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Iliad
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>gods

What was the point? What were they even doing there? The narrative would be improved a thousandfold without literal deus ex machinas out of the ass and muh ALL ACCORDING TO KEIKAKU Zeus bullshittery

Why did Homer use them at all?
>>
Think of them as similar to a greek chorus. They mirror the action of the central plot using a different set of metaphors and give it another dramatic layer using the relationships between the characters.

Just don't it too literally, man. This is literature.
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>>7634086
There was some awful fucking movie with a big star studded cast that tried to do this.

Turns out the idea is shit.
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>what cut you looking for fa.m?
>OP: Just pleb my shit up
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>>7634086
This is literally like asking why mention Christianity in a novel
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the consequential world of men is mirrored by the inconsequential world of the gods, whose games and petty rivalries are our wars and tragedies, and who wield mortals like toys to spite one another and amuse themselves
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>>7634118
I actually liked that film. Flawed, sure, and it could never be very faithful, but I thought it captured Hector and Achilles pretty nicely. Felt like there were some nice nods to the source too, like when Achilles tells his men they are lions.
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>>7634086
It amazes me that /his/ is too stupid to ask these questions, and that /lit/ is too self involved to place themselves in another society or mindset.

Dark age Greece is alien to your conceptions. Gods literally existed for them. Shit, in the second century AD magic was a given. You cant come at this from the perspective of a 21st century autist.
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>>7634254
Best analysis so far.
Also remember that the Gods were an explanation for the metaphysical relationships of things; justice was not just human but godly to the Greeks
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>>7634086
They are there to explain the inexplicable, crazy events that take place.

Also >>7634254.

The reason Achilles was so different from the rest of the characters is because he was acting like a God. He didn't think about the consequences of his actions, he just did what he wanted, regardless of who got in his way. He was completely self-assured, and just wanted to have the most glory (sounds familiar, right?).
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>>7634086
>Iliad
>narrative
I don't think the ancient greeks would have agreed with you on what's good narrative.
Also it's from fucking oral tradition.
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>>7635100
Since when is justice human to us? Haven't you read too many court-thrillers perhaps?
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Read Hamilton's The Greek Way for an old introduction into how alien Greek thought & culture is to ours, then read Dodds' The Greeks and the Irrational for more alien culture
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>>7635463
The ancient greeks are less alien to us then some tribalfucks in the middle of Brazil nowadays.
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For drama. It's implied that bards back then didn't really focus on making their own completely new stories, but taking existing popular known stories and presented them in their own polished-verse and few added unique details to impress others. Just like how he refers to other mythical events of the Theban War and the accomplishments of Heracles. The Gods also likely played a huge role in the main-source he took from, as it was probably remembered more as "that war where the Gods got involved and chose opposing sides of each other" instead of that "war where Achilles kicked a lot of ass".

From an anthropological standpoint, it's common for people in early developing civilizations to make-up myths to rationalize the world and workings around them and why they occur.
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>>7634593
>>7634118
As a loose adaptation for the lay person it was an excellent attempt, especially when you consider what has been done in mythology/historic films.

The exclusion of the Olympians saved it from becoming a clusterfuck of plot points and made the plights of the Achilles and Hector more potent and absolute.

It would be a very different film if Achilles+Patroclus theorists had been indulged.
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>>7635459
Law is made and withheld by humans. Or do you suffer from monotheistic indoctrination placing government above all?
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>>7635519
>brazilian natives
no we dont have that anymore we killed most of them and forcefully brought CIVILIZATION AND DEMOCRACY to what remained
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>>7634086

one interpretation, which happens to have historical evidence backing it up, and one which I find interesting, is that the gods of Olympus were a metaphor for the oligarchs and tyrants of pre-classical Greece who, through their incessant, irrational war warfare, plunged Greece into a dark age which for around 300 years. During this time the Mycenaeans lost their language and literature, until they adopted the Phoenician alphabet. It's what people in the /lit/ biz call kind of a big deal.
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>>7636161
Really? Source please? That does sound interesting
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>>7635786
I think anon was just talking about brazilians
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>>7635519

What does that have to do with anything? It's relative, we're not comparing ourselves to Brazilian natives we're comparing ourselves to the Greeks, and it is undeniable that there are major cultural differences - regardless of whether or not there are greater differences between us and other cultures.
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>>7635769
And since when is law justice?
>>7635529
>the bards
Use the right term, it doesn't cost anything.
>>7635786
You mean the ones that eat human flesh or the ones that collect shrunk human heads?
>>7636732
Time, nigga, nowadays space theoretically doesn't make any difference. Even with all our differences we can still easily relate to the ancient greeks a thousand times more than to some dumbfuck in the middle of the jungle today.
Is this something that should require an explanation?
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>>7636716
Well, it's not. Most of the shows we watch and the music we listen is american; we inevitably borrowed good part of the american culture.
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It's not fiction. The Homeric Poet was telling the story as he or she believed it happened exactly.
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>>7636716
I wasn't.
>>7636755
I'm not a burger though.
>>7636764
Who told you this bullshit? This guy >>7635529 was spot on. What mattered was how you told the story. Everyone had already heard that story a thousand times already.
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>>7636161
Could you provide source?
It looks bullshitty
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>>7636161
Idk man, that might fit but people really believed in the gods. Plutarch speculates extensively on the obsolescence of the gods in his lifetime, before that it is generally regarded that the gods would appear and speak to men, to the degree that matters of politics could be swayed by reports of a peasant encounter with Pan. A story without gods would probably ring hollow to ancient Grecian ears.
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>>7636161
Source? If your evidence is just that "oligarchs and tyrants of pre-classical Greece" " through their incessant, irrational war warfare, plunged Greece into a dark age which for around 300 years", then I'm calling bullshit.

(Mind, Herodotus presents the idea that Homer and Hesiod were inventors of the gods.)
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