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Scout Rifle Reborn
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>Rifle for Scoot

I think it needs to be revisited.

Instead of just dogmatically parroting what Jeff Cooper laid out way back when, why don't we look at what Col. Cooper was trying to accomplish IN EVERY ASPECT.

My quick estimate
>extreme reliability and lifespan of weapon
>quick acquisition optic with zoom
Here he suggests a combination of a low powered forward mounted scope and a back up ghost ring iron sight. Both being readily usable.
>2 minutes of angle or less (4") at 200 meters/yards (3 shot groups)
>unloaded weight of 6 and a half pounds or less
>length of 1 meter or less

>lastly stipulates that the rifle must be a fullsize rifle round

So how do we translate this all with the best modern advantages?

Can we satisfy the spirit of all these rules while also improving? Something maybe still lighter, or automatic?

This is a question for discussion, I don't believe I know what if most correct. I do think there must be room for improvement by now.

So, any semiautomatic function that offers the same robustness of a bolt action, under typical use? I'm pretty certain we can satisfy what he wanted from the optics and sights BETTER with modern technology.
[cont.]
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>>28858994
what role is it suppose to fill? is the better question
>>
Bullpup with straight-pull bolt-action. Reduce overall size.
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>>28859015
Basically a durable SHTF civilian rifle.
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>>28859041
why would i want a long rifle that is front heavy, has full sized round, low capacity and with quick acquisition?
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>>28858994
heres a good article.
>http://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/scout-rifle/
tldr: there are better options these days
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>>28859015
It is a longer-than-medium-range real fucking NATO rifle with quick (as possible) target acquisition both at range and close up.
It is intended to be used for long duration without proper servicing, as in on a long range scouting mission.
It is to fight aggressors solo or in a group where skirmish tactics and/or hit and run would be king.

It is also for hunting all large game.
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>>28858994
I think I'd like to see what the lightest we could get a roller lock to go, essentially a scout G3.

To my knowledge, the classic scout rifle has a rather thin barrel, so what barrel lightening option do we have AND what is the expected lifespan of one of those pencil .308 barrels?

Roller lock should be lighter than short stroke piston, correct?

What else can we cut weight on nowadays that they could not do back then? Different metals/polymers?

What's the lightest we could make the top battle rifles?
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>>28859140
*[end cont.]
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>>28859140
What is the melting point of steel? How much thermal energy does a single cartridge emit? Aren't standard HK G3 handguards polymer? Could we take the lower and other parts made normally out of metal and polymerize them?
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>>28859195
>melting point of steel
Stainless Steel -- 1363c 2550f
Steel-High Carbon -- 1353c 2500f
>>
What are some good, cheap scout optics?
>>
SBR 17S with a TA-11.
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>>28859140
If we don't care about how much these things will conceivably cost, simply going for maximum performance improvements...
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>>28860076
What's the lifespan on a carbon barrel though? Does it diminish any of the other important qualities we want?
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>>28860163
Assuming the CF wrap can soak up heat, I can't imagine the rifling would wear any faster than an ordinary barrel profile.

Most of the wear is going to occur within the first four or five inches of rifling, as well as near the muzzle.
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Year before last I decided that I wanted something modern that fit the scout rifle concept and didn't break the bank. In the end I went with a 16 inch vepr in 308 and did the following:
1. Removed unfinished wood thumb hole stock and replaced with at style furniture.
2. Replaced wood Fore end with slotted aluminum guard. *
3. Side mount optic with fixed power optic. **

The gun is just at 26 inches and 10.2 pounds with metal mag and 20 308 rounds. It meets the accuracy test at 100 and 200 yards and bagged a deer last year. It's not a perfect cooper rifle but I'm mostly happy.

* - the hand guard is heavier than I want. May go back to wood or a plastic one.
** - Nikon p223 was sitting around. I'm honestly surprised it held up to 308 this long . May replace with primary arms fixed mag optic.
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>>28858994

what about an SR-25 with an acog? fills the same role, maybe weighs a few pounds more, though.
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>>28858994
The only reason I would own a scout rifle would be if I could only have one rifle that would fill the role of a hunting rifle, and SHTF if that ever happens.
>>
Toggle or stright pull with user selectable ejection side. And reversible bolt

7.62 x51

True 1-6 pr 1-8 optic
Forward mounted

Folding stock

16" barrel
Threaded for can

Overmolded

Grip pod or qd bipod
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>>28861622
Add to this

Magazine feed

Spare magazine storage in butt or foreend. Like a biathalon rife

Sling cups

Flip up irons
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>>28859016
>>28859074
because you want a rifle that's easy to maintain and less likely to fail. Fewer moving parts, ect.

precise choice of t argets over volume of fire. guerrilla tactics, shoot once and make sure you hit and then retreat.
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>>28859140
Roller lock has questionable longevity
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>>28859041
>Basically a durable SHTF civilian rifle

AR-15 in a nutshell. It's the everyman's rifle, American as apple pie. Ubiquitous spare parts, compatibility, etc...

Comparing firepower, I'd rather take an AR-15 over a 16 inch long .308 Win Boltgun 90% of the time
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>>28859091
So get a scar 17 and a 3x optic
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>>28861875
>AR-15
Yup, besides there are plenty of places to save weight with it, there are full featured builds under 5lbs. Pop in a 10/20rd magazine and you can get nice and low.
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one rifle to rule them all.
>>
I have a pretty good idea of how to throw a bunch of money away on a M70 scout rifle project.

However that Canadian ranger rifle contract winner is pretty good. http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/meet-the-canadian-rangers-new-sako-rifle-built-to-defend-against-large-carnivores-extreme-temperatures
>>
>>28862152
>Laminate stock

Nah.

Also how is Sako going to guarantee 1" MOA if they aren't making the barrels?
>>
I think that the Ruger American Compact is really good.
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>>28862221
>>Laminate stock
>Nah.


I agree friend. Also I would prefer an integral magazine and a clip slot cut at an angle to clear a smallish diameter scope. 18" light profile barrel, adjustable rear sight (CZ style) and hooded front. A Nightforce 2.5-10x32 would do nicely.
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>>28862152
> Canadian Rangers
Never heard of them. What do they do?
> Basically roam around the frozen tundra killing bears and shit
mfw
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>>28862493
Bit more than that.
The northern patrols train soldiers in winter survival skills while the southern patrols teach basic bushcraft and woodsmanship.
All patrols participate in SAR operations in their regions.
>>
Oh hey the Brits made one before Jeff Cooper.
>>
solution looking for a problem
>>
I bought a Scout because I was told I could run faster with it than with my knife

You'll be seeing me in the upcoming Olympics
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>>28862850
Shooting at the participants?
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>>28862892
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>>28859140

>Roller lock should be lighter than short stroke piston, correct?

Nope. You need a massive bolt when using roller-delayed blowback, which is why a stamped-steel G3 weighs as much as a milled FAL or M14.
>>
I own a Scout rifle and it is overrated. First one I'd sell if I needed to..

Much rather have an AR, in any circumstance.
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>>28863127
Roller lock and Roller-delayed blowback are 2 different things, but I don't know if one would be lighter than the other.
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>>28861943
If Ruger cut stripper clip guides in the receiver I would sell my boipussy for one.
>>
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>>28863288
>clip
>>
>>28863228

Roller locking is where you have 2 rollers instead of a bolt, and the action is locked, and roller-delayed blowback is blowback where 2 rollers provide mechanical disadvantage, allowing the bolt to be lighter than a straight blowback. For example, a straight-blowback .308 would need a 37-pound bolt to work, whereas a G3's bolt, while still fuckhuge, is much lighter.
>>
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>>28863409
>being this noguns
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>>28863127
>>28863228
Pic related.
>>
Dream scout rifle:

Springfield 1903A3 action with ghost ring rear sights

Cut down to 18 inch barrel

Surplus navy synthetic stock

Load via stripper clips cuz those things are hella efficient in manual cycled guns

3x long eye relief scope
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>>28863288
but then youd have to have the optic so much further forward...
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>>28863924
Not to mention bolt forward and clip ejects
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>>28858994
I dont have a picture but I built a scout concept rifle.

Winchester m70 featherweight 30-06(I went with this caliber over 308 because I reload it, and its gun panic proof)
>Cut the barrel down to 18in
>Dove tail slots cut into barrel for a folding leaf sight and hooded front sight
>picatinny scope rail
>1-4x SWFA scope
>cheap takedown weaver rings
>nylon military sling
>weight = 7.2lbs with scope and loaded

Some thoughts on my build:
I chose to use a newer Portuguese made winchester, quality control is spectacular on these newer rifles. Brand new, it felt smoother than my rem700 and savage rifles. I also prefer the larger bolt knob. With my m70 I notice that I dont have to use as much force to push the bolt forward on stubborn rounds compared to my other rifles. I chose to go with a folding leaf sight on the barrel instead of a receiver iron sight and forward scout rail because I could not get used to using a forward optic. If I had more funds to spend on it, I would have sent my rifle in for one of those pop up rear sights built into the rail or a folded peep sight installed onto the rear face of the picatinny rail. I chose a regular nylon military sling over a ching sling because its cheaper and I can support the rifle with a two point sling just as easily as with a ching sling. The swfa scope, I chose the 1-4x because its illuminated and a good reticle for judging distances. I didnt replace the stock since the wood looks nice, its pretty light, and has an excellent recoil pad.

Total cost for my set up was about 1300$:
Rifle - 700$
Scope - 350$
Sights - 50$
Rail - 40$
Sling - 10$
Gunsmith - 150$

I tried to do this as cheap as possible and keep the rifle under 7.5lbs with scope. Sure I could have gone with a pre 60s m70, but I really liked the quality of the newer one.

It is by far my favorite rifle, and is the one I take out the most. It is super light, and the balance point is directly under the chamber.
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>>28864014
precisely, and its not like its a huge deal if you lose them. You can buy like 30 for $10.
>meanwhile $10 per stanag and they're big
>>
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>>28863924
one of these with a us optics sr-6 1.5-6 chambered in 6.5 creedmor. i would marry that rifle.
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>>28858994
Maybe a lightweight AR10 build would work.
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>>28858994
http://www.chuckhawks.com/win94_scout_rifle.htm

7.5lbs w/ scope and mount, will 1 shot kill the fuck out of just about anything in North America
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>>28858994
Dude I had a scout Rifle built out of a K98 in 308 back in 1985. My local gunsmith in South Africa used to build guns for Professional hunters and he built scout rifles after going on a trip with Mr Cooper. One of my Favorite rifles that he built was a Scout with Bipod and integrated Silencer...LOL Not really meeting the 6.6lb limit but So much fun to shoot.
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>>28861443
What's the unloaded weight though? That's what Cooper always talked about.
>>
But can I jumpshot someone in pit?
>>
I just picked up a mossberg mvp patrol in 308.
Seems to fit the bill almost.
I got it for a SHTF rifle, minimal servicing and something to hunt with,
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>>28861820
Not really, and keeping extra rollers/bearings is cheap, and installation (of new rollers) is/can-be fairly simple.

New rollers last a pretty long time too. If you're implying something other than the rollers wear out regularly, I haven't heard that before.

Let's not forget that the pencil thin barrel will wear out faster than most of us are used to; I'd even recommend having a heavy training barrel for getting your familiarity in and ONLY train with the pencil barrel enough to learn its characteristics.
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>>28863670
>>28859140


Uhhh... The G3 is roller-delayed blowback. There is no such thing as a roller-lock action.
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>>28866060
Unloaded would be 9-9.2 lbs. metal mag and 20 rounds of 308 are heavy.
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>>28866413
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEPwmYcCPFs

based ian will teach ya
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>>28866413
>There is no such thing as a roller-lock action.
MG42

Not to be confused with roller-delayed blowback, which does not actually lock the action.
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>>28866413
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3GJAPgz23c

not knowing the developmental history of roller locked/delayed blow back, pleb
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>>28866416
Now that ain't so bad considering what you have is HALF an RPK. What weight could a skeletonized FAL, G3, SCAR, or especially an AR10 achieve?
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>>28864817

This. Brooklyn Scout is best scout.
>>
>>28862549
>.303 Brit

but that'd be retarded, rechamber in 7.62x39mm like some people already have and you have yourself a decent brush rifle
>>
SCAR H with an SR8m.

Boom, done. Thanks FN.
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>>28864817
>http://www.chuckhawks.com/win94_scout_rifle.htm
>lever action
FUKCING FUDDS!

Call me back when it's a slam-fire-capable slide-action.
>>
>>28867001
Looked into the fal and rejected it as too heavy. I'm not familiar at all with the G3 action so no idea.

The ar10 platform has promise but when I built that vepr a few years ago the reviews simply were not in. Looks promising now though.

The big one was the scar. With all that plastic it starts in the 7 to 8 pound range. I simply didn't have the cash to pursue it. If you have the dish that's where I'd start.

The vepr was 599 with the unfinished wood. Add to that the 350 for parts and mags(the scope was free) and I'm quite happy.

Posting on phone es no Bueno.
>>
How is a scout rifle any different from an M4/AR?
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>>28861943
The Mossberg Scout is bretty good too.
I recently bought one in .308 and sighted it for 150 yards this past weekend.

Removes paint cans with extreme prejudice.
>>
Thinking about turning either my 91/30 or k98 into a scout rifle setup. You can install the brass stacker mount and a scope without any permanent damage to the rifles, so I thought it might be cool to have something that I could use to hunt durr. (obviously while taking precautions to not cause any more wear and tear on the rifle)
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>>28867384
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scout_rifle

Basically the ar does not qualify because the round is too little.
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>>28863409
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA

the one time someone uses clip correctly.
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>>28867384
>>
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>>28858994
We Counter Strike now
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>>28870063
>>28870063
>>28870063
>>28870063
>>28870063
THIS
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Aside from being pretty heavy, the Ruger GSR is pretty spot-on for being a good all-in-one rifle, barring expensive mags.
Pros:
>1 MOA with >150gr. hunting rounds and I do my job.
>Robust Mauser action
>Flash hider and weather-proof materials
>18" barrel
>Irons
>Plastic mags can be top-loaded

Cons:
>Heavier than my AR
>Mags are expensive, the plastic ones are a bit flimsy-feeling
>Mauser action is slow on the eject, needs to be forcefully worked
>Trigger is average to below-average
>Scout scope is kind of like a magnified red-dot, but doesn't offer the variable zoom options of normal scopes.

I like mine.
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>>28867403
I hear the action can be touchy and it likes too fuck the brass on its way out. You've had no issues though? I'd be super into getting one of these.
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>>28867124
.303 Brit is just barely under .308 in performance. I hand load 150 grain sp. Gets 2650 fps and 2400 foot pounds on average. That's only a hundred less fps and foot pounds than the 308. Plus it loads from strippers and can hit targets out to 500+ yards.

Fuck x39 for that distance
>>
Why the fuck would you put the scope forward like that?
>>
>>28871427
you have to look through it to understand
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