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Do people transition as an alternative to...
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Do people transition as an alternative to gender nonconforming? Are there people out there who are transitioning to align themselves with what is expected, rather than to quell dysphoria?

Conversely, are people who would otherwise transition being scared off by a hostile social climate? Would these same people readily transition in a friendlier world?

I made a short survey to find out what this board thinks: (The system thinks this is spam, so I'll post a link in a subsequent sage'd post.)
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It's only three questions, and should take less than a minute of your time: surveymonkey/r/8LS6FC9
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>>5706781
This is dumb. I took it anyway, but people don't transition because of social pressure, they transition because of sex dysphoria

More people would transition if trans people weren't treated like shite tho, yes. Lots of people choose not to transition b/c their family would disown them if they did
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Your survey is a little weak, but the discussion can certainly salvage it.

There are some people transitioning because it is more acceptable than being gender non-conforming in the way that they are, and there are some transitioning as an aid to the kind of gender non-conforming they prefer (think the guys on femgen for a readily-observed example).

There are people being scared off from transition by social pressures, yes, and there would be slightly more people transitioning, with many earlier, in a society that didn't place such a huge stigma on it. Homelessness is a heavy price to pay for being wrong about your parents', employer's, or landlord's reaction, and many trans youth have had to pay it.
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>>5706897
>More people would transition if trans people weren't treated like shite tho,
Actually it's the other way around. MtFs transition about 3 times as often as Ftms do and the only way to explain that (that doesn't invalidate FtM identity) is because of *lack* of social pressure for FtMs to conform to any gender stereotypes. Women in the west today are allowed to be absolutely anywhere on the scale of gender and even butches won't draw in attention. So a lot of them just decide to never transition (especially with FtM bottom surgeries being what they are) and live their lives as tomboys/butches/hard butches.
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>>5706897
>people don't transition because of social pressure, they transition because of sex dysphoria
this
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>>5708924
Do you have stats on this 3:1 ratio?
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>>5708924
Firstly, we don't know for sure how many MTFs transition in comparison to FTMs. Most formal studies are flawed in some way or another (a lot of them are based off of bottom surgery which is obviously not a good way to count trans men). Do you have any proof at all for your "3 times as often" number?

Secondly, if there really are more transitioned trans women than transitioned trans men, there are definitely other possible explanations for it. There might be a biological reason for trans women to simply be more common. Trans men might be less likely to identify as trans post-transition. They might be less likely to stay in contact with the LGBT community and therefore less likely to be counted in surveys. Etc.

If I take what you said to its logical conclusion, it would mean that 66% of trans women transition because it's socially unacceptable to be a feminine man. It would also mean that for every trans woman in that 66%, there is a trans man whose gender issues are magically solved by wearing men's clothes and getting a short haircut.

I think it's pretty obvious that this scenario is both ludicrous and invalidating for both trans men AND trans women. I'm sure that there are trans men who are okay with just being butch. But I think you're reaching pretty hard by explaining perceived (but not measured or proven) population differences away with the "social acceptance!!!!" strawman.
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>>5706781
The color choices for that graph are odd
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I believe both may happen, but are very few in number.

I think that a 'friendlier' world, with more opportunities afforded to people regardless of gender, would lend towards an increase in transitions. I also believe that if a society became more accepting of gender non-conformity, transitions would increase as well.

The reason I think this is that I conflate these ideas with a general attitude towards acceptance of individual identities and choices, so a person who is more likely to accept gender non-conformity is also more likely to accept trans people, even if those trans people happen to conform to gender roles.
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I think if there were less risk of losing the life you had, and less pressure to pass well then more people would transition. With less pressing gender roles there'd be fewer hons living out fetishized and distorted ideals of femininity, and other late transitioners wouldn't feel the need to overcompensate or become living parodies of their preferred sex.

Since genital dysphoria isn't actually the most universal dysphoria, I suspect there would be fewer super-early transitioners since the social pressure would be lower, and most trans people would begin feeling dysphoric once puberty hits. Hopefully there'd be education on what dysphoria is so trans kids would get themselves sorted out sooner rather than later.
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>>5709337
It's vox. They have said that their color choices reflect positions on racial oppression. Their data is also universally crap. They do no research of their own. ALWAYS go to the thing they're citing.
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