Belgian F-16 replacement process to start by mid-year

Super Hornet

Super Tucano

>>28907073
F35 if they have a brain.

>>28907099
They are too poor

>>28907099
They already expressed their interest in the F-35 when their MoD was cocksucking NATO to be Secretary or something.

>>28907121
If they cant afford F-35's then they cant afford anything 4.5 gen.

>>28907209
Gripens and Super Hornets

Or more Block 52 F-16's

As sad as it makes me, F-35 is the better choice.
Eurofighter would be second probably, but too expensive and has poor air to ground capabilities.
Rafale is even more expensive.
Everything else is just old or unfeasible.

>>28907249
Won't the Super Hornets end up being cheaper ?

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>>28907242
So either old Gripens that are equal to their old F-16's, new Gripens that cost way more than they should, or Super Hornets which at best will only be $10 mil cheaper per plane than F-35's by the time Belgium buys any.

Paying 75% of the cost for 50% of the capability is pretty dumb.

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>>28907272
Are they? This is what a new F/A-18C would cost.

>>28907242
>more Block 52 F-16's
Aren't the Fokker/SABCA F-16 MLUs up there with Block 50/52 in terms of capability already? Minus the ability to fit CFTs and the fact that the airframes have a lot of flight hours of course.

If that's the case, F-16V and Block 60 would be the only proper step forward without going for a totally new aircraft

>>28907121
The F35 is cheaper than a Grippen, only about 15% more expensive than a Super Hornet.

Don't buy the memes.

>>28907272
Only a few million dollars each.

>>28907073
Eurofighter

>>28907299
>>28907433

Even in terms of maintenance ?

I know one engine is cheaper to take care of but everything else seems more complicated on the F-35.

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>>28907395

Typhoon

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>>28907073

>>28907474
The cost estimates he's using are likely not the same method of estimation as the F-35.

An A airframe in LRIP 9 was $94 million. That is in no way the final cost of the plane.

Watch out for shills on both sides comparing apples and oranges.

>>28907517
Why is this spammed everywhere?

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>>28907517

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Good to see the Belgians doing something about replacing their F-16's.

>Place your bets.

The inner slavaboo suggests MiG-35's but more realisticaly would be F-35A's.

>>28907546

It's a cute girl, bro.
Also, to help people fill the bingo in F-35 threads.

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>>28907073

>>28907556
>balls deep into NATO
>buying Ruskie

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>>28907594

You think i dont know that?

>>28907350

MLU's don't have the better engine, and they have the F-16A airframe, which is lighter but less capable of handling extra loads.

Most of the MLU's are very high hour frames that can't get many more service extensions.

>>28907474
It'll probably be a wash. There are lots of features meant to reduce maintenance time and cost, but other features that will be more maintenance intensive like the stealth coatings.

But even those features are less maintenance intensive than previous generation stealth coatings.

Who the fuck would attack them? France? Netherlands? Germany? UK?

Whatever they buy, it's a WASTE OF MONEY.

They should buy small arms and go on a full kebab removal. Parts of that country are GIGANTIC SHITHOLES.

Paris attackers came from that Islamist-infected shithole.

>>28907633
They're involved in NATO bombing of middle east shitholes.

Their objective for the future is too have a small fleet of capable fighters, F-35 would be a good option.

>>28907650
>They're involved in NATO bombing of middle east shitholes.
WAT! Where?
You mean "The Coalition"? HAHahahah... that's just a PR cover for the US. It's the US that's doing bombing. Everyone else is pulling their dicks.

>>28907623
"Better engine" would refer to the F100-PW-229, right?

>>28907703
I'm not talking about ISIS, but they did use their F-16s before.

>>28907546
its a mandatory image for F-35 threads

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>>28907746
Who cares? Let someone else do the bombings in ME. There are much bigger and richer countries that can do it. They can contribute in other ways.

>>28907784
But Belgium wants to be involved.

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>>28907810
Then they should fight ISIS inside their own country.

>What’s the Matter With Belgium?
>The small nation has become a major source of violent jihadists, both in Syria and Iraq and also inside Europe.

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/11/belgium-radical-islam-jihad-molenbeek-isis/416235/

>Belgium providing most ISIS recruits per capita in Europe – UN
https://www.rt.com/news/318921-isis-recruitment-belgium-pay/

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>>28907850
Fucking hell, is any country safe from these cunts?

>>28907546
Why are anti-F35 meme everywhere?

>>28907717

yep

>>28907619
remember 5 months ago when people argued
>MUH 4 MISSILES
>F35 NO EXTERNAL HARDPOINTS

>>28907073
Rafale
Pls... ;_;

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>>28908409

>F35 NO EXTERNAL HARDPOINTS

They said that? Realy?

Pfffffff

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>>28907073
Sexy Su-35

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>>28907073
D-do you like Gripen, sempai? It's pretty good. And cheap.

>>28908698
You're better off buying late F-16s tbqh

>>28908698
According to croatian ministry of defense, MiG-21 is better

>>28908698
>cheap
Not really.

>>28907099
This.

>>28908791
$43 million vs approximately $50 million for later model F-16

>>28908698
>>28907283
>>28907532

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/europe/gripen-sales.htm

Any other source? Each contract so far seem to be for way more than just the planes, specially the Brazilian deal. How do we compare it to F-35 costs?

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>>28907073
Will India be selling the Tejas? Seems to be one of the cheapest so far.

>>28908864
I think Belgium still have a bit of pride.

>>28908864
Does it use poo as ammo?

>>28908698
How is this an upgrade?

>>28907073
Eurofighter, because EU.
>paying money to murrifats

>>28908925
>eurofighter
>4 year backorder for spare parts
hopefully nothing breaks in the 1st 4 years

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Hey guys, what's going on in this thread?

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>>28908925
>Paying more for substandard Eurotrash.

Why?

>>28908970
Rafale is when you can't buy NATO, can't really buy Ruskie either but still need to remove kebab.

And Belgium can definetly buy NATO.

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>what could have been...

>>28908989
Its good enough. Also
>even thinking about LM shillplane

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>>28908698
>>28908970
>Cucknards
Shit's fugly.

>>28908840
Cherry pick a Gripen deal and divide the whole cost of it with planes purchased, pick the $80 million promised future cost of F-35 and then just compare.

>$5,440m/36=$151m
>$151m > $80m
>F-35 is cheaper
Simple

Probably F35's so the Belgians can share infrastructure with the Dutch to save money.

>>28909024
>its good enough to pay more for less

This is why you are not in charge of procurement.

>>28909107
>bad goyim, investing your money in EU military industry is bad, give your shekels to LM

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>>28909024
It's not good enough, it's mediocre garbage that's barely any cheaper.

>>28909138
>no goyim, give your shekels to my pet company

>>28908733
>Croatia
>relevent

>>28909222
>money staying in EU, taxes, wages, investments into future of EU industry
vs
>give everything to amerifats, AND pay even more later because muh upgrades and technical assistance

>>28907395
is this true ?

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>>28909243
its spelled Relephant

>>28909269
>buy 50% inferior planes now because they are 25% cheaper
>pay more in 10-20 years when they are hopelessly obsolete and you need to replace them

And F-35 production money goes to EU as well, since you want your share of shekels.

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>>28909043
>Rafale
>Ugly

Nigga, you dumb ?

>>28909449
>buy 50% inferior planes
Citation needed. Also
>care so much about differences instead of just buying cheaper plane and allow US to do all expensive defense job
NATO is here for a reason :^)

>>28909643
>spending money on immigrants instead of your military because daddy Murrica will protect you

t. cuck

>>28909770
>not squeezing US for free money
>2016

>>28909936
>get Murrica to be your defense guarantor which equates free shekels
>complain that Murrica influences your national policy

>>28907395
That post is fairly true until you consider operational costs.

>>28909974
>implying small EU country can do anything with US influence on their national policy

you know what i like about stealth aircraft?

they actually look like birds.

b2? hawk/osprey in profile
f22? a duck
f35? a canary

we live in high times gentlemen.

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>>28908730
Grip has a waay smaller RCS, better selection of weapons and is cheaper to operate.

The only real problem the grip has is in terms of usage (F16 is a better multi-role other platforms are better at policing airspace etc).

Which is largely due to the fact that Grip is true jack of all trades and a master of none.

If you are a country with a small military budget and you want a modern western single engine platform there is simply no other choice.

>>28908970
Can beat an Su30MKI in BVR combat

Good enough for Government work IMO

>>28908698
>Gripen

>aka the we can't buy Su-35s because we are NATO, the plane

Targeting system on it probably fail when used against brown people too.

>>28908864
>>28908887

Memes aside, does anyone here have a more informed opinion concerning the Tejas? Indians sure seem to be going forward with it as the bulk of their forces replacing their MIG-21. And for around US$30million a piece it is quite cheap compared to other multi-role fighters.

>>28910223
They're looking toward a three aircraft mix : A shit ton of Tejas as lightweight fighter, some Rafales as fighter bomber, and the PAKFA or whatever will come of it as heavy fighter.

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>>28910125
>If you are a country with a small military budget and you want a modern western single engine platform there is simply no other choice.

Except for, well, you know.

>>28910014
What are the operating costs of a Gripen E?

>>28907395
Bullshit.

>>28909048
apples to oranges

>>28910181
Ironically Su-35s are the "I cant buy F-35s or Eurofighters" plane.

>2016
>PESA

>>28907073
Gripen.

They have looked at Typhoon bur I doubt they'll want to spend that kind of wedge.

I don't see an F35 or Super Hornet buy.

>>28908590
Considering the French literally had to pay Egypt to take the Rafale then I doubt that'll happen.

Now the upgrades are coming through, they have a better product in Typhoon available or a cheaper alternative in Gripen.

>>28907073

the mentioned budget is 4 billion dollars for 34 aircraft, it was not stated if maintenance and operating costs are included in that budget

for the f35,
assuming a higher than advertised per plane price of $95 million (including engine) just kicks:
95*34 = 3230
or around $3.2 million overall

an f35 buy is not improbable

>>28911704
3.2 >B illion

Belgian here, I'm honestly doubting anything is going to come from it.

Defence has had massive budget cuts in the past years and the decision is scheduled for 2018, which is also an election year.
So nobody is going to risk public ire by cutting in civilian oriented service to find the funds to replace our F-16's.
My guess is either F35 (buy new and kept it again for 40 years & the dutch are buying it), the Dassault (our fighter pilots already do their training in cooperation with the French) or the Gripen

>>28907633
Not anymore, our 6 F-16 (yup we deployed 10% of our fighter jets against IS), returned in the summer of 2015 because there wasn't a budget to continue the operation.
We might either take over from the dutch in 2017 or redeploy in 2016.
We do have 4 F-16's deployed in the Baltic to secure NATO airspace.

>>28911704
$3.2 million for 34 F-35s? Sign me up.
>great new deal, these F-35s are 99.99% off!

>>28907784
>>28907850
>All of the Paris attackers were EU citizens, not refugees

>>28907073
Do they simply need a replacement due to wear or they feel their fleet is getting obsolete?

Also, why replace 59 fighters by 34?

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>>28907073

>>28911209
Nobody publicly knows because the numbers that SAAB / the Swedes use way different metrics; it's believed they don't count replacement parts and unscheduled maintenance as part of their operating costs (while US figures do, which skews everything).

>>28911704
They're not going to get 34 F-35s for $4 billion, unless they're only considering flyaway costs. For 34 F-35As they'd want about $6.5 billion (including all the necessary support equipment, etc).

They'll either boost the budget or reduce the aircraft number requirement - $4 billion for 34 jets = $117.6 million per jet. Even the Gripen E's total acquisition cost is around $150 million (an F-35A's is around $175-200m).

>>28915856
Even then an F-35 is worth two or more Gripens.

In a couple years Belgium will be full blown muslim, so maybe they'll buy that pakistani produced jet they made with china- i think its called the jf-17.

>>28911730
Do you guys still want to retain nuclear capability?
Because in that way only f16 and f35 are viable. Its a shame, that the Dutch don't want it any more...

>>28917852
>2015
>Nuclear free fall bombs