>>28697857 Faithful reproductions of Medieval crossbows would take a little more skill to use but are probably far more effective in use than modern target/hunting crossbows. Besides, they look proper and not like some kind of tactizombie mall ninja abortion that begs for death. If you get a crossbow, get an authentic-ish one like OP Pic with a nice heavy draw and go have yourself some fun.
>>28698096 Even 300-400 pounds is pretty decent for a crossbow really, but if you're getting a big arbalest with a craneqin then go aright ahead and fuck everyone's shit up la familia nostra. Modern crossbows are made for soft squishy little manlets with no muscle tone and wood allergies, they're just as bad as the muzzleloader muskets with polymer furniture and marinekote.
>>28698162 Ya, I'm slowly making my 3rd crossbow. It will use a 175lb prod. However if I feel the need for mo'powah again I left space so I can stack up to 3 loose bound prods. Will need into Gafa, windlass or cranquin though. >Mwf cant afford Todds stuff..
>>28698222 >Drooling... Todds stuff... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEOeZTV9wiA1250lb windlass crossbow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_ovVTHpgLg350lb crossbow using belt an claw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GozSx3PMO6814 century munition grade crossbow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjYQEyC4m10450lb craunquin hunting bow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kP8bqIgd5roGastrophetes or greek belly bow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se_N8CrooPYBalasrino or assassins bow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIkxyjVu9gc350lb Munitions Grade bow with Gafa https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tk5drua6sK411 century hunting bow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-8DQYLjHJE12 century crossbow
>>28697857 >Are crossbows useful in any way, form, or shape in this age?
One of the easiest ways to get an idiot-proof silent projectile weapon without a single background check or otherwise.
Modern broadhead hitting anyone not wearing a rifle plate in the lungs is pretty much certain death unless they get immediate triage (and not even then sometimes depending on what else is hit), and a crossbow is piss easy to learn how to shoot compared to a compound bow.
Of course it's role is taking a single, quiet shot - so besides hunting, it is a tool of premeditated murder and not wanton killing. Get someone to stand on the X and shoot from a predetermined position where you know you will not be seen. Besides a "click" and the sound of the bolt flying, not much else to give away your position.
However it is already known that the farther away you are, the more likely you are to miss, and a bolt is lighter than an arrow, and thus more prone to be thrown off course (even though the poundage getting thrown on a Crossbow is almost always greater than a compound bow). This gets back to more obvious tenets of trying to commit a crime: If someone is going to do something like this and commit themselves to the consequences of the act, then they want to be certain they get the job done.
Easiest way to do that is to get up close and personal. Why else is .22 cal such a popular caliber for clandestine murder? Because it's so easily suppressed, and at point blank range can typically penetrate a skull.
More to the point, the role of the crossbow besides doing shit like that is that it's an easy way to take part in bow season without learning how to shoot a bow.
I'd say there have been improvements. Medieval crossbows tended to have very short power strokes (the distance between the string at full draw and braced, or undrawn, position of the string). More power stroke means more projectile acceleration. This was also why medieval crossbows were built with massive draw weights (i.e. to get the same power as a conventional bow while having a shorter power stroke, they increased draw weight). I've heard a 300# crossbow is roughly equivalent to a 70# bow.
Modern crossbows have significantly longer power strokes. Reverse-draw crossbows are the most extreme examples (e.g. a bow with no brace height, so its entire draw length translates to power stroke). Modern bows and crossbows pick up even more efficiency through limb weight/composition/travel and cam geometry.
I can't give a hard and fast comparison of a 1500# medieval crossbow to a 200# modern one say, but a modern crossbow will outperform a medieval crossbow of the same draw weight.
Jesus if you're that concerned, put some fucking kush balls on the string. Compared to the report of a gun, it's minuscule. No, it's not totally silent. From 50 yards away, I doubt it'd draw much attention.
>Modern crossbows just shoot arrows though don't they
It would need to be pretty long to accept a 28+ inch long arrow. But even with the shorter bolts you can put weighted inserts in them to make the bolt heavier and change the ballistics of it.
>>28697857 Yeah they're great for standing up to the tyrannical government in King's Landing. It's nuts how Joffrey isn't even Robert's trueborn son, where's the fucking birth certificate? Also I'm pretty sure he worships R'hllor, night is dark and full of terror my ass. Anyway The North Will Rise Again! Juck Foffrey!
There are times when I take my crossbow out instead of the rifle. When I have a job clearing feral animas around buildings. The property is smaller than the danger trace of a rifle big enough to kill the pests I'm contracted to reduce. The pests have been spooked by fuds blasting away at any thing that moves.
>>28699915 No tests on exotic materials. Lots of tests on different shafts and broad heads.
If you want to use a crossbow against body armour you are out of luck, no crossbow will go through a plate, a good, small and sharp broad head may go through soft armour. One inch single bevel two blade heads will go through a 00's soft vest. Google crossbow v ballistic vest.
>>28700225 >reusable projectile Reminder that you can't really use sticks for strong bows/crossbows. You either break the crossbow or a the sticks can't take the force and break which can pierce your hand.
>>28700895 by reusable projectile, i mean you might be able to pull the bolt out of a deer carcass and reuse it as long as it didn't shatter.
depends on how available certain woods are, and the tools to work with them. you might be able to build new bolts if you are good at crafting with resin, hardwood, and thread.
all in all probably not worth it, why I say a slingshot is probably a better option in almost any situation. you are not going to be taking down a deer with a sling shot but you can survive on squirrels
>>28701086 Mechanically they're dead simple, but just like any good bow, you'll need the correct proportions, materials, and construction techniques to make something that doesn't snap, shatter, or fall to pieces the moment you try to use it.
>>28701086 Not really hard. I would recommend a skain-lock for anyone's first time. A lever pushes a pin through a hole trolled in the stock. The string sits in a notch cut into the stock. Dead simple...
>>28703131 What about fiberglass tent pole sections? I've accumulated a fair number, and I was pondering on their suitability for bolt material. Is there any kind of formula or rule of thumb regarding bolt length/weight vs. draw weight?
>>28699202 >bolt Modern corssbows don't use bolts, they use shorter arrows. A bolt is a very short and heavy projectile that is supposed to hit hard at close range (so it can penetrate armor), but loses it's energy very quickly at longer distances, kinda like slugs.
They are less accurate themselves, but they are shouldered and the positions you can shoot them in makes them more accurate overall.
Bows can only be shoot standing or kneeling if they are short enough (well you could shoot them prone, but it's going to make them less accurate, not more) while crossbows can be shot in virtually any position (even blindly from behind a cover) and with a support to stabilize them even more.
>>28705128 Why would a heavier projectile lose energy quicker than a lighter one? Because as I said, bolts are also much shorter and often lack any fletching, and that does influence their stability during the flight.
>>28705193 Fletching has nothing to do with weight. Shortness has nothing to do with weight.
Give me an actual reason why a denser (heavier) object loses energy quicker than a lighter one. You can't because denser objects are relatively less affected by air friction than lighter less dense objects of the exact same dimensions.
>>28705251 >Give me an actual reason why a denser (heavier) object loses energy quicker than a lighter one. There is none and I never said there is. I said that bolts are both shorter and heavier, I didn't say the weight is the sole reason why it loses its energy quicker.
>>28705754 >A bolt is a very short and heavy projectile that is supposed to hit hard at close range (so it can penetrate armor), but loses it's energy very quickly at longer distances, kinda like slugs.
I really never said it's because of weight. If you understood it like that, I'm sorry, it's not what I meant.
Arrows actually lose energy faster than bolts, due to friction (arrows are larger) and also largely due to flex. Arrows need to flex because archers paradox, which absorbs a surprising amount of energy. Bolts should not flex.
Bolts lose less energy slower over small distance, but have more rapid energy loss as range increases. The result is that bolts shoot more flat then drop quickly past a threshold, while arrows shoot a long arc from start to finish.
This is why crossbows were never used as long range bombardment weapons, while longbows were. By the end of the arc, the bolt had lost all it's energy, while the arrow was *gaining* energy due to it's superior weight and gravity (arrows shot during bombardment were fired at a 45 degree arc and came in from above)
None of this matters in modern applications, because nobody shoots 8 ounce pile point arrows from 120lb longbows today. The only thing that matters in a modern sense is poundage and how skilled the shooter is with their weapon of choice.
>>28704029 He's not a YouTube, Todd is a manufacturer. He's just demonstrating some of his products. http://www.todsstuff.co.uk/index.htm
Have these though; Medieval Style 100 Pound PVC Crossbow with Skane or Pin Lock for under $10; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qU_tc1CWIrU Introduction https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQQjY-EOvdM&index=2&list=PLmZjohx-3PZkLsnEJ8kQpyI1rNL-Kr2SK Part 1 of construction.
And a discovery channel style episode on crossbows, note it does have several errors but it gets the job done in a entertaining fashion. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WDXdKCe-yw&index=6&list=LLu1yuWzxWaj-nHNJCJQm0zg
>>28707799 Question: if i wanted to make a crossbow whose job is to pack as much punch as humanly (material-y?) possible while still being man-portable (in the same way a M2 is man portable, you can only fire it from a fixed position but you can still physically haul it around by yourself) what design choices should i implement? Ratcheted pulleys for cocking? Multiple limbs?
>>28707871 Multi-axle lock, with delrin nut (Steel reinforced) and delrin socket reinforcement. Near-frictionless hardened sears on trigger and nut. Hardwood laminate or solid delrin tiller. Steel pin by prod cutout to prevent splitting. Bow-irons instead of bridle, for strength. Maybe lead or steel insert in butt to reduce backlash. Delrin sheet on top with groove for bolt and for string to glide on. As long a power stroke as you can handle... 16-20 inches (This will make MASSIVE difference..
Prod is more complicated. You could loose-bind multiple prods together steel or fibeglass and shrink wrap them with rawhide, plastic or fiberglass. Or you could have one custom made. I wouldn't go higher than 3000lbs which is what the payne-gallowey bow was estimated to be originally. You could go higher but... I wouldn't because reasons.
For spanning cranquin or windlass. Could also use a modern come-along winch with a steel cap welded on for crossbow butt. that would be cool
Lots of kush balls.
This is only for a medieval style one though... you could always go reverse draw or compound. see;https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEOeZTV9wiA1250lb but x3 in power with a much longer power stroke.
>I said delrin but you could also use abs or nylon. Any high-stength, self lubricating industrial plastic. Or horn for authenticity. if your rich.
>This is my dream bow that will never happen... hold me, might need to make 3d model to numb the pain.
>>28708965 The 3000lbs limit is due to the payne-gallowey bow. Let me explain.
>Sir Ralph Payne-Galloway liked crossbows. He wrote a book, called book of the crossbow in 1903. Now back then old stuff was a little easier to get a hold of. He go an ORIGINAL medieval crossbow (400 years old in 1903) and fixed it up, it weighing in at 1200 lbs. However it had remained FULLY SPANNED FOR SEVERAL HUNDRED YEARS. as you can imagine, it lost some of its springiness, as it has been estimated to originally been about 3000lbs.
So back to the limit, 1200lbs is the proven siege bow limit with 3000 being the estimated limit for a shoulder fired medieval bow.
So you could go higher... but there is no telling what could happen, and why or If they stopped at that. Remember this was ONE surviving tested example.
>Pic related, a picture from the book. If you want any more info from it I have the .pdf.
>>28709378 More stuff... those siege bows, indeed most medieval crossbows usually had a draw-length of 10-12 inches and a power-stroke of 9-5 inches. The power-stroke is how far the bolt is actually pushed. This is the main reason crossbows are much less efficient than a regular bow (about 30' for a medieval warbow). So a much longer power stroke would GREATLY increase power, almost more than increasing the draw-weight.
>>28715042 Dude, geezer lost his eye with one of those. Lead and clay balls are the traditional ammunition. Used for small game, now we use pellet rifles instead. wear eye protection. Don't shoot at something hard.
medieval crossbows were for siege combat, made to fire through small windows and able to have immense power to penetrate plate metal
modern crossbows are generally for hunting, and so are not very powerful; but certainly more efficient very few have winching mechanisms for instance, and most have a "long draw+fire short arrow" type arrangement
now it would be entirely possible to use modern technology to make a medieval-style crossbow, and if done it would be terrifying
imagine two regular arms, two lateral arms; compound bow draw, super thick polymer string, tungsten head bolts, double gear winch, steel frame, 1000 pounds
>>28697857 Crossbows have surprising levels of penetration in addition to being remarkably quiet. Not silent, but quiet. The length of the shaft means there's more weight behind the tip so penetration is very high for what amounts to a slingshot on crack.
>>28699202 >silent Theyre louder than a suppressed .22 >short range A total noob should have zero issues putting 10 consecutive bolts in a pie plate at 50 yards with a modern scoped crossbow. A bolt carries lethal energy to several hundred yards and is accurate enough to reliably hit a human torso at 100 yards. >bolts lighter than arrows Exact opposite. A 20" crossbow bolt with a 100gr broadhead is about 550 grains. A 30" carbon arrow with a 100gr broadhead is about 350 grains.
A modern crossbow can fling a 500gr bolt to about 430fps. The best compound bow might maybe break 330fps with an ultralight target arrow with an 85gr field point.
can anyone help me identify this crossbow? bought it at a fleamarket for 20 bucks. the only markings on it are a sticker saying its 150 lbs. i want to get a new string for it cause the one on it now is frayed as shit on one side. it didnt come with any arrows either so i have no idea what size to buy. if anyone can tell me what it is or what its a knockoff of it would be helpful.
Theyre typically about 125gr heavier, and at the extreme ends of the spectrum nearly 3x the weight while being about 8" shorter. >example 20" bolt. Piledriver shaft, brass insert, steel crescent nock, 175gr Magnus broadhead. Total weight of appx. 715gr >vs 28" arrow. Gold Tip Ultralight shaft. Easton Medalist capture nock. Packaged Gold Tip insert. 85gr field point. Total weight appx. 285gr.
>>28717442 You should take it to your local archery range so they can check it in detail for you. If the string is frayed it probably isn't safe to shoot until you replace it. Any other markings on it?
>>28717669 nah no other markings was hoping its was common pattern crossbow seems pretty old at least a decade probably more. wasnt planning on shooting it anyways cause ive got no bolts. going to an archery place is a good idea but i dont really have any in my area except for chain stores like basspro. dont think the guy working retail would know anything
anyone know if modern crossbow stings universal or if theres some measurements i should be taking to buy the proper sting?
Can't remember from where but I remember reading about examples of medieval crossbows before, and one design was described as having a metal barrel arm was used to launch stone/lead projectiles. Anyone know anything about this?
>>28717425 >Theyre louder than a suppressed .22 You can add silencers to the bow string if you want it quieter.
>A total noob should have zero issues putting 10 consecutive bolts in a pie plate at 50 yards with a modern scoped crossbow
This is actually a historical fact. Not entirely sure if it holds up today but historically, anybody could use a crossbow proficiently.
>Exact opposite. A 20" crossbow bolt with a 100gr broadhead is about 550 grains. A 30" carbon arrow with a 100gr broadhead is about 350 grains.
There was this myth that the gun was adopted by most armies because bullets and powder were lighter than crossbow bolts. Crossbow bolts had to be made heftier than arrows to keep up with the strength of the crossbow.
not really, they had an average height of 5'7" or so instead of a modern average height of 5'10"
People only got really short as a result of the industrial revolution and urbanization leading to people getting most of their calories from potatoes and sugar.
Granted, that's if a famine didn't hit during childhood, and plenty of people never even made it past 5 years old, but adult height wasn't that much shorter all things considered. examination of Towden skeletons shows a level of physical fitness that was on par with professional athletes, not that that helps much when you're being summarily executed by angry Yorkists.
>>28718971 >If we are talking about flesh target aim for their feet,they will be litteraly pinned down to the floor screaming in agony for having a fucking bolt passing throught their feet. Or, if you live in the real world, you're either prepared to use deadly force to defend yourself and aim centre mass or you DON'T FUCKING LOOSE YOUR ARROWS.
Crossbow bolts aren't nearly as deadly as bullets but they tend to be more debilitating. Having an arrow through a muscle basically pins it in place. As long as they don't pull it out the bolt will plug the wound, limiting bleeding. Be careful with hollow shafts, though. Those can siphon the blood right out of someone.
Since a crossbow is incredibly low tech, you could make one at home with some tools, some PVC piping, and bits of scrap metal. No licenses required. Police have recognized this kind of thing is nearly impossible to regulate so it usually falls under "Other Weapon" categories with little to no rules regarding it's possession and use.
Keep in mind that making a crossbow requires practice and skills so like >>28716138 said, start small.
Rate of fire is pretty bad for a crossbow but you can fix this with repeating crossbows. Keep in mind that repeating crossbows tend to be weaker than normal ones. The Chu-Ko-Nu is a basic design you can make at home if you want.
>>28719745 >Rate of fire is pretty bad for a crossbow but you can fix this with repeating crossbows It's actually ok with a goats foot lever. Not bow-tier obviously but you should be able to shoot every 5-7 seconds even with a 350 lbs one, which is roughly equal to a 70+ lbs bow.
>Keep in mind that repeating crossbows tend to be weaker than normal ones They are awfully weak, may fail to do any significant damage even against someone is plain clothes.
You can't cheat physics, it's going to be just as weak as it is fast. It was common to use them with poison as then even one weak shot might be lethal.
It does have a psychological advantage though, no matter how weak they are it's pretty scary to be shot at every 1-2 seconds.
>>28719876 >It's actually ok with a goats foot lever. Not bow-tier obviously but you should be able to shoot every 5-7 seconds even with a 350 lbs one, which is roughly equal to a 70+ lbs bow.
But not enough to stall a rush. Maybe enough for an inna woods scenario or if your foes are cowards but you'd need something to keep them from bum rushing you.
>It does have a psychological advantage though, no matter how weak they are it's pretty scary to be shot at every 1-2 seconds.
What if you take the first shot with the full power crossbow and then follow up with the repeating crossbow? Under the right circumstances a group of opponents might not realize the follow up shots are weak.
>>28720252 >But not enough to stall a rush Well you shouldn't be doing that with a crossbw, especially if you are against multiple opponents.
>Under the right circumstances a group of opponents might not realize the follow up shots are weak. Could work, but not for long.
The best option would be to just have a huge stockpile of pre-loaded ones, at least for home defense scenario. There are records of knights/noblemen with henchmen carrying a cart full of pre-loaded crossbows.
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