What is an avant-teen? I hear it used as an insult all the time

How the fuck is Trout Mask Replica Mallgoth-core?

>>48625622
>Does just enjoying certain albums make you an avant-teen?
Enjoying? yes. You should be appreciating them. If you actually enjoy (instead of appreciate_ TMR you have just convinced yourself of that.

>>48625653
So you're saying it's impossible to enjoy TMR without forcing yourself to?

>>48625653
am i not aloud to enjoy the slightly misanthropic and hopeless lyrics of the album?

>>48625653
how do you appreciate an album

http://pastebin.com/dGpS38iU

Hope this helps to clear things up a little.

>>48625653
what if you enjoy appreciating things?
or, durr, you like the sound?

>>48625689
you stare at the record sleeve while listening to it and be all " i reall appreacitate this"

>>48625681
Correct.
>>48625683
>grasping at straws to justify false taste
>>48625689
On an artistic level.

>>48625701
What/why do you like the sound?

Guaranteed you have either a completely ambiguous or a non-answer to that.

>>48625650
People don't like that you enjoy an album they don't so they try to invalidate your opinion by grouping you with a subculture full of posturing children.

Which is pretty funny because that's basically /mu/.

>>48625741
>People don't like that you enjoy an album
No I don't mind that he convinced himself he likes it.

>>48625653
this might be one of the most pretentious things i've read in a long ass time

>>48625622
its a way to make sure people that listen to underground stuff but not the usual "hipster stuff" feel bad about themselfs

kind of "I dont want be different from you but dont wanna to change myself to be like you (and so dont be different from you), so please stop liking what I dont like, and so I will be able to be like you"

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>>48625653
>Not liking something, so assuming others pretend to.

How can one be tipping any harder?

>>48625689
analyze the composition, the technique, the sounds, the sequencing, the singing, the playing, etc. understand why it does or does not work, why people enjoy it or don't, why you may enjoy it or not

>>48625763
Enjoying TMR isn't?
>>48625779
Don't get a splinter grasping for all those straws anon!

>>48625803
This is the best answer.

>>48625708
>Correct
Nigga just because you don't enjoy it doesn't mean that everyone doesn't enjoy it. That's closed minded and not a good way to think about stuff at all

>>48625689
Learning/understanding music theory really helps.

>>48625760
I mean, I personally don't mind it. It kind of reminds me of Zazen Boys.

I'm not crazy about TMR but it's definitely not mallgoth shit or something you have to force yourself to like.

Shit like The Goslings, HANL, Macintosh Plus. That's all stuff that I feel people would have to force themselves to like.

sachiko m is great

>>48625831
>Nigga just because you don't enjoy
See >>48625828
>That's closed minded and not a good way to think about stuff at all
Enjoying or not enjoying is not the correct way to think about it at all.

>>48625828
I honestly enjoy TMR. That's it. I'm not trying to impress anyone, I'm not forcing it, I just like how the sounds make me feel. I can't force you to believe me, or prove it to you, but why is it so hard to believe that someone likes something?

>>48625828
Not unless you count liking music as pretentious

>>48625828
>Not understanding something as simple as varying opinions.

Grow the fuck up.

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>>48625653
Today is the day /mu/ went too far

>>48625888
>I just like how the sounds make me feel
Oh look!
>What/why do you like the sound?
>Guaranteed you have either a completely ambiguous or a non-answer to that.

>>48625873
>implying there's one correct way to think about art

>>48625904
Some opinions are more correct than others.
>>48625919
Of course there is.

>>48625941
Let me guess. The correct way to think about art just happens to be the way you think about art.

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>>48625941
>Some opinions are more correct than others.

What the fuck do you think this is. Animal Farm?

>>48625915
it's almost like music is subjective and sometimes there aren't hard reasons for liking it

>>48625915
Whatever I say will be made fun of by you anyway. I don't really want to feel bad the rest of the day.

But if you really want an answer then I'll give it to you. I just don't like getting made fun of for liking something, that's all. I probably should' have never posted this anyway

>>48625941
You sound like a trip fag, but you ain't got no trip.

>>48625967
Welcome to 4chan nigga

>>48625622
Marcel + Wondermoose are top-tier avant-teens.

>>48625941
gr8 b8 m8

>>48625961
Not coincidentally I'm the only one here not obsessed with "I enjoy it!" or "I don't enjoy it!"
>>48625975
Isn't there a feel thread you should be posting in?
>>48625979
Your choice
>>48625996
>>>/b/
>>48626010
zzzzzzzz

>>48625775
>I dont want be different from you but dont wanna to change myself to be like you (and so dont be different from you), so please stop liking what I dont like, and so I will be able to be like you
holy shit, i've never seen /mu/ summarized so perfectly

>>48626027

this is an insult, he didn't even put fresh bait on the hook

>>48626027
You're either the greatest baiter or the most pretentious fuck on /mu/.

>>48625854
WEEK-H-END!

>>48625828
What a shitty comeback. I mean, how the FUCK do you get a splinter while grasping for straws? Straws are usually in plastic containers, not boxes. I don't even care about TMR but that was shit.

>>48626145
>I don't even care about TMR
Doubtful

>>48625854
>HANL
i liked them pretty much immediately though. but i'm also sad, so it's different.

>>48625622
donut flow sucks

>>48626153
No seriously. Never heard it in my life, just say this thread as I browsed and saw an interesting discussion which is rare on 4chan.

>>48625622
Avant-Teen is an album by Dan Jordan, released in the summer of 2013 to mixed reviews.
http://tyvmr.bandcamp.com/album/avant-teen

>>48626198
It's not my fault you are daft.

>>48625622
>nobody is allowed to enjoy dissonance
>nobody is allowed to enjoy free music
>nobody is allowed to enjoy weird lyrics
>nobody is allowed to enjoy anything that doesn't stick to standard rock form

>>48626245
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QamU4-8NUw

>>48626214
>using the word daft
>not in the context of daft punk

You might sprain your wrist with all that tipping, anon.

>>48626288
Friendly reminder that "get" posts are against the rules.

>>48626304
But Daft Punk is a fedoracore artist. Nice try anon

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>>48625622
>avant
Avant doesn't mean shit unless it has other french words around it.
Avant teen = Literally no meaning

>>48626388
>advanced teen

>>48626442
>meaning changes on context.
>no french context
>no solid meaning

>>48626469
>what is an idiom

>>48626354
Curses. You got me!

>flies away in my fedoracopter

avant teens are by definition teens, and I'm 20. Ergo I am not an avant teen.

now I'm off to listen to some noise, glitch and EAI

It's an RYM-core maymay.

>>48626514
noise glitch and EAI that I found on RYM specifically

>>48626514
You are still a teenager if you are twenty.

>>48626614
twenty doesn't begin with the suffix "-teen", which by definition disqualifies it from being a "teen" age. also, check em.

>>48626647
Wrong, because since you were never 0 years of age, it is all offset by one year. Kind of like why the year 2000 was still technically the 90s.

This is why age restrictions end at 21.

>>48626068
>holy shit, i've never seen /mu/ summarized so perfectly
this is not /mu/, this is what the average anti-hipsters/nerd are.

this is why hipster and nerd definition change so much, to be able to group everyone that venture at stuff they wont.
And when being a nerd become "not so bad" we started to have hipsters and then we jump into another thing

I don't dig this cultural stigma against people who are young and listen to music that isn't in the top 40 charts and isn't for everyone. Seems pointlessly negative.

>>48626713
Young people are not intelligent enough to really understand what they were listening.

The younger you are and the more complex music you listen to, there's a higher chance you are listening for the wrong reasons. Hence a term was needed to classify this type of individual .

>>48626713
see here

many times it works like that.

some dont hate it but change their ways to be the "average hipster" (whateaver the hell this would be, since there 20+ variatios of the hipster definition) and so be similar to those guys

>>48626679
twenty doesn't end in teen. teenager means your age ends in teen. i was zero years of age when i was born. do you know what logic is?

>>48626027
http://pastebin.com/AJLCA1sz

Again, I'm not professionally trained or anything (but that should be obvious)

This is really embarrassing to post but I may as well be a man about giving some reasons

>>48626830
>twenty doesn't end in teen
Arguing semantics to win an argument?

Also, developmentally there is no difference between a 19 year old and a 20 year old. It's a completely arbitrary definition you invented.

>>48626769
I mean I can see if someone listens to it for significances sake and to look cool, but I don't think its too far fetched to believe that some will geniunely appreciate some of that stuff. And not every teen is lacking in intelligence but I certainly see what you're saying.

>>48626854
Doesn't explain why you like it though. nice try.

>>48626915
>but I don't think its too far fetched to believe that some will geniunely appreciate some of that stuff.
No, not possible.
>And not every teen is lacking in intelligence
Once you get older, you'll see the blunder your comment is.

>>48626906
the entire concept of attaching a number to the amount of time a person has existed is arbitrary. but there's no difference between a twenty-year-old and a 21-year-old, either. it makes no sense to say i was never zero years old, because i was.

>>48626930
>>48626930
Yeah, just as I was re-reading that I realized that it read more as a review on why it's of good quality, not why I personally like it. So sorry about that

though I'm sure you know that it is super hard to say why you enjoy some things? Do you think it did a good job at showing why TMR is good though?

>>48627011
I think it did anon.

>>48627094
thanks

>>48626491
you are

>>48627011
Ok I've played Pachuco Cadaver and the riffs are cool but I don't see how they 'fit' to each other.

After reading this thread:

>/mu/
>being anything but the worst board

>>48627483
I tried writing it out with numbers for each note to show how they kind of fit together but it got way too fucking confusing

Honestly it's just that they work well together. Right as the right melody ends each time the left one will do its syncopated CHUNK CHUNK CHUNK CHUNK part. Kind of just shit like that

It's hard to explain, and maybe try listening to the song again. I could try to be way more specific if you want but I'll end up making a fool out of myself by misusing words like 'syncopated'

>>48627011
>Do you think it did a good job at showing why TMR is good though?
No, it did a good job at showing why one should appreciate it, not enjoy it.

So can someone explain WHY they like something for us then?
Could use some clarification

>>48626980
That's because you are 20 and want to try really hard to not appear as a child.

>>48627917
I tried, but apparently I did it wrong

>>48627922
Shut up

Avant-teen isn't used for stuff like TMR which you could conceivably say sounds good despite being unconventional. It's for stuff that makes very little (if any) sense to be listening to, stuff that entirely lacks anything "pleasant," but is preferred by—out of all people—teenagers on music sites showing off their taste. When asked to explain themselves, they spout some nonsensical philosophy shit or dodge.

Examples:
>Good Morning Good Night
>Solo Violin Improvisations
>Requiem

This applies to film as well, since most avant-teens do the same thing with all mediums.

Examples:
>The Colour of Pomegranates
>Anticipation of the Night
>Meshes of the Afternoon

>>48628288
So people who listen to vaporwave

Hey, my name is Dan. The thread picture is my album cover lol.

>>48628352
No, it's easy to understand vaporwave still sounding "pleasant" because it's "smooth" and "chill" and whatnot.

What I'm talking about is sounds similar to nails on a chalkboard. Violin screeches, pure sine waves in super high pitches, etc.

>>48628382
Examples of albums that are ACTUALLY popular among avant-teens, for people who aren't familiar:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0BciTePrvY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHs0LkixGvY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ELam9zJ7f8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxfUiab3W4Q

If you visit the avant corner of RYM, you will see teenagers giving this music five stars and never writing a word about why.

>>48626679
>you were never 0 years of age
yes you were...

Avant-teen is just a thing on the internet, dont worry, like whatever you like

>>48628496
But second one is lowercase, which could be appealing even for a teen if they listen to it properly.

'avant teen' is just yet another device /mu/ posters use to claim superiority. I've been thinking about the topic for a while now, and I've come to some conclusions:

1. When you admit to liking anything, you give others the opportunity to criticize your taste and make (usually false) assumptions about you. This is why posters who make fun of others are often asked to post their own favorites. They rarely do, because it makes then vulnerable. I rarely visit /fa/, but their "talk shit, post a fit" mentality is somewhat refreshing.

This usually works best when you admit to liking something that someone can easily classify as "pleb music". (people can classify anything as pleb music, but its certainly easier to do with more accessible music.)

If you are claiming to like music that is inaccessible or abrasive ("patrician music"), you can turn the tables.

2. Saying you enjoy something that others dont also gives you power. It lets you claim that others "dont get it" due to a lack of intelligence or artistic prowess.

So this is where "avant teen" comes in. Its based on the ultimate comeback for point 2, which is that people who like what you dont like are merely pretending. This strips them of the power given to them by liking it, and it gives you the power to call them a poser, a wannabe patrician, a hipster, etc. This happens most often with albums like TMR or Faust. It even happens preemptively, like in this thread.

Its all pointless, and it makes up 90% of any thread on /mu/.

>>48628618
You win /mu/.

>>48625728
Why do you enjoy listening to any music at all?

Guaranteed you have either a completely ambiguous or a non-answer to that.
Faggot.

>>48626952
Please stop posting. your pretentiousness is overwhelming.

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>>48628618
>This happens most often with albums like TMR or Faust
Not true at all.
Like I said, it's mostly for non-rock, ACTUAL AVANT-GARDE albums, such as these >>48628496

Non-rock is much harder to understand for /mu/, which is why idiots like you try to pretend rock is the only genre.

"Avant-teen" is mostly a RYM meme associated with certain users and their avant-garde favorites.

In fact, the music doesn't even have to be avant-garde in some cases, it just has to strange and be popular among the avant-garde RYM teen community. Example: Zhou Xuan. It's strange because why would an American teenager in 2014 like Chinese pop from 1930?

>>48627011
I actually hear it anon. I never knew that an explanation would actually help me appreciate this.

>>48628288
>It's for stuff that makes very little (if any) sense to be listening to, stuff that entirely lacks anything "pleasant,"

when talking like this about something so subjective as art and the resulting feelings/emotions from it, you come across like an uneducated and inexperienced moron.

Who the fuck cares if someone in the internet thinks you're only pretending to like the music you listen to? It has zero effect on your real life and the guys shouting avant-teen and stuff like that seem to be the guys who only talk about music and have contact with other music fans in the internet.

tl;dr: nerds trying to make themselves feel better

>>48628908
I didn't say it's impossible, I just said it makes very little sense for some teenagers to feel that way, to be such specials snowflakes that they derive pleasure from nails on a chalkboard.

>>48628590
/thread

imagining people actually getting upset by some idiotic-sounding term like 'avant teen' is sad, but imagining people actually getting upset by other people enjoying certain forms of art and calling those people avant-teens as a way of trying to belittle them is even more sad.

>>48628593
So how do you listen to improvised sine wave beeps "properly?"

>>48628939
>it makes very little sense for some teenagers to feel that way

again, what a completely subjective statement made desperately to sound like its making any valid point at all.

>>48628868
the point about TMR and Faust was really for the whole "say someone is pretending to like something" thing. Not about "avant teen", sorry if that was confusing.

I never said that rock is the only genre, so idk what that's about.

The biggest quostion is why /mu/ cares so much about teenagers and their taste in the internet

>>48625689
Listen to it until you reach a euphoric state

>>48629034
It makes very little sense to the people who call you an avant-teen, which is why they do so. Sorry if your precious feelings got hurt; maybe tumblr would be a better place for you.

>>48629081
They started to post here.

>>48625653
It is true that it has been scientifically proven a lot of those things avant-teens "enjoy" can't actually be enjoyed and you can only pretend you enjoy them. That said, I listen to that kind of music myself but more for the experience than because I "enjoy" it.

>>48629081
Because many threads on /mu/ are dedicated to showing off your taste and people commenting on your favorites, which is where the insult is mostly used.

>>48629125
>implying 4chan hasn't been mostly teenagers since forever

>>48629081
gee, I wonder...

>>48628868
>It's strange because why would an American teenager in 2014 like Chinese pop from 1930?

why the fuck cant they? your mindset on what people are allowed to like or not is alarmingly naive

>>48629081
OP here, I'm not talking about the taste of teenagers and why they have it, more about what an avant-teen is. It's used to describe anyone who likes certain albums or music, regardless of whether they're a teen or not

>>48629170
>a lot of those things avant-teens "enjoy" can't actually be enjoyed and you can only pretend you enjoy them

2/10

>>48628939
Teenagers are fully capable of cognitive thinking too, you know.

>>48629203
Yeah, I didn't aim that post to you, but to all the other people discussing here whether a teenager can or not genuinely enjoy a certain kind of music, which seems to be a very important and serious subject to some people here.

(obviously I'm trying to imply here that /mu/ just has lots of teenagers fighting about their e-cred because it's still an important thing to them)

>>48629170
>That said, I listen to that kind of music myself but more for the experience than because I "enjoy" it.

I find it baffling that you take yourself seriously.

>>48629264
Look I didn't save the links but it's been posted many times before. Also, I'm obviously not talking about stuff like Trout Mask Replica or free improv or that sort of stuff. Everyone enjoys that.

>>48629328
>not listening to all kinds of music at least once
>>>/b/

>>48629452
cute pic

>>48629202
No one said they *can't.* It just causes feelings of bewilderment when someone who shuns popular music at large has popular music—from 80 years ago in a foreign country—among their favorites, and completely without explanation. Avant-teens are known for their obsession with being intellectual, which is why they gravitate towards academic avant-garde music and modern classical, but for some reason they also dot their favorites with the strangest pop music, usually from foreign lands. One can't help but assume it's due to the fact that it makes them look "diverse" and "cultured" and aware of both the scope of time and the scope of the entire Earth. Whether or not that's true I don't know, but a lack of certainty won't make anyone immune from reactionary insults.

This is the silliest discussion I have seen in /mu/ in a while

>>48629467
>completely without explanation

they need to explain themselves? hahaha, oh wow.

>One can't help but assume

here's where you go wrong as well.

>>48628700
Non sequitor

>>48629665
>they need to explain themselves?
Yes. Why wouldn't you?

>>48629170
>can't actually be enjoyed and you can only pretend you enjoy them
like what?

>>48629821
I know what he's talking about. A news article reported on some study where scientists had people listen to Arnold Schoenberg and Luigi Nono among others, and monitored their brain activity. They didn't have the activity where your brain registers something as music, it just did nothing.

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>>48628868
>avant-teen is a RYM meme
no it's not, it's a term coined by /mu/'s teenagers to feel somewhat superior to other teens on another website. if they actually enjoy the music it's irrelevant to the subject. /mu/ talks more about the idiotic term than RYM regulars do
>>48629891
>A news article reported
source?
>They didn't have the activity where your brain registers something as music, it just did nothing
your point?

>>48629891
>They didn't have the activity where your brain registers something as music.
Depends on what kind of music we're talking about, I wouldn't be surprised if different music is experienced by different parts of the brain. For example, the part that registers rhythm doesn't necessarily register other musical elements.

>>48625622
to me it refers to the type of person who constantly churns through unnecessary amounts of art, making sure to let other people know they've been doing so

it's pretty embarrassing

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>>48629891
>be in a scientific experiment about brain activity while listening to music
>have to listen to a normal piece of music as a test first
>no brain activity detected at all
>mfw

>>48629891
Because babbys can't handle anything that is out of their comfort zone.

>>48630786
That doesn't make it music.

>>48630022
he might be talking about this
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/7279626/Audiences-hate-modern-classical-music-because-their-brains-cannot-cope.html

>>48630840
Yes it does.
>20-something male has only listened to radio pop his entire life
>Approaches something radically different
>Is unable to process it

>>48630022
> it's a term coined by /mu/'s teenagers to feel somewhat superior to other teens on another website
Nope, it was invented by the user joy_circumcision in a self-mocking blogpost he wrote.

>>48630926
So silence is music? Random noises is music?

>>48628496
I can understand why one might enjoy 1, 3, and 4, but what's the point of 2?

>>48630983
4'33 is not silence.

>>48630316
thats why I hate these websites where you list every album you have listened to, every movie you've watched, etc. I don't give a fuck about listing every painting Ive viewed and giving it some form of arbitrary "rating", so why would I care about doing this with other artforms? Fuck off.

>>48630983
You might be retarded.

The average person wouldn't process traditional foreign music as music, because they don't use the same scales as us, and they follow a different structure.

Today's pop music wouldn't be considered music 500 years ago.

>>48630995
Weird, 2 is the only one that sounds slightly pleasant to me.

There are many reviews here with very high or perfect scores awarded:
https://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/sachiko_m_toshimaru_nakamura_otomo_yoshihide/good_morning_good_night/

Some of them make very little sense to me, though.
>this sine waves signifies the lack of reality. low frequencies signifies loss of importance of the self. if you believe communism capitalism god etc or if you are living to get a new car or for the tv show you gonna watch tomorrow dont listen to this record. you cant appereciate this recording or you gonna just pretend due to its popularity.
^Fifteen favorites

> Perfect ragas of the new millennium.
^Eleven favorites

>>48631039
No I am actually referring to silence, not 4'33
>>48631071
Quote me where I said "foreign music"

>>48631175
>No I am actually referring to silence, not 4'33
So what artist are you talking about? The Gerogerigegege's statement releases?

>>48631175
You may actually be illiterate
READ. IT. AGAIN

>>48630903
>because their brains cannot cope
this is very different from "it's not music, anyone that listens to this is only pretending"

>>48631210
How so? explain.

>>48631202
>So what artist are you talking about?
I'm not referring to an artist at all. Just random sounds, which the brain does not register as music.

>>48631125
>^Fifteen favorites
This reviewer more than likely did not comprehend what he listened to and only holds a false sense of superiority

>>48631043
exactly. these websites seem to be made for people who want to brag about what they consume or define themselves by what they consume. it's actually pretty much the same thing.

>>48625653
Jesus Christ

TMR is one of the most enjoyable albums I've ever heard. I can't be the only one who thinks that?

I'm literally a pleb, my favorite bands are radiohead and animal collective. But tmr is fucking good (after a few listens of course)

Just admit you don't get the album instead of spouting bullshit. You look like an idiot

>>48631251
READ.IT.AGAIN
I.ALREADY.EXPLAINED.IT

>>48631297
https://rateyourmusic.com/~MarcelsMusicJournal this kid for example

He's 14 years old for christ's sake and look at this shit. Plus, the reviews he does have suck

>>48631302
You haven't even identified which person you were I was replying to.

Either way you seem to be confused, so see >>48631271

>>48631271
>Just random sounds, which the brain does not register as music.
Anything can be processed as music if you move beyond conventional categories. Same thing as with paintings.

>>48631300
>enjoyable
Not the correct way to listen to it.
>Just admit you don't get the album
I really appreciate the album if that's what you mean.

>>48631366
>Anything can be processed as music
If there wasn't an artist to create it, then no.

Which is why found sound in a clinical survey is not music.

>>48631361
USE.THE.FUCKING.LINKS
>>48631071

>>48631434
Still waiting for you to quote me where I was discussing music, let alone foreign music.

>>48631377
What? Music is meant to be enjoyed. I am pretty sure captain Beefheart and the band intended people to enjoy their music, not appreciate it in some detached intellectual way. It's a goofy psychedelic rock album

>>48631481
Yeah, you are fucking illiterate.

>>48631393
>If there wasn't an artist to create it, then no.
Well that's just, like, your mental limit, maaan.
No, seriously, why would you need an author? E.g. what you see in nature sometimes has an aesthetic value very similar to a painting or a photo.

I saw a listmania on Amazon in 2004 titled "how to be the weird kid at your school" or some shit and it had TMR at the end of the list. Just so you know this isn't a /mu/ thing. People here are so deluded.

>people still thinking Beefheart is remotely inaccessible when non-rock avant-garde music made from dissonant sounds has been posted ITT

who are some RYMers that are considered avant-teens?

>>48631497
How so? Explain
>>48631510
Because it doesn't become art until an artist creates it.
>what you see in nature sometimes has an aesthetic value very similar to a painting or a photo.
Pareidolia =/= art

>>48631698
>Because it doesn't become art until an artist creates it.
Why do you need an author, seriously? Things don't need an intention behind it to have a meaning.

>>48631648
Note that it isn't avant-teen until you start edging on level 5. Some level 4 stuff may be called avant-teen by people who are on very low levels, but it's not till level 5 that you will be consistently in danger of being called an avant-teen.
>>48631676
https://rateyourmusic.com/find_similar_users?user=AntiWarhol

>>48625854
I fucking loves Macintosh Plus at first lesson. It's very relaxing and carries a heavy base. It's has a thick, dreamy quality to it that I like a lot.

>>48625999
wait Wondermoose is an actual known person or whatever?


I got a friend request from him on last.fm a few months ago and I was confused as shit as to why some 15 year old who clearly only wanted to look "cultured" for his musical tastes would add me

>>48631873
How the fuck is Wondermoose an avant-teen? He doesn't even deserve that label because he doesn't listen to avant-garde music outside of like two albums. Even people who are only low-level avant-teens like Notebooks look down on him.

>>48631917
I don't know what you are saying or how it applies to my question

>>48631977
>clearly only wanted to look "cultured" for his musical tastes
He only likes standard /mu/core. There's nothing "cultured' about anything in his favorites.

Compare his favorites to something like
https://rateyourmusic.com/collection/Prisismae/r5.0

>>48631744
Just because you think there is meaning in something, doesn't mean there is

>>48632319
Yeah, so? Your point would be valid if art would exist by itself in the world outside of any perception.

>>48632522
It doesn't.

>>48625622

I have literally never heard anyone say "avant-teen" outside of /mu/.

>>48632556
That's my point.

The point of Duchamp's urinal was that he took something with traditionally non-artistic meaning and put it in an artistic context.
Would it stop being an art piece if nobody else saw it? To him there was no external author, he was an author and a consumer at the same time. You can do the same thing with any sound. You might not find some sounds as musical as others, but there will be no need to bring an author figure into the question.
Or to put it another way, everything you experience already has an author via you experiencing it in such and such way, your experience being based on your culture, language, etc... which give the necessary meaning and context to everything.

just listen to dull, generic, derivative "world" music and improvisation and you can become a true patrician

>>48633064
>The point of Duchamp's urinal was that he took something with traditionally non-artistic meaning and put it in an artistic context.
But he was an artist, thus making it art (because an artist created it)
>Would it stop being an art piece if nobody else saw it?
Not relevant
>You can do the same thing with any sound.
As long as someone is specifically creating the sound to be art
>You might not find some sounds as musical as others
I like that you still think that's what we are talking about
>but there will be no need to bring an author figure into the question.
For it to be art, we do
>everything you experience already has an author
The wind? No. A rock falling onto the ground and making a thud? No.

>>48631648
gotta love how albums randomly chosen from AntiWarhols 4.5s and 5s are considered the highest tier of "patrician" when the people making this chart don't have a clue about any of the genres those albums are from

>>48633218
Come on, anon, you're just repeating everything you've already said without any development.
>The wind? No. A rock falling onto the ground and making a thud? No.
The way we experience those things and attach meaning to it - it does have an author, the author being our conception of it. There is no sound without someone experiencing it.
And I don't need to make a hole in a concert hall and "officially" call the sound of rain falling art. By just listening and emphasizing certain elements of the sound to myself, it already becomes art. Not to say that I will necessarily find it good or interesting - maybe I don't know how to properly listen to texture yet and put too much emphasis on melody or rhythm, so I will find the rain sounds rather dull.

>>48628496
4 is pretty spooky

>>48633592
>Come on, anon, you're just repeating everything you've already said without any development.
Well I only work as hard as my opponent
>it does have an author, the author being our conception of it. There is no sound without someone experiencing it.
That's essentially bullshit propaganda non-artists implement to make themselves a part of a process they have no place being in the first place. It's like saying "The critic is the real artist". Give me a break. The logical conclusion of this faulty train of thought is EVERYTHING is art, which delineates the actual work artists put into their craft.

>>48633723
Well there is good and bad art and different contexts, different positions of experience, etc., it's pretty stupid to equalize all art.

>>48633963
Which is why the notion of the "Death of the artist" is completely antiquated, and we must always consider the artist's intent. When we do that, we realize art can only be art if the artist intended it to be.

In this case, scientists using found sound in a laboratory is not music.

>>48626679
I think like you, but nobody ever understands me. To me 2010 was the last year of the 2000's. My 20's were my last year of being a teen and the XXI century began after midnight dec 31 2000.

On the topic of avant teenness: It means being able to listen to a lot of avant garde music without really understanding what's good about it. I was an avant teen once, I enjoyed noise, downloaded shit ton of unlisteable music and listened to it. I've been going back to this avant garde music lately, I'm 28 now, and I feel like my appreciation of music is much more refined now and is easier to discern what's worth listening to.

>>48634046
Sure, but I'm saying you have too limited conception of author. You seem to think that author can only be external and not internal to the perceiver himself. I'm not claiming that someone's experience of sound is automatically good art, most people can't bring their perception of the surroundings to anything beyond banal unless someone else does the work for them.

>>48634301
We will have to agree to disagree

>>48631359
Nothing wrong with a 14 year old liking music more than you. His taste is not even that avant-garde.

>>48633122
WHERE DO I START?

>>48631648
Implying Henry Flynt is weirder than Vision Creation Newsun
kek

people that listen to avant-garde or obscure music to appear cultured/different

they usually are in their late teens early 20s