Who else here feels it is time to drop gay men from the LGBTQ+ movement because they are so much more massively privileged than every other letter? I feel that their presence is damaging our efforts for equal rights... they are just far too out-of-touch with the struggles of trans, bis, lesbians, and other gender nonconforming people that it just feels like they are out of place.
>I feel that their presence is damaging our efforts for equal rights...
May not actually be untrue. Lesbians and bisexuals are more socially accepted because they're not flamboyant and pushy and aggressive about their sexualities, and gay men literally do nothing for trans acceptance at all ever.
They're basically dragging the movement down with their sex parades and their burning need to let everyone know they suck cocks. Bisexuals could be respectable if being a homosexual wasn't tied to this image of being a flaming faggot and basically a woman's accessory.
Luckily, they don't affect lesbians much.
Furthermore, gay men are outright antagonistic towards bi men (who are just "gay in denial/don't exist"), bi women (who are just "straight women who are experimenting"), lesbians (because gay men hate women), and trans people.
Just look at the proof on this board. Gay men are predators.
>implying we want to be grouped with
>reject women that aren't qt enough to attract real men, so they have to settle with hambeast butch lezs that poorly imitate masculinity
>tranny freakshow monsters
Drop the LBT YESTERDAY.
So you're saying LBT part is just dead weight holding back the G?
"Privilege" is just a fashionable word to punish the more successful. Gay men aren't more privileged, there just, well, men, so they automatically outperform most of the rest of the lgbt.
Bisexuals are too much of an insignificant group to matter much and most of them will marry women to blend in and seem normal.
Lesbians have literally done nothing for themselves and would have gotten nowhere without gay men leading the gay rights movement.
And need anything be said about transgenders?
>So you're saying LBT part is just dead weight holding back the G?
It's more that G has already won its part of the battle, and is no longer making efforts to help LBT which is in a worse position.
>"Privilege" is just a fashionable word to punish the more successful. Gay men aren't more privileged, there just, well, men, so they automatically outperform most of the rest of the lgbt.
It's not that being privileged is "bad", it's that because they're so successful now they're blind to the problems of LBT, and assume everything is fine for LBT since everything is fine for them.
>most of you...autogynephiliac
MtFs are 33% straight, 33% gay, 33% bi, and 1% asexual And I'm pretty sure very few FtMs are autogynephiles.
What? You think transbians are homophobic because they don't want to fuck men? Seriously?
Man I used to find gays pretty sympathetic but once I heard LGBT was a thing and took a look inside I've started to despise them more with every passing day.
Meeting you around LGBT circles you've been the most repulsive people I've ever met.
I'd gladly see shit falling apart with infighting. Go be raging faggots with your own label.
Nah, I'm not the OP.
That's what it comes down to with you people, isn't it? The shell. The superficial. That's what you have to hide your aggression, your cold spirit.
Nothing is unanimous, but at least the B and L aren't visibly shitting on the T like schoolyard bullies in order to elevate themselves on this ladder to impress the straight white man.
the crabs in a bucket mentality never ceases to amaze me
I agree OP. The whole "gay" thing is bullshit, it's just fetishists who hate women so much they make it their whole identity. Like, why can't they just be straight? Lesbians, Bis and transgender people are they only ones with actual problems.
>That's what it comes down to with you people, isn't it? The shell. The superficial.
lol, no. It's important to you. It's why you hate looking at your own body.
And it's never, ever going to be right.
>Nothing is unanimous, but at least the B and L aren't visibly shitting on the T like schoolyard bullies in order to elevate themselves on this ladder to impress the straight white man.
Maybe, just maybe they say nothing because they are avoiding you?
It's not? You make a judgement call based entirely on physical appearance, and it's not important to you? Well, forgive my misunderstanding. Normally people talk about things that are important to them.
>It's why you hate looking at your own body.
If I ever experience something similar to this, it's only the regret that I did not work harder to reach higher. My body is something I'm comfortable with, and I have come to cherish myself because I do not look down on others.
Maybe. That would be a lot more decent than the alternative I stated, right?
My answer was in my statement.
It's not about impressing others, anon. That's the trap people fall into when they don't know what they want. It's about bettering oneself. The peace that transition can offer is what it's about.
Go be an excellent human being, if you can.
>It's not about impressing others, anon.
>decide to become a "woman"
>make no effort "because who cares what I look like."
>being trans is about "bettering oneself"
>the other shit you said
hilarious. absolutely hilarious. It's fucking opposite day.
Being trans isn't about "looking beautiful" or anything like that. Someone could be so beautiful that anyone would sell all their worldly possessions just for the opportunity to be smiled at by them, but if they have gender dysphoria they'd still be uncomfortable with their body. Trans people really don't care about their appearance any more than cis people do, except to the extent that it's harder to be accepted as your gender if you don't look the part.
>make no effort
I didn't say that.
But if you think I'm hilarious, then I'm happy to entertain. However, I'll mourn the fact that the concepts of empathy and self-improvement are lost on the you of today. I hope for your future.
>Nothing is unanimous, but at least the B and L aren't visibly shitting on the T like schoolyard bullies in order to elevate themselves on this ladder to impress the straight white man.
Because Bi's fit easier with "straight white man", and L's vibe super well with them as well. Gays only stick out to you because they're doing it for sexual reasons (which you are jealous of, let's be honest).
T's are alone, and will always be in any "rights" movements.
>Being trans isn't about "looking beautiful" or anything like that.
gee, I thought it was about a man becoming a woman. Since nothing obviously matters, I guess you just have to put on an over-sized dress from Sears and stop bathing or shaving.
You missed the point by a couple thousand light years. Trans people do want to put in effort, but it's not to make themselves pretty for other people. It's because if they don't put effort into their transition, they won't be able to change the aspects of their body and life that make them dysphoric. Dysphoric is a personal thing, it's between your mind and your body, it's not about impressing people.
Yes, it's about becoming a woman. And a mtf would rather be an ugly woman than continue living as an attractive man. And no, putting on a dress alone isn't enough to count as transitioning. And it makes no sense that a mtf would stop shaving, since many are dysphoric about facial and body hair.
>Gays only stick out
That's not an excuse, is it?
>you are jealous
Honestly, I don't even pursue sex. My experience with it hasn't been great yet, so I'm just taking it as it comes. Maybe I'll enjoy it, but so far I prefer the more romantic parts of relationships.
>T's are alone, and will always be
I hope that's not the case, but as long as we can talk about a message of common sense and good will to your fellow human beings, we will never be truly alone.
If there's anything that will cut a person off from others, it is their own bitterness. It's pretty difficult to wrestle with that every day for a long time, and it can only get better through self-improvement. Becoming something that is beyond shame.
People will come to understand, and overcoming ourselves will make it easier. It means the T will have to try extra-hard to be superhuman, but that's a goal that we can all at least share.
Why are we arguing about who's more oppressed? A good portion of the world still hates us, and we only make up a good 1% of the population. Shits getting worse for the community as a whole now that people are associating furries and 'Star-kin' with us. We're all fucked. Gay men may have it just a bit easier considering they're getting more socially excepted(especially if you're a white gay male. You get extra bonus points). But that doesn't mean they're having it better.
Basically, stop being a bunch of whiny faggots.
>but you contribute to all the shit too
Oh yeah I'm invading all the gay threads am I not? We trannies just love to shit up your discussions.
The fuck you talking about? We're literally more than you on this board and you still manage to stick out with your shitposting.
> lesbians are literally so unaffected by homophobia that pretending to be a lesbian is something a woman does to get more good attention
> gay males are still treated as the privileged ones
> despite being most of the lgbt hate crime victims everywhere
Really, the only ones who are more fucked up than gay males are the transwomen. Lesbians and the others are pretty much on Easy Mode. And really, transwomen only get attacked because they're treated as if they were just extra gay males.
The only advantage gay males have is the fact that they're in the top tier Male-Male relationship where everything works as it should and they don't drive each other crazy and shit. Also two working males who have a working male for a boyfriend also will have few expenses, so they'll appear richer even though they're really not.
You seem to be extremely upset for no good reason, but that's pretty much typical for you trannies.
>We're literally more than you
Congratulations on having more people on a board of one type than another, I guess? Literally how pathetic are you to even bring this up. LOL
i never really identified with the lgbt because you are all mentally ill immodest libtard freaks.
i guess after everyone starting tolerating them, there fucked world views and ideas started clashing.
i would love for this whole moment to die so i wont be lumped in with tumblristias like op
>top tier Male-Male relationship where everything works as it should and they don't drive each other crazy
Why do gay men have to justify their choices with misogynistic reasoning? Have some respect, anon.
>Who are you quoting?
I'm paraphrasing some retart on an imageboard.
>despite being most of the lgbt hate crime victims everywhere
Pretty sure mtfs are worse off. I mean, there are still people in civilized countries who think it's perfectly acceptable to kill trannies for 'deceiving' them. And there are plenty of people who are perfectly okay with gays but still insist that trannies are all fetishists, mentally ill, etc. You don't see the opposite at all, except maybe in Iran.
lolwat why would you include bi's then? It's statistically proven that over 90% do not date the same-sex.
Tbh most of them do date same-sex, they'll just never do it long-term.
And honestly, can you blame them? If you legit had a choice wouldn't you just take the path of least resistance?
>that's what trannies consider humour nowadays
Why can't I just suck dick in peace without a bunch of cry babies trying to fucking guilt trip me into "helping them"
The only problem is trans right now. They can fight their own battles.
disclaimer: i know that part of the notion of "privilege" is that it can be hard to see what it's like not to have privilege if you haven't experienced being black/female/non-hetero/etc.
to me as a gay guy, it seems plausible that we are more priv than lesbians and trans people, but i'm not sure the same is true of bisexuals. they have to put up with some stuff gays don't (like people who say bisexuality isn't real), but to me it seems in some ways being bi seems less stigmatized than being fully gay since bi is 'closer' to straight. my impression is that bi guys and gay guys seem about even, but i'm willing to be wrong on that because it's just my subjective impression.
the self is all there is, what else is there to get absorbed in?
>mtfs are worse off. I mean, there are still people in civilized countries who think it's perfectly acceptable to kill trannies for 'deceiving' them.
And being gay is still punishable by death in places like Iran, Nigeria, etc... But it's not the Oppression Olympics hon. All gays don't hate you, stop giving yourself such importance.
I find it funny that you refer to the gay battle being over as if equal marriage immediately erased homophobia. A "racism is dead" tea. Embarrassing.
>but to me it seems in some ways being bi seems less stigmatized than being fully gay since bi is 'closer' to straight.
>my impression is that bi guys and gay guys seem about even
You're contradicting your previous sentence.
But again, why are we fighting about who's more oppressed and stereotyping that "the other" (gay or trans) is all the same? What's the goal, online sympathy? A kick knowing you're OH SO HATED? It's fucking pathetic.
>And being gay is still punishable by death in places like Iran, Nigeria, etc... But it's not the Oppression Olympics hon. All gays don't hate you, stop giving yourself such importance.
>I find it funny that you refer to the gay battle being over as if equal marriage immediately erased homophobia. A "racism is dead" tea. Embarrassing.
It's not that gay men don't face problems anymore, but mtfs face all of those problems, plus more.
I'd be happy if gay guys were out of that clusterfuck, much better to be considered normie than to be lumped with biscum, trannies and whatever other snowflake letter they end up adding. Some dykes are cool tho.
Yea an organization platformed on women and trannies, I'm sure that'll give you the legitimacy you're looking for. Nice try kiddo but if you want anyone to take you seriously keep the G
>It's not that gay men don't face problems anymore, but mtfs face all of those problems, plus more.
no one likes ugly people and no one cares. All your ilk does is demand and yet you bring nothing but making everyone grossed out.
Gays and transwomen are still getting killed off in most of the world, and with the developed countries that were actually close to killing homophobia starting to import uncivilized subhumans en masse, homophobia is coming back full force. The only ones who are mostly unaffected by homophobia are lesbians and transmen.
>To make a point about gays standing out shitposting everywhere outside their threads.
trannies have like 3 generals for themselves
I havent been there in a while, but last time I chekced the gay general was filled with trannies as well
I made a post asking stuff about ftms and it got derailed 3 posts in with mtfs talking about how they had man butts and not female butts
not saying gays can be shit (there's a reason I don't go to gaygen anymore) but come on, you can't say gays are the ones that do the most shitposting when like 90% of the board is about trans stuff
>last time I chekced the gay general was filled with trannies as well
That your way of saying anyone who's feminine is a tranny according to you?
When you put it like that, it seems more like a catchall for anyone you don't like.
I wholeheartedly agree with anyone suggesting that G drop LBT. Gay men were the initial founders of the GAY rights movement, with lesbians supporters being small in comparison to gays. Now that these stupid women think they're more oppressed because they have vaginas and the 'plight of bisexuals' because they're perceived as gay are a thing, we don't need to be associated with those that will bring us down. They can continue they're oppression Olympics about have it worse (lel, neither of them do except T). The G in GLBT is what got us this far, not because of the other letters.
>Everyone thinks porn lesbians are hot, no one cares about masculine lesbians, most people don't even believe in lesbianism
>Bisexuals if men are seen as gays, who haven't made the full transition yet, and bi females are seen as college sluts
>Transsexuals have always been hated for being 'faggots', any comment section on caitlyn jenner is full of 'gay' or 'faggot/cocksucker' comments
who's the one holding everyone down again?
>literally anons going through hrt
Femboys on HRT to keep their looks aren't really the same thing as trannies. And it's always been fairly common for gays to be attracted to feminine guys.
>other people from ftmgen that were feeling 'manly'
So? They're gay men, what's the problem?
They aren't accepted. the problem is that the only hated members of lgbt are gay men, or people who anyone assumes to be a gay man.
lesbians are not hated, bisexual females are not hated, ftms are slightly hated but mostly ignored. gay men, male bisexuals, and mtfs; who everyone just sees as ultra-faggots are hated. the root of all lgbt hatred is the gay man
Oh fuck off with this bullshit. Why do gay men have fix the rest of the problems with the movement when the others aren't doing the same thing?
Gay men are still killed outside of 1st world countries and I don't see lesbians doing a damn thing about it.
>So? They're gay men, what's the problem?
Are you implying that if I go to mtfgen and start posting "hey pals I'm feeling girly this week so I guess I'm trans!" people there won't think I'm just shitposting?
Says the gay man. Those groups get way more shit than gay men. More likely to be underemployed or unemployed, more likely to lose housing, more likely to lose family, less likely to have specific support structures in play. Shit, gay bars are even exclusively male most of the time. It's at every level.
>literally anons going through hrt
Just cause you take female hormones doesn't automatically make you trans. If I simply want my body to remain feminine, but have a dick, like men and 'identify' as gay, then under what logic are you to tell me I'm not.
>losing housing, a family, being underemployed or unemployed
What is pulling shit out of my ass for $1000, Alex? The only ones who would suffer this the most are trans. Fuck off tumblr sjw.
Pretty true http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/press/americas-shame-40-of-homeless-youth-are-lgbt-kids/
There's more homeless boys that are gay/mtf than there are homeless females. Society treats this sort of thing much less harshly with women.
I don`t think so. Gay male have many issues, specially if they are affeminate, even there is a lot of discrimination from other gays who prefer to hide their sexuality, cause they don`t feel "privileged".
The only group that gets more shit than gay men, within LGBT, is MtF T. Bisexual males get close to gay males, but they can just stealth if absolutely necessary so whatever. Not like most of those don't make up that choice later anyway.
FtMs are just unwanted in general, while lesbians don't get shat at at all. But then again, it's not like you can get any more privileged than women. Having a vagina is pretty much a license to succeed without actually being any good at anything these days. Hell, women sometimes pretend to be lesbians for the attention they get when they do so. THAT's how easy lesbians have it.
Meanwhile gay males would rather fuck in secret like vermin, just because dealing with homophobia is that bad and life destroying. Things are improving, but still long ways to go.
The problem with you faggots is that you are simply unhappy with yourselves. So you bicker and bite at each other.
The thing keeping you from "privilege" is, each-other and yourselves. You imagine "getting to equality" or whatever as some end goal ladder. Like if you could just get there, you'd be happy.
But you are not happy now. You are not happy when you are alone or with friends and when no one is bothering you. You forgot how to be happy. You forgot what makes you happy. What made you happy before? Was it "feeling equal to other people"? No, you get joy from trying to demean other people, so that certainly isn't it. No one feels happy about "being equal".
The truth is you hate yourself, but it's much easier to go on the internet and piss and moan or berate other people than actually improving yourself or your situation. This place is holding you back, this place where you struggle for meaningless victories in the form of (YOU)'s that complement you. Or feeling like you've defeated someone because they stopped posting when they went and took a shit and forgot they were even having a debate. Meanwhile it's the highlight of your night to get a few "yea I agrees" from some random person on the internet, who if died tomorrow you wouldn't know.
Run. Get out of this place.
I know this but I completely botched up my reply because I had to head out. What I was trying to get before I completely sperged out is that I highly doubt B and L get more shit thrown at them T. Where are the statistics that they are more at risk than gay men like that anon claimed. That's what I want to know.
Petition is utterly stupid and probably some sort of pol/rad scheme for infighting.
That said, if OP went along with his divorce, what's gonna happen to femgen? Neither group wants us around so...
Tbh, all I want is to not have to worry about getting fired as soon as someone in management learns about my situation and not having to worry about some nigger killing me once he learns about my situation. Everything else, I can deal with.
I guess living in a third world country that's #1 at gay killing, even though it's perfectly legal to be gay and even gay marry, really changes your perspective, however. Maybe I'd also be worried about first world problems if I actually lived in a first world country.
Then again, mudslimes are soon going to turn those into new third world countries soon, so I guess I should just go ahead and hang myself or something. Not like there will be many better options in the future.
Fuck no. Kick out the L. Where there are lesbians, there are SJWs. Being associated with the feminist crowd makes the rest of us look bad.
How many gay men of note are actively trying to stop trans people from existing? I can't name any. Milo? I can name at least several high profile lesbian feminists however who are or have worked to that end.
Gay men might not always be nice to trannies, but at least they're not trying to exterminate us.
>I can name at least several high profile lesbian feminists however who are or have worked to that end.
How influential and respected are those lesbian feminists today, among the general population and among other lesbians? Milo seems fairly popular among the alt-right, and he did manage to push that "drop the t" petition. Have any of these lesbian feminists managed similar accomplishments?
In absolute numbers? Yeah. Last I checked the stats were like 90% of all lgbt hate crime victims were male (which includes MtFs), with that being about half and half Gay Males and MtF trans.
But since the MtF trans population is just a tiny speck compared to the gay male population, if we were to adapt these numbers for population size, being MtF is extremely hazardous to your health and well-being.
Bisexual men are barely relevant, though. Not like they aren't going to marry a female stripper in the end and pay alimony later like every other straight dude, so who cares.
> "gay dudes who do drag are like 99% of why people think trans women are freaks"
> trans women who try to make cute surprises about their dicks are not
Gays do drag in fun events that most non-gays don't even get to look at. Trans freaks who will never ever pass, however, do it right in front of them.
L's and B's are mad because they realized the only letters that ever actually mattered were the G's and T's. It tickles my insides whenever I see white middle-class bitches (9 outta10 times it's a white bitch) complaining about how oppressed they are because hetero-meatheads said some nasty shit to them once.
I'm pretty sure very few people who cut their dick off aren't turned on by the idea of not having a dick
Also their are 7 transgens that haven't expired yet, but it's everyone else who shitposts. At least you stopped spamming /passgen/ threads, maybe cause none of you pass and you all look like degenerates.
If anyone questioning is reading this, remember; the world would prefer it if you cut your wrists not you dick. No one likes trannies, legitimately the most insecure people on 4chan.
Fiction. MPs that are observed engaging in obviously sexist behavior, especially amongst the general public, have their COs come down on them like the fist of an angry god. It's getting less tolerated still, even in private.
This "drop the _" nonsense is what needs to get scrapped. There's always been a solution to not wanting to associate with the rest of the LGBT+ community: leave. If you want to be free from association by others with the rest of the community, just perfectly conform to your prescribed heteronormative gender and sexual roles.
>there's always been a solution to not wanting to associate with the rest of the LGBT+ community: leave
It's your stupid umbrella term that keeps associating with me. It speaks for me, has a public presence for me, takes political decisions for me. This acronym is holding in hostage everything that concerns my sexuality. Leave me the fuck alone.
Aww. You've discovered the existence of categorization, prejudice, and othering, and made the intuitive leap to wailing that you are different, and "the good one", while spitting at the other others.
Have you read the script, or worked it out intuitively?
Yes, that's what bisexuality is. You're attracted to the same sex and attracted to the opposite sex. The same-sex attraction (which they share with true gays) is the only reason they're considered part of LGBT.
>> trans women who try to make cute surprises about their dicks are not
That barely ever happens though.
I fail to see what any of that has to do with my post.
>struggling of bis
Really not dispelling the notion of being the tumblr board, /lgbt/, just saying.
- Love, /v/
As a black gay man I find this thread absolutely ludicrous. It pretty much conjures up the same ridiculous feeling I get when a white LGBT, regardless of what letter, tries to tell me about how hard their life is.
Playing this baseball card game of identity politics is already ridiculous, but if we're gonna play it, then you guys definitely should just shut the fuck up complaining about everything because there are gay black men that would kill themselves to be in your position. Gay black guy vs bisexual white woman? Equal hurdles? Come on, now.
as a gay black man you probably have more affirmative options at your disposal + the cultural positive stereotype of a big dick + exoticness + perceived oppression.
Being born black probably isn't born into easy mode but society sure as hell is trying to cater to your every needs.