has such a grip over their minds that they can't possibly accept it when a liberal does something that makes a place better than it was before. That's why there are still right-wing middle class people in the United States when the right wing has done nothing in their interest whatsoever.
>>61911127 Actually the left-right scale is used to measure all kinds of different shit by different people. Some use it to measure size of government and some use it for other stuff. It's just absolutely useless.
I don't know what you mean by working class, middle class and working class are completely different to me. Middle class are mostly liberal things like teachers, office workers, mangers, etc. When I say working class I mean welders and mechanics.
The reason why so many working class are conservative is because whether you like it or not illegal immigration have hit these jobs hard and even though pay increases would be nice having a job in the first place would be better.
Of course the fault is with the companies hiring illegal work for next to nothing, but the government is also letting these things happen.
>>61916775 Koch brothers are really good at being capitalist. Socialism is a political ideology based on the idea of workers control of the means of production(factories , farms, land etc). Socialism is inherently anti-capitalist. Anarchism is opposed to hierarchy. Most anarchists agree with socialist on the comunal ownership aspect, those who dont are called individualists(there are also minor quirks like market socialist.
Marx used the terms Communist and socialist interchangeably, but nowadays it is fashionable to think that leninism=communism and social democracy= socialism(Bernie for example). It is also popular to think that any sort of state intervention is socialist, but socialist do not want massive state, they want the present state of things(capitalism) abolished, and the state is a means to do so. Marx defined communism as statelesss and classless, like a collectivist anarchy.
>>61917970 >I bet you felt a great deal of brotherhood and camaraderie with those people too. That's how they get you. >not seeing the irony when the mantra of the left has been "workers of the world, unite and rise up, we are one people" etc
>>61910956 this guy made some of the best rock song I've ever heard! I am talking about his guitar riffs etc I don't care much for his racist lyrics really. Although his "House of Treason" song etc makes perfect sense about the government giving lots of free money to refugees yet allow so many who have grown up in their own country to go homeless or quite poor with not much income.
BUT yeah his guitar solos and everything were amazing! I watched an interview with the guitarist Stigger who was with the band for a few years (my favorite era of their music: Freedom What Freedom, Strong Survive) and he said all the guitar writing was done by Ian himself.
So I salute Ian Stuart tremendously with all the songs he wrote! All of them are kickass catchy.
I loved how they started out as a punk band, and then experimented with hard rock and metal.
>>61918046 The Republican-legislated government. They have corporate interests in mind, and hiring illegal workers saves corporations money, so of course they aren't going to do anything about it.
I mean working class by middle class, "proletariat" would be a better word, basically anyone whose only "marketable skill" is their labor value, but I'm not really a very big Marxist. I grew up in a working family. No office workers or anything like that. Been in poverty my whole life, used to be a hardcore libertarian until some point where I realized those people are fucking stupid and their overuse of nationalistic rhetoric is despicably base and tasteless. I prefer tasteful rhetoric that actually talks about doing good for more than just the individual, and that questions the current way things are rather than blind patriotism.
>>61918438 No they dont, they change with time like they always have. Peoples have come and gone for as long as there have been people. Where are the Hns or lattgalians? Did the sjws or jews make them extinct?
>>61918146 The whole workers of the world thing is melodramatic, but mostly accurate. Workers still do not earn a means to live in the United States, without working unfair hours, at least by the standards of other nations. We're a nation of poor people being lied to, and the big lie is that our companies aren't making enough money to pay us a living wage, and doing so would destroy our economy.
Right and left wing are a myth. A badly forced meme all the way from the french revolution. The political issues are entirely different these days and trying to split the complex world of politics on this bipolar axis is simply a way to make politics more a sport than a serious subject.
>>61918438 man this is something i just dont get.... if the left wing is all about this tolerance and PC stuff then why do they wanna import people who practice the most socially backwards religion in the world en masse?? makes no sense
>>61918643 >this is what libertarians actually believe Do you not see how crazy what you are saying is? I'm not saying "it can't happen here", but I am saying it WOULD happen here if the right wingers in the United States had control. The majority of Republican voters seriously want to make us a Christian theocracy. Libertarians say they don't, but buddy buddy around with the people who do, so why would I believe them?
>>61918615 Lefties are not about PC, thats a modern liberal thing(liberals are center). Leftist are pro-worker and anti hierarchical. >>61918643 The lefties in the states are really just center or center left, but they seem left because of your insanely rightwing political culture. Far-left dont care about your shit, they care about workers and property.
>>61919069 Bruce Johnston called Obama a "fucking joke".
>>61919043 Pretty anti-capitalist, if supporting heavily mixed markets with lots of regulation on industry is 'anti-capitalist'. I'm against the capitalist class, I guess. Workers can't truly be capitalists because they have no capital, and I think this is something that workers here tend to not realize.
>>61918472 so an african society that's been observing the same "you have to get these scars to become part of the tribe" tradition for hundreds of years is less anarchic than china when it was trying to erase the "four olds"
>>61916891 You're not wrong, about the sentiment of your post but you'd be hard pressed to find american thinkers more thoroughly individualistic than Thoreau and Spooner who were not explicitly anarchists. Individualist anarchists like Tucker and Greene quoted Spooner almost more often than they quoted their direct ideological forebears.
>>61918472 Freedom of association is an incredibly anarchistic value, and a completely unregulated market is its fullest expression. There are obvious ideological conflicts with the concept of property in any theoretical anarchistic society, but property, and hence capital, is not de facto mutually exclusive with anarchism, and is all but required by adherence to freedom of association. There are whole traditions of anarchist theory built around the concept.
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