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JESUS CHRIST PEOPLE, GET IT TOGETHER
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You are currently reading a thread in /lgbt/ - Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender

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The whole world has gone mad. Why does the gay and lesbian community even associate with these people? Most of them are clearly mental ill and living in a fantasy world of made-up bullshit and now they want to fuck with kids even before they can locate their pecker/vagina. I suppose you can't spell "tyranny" without "tranny".

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3420203/Are-gender-fluid-demi-girl-intersex.html#comments
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Is this the make Trannies want to die week on lgbt?

Holy fuck with all these hate threads.
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>>5622799
Hey OP, maybe you should take this sort of tuing up with tumblr. Most of the trans people here just want to live as their preferred gender, they don't want to be treated like speshul snowflake genderqueer otherkin with a billion different pronouns.

>>5622806
>make Trannies want to die week
That's every week yo
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>>5622814
I franky don't care what most of them want because most of them aren't fucking right in the head and I'm pretty sure that there are people who know this, but push logic and reasoning aside for MUH FEELYS. There is a reason so many "trans" people commit suicide after SRS and I can gaurantee you it's not because WAHHH MUH BULLIES.

It's because they have a moment of clarity that they have done almost irreversible damage to their bodies and want to end it all upon the realization that they fucked up.
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>>5622818
>MUH FEELYS
It's weird, i seem to getting a lot of MUH FEELYS from you right now. Whereas I'm just following standard procedure for treating my gender dysphoria.

>so many "trans" people commit suicide after SRS
Oh god it's this meme again. How about you compare pre transition and post transition suicide rates and get to me okay?
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>>5622799
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>>5622818
>social ostracisation and ridicule doesn't contribute to suicidal ideation cos i said so.
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>>5622825
Not personally attacking you, or all transpeople.

HOWEVER, you would have to have a pretty vacant skull to not notice that there are waaaaay more people out there wanting this surgery that are clearly fucked up and need help mentally.

Ex. - I have two friends that both, within the same fucking month, had the revelation that they are both MtF and that they need to have their dicks chopped off and get a new nice set of tits. Guess what they both have in common? They both were diddled as kids and have both recently come down off of major drug addictions. SURELY this will help.

Also:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/michael-w-chapman/johns-hopkins-psychiatrist-transgender-mental-disorder-sex-change

I'm sure there are more, this was just a quick google search.
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>>5622846
>http://cnsnews.com/news/article/michael-w-chapman/johns-hopkins-psychiatrist-transgender-mental-disorder-sex-change
Everytime I see the words "John hopkins" I internally kek.

Now if you take the time to find the study that this article misrepresents (http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/AFSP-Williams-Suicide-Report-Final.pdf look i just did it for you) you will find that while the rate of suicide for transsexuals is higher than the general population, the rate decreases after successful transition. It also has some interesting statistics about how the rate of depression and suicide attempts is lowered when the trans individual is accepted by society, passes and has a good family life.
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>>5622818
They don't die
>>An established body of medical research demonstrates the effectiveness and medical necessity of mental health care, hormone therapy and sex reassignment surgery as forms of therapeutic treatment for many people diagnosed with GID… Therefore, be it RESOLVED, that the AMA supports public and private health insurance coverage for treatment of gender identity disorder.

>McHugh does cite one study from 2011, by Cecilia Dhejne, MD and colleagues at Karolinska Institute in Stockholm. However, he misunderstands Dr. Dhejnes work. In the paper, Dr. Dhejne states that the study was not designed to draw conclusions on the efficacy of transgender surgeries, yet McHugh does exactly that. A closer reading of the paper shows that the increased mortality is in those who had surgery before 1989, and that mortality in trans people after 1989 is not statistically different from the general population. A recently published paper by Dr. Dhejne and colleagues shows that the regret rate for those having surgery from 2001-2010 is only 0.3%. Dr. Dhejnes work shows that outcomes for transgender surgery have improved tremendously in the past 30 years, which supports the HHS decision to remove trans exclusions.
>The American Psychiatric Association and the World Professional Association for Transgender Health no longer view transgender identity as inherently pathological. Dr. McHughs views are stuck in the past.
You're even more deluded than tumblr
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>>5622837
>implying that this is the main reason that transgendered people kill themselves and there couldn't possibly be any bigger, unlying problem besides simply not being able to handle the bantz

Again, MENTALLY ILL.

You know, this wouldn't be so much of a problem if people could just leave well enough alone and let people who are genuinely afflicted with this disorder just have what they want and be happy, but then the politicians and activists have to butt in, pushing a narrative down people's throats when they can't even begin to fathom what the fuck you're talking about and rightfully so because most of you are shilling MADE-UP BULLSHIT.
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>>5622869
Uh >>5622867
You're seriously assuming your delusions make reality. Pathetic.
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>>5622863
>UCLA

Dropped. It doesn't look like were going to get a non-biased opinion on this issue because I refuse to believe that their is zero bias coming from a university that resides in the mecca of plastic surgery for the west coast.

Also, what constitutes a "successful surgery"? Creating something that vaguely resembles a penis/vagina? Maybe if some of the people choosing to mutilate themselves for attention took a look in the mirror every once in a while, they would realize YOU WILL NEVER BE ACCEPTED BY SOCIETY OR ANYONE ELSE THAT ISNT AS FUCKING CRAZY AS YOU.

I'd love to show you guys a picture of my friend Brent, aka "Michelle". This guy has the face of John Belushi and the build of a lumberjack and no amount of plastic surgery will ever make him look like an actual woman, but I guarantee he would get put a pedestal by mouthbreathers as the pinnacle of femininity. Also, the guy who just came off a serious heroin addiction and was abused sexually as a child.

Pure coincidence.
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>>5622846
Dude i am kinda with you on this to a point but I draw different conclusions from it.
I mean yeah body dysphoria is probably mostly a mental disorder and mental illnesses are even today for the most part not understood very well. We still don't know how the mind works.
So whats the solution here? I mean just saying hormone therapy as well as several surgical prodedures and the likes are the best shot we have at helping those people lead somewhat happier lifes. Changing the mind is very often sadly just not an option and some mental illnesses don't go away.

I mean you could just as easily call homosexuality a disorder as well and i probably woudln't even disagree with you. But why would you deny them the chance to life the lifestyle that makes it most bearable? I mean yet again whats the solution? Not let gays have relationships and the occasional buttsecks with each other because it would be feeding their disorder?
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>>5622892
Apa and others say Paul was wrong >>5622867
though. The study explicitly contradicts him and he just engaged in academic fraud to misrepresent that.

You're just delusional enough to trust a disgraced hack over all of his former coworkers combined, and the study itself.

We don't need to humor your delusions.
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>>5622892
>Dropped
Of course, the guy who reads the daily mail and trusts cnsnews over a university study would disregard it.

>successful surgery
I said successful 'transition', meaning passing in their daily lives, accepted by family, and also friends and colleagues etc (if their friends and colleagues even know about them about them being trans which happens in a lot of cases when referring to passing transsexuals) regardless of whather they have surgery or not (seriously, why the fuck do you all focus on the surgery as if this is some holy grail of being trans or something).

Also I don't care about your anecdotal trans friend. I could tell you about my anecdotal passing trans friends but I'd probably just receive more incoherent caps lock rants from smeone who refuses to read studies when they might tell him that he is wrong.
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>>5622903
Well, a big underlying issue with this to begin with is medical industry. Plastic surgeons, drug companies, psychiatrists, they're all looking to get paid and I'd bet my dick that more than a couple people who weren't actually afflicted with body dysphoria "passed" all the mental checks in the SRS process and were allowed to go under the knife.

Then you have the political activists and politicians who make the issues of a very, very small population the problem of everyone in the fucking country and anything less than total, blind acceptance is met with furious outraged, frothing at the mouth screaming bigotry, hatred, etc. Again, they create the issue so that they are able to maintain employment and act like they're actually doing something besides shilling bullshit.

And homosexuality was never a mental disorder to begin with in my opinion, simply a preference with no physiological effects. Most homosexuals I know also don't have any urges to get their body altered for the sake of their feelings and increasing pressure from outside influences to do so. It's one thing to get fucked in the ass and enjoy it, it's a totally different ball game to start taking drugs and having your body altered, much more serious implications to be pondered there.
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>>5622799
>WHY AREN'T ALL MEDICAL POLICIES AND TREATMENTS BASED ON MY BOOTY-BOTHERED FEELS INSTEAD OF DUMB OLD RESEARCH AND EVIDENSE!!1!!??!?1?!
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>>5622953
So considering all of that, instead of standing up and saying "hey now you sjws/medical industry/plastic surgery industry, stop exploiting people with a recognized condition (gender dysphoria) you instead decide to turn on caps lock and rage against 4chan trannies of all people.

gr8 job m9
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>>5622943
>seriously, why the fuck do you all focus on the surgery as if this is some holy grail of being trans or something

Oh yeah, having your body drastically altered by products pushed drug companies and plastic surgeons is no biggie and they do it all out of the benevolence of their hearts so that people can feel comfortable in their own skin. Right... I was so blinded by my hatred, thanks for clearing that up for you.

And I'm sure that you don't give a shit about my friend, no one else seems to. Fuck, most of his "friends" are placing bets on when he is going to off himself and the popular odds are before the end of the year.

But that's none of my business. Fuck me for not wanting my friend to make a huge mistake, right? And no way that there aren't a lot of people like him, just following popular trends, right? That's just a sheer impossibility.
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>>5622869
Being socially ostracized is the reason. That's why FTMs don't kill themselves post-op nearly as much, because they're accepted as male and have been socialized as girls, allowed to express emotions. They're fine after surgery. Nobody's pointing them out after transition because Testosterone over estrogen is like sharpie over yellow marker.
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>>5622965
kek
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Holy shit niggers, what are you doing? Sage this thread.
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>>5622953
>I'd bet my dick that more than a couple people who weren't actually afflicted with body dysphoria "passed" all the mental checks in the SRS process and were allowed to go under the knife.
Yeah i am sure that happens and it's horrible but i don't see a way to get rid of that possibility completely.

>Then you have the political activists and politicians who make the issues of a very, very small population the problem of everyone in the fucking country and anything less than total, blind acceptance is met with furious outraged, frothing at the mouth screaming bigotry, hatred, etc.
Fuck the activists right with you there.

>it's a totally different ball game to start taking drugs and having your body altered, much more serious implications to be pondered there.
Here i actually disgree. Both are issues of bodily self deternination and autonomy. Yes one has more serious implications but in my mind the severity of the situation doesn't change the nature of the thing. Taking it in the ass and cutting off your dick are both things you should be allowd to choose to do if you so desire. I just don't think it is anyones business to judge another persons motivation for what they do with themselfs. Irreversibility or not doesn't matter in my opinion.
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>>5622965
Oh, they get theirs as well at any chance that I get, but you're pants on head retarded if you think that everyone who come to 4chan are well adjusted people to begin with.
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>>5622818
>I can gaurantee you it's not because
discrimination
Based on what?
Some sort of research or statistics?
or just your feels?

>It's because they have a moment of clarity that they have done almost irreversible damage to their bodies and want to end it all upon the realization that they fucked up.
But the rates of suicide are lower after srs, why do you think your feels supersede statistics?

>>5622846
>They both were diddled as kids and have both recently come down off of major drug addictions
So the same bs that /pol/ types say causes gay people too?

Also the famous johns hopkins paper only actually uses ONE real statistical study and even the author has condemned the misinterpretation of the study used by ignoring the demographic data.
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>>5622806

nah ftms are cool
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>op ignores >>5622874 >>5622867 and >>5622926 and continues to shitpost his feels
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>>5622972
my hormones cost me $250 per year without insurance because of generics SRS can range from 2k in 3rd world to 20-30k for the good ones.
FFS is the most expensive depending on what gets done but thats basically just multiple plastic surgeries at once.

Trans people take up such a small amount of the population that they make no money based on what the medical industry gets. my pysch meds cost twice as much with insurance and they are not even crazy good ones.
They make no money off us.


Im sorry about your friends and yeah there is a fad going on, but thats not most of the people here. thats over on tumblr and honestly its more likely to be DFAB, you just see the MTFs more because they suck at passing and its less accepted.
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>>5622892
>I'd love to show you guys a picture of my friend Brent, aka "Michelle". This guy has the face of John Belushi and the build of a lumberjack and no amount of plastic surgery will ever make him look like an actual woman, but I guarantee he would get put a pedestal by mouthbreathers as the pinnacle of femininity
You do realize this actually just supports the need for better access to treatment especially at younger ages?
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>>5622995
Of course, get rid of any sort of dissident opinions. Keep living in your fucking fantasy world where people's actual afflictions aren't being turned into popularized social trends and made out to be a complete fucking joke and a payday for people that could give a wet shit about people.

>>5622999
Thanks for the level-headedness to the reply, anon. I get what you're saying at the last part, I just wish that people weren't so easily influenced by external pressures egging them on to do something that they are going to regret, much like my friend. I'm still trying to work up the gumption to tell him how I feel about all of this and I'm pretty sure it's going to be met with staunch opposition.
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>>5623034
You didn't read the part about how he was molested as a child, has recently come down off a major heroin addicition, and I'll also add just got out of jail less than a year ago.

>>5623026
>posts a study from an accredited medical institution and offers to cite more
>MUH BIAS
>anon posts another study in favor of their point
>THIS TOTALLY FITS MY NARRATIVE, SUCK IT DELUSIONAL SHITLORD

What's the fucking point dude? Only a handful of responses have even been remotely close to even being cordial and rational.
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>>5622953
>And homosexuality was never a mental disorder to begin with in my opinion
Well opinions are great and everyone has them but the fact of the matter is that it was considered a mental illness and is still considered so by many people and even some countries.
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>>5623026
>>5622799
Just Sage and report. He doesn't want to do anything but spam his livejournal all over the place. A good global ban should take care of it.

Board doesn't have to pay to host his soap boxing.
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>>5623053
better medical access means better screening. pushing it away just means they will come to it later
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>>5623053
Pathetic, the study said they die at the same rates as normal people but Paul fanboy insists he knows better than it.

A crackpot who's been called out by the study authors and the APA on academic fraud shouldn't superceed the studies or consensus.

He is deluded, not an insult, just being objective.
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>>5623069
You're just as bad as the SJWs

Hear something you don't like or agree with? BAN THEM! FUCK CRITICAL THINKING AND SHIT, WHO NEEDS THAT LOL?!

Fuck out of here. Knowing the shitbreathing mods of this site, you'll get what you want.

>>5623071
Again, you're dealing with a for-profit industry that lobbies every year in Congress to get more and more of what they want, regardless of what effects it may have on society. What kills me is how many people just completely forget this and think it's just impossible that an issue that effects a very small amount of people suddenly effects many more people who didn't even know what the fuck it was before they heard of it.
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>>5623099
see >>5623031
Its not for profit, They make such a little amount off trans people. not to mention if anyone is making money its the other countries where people go for their surgeries much of the time
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>>5622953
>>5622965
>>5622972
>it's all a conspiracy by big pharam and sjws to turn people into trannies to make money!
Get a hold of your delusions anon.
Trans people are an extremely small percentage of the population and their treatment is a drop in the bucket compared to the bigger landscape of healthcare costs, just pushing pain and psych meds is a much more tried and true money making method.
Even if there was enough money in trannies to necessitate the level of medical conspiracy you've conjured up you've presented no evidence that such a conspiracy exists or that the current medical research is false besides your delusional feel-based "logic".

Furthermore you have no evidence that there are suddenly many more people transitioning beyond increased access to treatment for trannies who couldn't get it before. More likely you just personally noticed more trannies in the news and media and met a few and assumed that means they're everywhere and becoming exponentially more common since you clearly don't understand how statistics work.
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>>5623099
There is a difference between being a "critical thinker" *fedora tip* and being a complete asshole, dingdong.
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>>5623053
>You didn't read the part about how he was molested as a child, has recently come down off a major heroin addicition, and I'll also add just got out of jail less than a year ago
And you clearly didn't read the post that pointed out that those are the same excuses used to try to deny the legitimacy of gay people.
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>>5623090
>>5623069
>>5623026
>>5623017
>>5622960
>>5622943
>>5622867
>>5622863

Quick google search, just scraping the surface. Even the fucking Google, prefabricated response shows something is amiss. But I guess google are just a bunch of bigoted shitlords too, huh?
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>>5623099
You're delusional
>McHugh does cite one study from 2011, by Cecilia Dhejne, MD and colleagues at Karolinska Institute in Stockholm. However, he misunderstands Dr. Dhejnes work. In the paper, Dr. Dhejne states that the study was not designed to draw conclusions on the efficacy of transgender surgeries, yet McHugh does exactly that. A closer reading of the paper shows that the increased mortality is in those who had surgery before 1989, and that mortality in trans people after 1989 is not statistically different from the general population. A recently published paper by Dr. Dhejne and colleagues shows that the regret rate for those having surgery from 2001-2010 is only 0.3%. Dr. Dhejnes work shows that outcomes for transgender surgery have improved tremendously in the past 30 years, which supports the HHS decision to remove trans exclusions.
Your own study contradicted you, the only argument you have now is some Jew medicine conspiracy theory. Not a discussion by this point just spam and a violation of global rules.

You're now shitting up private property. Your sad commie philosophy doesn't entitle you to take that.
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>>5623120
Why the fuck is everyone trying to equate homosexuality to gender to dysphoria? Not even fucking close. Just because a group of psychologists deemed it a mental disorder in the past doesn't mean that every sexual disorder known to modern medicine has been deemed invalid.

Where does the buck stop?
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>>5623127
>treat a group like shit
>deny medical access
>surprised when they have higher suicide rates than the general population

Guess what poor people and people with depression also have higher rates. guess that means we should deny them help
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>>5623127
You're now quoting tumblr over the apa and wpath
>McHugh does cite one study from 2011, by Cecilia Dhejne, MD and colleagues at Karolinska Institute in Stockholm. However, he misunderstands Dr. Dhejnes work. In the paper, Dr. Dhejne states that the study was not designed to draw conclusions on the efficacy of transgender surgeries, yet McHugh does exactly that. A closer reading of the paper shows that the increased mortality is in those who had surgery before 1989, and that mortality in trans people after 1989 is not statistically different from the general population. A recently published paper by Dr. Dhejne and colleagues shows that the regret rate for those having surgery from 2001-2010 is only 0.3%. Dr. Dhejnes work shows that outcomes for transgender surgery have improved tremendously in the past 30 years, which supports the HHS decision to remove trans exclusions.
>The American Psychiatric Association and the World Professional Association for Transgender Health no longer view transgender identity as inherently pathological. Dr. McHughs views are stuck in the past.

>Dan Karasic, MD Health Sciences Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, UCSF Member, American Psychiatric Association Workgroup on Gender Dysphoria Member, Board of Directors, World Professional Association for Transgender Health
Pathetic
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>>5623053
>posts a study from an accredited medical institution and offers to cite more
>ignores evidence that the only actual research quoted in said "study" actually shows that people transitioning after 1989 have suicide rates in-line with the general population
>continues to ignore the evidence that disagrees with him and pretends that any disagreement is just sjws

I mean, you're free to ignore evidence and keep spouting your feels but anyone can just read up the thread and look at those studies and your lack of response besides
>SJWS!!!!
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>>5623127
>who needs research and evidence, I get all my info from google, wikipedia, tumblr, and reddit :^)
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>>5622892
If you want to be non-biased, you wouldn't use McHugh to support your argument. The guy blatantly misinterpreted the study that he got his suicide rate data from. It was comparing post-op trans people to the general population, which obviously says nothing about what effect the operation has on suicide rates. And the study itself reports that while the post-op trans population does have an elevated suicide rate (again, compared to the general population, not to non-op/pre-op trans people) the difference is not statistically significant after some year (1989 I think).

>>5622972
If you really want to help your friend, try to find actual non-biased information on SRS, rather than blindly trusting McHugh and his right wing religious fundamentalist nonsense. You're going into this ASSUMING that SRS is a bad thing and having the attitude that it's your duty to talk them out of it. But it's not. It's their choice, they're not transitioning for your benefit. Sure, you can ask them if they're really sure if they want to go through with it, but it's their decision, not yours. And if you do manage to talk them out of it using blatant lies and misrepresentation, all you've accomplished is deny them their happiness. You haven't proven anything. If you really care about your friend, let them make their own choices. They're an adult, they should be able to think for themselves.

>>5623127
And none of that indicates that stopping them from transitioning would reduce the suicide rate. People are transgender even if they don't transition.
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>>5623134
>Why the fuck is everyone trying to equate homosexuality to gender to dysphoria?
People are just pointing out that you're using the same stupid arguments of
>but they're just degenerate abused criminal druggies!
that were used in the past and continue to be used today to try to deny the legitimacy of homosexuals.

>Just because a group of psychologists deemed it a mental disorder in the past doesn't mean that every sexual disorder known to modern medicine has been deemed invalid
No but it shows how things can change, but if the same happened for trannies you'd just shout
>CONSPIRACY!
because it doesn't agree with your feels.
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