Game where you actually get to climb into a mech and personally stop around are rare yeah. On the other hand games with /m/ elements of some sort in them are common as hell, since /m/ is the domain of everything from spaceships to power armor.
>>11209265 >What is Mech Warrior Online? What is Strike Suit Zero? Both huge letdowns, one with a weak fart and the other with a colossal rotting corpse that will stain the ground for years to come. Neither even managed to present a worthwhile entry to the genres they tried to revive, much less succeeded at continuing the tradition.
>>11209533 I dunno, SSZ managed to get an arcade scoreboard mode going and a Director's Cut. It isn't ideal, but it isn't nothing.
Nothing but shame for MWO though. Sad that FlyingDebris got his art shackled to that POS, he really deserved better. But then again, not really anybody's fault but PGI's that they outright lied and turned their backs.
I guess there is something about widespread mech usage that doesn't sit well with the western crowd. Maybe it's too much for their suspense of disbelief.
That is not to say they don't like giant robots in general, hell there are a few things as powerful as a sigh of a mechanical giant staring you down. When a mech shows up on the scene you know shit is about to get serious, but I guess that it the extend of their role - being a spectacle rather than the main hero.
>>11209561 Yeah but there's like 200 of us so they'd be cooking for an empty kitchen. Logically it wouldn't be hard and you could probably even pull it off in Unity or something, like Lift did years ago. Problem is that it's only "easy" in the sense that you don't have to pay thousands for a development kit- it still takes time, skills and assets.
Mechs in western fiction are always depicted as being something incredibly advanced or needlessly extravagant and eccentric, so they are usually reserved for aliens or villains. You are more likely to find yourself fighting against them rather than with them.
>>11209610 Strike Suit Zero Titan Fall Hawken Mechwarrior Online Lost Planet and Front Mission Evolved If you include indie titles that number will jump to include stuff like MAV.
I'm not saying that these games aren't shit, but I'm also not saying that big-time Western developers have ever really made mecha titles to begin with. Right now sci-fi seems to be getting popular again, so maybe we'll get lucky?
>>11209630 But anon, Lost Planet is by Capcom. I kid, I know you mean it's western style mecha in general.
But good god all of these games... >Strike Suit Zero Couldn't decide what the fuck it wanted to be, absolutely no physical weight to any of the hit detection, wasted Kokia's vocals and couldn't even manage something resembling a plot. Whole thing came off more as a game made by a few Tumblrtards.
>Titan Fall Everything fucking wrong with Western devs/media regarding mecha ever and to further add insult into injury the mechs suck in this game. They could've simply left them out.
>Hawken Game at it's core is a fantastic arena shooter but completely dead and wasted. Userbase is anemic, updates are nowhere, devs have spent 3 years and $20mil+ making something that can be barely considered a tech demo. Plus the final nail in the coffin they ban all monetary agreements on the game, meaning no publicity, no advertisement, no LP's, no competitive gaming endorsement.
>Mechwarrior Online If there ever was a fine example of a dev who should actually be legally vulnerable to a lawsuit by trading standards this game would be it. It is almost criminal they are allowed to continue doing the things they do as a registered business. Also the game is pretty much awful anyway.
>>11212623 Titanfall's gunplay is CODeque, but the reason COD is bad is because of the cramped levels and razor-thin TTKs. Titanfall improves on its failures by adding the jetpacks and open spaces. Unfortunately the price is quite steep for a game that's so lacking in variety.
>>11209280 One of the great things that Lost Planet and Titanfall had in common was the on-and-off style of play.
You start off on foot and it's just another shooter and all's well. Then you find your mech and it's Rock and Roll time. Eventually, you're mech gets busted.No problem, just eject and you're back to fighting on foot.
The mechs themselves aren't unstoppable, you can kill them on foot but being in one is a huge advantage.
>>11212691 >Whole thing came off more as a game made by a few Tumblrtards I don't understand this assertion. Has tumblr earned a reputation for making half-assed space shooters and being heavy on torpedo cover? Seems more like a typical Kickstarter letdown to me.
>>11212691 >Everything fucking wrong with Western devs/media regarding mecha ever and to further add insult into injury the mechs suck in this game.
Opinions. You're also blatantly wrong saying that Titans suck. They can very easily mitigate whatever threat pilots actually pose and plenty of the Titan weapons can kill pilots in one shot.
In fact, a lot of people seem to have the notion that Titanfall is "CoD with double jump and bad mechs". It's really not. If anything, It's a game about going fast that somewhat approaches the feel of an older arena style shooter at times. The movement system has much more depth to it than people think by being easy to get into with wallruns but hard to master with its strafejumping and bunnyhopping (since it runs on Source). If you're good at the game you can go really, very fast and rip people to pieces with the shotgun as you go.
The mech designs themselves look great and they play decently, as well. There's some immersion elements at work with the cockpit view, embarking/disembarking and the like and they're pretty agile.
You'd also be surprised by the amount of weebs on the dev team and Eastern references in game
>>11212681 Well, we also had Battle Engine Aquila, Gun Metal, Slave Zero, Future Cop LAPD, G-Nome ,Shattered Steel, Cyberstorm, and 2 more games I used to play years ago but I can't remember for the life of me.
I'm not saying it's a lot, but this theme is popular enough to pop-up every now and then. We still have a better tracking record than let's say space sims these days.
>>11212751 >You'd also be surprised by the amount of weebs on the dev team and Eastern references in game They come as a pretty huge surprise, considering how weird they were about admitting it before the game's release. If nothing else, they sure put a lot of effort into marketing it as CoD with different powerups.
>>11212794 And that's just how things has to be, I suppose. Marketing left a lasting, negative stigma upon the game and many will keep dismissing it as just another CoD clone.
However, It's been a nice experience playing with others over on /tfg/ and discovering new mechanics in the game. Such as propelling pilots with Titan ordnance, a form of rocket jump. As stupid as it sounds and take it as you will, but there's like a single digit percentage who'll ever get to experience "true" Titanfall.
>>11212860 I still remember a few years back when people were trying to argue that Battletech was super realistic because melee combat was implausible, and only weebshit would have pilots close in and hit each other with swords.
I kinda wonder why melee didn't make it into the Mechwarrior games. DFA and ramming were pretty popular concepts, so a close-range "punch that fucker" button and a set of melee weapons would've been a really interesting addition.
>>11212945 It's funny how people complain about Titanfall being CoD with mechs, but Shogo is considered a classic even though it didn't even bother to wear the mech skin all that well. Blowing open a seven-story apartment building to find a big hollow concrete box with a switch on the floor is one of the most disappointing experiences I've ever had with a video game.
>>11212939 Well, the 'Mechs that focused on melee/short range combat like the hatchetman, as far as I'm concerned were primarily for urban scenarios. You know, where it can be a bit tricky to hit people with LRM salvos and PPC blasts. Clanners weren't huge fans of melee/hand actuators either because "muh efficiency".
At least Spheroids realised that sometimes you just gotta' slap a bitch.
Anyone here who's played Heavy Gear 2's space levels KNOWS that the world is being deprived of a proper space robot sim-like game. Those three levels, as awesome as they are, are not enough to satisfy that itch.
You'd think someone would have made one around 2000 or so.
>>11213536 That's addressed in the backstory; after the First and Second Succession Wars, a lot of the factories capable of building spare parts or new ones for complex things like targeting systems were nuked out of existence. Add in ComStar deliberately assassinating people trying to reclaim the tech and you've got issues.
Remember, before the clan invasion, a battlemech was usually hundreds of years old and by owning one, a family was considered nobility. That targeting computer had probably been burnt out centuries ago and entire generations had piloted that machine without even knowing it existed.
Check the steam greenlit games for mech/robot. There like 5 games they're making, one that's called beyond flesh and blood or something g like that? Plus project nimbus and another one I can't remember.
>>11212773 >We still have a better tracking record than let's say space sims these days Uh, no? If you're going to include everything under the sun, Space Sim has the Mecha genre beat. Just look at a list of space sims released from 2000 to 2014 and compare it to Mecha's.
>>11225471 Titans of Steel! Make a crew and get deployed on missions so you can pay for your monthly expenses. Unfortunately, the game is designed after Battletech's rules somewhat, so you get really powerful weapons that can potentially 4 shot an opponent but even with max skills you will miss a lot. Also, deploying more than 3 mechs is a chore in the battlefield because it's turn based in a very functional yet worst kind of way.
If you're thinking something along the lines of >>11227074 then The Precursors might be enjoyable.
Games dedicated to mech combat are fairly rare, but I've noticed that there are quite a lot of major games that have mech sections in them. Killzone, gears of war, halo, titanfall, F.E.A.R., they're everywhere.
>>11228348 With the western indie scene, it's much more plausible than it was a few years ago.
Like wise, Front Mission always had a slant more towards the "Walking Tank" side of mecha instead of the fast-moving assault mechs of more Japanese influence. So a indie with a decent budget could definitely do it.
>>11229362 It's because they wanted to differentiate themselves from the MechWarrior franchise in which people pilot 'Mechs.
That's why they made such a big deal about the word "mech". iirc their blurb was worded to essentially put down MechWarrior and pat themselves on the back. But looking at MWO I guess maybe that's deserved a little.
>>11230567 Their use of the word "mech" offended many on /m/ who took it to mean big robot in general, and you are correct that Titanfall did not invent robots that fast and powerful but that's not quite what the devs were trying to say. I reiterate that the Titanfall devs were specifically picking a fight with MechWarrior/Battletech 'Mechs, saying that Titanfall has big robots but they're not slow like a battlemech.
the devs making a whole big deal about the word "mech" was because they're picking a fairly well-known western franchise with giant robots and telling people that they can do it better. Put down your competition to make yourself look better. In their situation I understand the need to differentiate Titanfall from similar things but I think they did it poorly and made themselves look like dicks.
>>11230567 >>11230282 If anything, It's just that they had a "fun things are fun" mindset to it all. In the fluff they also mention that the Titans are the evolution of fledgling exoskeletons which to some level reflects that they intended Titans to be an extension of the player/pilot rather than a big stompy robot. They're not jet fighters but still quite agile.
I'd assume that they just wanted to avoid using the word "mech" because they believed that the word projected a negative image for most people in the West. I play both AC and MW so I don't really "discriminate".
>>11230567 It's one side panel in a preview article in a physical magazine (who even reads those anymore?), taken at the time when this game's hype was at it's highest peak. Can there be any kind of PR excreta that deserves less attention?
You are piloting a wonderful legged vehicle with an incredible range of possibility, motion, cross country capability and outside the box tactic (deploying fix weapon, shooting from cover...etc).
How do you use it ? Like a 360° tank on a flat ground with a few obstacle you don't just "hop over" but fly over using thruster that could be mounted on anything else. And when you aren't running on flat grounds you are hovering/skiing/driving around.
Because you can't play a realistic mech game with a simple controller. You don't have enough inputs. Movement is also slow on controllers, so 2D maps work better. Destructible environments also take a lot of power, which consoles don't have. Look at BF4 maps compared to BF2 maps, for an example.
It's no coincidence that the end of mech games ended when developers went console focused in the early 2000's.
>>11233503 Never, he isn't into PC game. Hell, I actually wonder if he ever played something in his life besides some PSone with me. He didn't even play when he brought me to the arcades, just spent and watched.
>>11212735 >You start off on foot and it's just another shooter and all's well
It's not. Titanfall's infantry combat feels more like a modern spin on oldschool arena shooters. Even the levels, albeit bigger, are geared that way. The game is a LOT better than people give it credit for.
>>11234404 I totally agree with that, it was a good justification for old system. But even if graphic evolved incredibly and we start seeing physics becoming more and more present, the gameplay itself didn't changed much. Mechs are "point moving in a 2D world like a human character". Worse, mech game are a niche, so it's incredible Steel Battalion even existed.
>>11234369 I'm disappointed by many, even if I still enjoy them. Even the one that are basically magic flying mech like Zone of the Enders/
>>11233949 More like a simulation that justify mech having arms. My wish would be a "Spintires" game with Military mech from Patlabor.
>>11233864 That did always bother me about mechwarrior games. From my perspective in the cockpit, I am driving a tank with a shitty turret that can't turn all the way around. Some of the tanks have jets to fly into the air a little. There was really nothing about the gameplay that had anything to do with my vehicle having legs.
>>11235556 I liked it, but eventually ragequit over like the 10th shitty escort mission.
Personally I'm of the opinion that mecha simply does not translate into a satisfying real time experience for the vast majority of players. There's just too many inconsistencies in the physics that they demand.
-If you make the mecha sufficiently agile (Heavy Gear), you're essentially playing scaled up humanoids, and that raises the question of why bother with mecha in the first place?
-If the mecha are big and stompy (like in Mechwarrior Online), players will optimize towards pinpoint shooting, turning games into a duck-and-cover long-range sniper duel, much like modern tank battles. This simply illustrates that a 10-ft tall bipedal war machine is an awful fighting platform. There's a reason why MBT design and tactics have progressed the way they have - it just makes sense to mount a single really big, accurate, long-ranged weapons than a multitude of smaller guns, because shooting without getting hit generally trumps shooting it out.
If the mecha fly with boosters (ala Armored Core), or skate on wheels (ala Front Mission), this raises the question of why even build a war machine with legs in the first place? Isn't the whole point of legs that you walk with them?
I think mecha actually shine in the strategy/tactics genre, where the thorny question of how you actually fight effectively with them in a real-time environment is conveniently sidestepped, but strategy as a genre is somewhat in decline.
>>11237515 I think those reasons are largely why Western mecha in games tend to be the way they are. Western games in general tend to derive gameplay largely based on the playable character. It reminds me of an interview with the Insomniac developers on why they abandoned the Spyro franchise and let Universal find other developers. The gist of it was that Spyro, as a quadrupedal character, was unable to use weapons like a bipedal character would, and they were itching to do a game based on weapons. which is why their next major franchise would be Ratchet and Clank.
Meanwhile, Japanese companies are fine with having characters in a variety of games. Even in his inception, Mario was being used for a variety of games with different gameplay.Sure it was just platformers at first, but then you had Mario puzzle games and stuff like the Game and Watch titles, and later the sports games.
Which isn't to say there aren't exceptions, but generally I find that Western developers want concepts to feel tied to the style of gameplay.Clunky, slow chicken walker types feel more obviously like robots than super robot types, which might as well be normal size cyborgs/ninjas/whatever in terms of gameplay.
>>11237742 I'm not sure if the Spyro/Mario comparison is a fair one.
Mario's mostly humanoid and thus can participate in a lot of games that demand humanoid functions - golf, tennis, kart racing, etc. Other Western developers have put mascot characters into all sorts of spinoff material.
Developer just lack the incentive to try something new, and if they have it, they keep it simple, thinking that casual are too stupid to be worth the effort.
>>11237515 Your first point is a perfectly viable way to make a mech-game as long as the "humanoid mech" can do things that is inhuman in nature but require a limbed machine.
The second point is more tricky, but you could still make it relevant if you ever had to move in harsh (more complex) environment with big obstacle, steep slope, and required tactic, scale or equipment unavailable or unpractical for human or tracked vehicle. For now such obstacle course are limited to FPS or platform-game where special move are important feature.
The last point lead to the first.
All this can be inconsequential if one dare creating a grossly coherent in-universe reason for mech design, however studio won't put money into details if it limit the possibility for sequel. So we either get a new gameplay but a nonsensical universe, or a (relatively) good universe with a simple but overused gameplay.
Those problems stay in Strategy game. Mech are treated like any other unit and rarely get special use adapted to their nature (like climbing or passing obstacle) How many time have I seen walker being stuck by lowly obstacle because they were just tank in disguise ? How many time have I seen walker incapable of climbing a slope intended to be obstacle for any "ground-type vehicle" ?
The game itself wasn't very good, but I was surprised to discover in Battlezone 2 that the Xion mech could actually climb over cliffs in a game where the use of terrain can be important.
>>11237742 >The gist of it was that Spyro, as a quadrupedal character, was unable to use weapons like a bipedal character would, and they were itching to do a game based on weapons Haha ho wow, what a bunch of unimaginative incompetent morons. Surely it's not possible to make him hold weapons in its jaw or mount them on its back. I know the industry was full of retards but I wasn't expecting it to be that bad.
>>11238594 I don't have preference, I just want mecha game to make you feel like you are piloting something.
I started with Mechwarrior 3 and Armored Core, Battlezone felt "mecha" because not only you could move in all direction but you had inertia and optionally could hop out the vehicle. I've seen Half-life mods for Mecha that had meaningful mode-change, Old Gundam for PS2 that required to really maneuver around...etc
Sometime its just the immersion that pose problem. You have the mech-looking machine, you have a gameplay that isn't bad, but you just feel playing a FPS, a fantasy RPG or driving a tank.
Of course I do have a wish (aka : game I have better luck to do myself). A game of Patlabor-like military mech, you would have a quasi-support role helping infantry, switching weapon and role, doing anti-air for tank, ambushing enemy from unexpected terrain, clearing obstacle or even doing recon because just moving the mech around would be interesting. Oh and lastly you would have 5 different models from spider-mech to legged-gunship an humanoid for different game experience.
If at least the gameplay was great I wouldn't care much with cheap-trick to keep the player alive (so don't bother telling me "mech can't be real", that's not the point).
Holy shit, how do you even beat the Arena in AC: Project Phantasma without Human Plus? Even with human plus a lot of these guys are difficult since they're all human plus wielding Karasawas and moonlights among other heavy back mounted weapons
>>11244762 But you need human plus for that unless you're a quad leg, in which case you're too slow to dodge all of their shit or get them in your sights. Some of these fuckers are crazy fast. The only way I beat them was to get the highest end dual back missiles and blast them from the sky
>>11209220 Because it requires too much money and effort to market a mech-centric game, and when it does exist, is usually just an accessory to a game system that will actually sell. Look at Titanfall (yeah, yeah, it's not /m/) and the upcoming Call of Duty with it's power armor. The mechs in Titanfall are just accessories to the otherwise typical FPS games, and in Cawadooty, it's just flavor designs to theme up the setting.
>>11212735 Titanfall plays like Halo with Mantis units available for half of each starting team, only with customization.
>>11209220 Because Westerners want instant action. They don't want to spend time kitting out their mech or tuning and tweaking the finer elements, when all they have to do is swap weapons/jobs/armor then hit go.
The limit at which most Westerners seem to draw the line at is the basic customization level, whether it's customizing a spacecraft or some terrestrial vehicle.
Actually adding armor to specific locations instead of just a general armor boost item? Too complicated.
Planning how much ammo can be carried instead of just having fixed ammo and a general ammo boost item? Too complicated.
Weight distribution affecting handling beyond basic movement? Too complicated.
Because stomping around in a robot wrecking things doesn't make for long term sales; moreso, when there's limitations on them. People have come to expect robots being either EVIL or capable of taking on entire armies with ease. Balancing a game that would allow for a certain degree of feeling like a war god while still keeping some limitations is rather difficult, as opposed to balancing a ship or tank, which have their own preconceived notions of how they are expected to operate (and have far less expectations).
Which is unfortunate; Robot Alchemic Drive + Pacific Rim seems like such a perfect fusion for being a hulking avatar beating the shit out of monsters, with possible collateral damage, and a simple but straightforward equipment loadout.
>>11237515 Actually, if you've played Heavy Gear (esp with a flight stick) you'd know the game is nothing like controlling a human. The way the gears accelerate and slow down, the turning circles at different speeds, the various sensors, comms and weapon systems, stances, etc.
Maybe someone already addressed it, but there are all these claims about mecha being dead in the west, can someone tell me what all the huge glut of mecha games are in the east that we are all missing. I can only think of Armored Core V, and VD, recent EDF sorta counts, Couple of Gundam dynasty warriors, and one or two strange little F2P online fighter games. What new and exciting Mecha IP have come out recently in the East, I think mecha games are dead period.
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