I guess most of you people still remember the bullshit directive some EU folks tried to propose after Paris' attacks in 2015. The idea was to ban all semiauto firearms on European soil, and limit storing guns in your home.
The tl;dr version of how this mess was received by the population:
>an opposing online petition with some million signatures by now.
>Finland plain out directly said that bullshit won't be adopted by them, because it'd kill reservist activities.
>Whole thing was technically BTFO in a live EU discussion event, where only couple stuttering UK and Belgium fags tried to support it.
>Americans were all "Europoors can own guns??"
It's been a couple months now, and things seemed to have quieted down. However, it's still not safe to let your guard down though.
When this crap first was brought up, I wrote to an open mail to the EUROPE DIRECT Contact Centre, stating my personal opposition and why the whole law would be silly as hell, not helping fight terrorism one bit.
Just today I actually got a reply from them, which I'll be posting next:
"Dear Mr ANON,
Thank you for contacting us.
As your enquiry was rather complex, we had to consult specialised services in order to prepare the answer. We apologise for the delay and any inconvenience this may have caused you.
The terrorist attacks carried out on European soil in the course of 2014 and 2015, culminating in the attacks in Paris on 13 November 2015, illustrate the need and the urgency to strengthen existing tools and to scale up the EU-level response to better fight against terrorism and trafficking in and use of firearms and explosives.
We are not planning to put legal gun owners in the orbit of terrorism. The fight against illicit trafficking of firearms and explosives goes hand in hand with the fight against organised crime and terrorism along with a better control of the legal trade. And we have to avoid that criminals and terrorists circumvent the rules and exploit loopholes.
Semi-automatic weapons represent a high share of today's hunting and sport-shooting weapons. However, the evaluation study used for the preparation of the revised legislation concludes that some semi-automatic arms can be easily converted into automatic arms, and the existing Directive does not provide any technical criteria to prevent such conversion. However, even in the absence of conversion into category A', certain semi-automatic firearms can be very dangerous when their capacity regarding the number of rounds is high.
The evaluation of the Firearms Directive implementation and other preparatory studies demonstrated the increasing use of internet as a sales channel for firearms and the difficulties to control it. Considerations about a serious risk of fraud in case of acquisition by means of distance communication may increase with a wider use of such sales method in the future. Given the recent terrorist attacks where in some cases firearms were illegally assembled with components legally bought via Internet, it would be an important risk not to regulate this sales channel. Moreover, it will be more difficult to verify on line the legality of authorisations for arms possession. The risk is still higher in the case of acquisition from third countries.
The Commission in order to complement its recent legislative proposal has just adopted an Action Plan to better fight trafficking in firearms. It foresees a number of initiatives around four main priorities: restricting access to illegal firearms and explosives, enhancing operational cooperation, improving the collection and sharing of information and international cooperation.
In this context, the Commission has decided not to forbid the sale of all semi-automatic weapons but only the ones that are considered to be the most dangerous. This constitutes only a small amount of all available semi-automatic weapons. This only concerns former automatic weapons which have been converted into semi-automatic weapons, as well as semi-automatic arms which resemble automatic weapons that are used in armed combat.
The Commission does not propose any changes concerning other types of semi-automatic weapons which citizens can purchase with an authorisation. This includes the following types of semi-automatic weapons in particular: semi-automatic short firearms or short repeating firearms, semi-automatic long firearms whose magazine and chamber can hold more than three rounds together, semi-automatic long firearms whose magazine and chamber cannot hold more than three rounds together, as well as repeating long firearms and semi-automatic firearms with smoothbore and with a barrel which does not exceed 60 cm.
We hope you find this information useful. Please contact us again if you have other questions.
With kind regards,
EUROPE DIRECT Contact Centre"
>Where you happy with the reply that you got?
to be honest, not exactly.
Sure, it's nice that the current version of the directive would not get all the semi funs ban'd, but at the same time those vague definitions of "semiautos that LOOK like automatics" and "guns that CAN be converted into fully automatic" are clear hints that the core goal of these people still has not changed: they don't want civvies to own AK or AR lookalikes. This crap would still mark the death of the non-prompted reservist activities, which literally rely on people practicing military activities, with very mil-style weapons of their own.
I'm happy that there's so much overall opposition towards this directive, but I'm worried that people will get careless and let some slightly watered down variant of the proposed directive get green-lighted.
>semi-automatic arms can be easily converted into automatic arms
>certain semi-automatic firearms can be very dangerous when their capacity regarding the number of rounds is high
>the Commission has decided not to forbid the sale of all semi-automatic weapons but only the ones that are considered to be the most dangerous
This alone tells us that these people are either totally clueless retards, or that they think we are totally clueless retards and they can get away with this bullshit drivel.
Automatic arms are not more dangerous than semi-automatic arms, except maybe in very specific circumstances such as crowded theaters. There would be no reason to convert a semi-auto to a full-auto just for committing a terror attack. The only improvement would be the 'convenience' to not have to pull the trigger as often as with a semi-auto, wich comes at the cost of the weapon being more difficult to control and running out of ammo quicker. It's useless.
>muh high capacity
So are they going to ban everything except semi autos with internal magazines that can't hold more than 10 rounds?
Pretty much every semi-automatic firearm is 'high capacity', and even if for some strange reason terrorists would comply with magazine restrictions, it takes like 1-2 seconds to reload.
What makes a firearm more dangerous than others? The caliber. So are they going to ban every semi-automatic except .22s? Or just the semi-automatics that LOOK dangerous? This is absolutely retarded and does not make any sense.
These people are full retards and I bet none of them have ever shot a gun in their lives.
Here is a link to the petition, for everybody who wants to help europoors.
Yup, my thoughts exactly.
Once again it's some wannabe silver-tongued retards spewing out terms they don't even understand, trying to tickle the emotions of ignorant masses.
Yeah, you can turn even a piece of log into fully automatic firearm if you really want so, but that doesn't make it a potential killing machine.
it's also this kind of people who literally call 9mm handguns "sturdy" and "deadly", wanting them banned everywhere, but are usually completely fine with 30-06 bolt-action rifles.
Complete ignorance paired with a superiority complex and a fear of retaliation. It's a deadly mixture for gun rights.
It baffles me that apparently there is not one single politician that is actually pro gun. Like "shall not be infringed" pro gun. I mean, it's the most logical and consistent position on the matter...
French anon here.
I don't have the time to translate. In substance, a french gun owner organization met representatives from the European Commission.
According to them, the commission is not the one pushing for tighter regulations, it's the French government. Despite what they said, they were at the origin of the "semi auto look-alike ban'". Elections are near, I doubt they will do anything that would anger the fudds. Still they are the one desperate to show they're accomplishing something. They are not our allies in this.
>It baffles me that apparently there is not one single politician that is actually pro gun. Like "shall not be infringed" pro gun.
Check out the MEP from Finland!
You should be able to find a video where he totally wreck the proposal.
The MEP from CZ is actally pretty good as well, but not as based as finbro
While I am not letting my guard down yet, I actually think we will win this round.
Maybe they get some more restrictions on deactivated firearms which kinda sucks, but the way things are looking right now I don't think there is any way that they can actually manage to ban the evil black salt rifles
I heard of that guy, will look him up. But I thought the finish were mainly worried about their reserve forces, not the right to bear arms in general.
I hope this brings a bit more attention to the issue in general and maybe wakes up some normies. I fear that, if we win this round, they will just create a slightly different proposal and try to be even more sneaky with passing it... and some states like Germany or France might just do it anyway to be good goys.
Everyone in Europe?
My country is not even in the EU, but if the entire EU bans semi-auto rifles, the rest of the europe MIGHT follow...
If almost every country in Europe bans semi auto rifles, that feeds the anti gun crowd more ammo in USA as well, so actually you should also care
But sure, it is your right to think that this will never affect you directly.
>almost every country in Europe bans semi-auto rifles
>doesn't decrease crime at all, most likely even increases it
Sure gives them more ammo.
But remember that antigunners don't fight with facts or statistics anyway so it doesn't matter
>I thought the finish were mainly worried about their reserve forces, not the right to bear arms in general.
Yeah, that is one of the points he makes, but he seems to actually care about civilians as well.
I especially enjoyed when he told everyone that the only time a legal semi auto rifle was used for a terrorist attack in Europe, it was in Norway (ABB) and ironically enough the rifle he used would be one of the very few that would not be affected by this ban. (Ruger mini 14)
He also pointed out very well that:
>Looks does not equal easy FA convertion
>Looks does not affect effectivity
>More bans would make more people criminals
>Legal guns are very seldom used for crime.
and probably some other things i don't even remember.
You are contradicting yourself anon..
It is indeed true that antigunners base things upon emotion instead of facts and statistics.
So what do you think is more likely to happen?
>Hmm, I see that Gun control don't work in EU, so now I am progun
>WAAAAAH, THE ENTIRE EU BANNED EBIL RIFLES, WHY WON'T YOU DO THE SAME??
>Cue sad picture of a 9yo school student holding a scary M16 warmachinekillergun with 30roundmagazineclip in half a second
That's absolutely nothing when you think about the sheer number of people in Europe, I bet there are more than 300k gun owners across Europe
Your hopes of gun ownership are dwindling friemds
>appealing to common sense
These people aren't idiots, they understand firearms and their functions. A large portion of Europe has a long standing serf mentality of being taken care of by some higher power whether it be a king or parliament. Current Euro governments will do anything they can to preserve this status quo and keep their consolidated power. Don't get your hopes up.
>that feeds the antigun crowd
Not really, its pretty hard to get handguns in a lot of places and that's the primary weapon used in crimes in the us but you'll never hear anything about banning them, the us doesn't care to follow trends set by other counties
>The us doesn't care to follow trends set by other counties
Well, there is no talk about banning handguns in Eu either.
In Norway 4 people got killed by guns last year.
3 people with pistols, and one with a shotgun.
But still people insist that rifles are evil and must be banned.
That is not unique for you guys in the us.
This is apparantly how people think in a lot of countries.
It's black rifles all the way.
I knew the French were behind this!
>If this shit somehow passes than I'm bailing for the US.
Just come here in Finland. The government, reservists, hunters, even larpers and airshitters alike are all opposing this crap.
...and before anyone asks, these are some reservists acting as the opposing force troops in some training exercise.
it is, but lucky for you, it's similarly phonetic like most other European languages, AND Swedish is our 2nd official language. And these days, you can count the English being the 3rd one as well, everyone speaks it at least decently.
>Swede here, I thought finbros didn't like talking swedish.
we kinda don't. Our coasts are filled with Swedish speakers though, and just about every bigger city tends to almost demand you to know some of it in important jobs.
All in all, if you know English, you'll do fine. If you know Swedish (or any its sister tongues), you'll do even better.
You tend to learn some basic words and sentences of Finnish quite quickly though. Makes things easier for everyone too.
>and we have to avoid that criminals and terrorists circumvent the rules and exploit loopholes
So wait, are they seriously saying that criminals and terrorists check the laws to make sure they can own the weapon before shooting someone? Are they seriously this pants on head retarded? They' re criminals. They don't follow laws. If they did, they wouldn't be criminals.
The French are fucking assholes. They've put the guns used during the Charlie Hebdo under what they call Secret-Defense, thus blocking all investigations regarding the origin of the guns.
Rumors pretend that the rifles were bought in Slovakia as deactivated guns by a Belgian arms trafficker, who worked with/for the French secret service, and is a friend of the Le Pen family. The guns should have been sent to Syria but got sold to the Kouachi brothers.
>>Americans were all "Europeans can own guns??"
Tell me about it. In my country, which has some of the strictest gun laws in Europe, some schmucks in the parliament are now trying to make playing airsoft/paintball or shooting a bow anywhere else but a special range illegal (as opposed to going to a forest, private land, or abandoned building). I've been seething with anger the whole day. I'm one step away from saying 'fuck it all, let's go full Australia and ban plastic forks'. Fucking cocksuckers...
>What about the Finish language? Is it hard to learn?
>Is it hard to learn?
I've been educating faggots on facebook all day. It's not much, but if I can just educate one person it's a win for me...
But it's infuriating. A site called 'Freitum' (basically Freedom, a libertarian site) posted a meme saying banning guns because you can call the police is like banning fire extinguishers because you can call the fire fighters.
And all the comments were people mocking it and spouting the same old anti gun shit.
I'm like nigga what, why are you liking a libertarian page when you don't support gun rights?
I have half a mind to go into politics to advance this issue but idk where or how or what to do. Maybe I should ask /pol/
All this bullshit wasn't actually started by the EU, but by Bernard Cazeneuve, French ministry of the interior. There are weekly shootings in Marseille, and Cazeneuve at some point toward the end of 2015, after a string of shootings involving sandniggers shooting each other with illegal weapons over the drug trade, as usual, said he would propose a plan to curb gun ownership (and he clearly meant legal gun ownership) in 6 weeks. Then about 6 weeks later, the Paris shootings happened, giving him yet another excuse to put his plan into action. He went to the EU comission and started blackmailing it "if you don't want to ban guns in all of the EU, then you're supporting terrorists".
Of course, the comission being full of retarded faggots who don't know shit about guns, French green party members have been able to spout their usual anti-freedom rant.
Nothing has changed, the law is still going to take effect in july 2016 with the following points :
-every automatic firearm converted to semi-auto will be banned
-every semi-automatic firearm that look like an automatic weapon of war (intentionally very wide definition) will be banned
-anything that looks like an automatic weapon will be banned, even if it's deactivated, even if it's a non-firing Denix replica (airsoft will probably fall into this as well)
-blank firing guns and deactivated guns will be moved into category C (hunting guns, need license, safe, registration)
That's what is written clearly on the EU website, but I also have an idea of some other points they might suggest :
-ban of the most common military calibers (.223, 7,62x39, etc)
-ban of pump action shotguns
Note that there is a worldwide tendency toward stricter gun control. The first wave started in the 80's/90's and now we are experimenting the second wave. The end goal is to prevent civilians from owning anything that is able to shoot a projectile, no matter how useless it may be as a weapon.
Why? All you need to do is get a lightly colored a stock set as you can (preferably FDE or something) and dip it in some rit dye. It takes an hour at most since you need to get the water to just under a boil and spend most of the time waiting for that to happen.
I especially love the utterly useless response those faggots gave to OP. All this text just to say "lol we don't want to ban guns, we are just going to ban 90% of all semi-auto weapons people own, don't worry you'll still be able to keep overpriced hunting carbines limited to 2+1 rounds, you silly peasant"
I don't think they'll even let us be able to own weapons such as the Mini14 or Benelly MR1, even though they have always been semi-auto to begin with and don't look like automatic weapons, leftist politicians will probably argue that the Mini 14 looks like a M14 and has an automatic variant with the AC556, and the Benelli MR1 vaguely looks like an AR15 or something (lol).
Yeah they'll probably only let us keep useless bullshit such as pic related, one round in the chamber, two rounds in a fixed magazine, and then again only for one or two years before they pass yet again another law banning anything semi-automatic altogether. Then they'll argue that sport shooters don't need anything but .22lr bolt actions, like in competitions and olympic games, then they'll come back and argue that .22lr can be replaced with airguns. Then they'll come back and say that airguns can still kill and must be banned. Bye bye sport shooting!
Later they will attack a much larger, but severely aging and dying out lobby : hunters. They'll say you don't need anything but a double barreled shotgun for hunting, then it's going to be a single barreled shotgun, then they'll ban hunting altogether because it is not ecology minded, it kills poor animals who dindu nuffin and it's dangerous, it prevents the tree huggers to suck dicks in the forest all day bla bla. Then they'll ban ball trap as well because it mimics killing birds, and that's so unprogressive and untolerant.
Watch as everything, and I mean everything is banned EU wide before 2025.
Of course shitskins will still run around with actual weapons of war from Yugoslavia, but hey, that's the price of tolerance.
>as well as semi-automatic arms which resemble automatic weapons that are used in armed combat.
what do aesthetics have to do with how deadly a gun is? Does this mean they'll ban all .22lr guns that are made of black plastic?
Clearly the tactical rails and black paint makes it EVEN DEADLIER just like red and yellow paint means a vehicle it's a dangerous high speed sports car.
mfw anti-funs are seriously using Ork logic
>Doesn't know about /k/'s furry population
This, I can't wait to watch the fireworks
>MFW watching Kiev style riots in Germany two years from now
Nice to see the thread's still up.
I wish lots of righteous winds for the poor Euro-bros facing bullshit laws at the moment!
most fictional things are based on reality :D
>already happening / happened around the world
>"lol ur hi!"
That's exactly the fucking mentality that's spreading and killing the freedoms like a cancer.
Exactly two decades ago they made guns acquired for self-defense reasons illegal in Finland, collecting them back, and promised to compensate it for the owners in some way. Guess what happened?
You give them even the pinky finger, and they'll rip the whole arm off.
Don't even wanna read their crap, knowing it will probably be basic bs as usual.
I'm Belgian and the shit I have to go through to even be able to buy a gun is too much and too expensive. Aside from that you won't even have a shot at getting a license if you don't have a crisp clean record.
Meanwhile there's been two shipments (that we know of because they were caught) of Turks shipping amounts of 5000 and 12000 shotguns into Belgium in the last months.
Pretty obvious what they should be focussing on..
Besides if they pretend people who buy guns legally try to sell them on illegaly that's silly. You'd have to spend so much for the licenses, it takes at least a year before you get one, and then the gun itself, how much would you have to ask for the gun to even make a profit? Plus you need to have them checked every year or so and if you don't have them anymore and can't explain why you're in deep shit. It just doesn't make sense.
There's supposedly a mil owners in Belgium alone, but desu I have never heard of this petition. I bet if you got a paper hung up in every club you'd double those figures in a few weeks.
Yeah, visited your country last year. Couldn't understand jack shit.
It's apparently more of a structural relationship than similar languages. Estonians and Finns have much easier time understanding each other.
Being in a literal liberal shithole called Denmark
>Learning about guns and laws for 2 years
>Come to Denmark for further studies (Production technology)
>People talk shit about guns, gun owners, and everyone in connection with guns
>intercept their nonsense circlejerk with some questions like why does it hurt that in another country you have a basic, from birth given law to acquire guns?
>Hurr-durr school shootouts, murder rates, every terrorist have a gun there,etc..
>Prove them, with facts that these are nonsensual bullshit just scandaled by media.
>"I feel that if there is a gun in the household, it just gives the possibility to get killed"
>Point out to debating is not based on feels, and further say that if you don't know about gun safety, why do you have a firearm...now everybody from that group hates me, coz muh fillings...
Further on, how can I personally work for more guns in Europe?
Uh, since the school system is the most cucked, and they earn the least money in my country, no?
Even though I would like to, probably the parents would sure me because "the safety of their children" and other not so based thoughts...
ask US to "liberate"
>be pro-gun eurofag
>join college and friend classmate on FB
>classmate shares anti-gun The Onion article
>call out the BS
>thinks that I'm crazy for being pro-gun
>pretty much ignores all evidence I show him
I want out of this shithole, if they don't want guns than that's fine but I'm not going to put up with shit like this.
Slovak here, signed the online petition and the local gun owner group petition months ago.
OP's reply shows slippery slope at its very best
>WE'RE GOING TO BAN EVERYTHING
>because we received such backlash and incorporated criticisms into directive 2.0 we will only be banning "a few of the most dangerous guns"
>awww look at the reasonable people being reasonable. Surely only an extremist neonazi with his dick inside a gun at this very moment would object to banning babykilling assaultclipazines
I'm not worried about my country or the czechs, we have a long and proud tradition of not being able to implement our own laws, much less foreign ones. I'm afraid for the good people further west however.
Die Parole lautet: ¡No pasarán
I've had the same 'backlash'. I just stay calm, don't try too hard to convince them and make it clear that this is what I believe, and they are free to ask or debate me but that I frankly don't care what their opinion on it is.
My gf gave me the same shit when I started shooting: "But a gun in the house feels so unsafe" etc.
Told her calmly that the last time someone got in our yard (our bedroom window is at our back yard so she woke up from it) she didn't complain when she got to lay in bed while I went out into the yard naked with an axe and a flashlight. That I'm getting a gun for if it happens again or otherwise she can take the axe and solve it.
EU contains the UK, which means that the US cares, even if the UK's rights have already been pretty mangled. Need to top them from getting worse, and need to shoo those damn apologists back to Belgium where they belong!
What they want a Fudd gun culture similar to Portugal.
Portugal is perhaps the worst country in Europe when it comes to gun ownership. Our entire gun culture is based on fudds with their double barrel shotguns and occasionally a semi auto shotgun BUT it has to have wood furniture or else it's tactical and forbidden.
Bolt action rifles are rare, although some hunters have them, but the vast majority is basically shotguns.
look, this EU bullshit was tooback and forth for me (maybe I am retarded and lack reading comprehension) but let me ask one simple question:
does that rifle pictured fall in the legal or illegal section?
OP here, if I understood anything from the EU tard's answer, those "traditional" looking ones would still be legal. Especially these iron+wood looks packing rifles with tiny mags.
It's the "eeevul black raifuls" (+AKs), and their lookalikes (including airshit) that the frenchies want to ban.
fuck, that's retarded.
the norwegian labour party also wanted to limit the number of bullets in a chamber.
I made a illustration regarding this.
it's funny how every single country seems to end up having their own "shoulder thing that goes up".
>my coutrymen want to fuck up everyone's gun rights
What's funny is that the people at my job see gun owners as responsible people which shouldhave their rights respected, hell they aren't even against a 2nd amendment like law in France.