>The OECD Adult Skills Survey shows that 17.9% or about 1 in 6, Irish adults are at or below level 1 on a five level literacy scale. Ireland ranks 15th out of 24 participating countries. At this level a person may be unable to understand basic written information. https://www.nala.ie/literacy/literacy-in-ireland
>>7619140 >According to a study conducted in late April by the U.S. Department of Education and the National Institute of Literacy, 32 million adults in the U.S. can't read. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/06/illiteracy-rate_n_3880355.html
On a per-capita basis I would agree Ireland has an astounding literary tradition but they have us to thank for that. If it wasn't for us, their most patrician neighbors, they wouldn't even be speaking English and still be wearing burlap sacks and eating their leather boots If it wasn't for us they wouldn't have anything tragic and depressing to write poems and plays about either.
By virtue of the fact that Ireland was British until 1916 (or whenever), it is only logical to say that all pre 1916 "Irish" authors were in fact English. Joyce, Yeats, Wilde etc. All subjects of His Majesty
>>7619156 It just seems that way because of the power of American media. Is Faulkner better than Woolf? Or Hemingway better than Lawrence? Not really, but they have more of a legend surrounding them so it just seems that way to laymen.
>>7619298 I think Americans have Hemingway and Steinbeck for Lawrence and Orwell -- which is not a fair trade -- but on the other side of it, I would say that Gertrude Stein is just as good of a writer, but didn't Woolf's glorious critical streak. I would honestly say that Jack Kerouac is the best of the bunch. He's the American Proust, really, and does Britain have a Proust?
>>7619322 I personally rate Woolf right alongside Joyce and Proust. And I'm sorry but I can't agree with you re. Kerouac. I somewhat enjoy the tone of his work but his syntax and figurative language are crude and there's not that much to think about.
>>7619329 In his best works, the ones that were basically proof-edited first drafts, Kerouac traded immediate syntactic control for an unrestrained stream of consciousness with which he was trying to express his reality, and the beauty he creates he does the same way as Dante, by the contrast between the perspective of Kerouac as he lived it and Kerouac the writer, later on.
And his major works, his 'Duluoz Legend,' is basically his attempt at La Comedie Humaine and the Proust formula.
The reason I say all this is not because I'm desperate to make the case for Kerouac as a world-beater, but because his actual literary craft is lost in his image and reputation.
I believe in Woolf as about an equal power to Joyce, but I also rate Gertrude Stein way, way up there. She's one of the closest successors Henry James has anywhere in literature
>>7619562 At this point, when Europeans think of a true American city, they should think of Chicago. Violence, great universities, great fast food, lots of angry smart white people, tons of bloodthirsty minorities.
I do wonder what alot of eurofriends would think of burlington vermont
>>7619566 Not to mention that people from warm climates in America are weak, weak bitches -- cold cities are better to live in unless you're existentially unaware and require a tropical spring break every year.
>>7619570 it can't really happen that way because of the population density and our small amount of manufacturing. arguably if that would have happened it would have taken place during or after the depression when the stockyards were all built over but they just had a very steady economic rise over the latter half of the 20th century
>>7619586 Strongly disagree, the only blacks NH or ME gets are drug dealers that travel up 93 to deliver their stock to white meth head trash in Manchester or Portland, or very smart professional african/n. african ex-pat doctors on visa programs. Vermont doesnt even get that.
>>7619570 Detroit turned into Detroit because that city only had one means of financial profit and almost everyone only worked for the auto industry, then when it crashed the gorillion blacks didn't have money anymore so they sell drugs now
>>7619744 >He thinks Le Fanu, Wilde, Yeats, Shaw, and Fitzgibbon came from working-class homes Not quite. Although people from all backgrounds can set themselves toward creating great works of literature.
>>7619853 >I'll admit that I don't >I find >I can't >I don't >I get nothing Do you understand that you and your personal tastes are not applicable to everyone? Songs of Innocence & Experience are probably some of the most commonly known poems anywhere on Earth. And you're dismissing Kipling, the author of that highly obscure collection of short stories, The Jungle Book? Please, think before you speak.
>>7619917 >Do you understand that you and your personal tastes are not applicable to everyone Absolutely, and thankfully nobody's opinion will demolish a great author, right? There's no fully objective appraisal to be made here.
I just like hearing the angle from which readers like yourself might defend them.
>>7619952 No, I don't care about a general perception of 'greatness'... I care about what I can get out of a book personally.
If I had observed a Greek urn more closely, maybe I would get more out of Keats the next time out. Sometimes it's just the location or outlook which needs to change before you grasp what makes an author so relatable.
>>7619963 Maybe if you examined what a thread was about next time you wouldn't come in and start talking at cross purposes like some deluded autistic fellow who doesn't understand that not all conversations are about his personal opinions.
>>7620124 >>7620133 >America isn't a continent with multiple countries. >The United States isn't a country separate from the other countries on the American continent /lit/ is still a smart board, r-right guys?
>>7619172 And England has Ireland to thank for being literate at all. If it weren't for Gaelic monks and monasteries in the dark ages writing would never have been spread to Anglos. >implying Ireland didn't have a rich literary native tradition before England even existed.
>>7620290 That doesn't make any sense. If anything a memoir would be less of an undertaking considering you're just transcribing your life to paper without adding anything to it. He had some traumatic shit happen to him and was able to profit off of that. A 16 year old could do the same thing if they were put through terrible situations early in life Anne Frank for example
>>7620319 Memoirs by young people do not, by rule, happen. It's definitely possible, but the problem is that young people don't have like a life-long narrative arc or really a story, or accomplishments, and much less the self awareness and talent requisite to write a good literary memoir, and so they write fiction instead. It's also really hard to pitch an autobiographical piece without requisite publishing credits -- which take time to earn -- or some degree of external fame.
I know this because I am 22 and attempting to pitch my own, which is basically just a bildungsroman-type story with a realistic portrayal of the punk subculture, which there are very few books about, and which I spent three of the past four summers touring through. It's a totally logical piece to write, so I think, and half of it is indeed written, but without the accreditation these projects just stall. People in my situation gather that it's easier to write fiction and submit your finished piece than to pitch a nonfiction piece -- you need a proposal letter foremost with a nonfiction piece, which is often before they even see text, and without a serious resume it just doesn't happen. Eggers IS the exception
>>7620354 You're just making up excuses for yourself. Once you start saying "this author did this thing because they're brilliant and I'll never be able to do that", you fail as a writer. You're making it seem like it's impossible to write a great memoir at a young age when that's completely false. Do you not agree that 10 years is a long time? If you were forced in a terrible living situation I guarantee you would feel that 10 years is a very long time. Even 1 year is a long time under certain conditions. You could write an amazing memoir that spans one year. If your only excuse is that it's a big hassle to publish it as non fiction then don't. Why is it a huge problem for you if you say it's all fiction? No one cares about your excuses.
>>7620394 I could give a fuck about the conventional thinking about writing and age because right now I am actively defying it anyway. I'm not saying it's impossible to write a great memoir as a young person, I'm saying that young people seldom if ever make the attempt and even less often than that does said attempt get published
I'm quite happy with where /I'm/ at with the project, but I have no illusions about where it's going in this year of our lord 2016.
>>7620402 Young people who write good fiction realize after it's written just how personal and real this "fiction" really is. There's no difference between memoirs and fiction. They're just different titles created for marketing purposes. People don't realize that these fictional situations can actually occur (and have) in real life because a label of 'fiction' has been printed on it so therefor it must be complete fantasy. Don't get so hung up on fiction versus non-fiction.
>>7620417 there is a huge difference between memoir and fiction, and if you don't think so I have no idea what you're talking about. they belong to the same tradition of writing, but the memoir is a certain kind of book, like the novel in structure but in which the author has implicitly attested to the factual, testifiable truth of the events in the story. Writers who break this contract like the guy who wrote a million little pieces, do so completely at their peril and this is why there is a difference. Kerouac wrote about his life plainly and autobiographically but he did so as fiction (also for legal reasons) but mostly for the authorial license fiction affords.
Check out 'The Art of Memoir' by Mary Karr if you have any further questions about the memoir form. It came out last year. She, a middle-aged memoirist, is one who regards Eggers as an inexplicably young as a writer of memoir, generally speaking. The younger fiction writers are even younger than their counterparts in memoir.
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