I was at a club with some friends last night including a ftm friend of mine. We met a group of girls and chatted with them for a bit. My ftm friend showed interest in a mtf transgirl and was sternly but politely rejected. We still chatted with them and had a good time until the mtf (pretty passable) started hitting on me hard. I told her I'm not really interested in her that way and she seemed fine with it. I continued chatting with her and her friends until the temper tantrum started. She asked me why I was not interested and I simply told her mtf is not my thing. She demanded more answers from me so I simply told her how I felt. Pre or post op I don't think there is a way she could sexually arouse me. I told her she looks great and passable but even still I can smell the man odor and somewhere in my brain it just tells me this person is not a suitable mate for me. Her female friend ended up trying to make out with me which resulted in a fight between them and I just ended up leaving. As I walked out she grabbed me and told me that I'm a piece of shit. I know trans people are not all like this but why is it that so many feel entitled like this? Am I actually a bad person for not being attracted to a mtf? I have rejected women for other reasons (overweight, fake looks, nasty personality) so what makes this any different? I'm a friendly guy and I get a long with everyone. There is no shame in being seen as gay it just is not my thing. I have gay friends and even frequent a sandwich shop at the lgbt center because it tastes good. Would you trans folks really consider me a bigot? I'm sick of this double standard.
There's a lot of nasty self-entitlement in lgbt. I blame recent feminist movements for poisoning them a bit.
Not liking a mtf because she's mtf is about on the same level as not liking a cis girl because she's black and you just don't do black. They can't change it and it's just not your taste. It wouldn't make you racist just because you wouldn't stick your dick in it.
This was probably the only winning move.
I wasn't trying to be offensive but she demanded answers. My brain does not desire that how does that make me a bad guy? I politely told her several times I'm just not into her but she just wouldn't let it go and really wanted to know why but I do see what you mean.
So, there's a lot to this.
1. You're not a bigot.
2. As has been said, you should not have provided a reason. Just never provide reasons for your unwanted suitors - it's a universally good habit.
3. You're somewhat prejudiced. This does not make you "a bad person", but just means that you have unexamined assumptions about others that colour your perceptions and behaviours. Change in body scent isn't even something that happens late in hormonal transition; "man odor", especially in the case of someone transitioning long enough to be post-op, is not something your sense of scent is informing you of. There could be (and are) many reasons that you could never be attracted to a trans woman, but the one you listed is illusion.
4. You met an asshole. It sucks that this happened, and she should certainly be reprimanded and held accountable for her awful behaviour.
You sound like a fine person, and I hope you can avoid people like this going forward.
Yes, op, I'm sorry to tell you but you're bigoted.
It's not your fault tho. You like pretty much everyone were brought up in a enviroment were cis is the norm and trans is undesirable. That's why you get turned off when you see a trans girl even when she passes and is post op, because you've been told one too many times that they are not worthy to be your mates.
Now you are aware of the situation, and you can choose. To keep living as a bigot, or to accept your transphobia and work to become a better person
She shouldn't have been trying to coax the prejudice out of you just to prove a point (it's like running onto someone's knife), and you shouldn't have let it out. Neither of you were particularly graceful.
Now you're here trying to build your case. Gay friends, ftm friends - even your favorite sandwich is gay: You're chill. There's no prize for being decent, though.
You're under no obligation to sleep with-, or even talk to someone in order to not be a bigot. She sounds really bitter, but that doesn't mean you should stoop down there to meet her. If sharing your gut feelings would obviously be hurtful to the person you're talking to, then just keep it to yourself. Simply do not say "mtf is repulsive and you smell like a man". Stand your ground at >>5635111 and don't give her an inch more.
>Talk to someone
Bad phrasing. The girl you met sounds like an ass, and there can be plenty other reasons to avoid a person that are not based in prejudice. I wouldn't keep talking to someone like that just to look good.
incredibly disappointed after reading:
>>smell the man
it simply doesnt work like that. if they were legit / on hormones long enough then no they wouldnt still smell like a dude.
passable does not mean attractive.
you found them unattractive. not a big deal. why you found them i have no idea. maybe you're transphobic specific to mtf's. maybe they were just ugly.
that wasnt the problem, this it: your way of reacting / de-escalating the situation. this was your failure.
last thing you fail to comprehend: test = confidence. makes you feel good. gives you energy. take that away from someone and they become an emotional mess. so here's the tranny that's insecure and just got rejected and doesnt know how to cope with said rejection. ya they f'd up too, but regardless you cant improve other people, only yourself.
TL;DR- OP is a faggot
So answer me this is she a bigot for having no interest in my ftm friend? And I wasn't trying to earn gay points I was simply trying to say that I am far from homophobic or transphobic that's all. I personally am not into Asian girls because of their scent. Maybe it is an illusion but from my personal experience there is something about the scent that tells my brain not to be aroused. If an Asian woman pressured me this hard I would have told her the truth. I agree though perhaps it's better to not let it get to that point. I know I came across as pulling that "I have a black friend" card but that's not my intention. It seems to me that you think anyone that isn't bisexual is a bigot in some form then.
Thanks I think you guys are right. I should just stand my ground not offer any reason and simply say I'm not interested in you. I felt like she was very aggressive and I tend to be very honest. It's just hard for me to understand how having a sexual preference makes me a piece of shit. I suppose it only does if I am honest about the reasons why. It seems you can't openly not want to date mtf like you can openly not want to date men or women and that is what irks me. I get it you're a woman just not my type of woman of that makes sense.
Trannies are fucked in the head and you know it. Just look at this board you tripping faggot. It'll never be fully accepted in our society no matter how hard to stupid sjws try. No real dude wants to date a mentally ill piece of shit.
Why do you care anyway? I hope it's accepted I just don't think I should be obligated to date them that's all.
>is she a bigot for having no interest in my ftm friend?
If the reason why she had no interest in him was just because he was trans, then yes.
Also, people don't smell different because they are of a particular ethnicity. You feel like they do becausr you have prejudices
Sounds more like people were objecting to you rambling about how others smell like men.
Having a sexual preferences and saying no isn't a problem. People might complain about your being a bargart though. That might matter more than going to sandwich shops and showing off how pc you are.
BECAUSE THESE PEOPLE ARE FUCKING UP THEIR HEALTHY BODIES WITH DRUGS AND SURGERY INSTEAD OF FINDING HELP TO ACCEPT THE WAY THEY WERE BORN. Jesus christ. I hate how the idiots in the media keep pushing for this. I mean don't get me wrong, anyone should feel free to dress the way they want, and act masc, feminine, or whatever else but when you start putting unnatural hormones and end up changing your genitals forever just to comply with what your fucked up head is telling you, that's crossing the line.
I completely disagree with you there. I can jack off to Asian women I find them physically attractive and I have had sex with three of them. The smell is not the same as black or white girls which both smell different.
>>An established body of medical research demonstrates the effectiveness and medical necessity of mental health care, hormone therapy and sex reassignment surgery as forms of therapeutic treatment for many people diagnosed with GID… Therefore, be it RESOLVED, that the AMA supports public and private health insurance coverage for treatment of gender identity disorder.
So, wana tell me why some manchild without a an education decides he knows better than all the doctors in America combined?
Why should the goverment ban things just on the acount of your not liking them. Your tantrums shouldn't supercede natural rights and bodily autonomy.
Emigrate to North Korea if you can't handle that.
Nobody said that. Maybe if you just didn't talk about men smelling people and had better manners then there wouldn't have been any trouble.
You like talking about ducking dick tho, wana elaborate?
>but even still I can smell the man odor and somewhere in my brain it just tells me this person is not a suitable mate for me.
You're an asshole and I imagine ou made a huge tantrum in real life while the trans woman didn't do anything to set you off..
I'm sorry, but you are basically saying that you smelt 3 asian women, who happened to smell differently than other women, and therefore every ethnicity has their own smell.
Have you thought that maybe they smelt different because everybody has a bit of a particular body scent? Which, by the way, can be affected by several external factors.
Maybe those women didn't smell the same because they used different deodorant brands on their bodies.
I'm expected to be sexually attracted to someone with a penis. If I am not attracted to someone with a penis I am a bigot. If I like only black women is that a problem? If I'm only attracted women that were born with a vagina how is that wrong? If I'm not attracted to someone who's voting for bernie Sanders is that a big deal? What about a woman born with a vagina but has fake lips and boobs? Should I be attracted to them too?
Not at all actually I was calm and cool as always. She was screaming and yelling. Thanks for all your replies I am not going to stress about this. Some people have different opinions I suppose. If I am a bigot for thinking equal rights does not mean special right then so be it. Thanks for input my friends. Goodbye :)
I never said or meant to imply that the government should have a ruling how anyone should change their body you dipshit and suicidal rates are still fairly high among them.
I care because they're fucking up their bodies and telling me that's an OK thing to do. I get that it's "their body their choice" but If that idea starts trending you end up with a society full of more people damaging themselves just to comply with their own stress.
Someone who is intolerant those others who are perceived as different.
>OP gets hit on by a person
>Is not attracted to that person for -reason-
>Trans folk blame the patriarchy.
You fucked up giving them a reason OP, you should of just said no. But you're not a bigot; sounds like you were perfectly happy to spend the night with her just to not fuck, I see literally zero problem with this.
You are at worst shallow, but not intolerant - obviously.
So you wouldn't ban creepy hairy crossdressers...
But you would ban cute boys on female hormones.
You thinking straight m8.
>but If that idea starts trending you end up with a society full of more people damaging themselves just to comply with their own stress
too late buddy
we live in a society where people ingest caffeine like candy in order to make it through the day
where in order to blow some steam off after a long week, people get drunk and usually get to the point of passing out -usually along with smoking literally cancer sticks
women wear shoes that destroy their feet and posture and men of a certain age take pills that can cause a heart attack to get their dicks hard
No I'm gay, and creepy hairy cross dressers don't take drugs and constantly fight with themselves just because they don't feel entitled to have the body they weren't born with.
Well do you think it's ok for obese people to be fat to the point where they can't walk properly just because "it's their way of life"? If someone wanted to be heavily obese would you recommend a diet to make them gain extreme weight?
Yea but all those are legal because they can be moderated by choice. Getting surgery that changes your body forever from it's unnatural state will completely fuck you up forever. You either choose to love your healthy body or ruin it for the sake of your own mental issue permanently. Just look at all the tranny degenerates all over this board. They're all in a mental crisis you know it and don't tell me just because "it's society's fault"
If you don't want to fuck someone you don't have to. It's that simple.
Trans folk really drew the short stick on this one, but you're not entitled to be attractive to people. Deal with it, rejection is something that 99% of the population experience, I'm sorry that you can't help it but someone not being attracted to you can't help it either.
>Wrong to take care of your body and ensure you stay cute
Deranged, you're preaching about how we have to stop people from improving themselves. You're preaching against basic bodily autonomy, as if there was anything morally unacceptable about that when you're cool with similar but more hazardous versions of those hormones being used for contraception.
Pretty much incompatible with modern society, in fact everything western civilization has been about since the enlightenment.
But hey, if people shaving and doing other stuff against your sharia bothers you, then you might get along with ISIS.
>changes your body forever from it's unnatural state will completely fuck you up forever
Wow, I did not know that dental surgery and vaccines were so bad! You certainly aren't mentally ill.
>Just look at all the tranny degenerates all over this board
>Trying to draw an analogy between 4chan and the real world
This is probably the internet butthole, of course you won't see people dancing happily around here.
There was literally nothing wrong with their bodies in the beginning you dumb asshole. Telling me that getting genital surgery is like telling me that getting bigger fake tits is a great life accomplishment for yourself. You prove my point it's a self entitled mental issue that you need real therapy for.
You are a fucking idiot. Those are REAL improvements to help physical health issues. Not mental ones.
It's mostly to do with whether something is perceived as punching down or not. If you openly talk about how you would never date a certain type of marginalized person you're communicating that prejudice to the world. People may respond negatively to this and look down on you for it. You really can't be upset about that. If you don't like something but you're totally cool with others liking it, then just skip talking about the first part of that sentence.
You don't have to toe the line of the gay agenda with who you want to fuck - getting transwomen laid is not your problem. Just don't punch down. Even if they're screaming for it, like this girl was. She just wanted to prove that you would.
If someone directly asks if you'd ever date mtf, you can say something like, "If she was cute" or "I dunno. I haven't met a trans woman I would date, as far as I know". Safe and friendly options that both acknowledge your right to have a preference and the fact that you couldn't necessarily clock every mtf. It sure looks better than bringing up man stank. If you get into it further you can say that penis is off the table (bringing up genitals first thing is a no-no), but getting into detail about what stereotypical mtf attributes you feel repulsed by is both presumptuous and impolite.
Later, as you go through your life simply don't date mtfs.
Actually, the bigot is you, because you're basically saying that OP _should_ be attracted to the girl, and should feel bad because he doesn't.
It's like telling a lesbian she _should_ be attracted to men, and should feel bad because she doesn't.
It's the exact same bullshit reasoning, and it is why OP thought the trans girl hitting on him was an asshole in the first place.
>BECAUSE THESE PEOPLE ARE FUCKING UP THEIR HEALTHY BODIES
Aren't like over 50% of people in most first world countries fat? Why don't you bitch about that? It seems to be a much larger health problem.
Not being attracted to transgirls does NOT make you a bigot. However, the way you expressed that lack of attraction does make you a bit of an asshole (though still not a bigot), at least in that instance.
You probably shouldn't have told her that it was because she was trans, that's going to make a lot of transgirls feel shitty and insecure. But you said she kept pressuring you to provide a reason, so it's kinda forgivable.
You absolutely, positively, definitely should not have mentioned any masculine traits she had, that would make ANY transgirl feel REALLY shitty about themselves. This was your real screw up, it was a total dick move and there's no real way to justify it.
You also probably shouldn't have made out with her friend afterwards, that's basically adding insult to injury. But you make it sound like her friend initiated it, so it was probably her friend's fault more than yours.
No, it is not the same.
A lesbian would never find a man attractive.
OP finds women attractive. If he saw a passing and good looking trans girl and he didn't know she was trans, he'd be attracted to her.
Then, the moment he finds out she's trans he'd ditch her out because "she smells bad."
I've had some MtF girls hit on me before. If they're pre-OP I usually just tell them that I'm not attracted to dicks even if they're attached to really cute girls. I feel shitty for it, but there it is.
Even if she isn't into PIV sex, there's some stuff I wouldn't feel comfortable doing. For various reasons, the kind of sex some of them wanted would make me either feel uncomfortable or guilty. Pretty much all of them were cool as shit and I told the girls in question that they deserved someone who enjoyed the kind of stuff they liked without any hangups.
If I met a girl who was post-op or pre-op but pretty much asexual, I'd be down, though.
Honestly, the only people who have been shitty about it was one trans girl who wasn't concerned about passing for bullshit tumblr reasons and a non-binary person who was biologically male or whatever the term.
My only answer to this is that you're a faggot. Not the good kind who is gay, the bad kind of faggot where people only use the word to insult a fucking putrid cock socket of a motherfucker.
Op here again. I'm surprised the thread is still up. I think most of you are right about me being a dick to some degree. I am very nice person until someone treats my like shit and from what I gather That seems to be okay as long as it isn't directed at a trans woman.
>If someone directly asks if you'd ever date mtf, you can say something like, "If she was cute" or "I dunno. I haven't met a trans woman I would date, as far as I know"
I don't want to feel obligated to lie. I also think many of you are right that I am not obligated to offer anyone any reasons at all. I agree there are nicer ways to phrase things you're totally right there but for the record I did not just jump into the odor thing I was seriously at a point I just wanted to get her to shut up.
I am certainly shallow and I have a very particular type of woman I am attracted to. That's just the way it is. I don't exactly want kids but that's another thing... I don't know why but if a woman can't have kids I don't want her. I won't lead her on at all though. So maybe I really am some evil cis white male dick but there are plenty of women uniterested in me for their own reasons and that's fine.
No, you're not a bigot. You don't owe anyone anything, especially sexual attraction. That tranny was just being egotistical. I'm a cute a passing MtF, and I would never ever make someone feel bad about not being attracted to me because I'm trans.
>Delusional trannies ITT
Trannies are one big lie so they hate the truth.
Hey trannies, your ball sack and taint don't stop having "that" smell just because you're on hormones. I should know from fucking a few and knowing what my own junk smells like.
You will never have that nice vagina smell, but that's okay cause I like fucking you anyway.
Enough. I've turned down women and other trans people too. What's your point?
If I'm not attracted to someone because they're overweight, I wouldn't tell them that's the reason why. And even if they pressured me into providing a reason, like the transgirl in OP's story, I still wouldn't ever say something like "ugh I could never date a gross sweaty fat fuck like you", which is basically what OP did.
you've just learned that no one wants to hear the truth, even if they ask for it
its not a trans thing (though you hit her where it hurts most), pretty much any person would get deeply hurt, girls probabaly more
trannies are legit the most entitled people you'll ever meet. They ALL have been coddled in this tumblr world for the past 4 years, and have literally had hundreds of hours of propaganda funneled into their personalities.
Its an even grosser side of the fat-entitled attitude. Because they have a HUGE flaw that is(debatable) not 100% their fault they feel anyone who does not extend every possible exception towards them is a racist/bigot/shitlord/homophobe/whatever...
I feel the best way to deal with that is INSANE bluntness. Dont continue the BS that they have been raised on. Be honest and say no matter WHAT happens, they will always be their birth gender in your eyes, or some weird middle ground.
A FtM will NEVER me a man... and once they start taking hormones, they're no longer a woman.
A MtF will NEVER be a female... and once they start taking hormones, they're no longer a man.
Theres nothing wrong with what they're doing, but i do not want to be involved in it, and them trying to brow-beat me into fucking them is annoying as hell(I'm a gay guy. The trannies on grindr are legit the worst. Even more-so than the gross old fat guys) and only stands to make me even more prejudice towards their 'community'.