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You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature

Thread replies: 47
Thread images: 2
Read this book!
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No, really, read it!
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>>7563990
but non fiction is boooring!
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Will I be able to meme about it on /lit/? Otherwise I don't see how it has any value.
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>>7563990
Thank you anon very much
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I don't wanna!
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not shitposting,
is it true that Debord committed suicide after he talked to Althusser?
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https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/debord/society.htm
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>>7565478
from what i understand he committed suicide once the effects of his lifelong alcoholism became too debilitating
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>>7565500
well most 'sociologists' commit suicide eventually, one way or another.

but i heard once very specifically that debord had ideas that althusser completely ruined and when he realized he was right, it was just too much.
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Read Vargas Llosa's Sociedad del espectáculo instead.
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To me it is no surprise that concepts and tactics created or used by the Situationists are now the mainstream marketing tools used to commodify "authenticity"...fucking academic asslords. The situationists were the occupy wallstreet of their day. Deny it and be damned op.
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If you don't explain yourself people won't take your word.
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>>7563990

I have OP it was very good. If you really dug the book its worth reading his follow up book he wrote about 20 years later "Comments on the SOTS", its of course not as good as SOTS but if you really liked the original you will probably appreciate and enjoy it

>>7565134

not really
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>>7565535
what?
the issue is that icons become more real than the things they should represent. if you think that any vanguard had any use, there's a good part in the book where it deals with controlled revellion in pop music and the arts.

just read the book, again if you already did.
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>>7565535
a lot of their followers and their may 68 comrades were literally the children of life long members of the Communist Party, just watch situationist films. It is well documented that all of the european left leadership fell into a process of holding their jobs, that any radical activity might challenge.

Occupy wall street is an absolute disaster and radical action literally doesn't exist in america. america and all their movements are all too stupid and garbage b/c the culture is too garbage. America is at least 5 or 6 generations behind europe in almost every way politically. You can't compare the french and america in any way at all.
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>>7565560
I have read it I had a situationist phase...DeBord's conception of "the real" is as perverse as it is shallow
.>>7565575
blame American culture if you like, I say that is a strawman, whereas the truth is that Marxism is itself intellectually and materially impoverished, and it is doubly a sham to revive one of its abortions from the dustbin of history...it is in fact an anti-Marxist thing to do.

also
>trusting life-long members of the communist party

have you ever been involved in party politics? have you ever been involved in radical action? take it from someone who has and who has had to come to terms with the horrifying internal, structural contradictions there.
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>>7565516
This book, it seems:

http://amzn.com/0374123047
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>>7565504
I've heard the same but Baudrillard
>>7565535
congrats on identifying the prodess of recuperation, looks like anti-capitalism is finished.
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>>7566105
capitalism is inherently anti-capitalism oddly enough. academics and disaffected liberalism is not.
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>>7566111
you're right, though I'm not sure why you think that SI was "academic"as they played a part in organizing during the '68 protests... and even if their prerogative was "disaffected liberalism", I don't see how pointing out that their tactics have been absorbed within the consumerist sphere really indicts them as a movement. Hot Topic sells Che shirts too, ya know?
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>>7566150
Well, to me the student protests of 68 were exemplary of disaffected liberalism, and the SI were engaged in a recuperation of their own (and ultimately a commodification...Debord was selling books wasn't he?) When I say academic I mean it in a few ways: primarily the SI was an academic pursuit as it arose from the "academy" (i.e. the university) and was lead, at least symbolically, by burgeoning public intellectuals like Debord...it was Marxism for the Coca-Cola generation (Godard was rather insightful about this)...I don't think their tactics were necessarily "absorbed" by consumer culture, I see them rather as a result of consumer culture as a product of it...the concept of "authenticity" is the most glaring example...it is an idea that is relevant only to those who are living from a surplus of wealth...i.e. the first worlders, the students of universities, etc. I don't think concepts such as psychogeography are in any way relevant to the proletariat, no matter what a crass intellectual vanguard would have you believe. Ultimately, I have to compare the SI with Intersectional first-world feminism...It is fine as a rhetorical device, and it is fine for promoting radical politics within the scope of academia...but there is no need for such a task, in fact the theoretical side of revolutionary politics is the most disgusting form of commodification in my opinion. But then again, I admire Ravachol and Jacques Mesrine most of all. I do like it when, in the case of the RAF, dialectics and theory are used as a way of sloganizing acts of terrorism...it makes me happy when criminals are able to recuperate the work of schoolboys to sound fantastic on the witness stand.
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>>7566150
>>7566195
You both need the redpill. Marxism is a mental illness
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>>7566195
I agree with all of this actually, my post was mostly just a knee-jerk response from reading "oh, you own an iphone but hate capitalism?" shit all day.
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>>7566221
Aus der Krankheit eine Waffe machen!
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>>7566239
thanks& i know how that feels, bro...totally deviating from my anti-academic rant, i will say i like how Zizek fucks that whole mentality by demonstrating the poverty of the "ethical over-investment" (i think that's what he calls it) paradigm of late-stage capitalism...the whole Tom's Shoes...buy organic apples bullshit. I think it was from First as Tragedy Then as Farce..Zizek is pretty cool guy really, even though i wouldn't say it to his face.
>>7566221
wew lad didn't know Sigmund Freud browsed /lit/
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>>7566248
>>7566261
Freud is one of the subverters of Western civilization. You are contributing to the downfall and the genocide of whiteness.

#TAKETHEREDPILL
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>>7566266
Whiteness as you understand it is a recent invention of history...Do you realize how many times the arabs literally raped the racial purity out of Europeans? There is very little chance of an Irish person, or a Russian Person or anyone from Eastern Europe being white...and really, if you are a rational person, once you look at the facts long enough...racial purity might be limited to a few families in the extreme north of Europe, and among isolated aboriginals and some Native North Americans from Alaska...also what is a red pill? is that from a book?
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>>7563990
Absolutely trash, not one thing of value in this book.
Don't be fooled by the cool cover and provocative title, it's utter shit. Watered down Marxy crybaby shit, not worth the paper it's printed on
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>>7566284
>implying you aren't a crybaby
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>>7566278
>Whiteness as you understand it is a recent invention of history

Liberal postmodernist leftist logic everyone.

You are mentally ill
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>>7566278
Nevermind that race science was a construct perpretrated with the express purpose of justifying the institution of slavery.
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>>7566292
You structure your life around a motif you gleaned from a shit science fiction movie and think someone who has read an anthropology book is "mentally ill"?
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>>7566303
>reading academia

Your unironically brainwashed. Academia is very much controlled by people who want to push a certain narrative.
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>>7566332
Yeah, I know... The damn Jews just made up all that stuff about how thousands of years of miscegenation should purge the very notion of racial "purity" just to get your girlfriend to leave you for a black guy. I'm sorry it happened but it's time to move on.
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>>7566278

If we're all mixed why are there so clearly white people and darkies? To be honest just because we've all got a touch of the tar brush doesn't mean we can't still be racist. A WASP will never look like a sub saharan African and it's idiotic to say that because they both have a shared ancestor from thousands of years ago that they're related in any meaningful way.

Fuck, I have full cousins that I severely dislike and have never gotten along with.
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>>7566363
dont bother, this kid has never explored beyond a media-driven narrative and he thinks he's a genius
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>>7566355
I would never be with a modern woman, they're degenerate.

Come to /r9k/ and see how far the rabbit hole goes. Women are worthless compared to us
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>>7566288
>making a thread and not even giving one reason why the book is good or interesting
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>>7566372
I'm just gonna assume you're trolling at this point, petit Houellebecq.

If not, I'm sorry that your sad outlook on life has lead you down a path of conspiratorial thinking which enables you to you project your twisted ressentiments on to the world... and I pray to the pantheon of Cultural Marxism that the leading light of the infallible science of socialism enters your sickly heart.
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>>7566372
this but unironically
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>>7565606
that is what i mean, they were the children of communist party members, a party they saw as acting ineffectually and too slow. They already knew and understood marxism but wanted the radical elements of it.

whereas america occupy wall street fags are a few generations off that level of commitment to be sure
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>>7565560

So is it just basically the same as Baudrillard with less intentional obscurity?
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>>7565606

>I have read it I had a situationist phase...DeBord's conception of "the real" is as perverse as it is shallow

Would you care to elaborate? I am very interested.
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>>7567766
Yes but what did the students actually accomplish? If you want to find out I suggest watching a film by Chris Marker called "Grin Without a Cat"....socialism with a human face phases into a consolidation of left partisans in France leads to Capitalism with a socialist face...I mean just look at the state of things when the Socialist party of France hires a hedge funder like Straus Kahn and the left swallows it as "expedient" or some such shit...The only way that Paris 68 was greater than Occupy Wall Street is that it was a much greater failure and injury to radical politics than occupy could even manage. Also, good morning dude it's actually nice to talk lie this I hope I don't sound dick-ish I have just committed so much time to these things...
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>>7567797
If you go and re-read "Ideology Materialized" you might see what I mean...well it's just my opinion, but here and elsewhere Debord bandies about with terms like "real life" and "illusion" a bit too metaphysically...when he finally does allude to what he might mean regarding real life it is more or less a rewash of Camus' "absurd struggle",...basically, as in Vaneigem, real life is presented as life lived in the revolutionary moment--and don't get me wrong there is something incredibly inspiring about that--but to me, coming from the mouth of a student, who ultimately never murdered a police officer or anything of the sort, it falls flat. Frantz Fanon, on the other hand...anyway I'm using an ad hominem...essentially my beef with the situational idea of "the real" is that to me it appears as just more bourgeois, white "adventurism"...the oppressive seeking of enjoyment...real life is the satiation of desire, the manufacturing of desire within one's own libidinal economy...this kind of thinking strikes me as very privileged.
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>>7563990
What is it about?
What will it teach me?
Thread replies: 47
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