Hey /k/ filthy nogunz here to ask a few questions. Im always seeing and hearing shit on the news and internet about guns and i want to hear from people who know what they are talking about.
First thing; 'assault weapons', what exactly is an assault weapon? How do assault weapons differ from other weapons? Can u make a weapon into an assault weapon?
Second thing; the media acts like some guns are more lethal than others. Dont all guns posses the ability to kill something? Why ban some guns and not others? Why not ban all guns? Why ban guns at all?
Third thing; does different brand ammo really matter? Shouldn't the same gun performer the same with the same caliber ammo if its a different brand?
Fourth thing; is possible to 3d print a gun and ammo? Why or why not?
Sorry for all the questions, i just hate hearing claims with no explanation or anything. Thx guys.
>First thing; 'assault weapons', what exactly is an assault weapon? How do assault weapons differ from other weapons? Can u make a weapon into an assault weapon?
Mostly a buzzword. Derives from a real thing: the assault rifle. Less directly, a breaching shotgun. An assault rifle is a fairly small carbine like weapon that fires a cartridge somewhere between a traditional pistol round and rifle round. You probably already know this. Crutialy assault rifles must be light and fire in single,burst and/or full auto. A breaching shotgun is usually just a normal pump or semiauto with no stock and a short barrel.
>Second thing; the media acts like some guns are more lethal than others. Dont all guns posses the ability to kill something?
Some guns are more lethal than others... sort of. Any class of weapon that can put out sustained controlled fire is usually considered "more dangerous". But this can also (incorrectly) be applied to rifles like the AR-15 which looks like the m4 but isn't an assault rifle because its semiauto only. Or some people are just dumb because they think a thumbhole stock constitutes an assault weapon. This is blatantly untrue.
Since people are already answering your post better than I can, I'll just tackle a part.
Yes you can 3d print guns, but currently there is littl point to it. When you fire a gun there is a lot of pressure released and plastics don't last very long and the gun breaks after a hand full of shots. What is kind of taking off is 3d printing parts of guns, generally ones that don't experience explosive pressure. And in the end it is just something blown way out of proportion by the media since making firearms isn't really all that hard, and I wouldn't be surprised if even you could do it after a little research online, here, enjoy an example!
>First thing; 'assault weapons'
Assault weapons often refer to semi automatic rifles like your regular ak and ar rifles. It's a term they came up with to make them sound scarier.
>the media acts like some guns are more lethal than others
True. Pistols and full size rifles/shotguns are on a different level from eachother.
But it still often boils down to where you got shot.
>Third thing; does different brand ammo really matter?
Hunting ammunition like soft point and hollow point is designed to expand rapidly and kill. It makes for a lot of energy transfer instead of just passing through you, the wound channel will be much larger. FMJ ammo is less deadly, it does more of a clean pass through.
>Fourth thing; is possible to 3d print a gun and ammo?
Technically yes, because you can 3d print the receiver which is considered the "gun" on a gun.
Ammunition however cannot be printed.
>Third thing; does different brand ammo really matter? Shouldn't the same gun performer the same with the same caliber ammo if its a different brand?
Oh god yes. This is like an Olympic athlete asking if he should stop eating McDonald's three meals a day. Ammo is a consumable like any others and if you put quality in you get quality out. Nutnfancy (yeah I know, the sperglord) does his reviews with multiple types of ammo and you can instantly see the difference in the accuracy of the weapon. Furthermore, poor quality ammo will not only perform worse but also run dirty, clogging up your gun with residue. This happened to the original m16. Or the bullet could explode in the barrel. Seriously.
>Fourth thing; is possible to 3d print a gun and ammo? Why or why not?
...yes? Obviously not the gunpowder but technically you could. Doesn't mean it would work well. The barrel probably wouldn't even last a single shot. Some people tried to make a 3d printed lower receiver and it blew out after 100 shots. They also made an upper, which melted. There is a purpose built, cheap, disposable 3d printed gun called the liberator, which at the time is a better application of the technology until it improves. In time well probably see 3d printed stocks and magazines.
>Sorry for all the questions, i just hate hearing claims with no explanation or anything. Thx guys
> assault weapon
This term is a meme
The latest legislation attempt tries to define it as any weapon with 'scary tactical' meme attachments, but there is no such thing as an assault weapon.
An assault rifle is a rifle which fires an intermediate cartridge and has the capability of firing in semi, burst and/or full auto.
Therefore, civilians rifles like the ar15, even if externally similar to an assault rifle, are NOT 'assault weapons'
Assault weapon is a political/legislative term. Look up assaultweapon.info for a really great explanation but basically it has to do with weapon cosmetics and ergonomics and not much else.
Certainly most guns are potentially lethal, but force = mass x acceleration. I'm generalizing here but most rounds work in one of two ways: light and fast or heavy and slow. Certain rounds will carry more energy and therefore be arguably more deadly, but it mostly comes down to where you get shot and what organs it fucks up and also how much energy is imparted to you and those organs.
Ammo matters. For instance, the .223 can run from a fast light 50 grain bullet which is great for shooting small varmints, but won't retain energy at range. For that you'd want a heavy 77 grain bullet. This is due to the F = M x A equation above.
You can 3D print guns but it's expensive and you can shop it with metal a lot easier and cheaper.
These are really simplified answers but they should get you started.
More info on the hollowpoint: Because it expands, the bullet going too far and hitting something it shouldn't is much less likely. This can be ensuring you don't shoot someone in the next room when fending off and intruder, or in the case of the PA constable, not shooting innocents behind the person trying to shoot you.
>Assault weapon is a political/legislative term.
To add to this with regards to you original question >Can u make a weapon into an assault weapon?
Yes, because assault weapons are defined by cosmetic features, it is trivial to turn a legal semiautomatic firearm into a potentially illegal (depending on state) 'assault weapon' by adding minor accessories such as foregrips, flash hiders, or a collapsible stock.
If your line of questions was pointed more at actual select-fire assault rifles (legally referred to as 'machine guns'), then yes, it is generally possible to convert a legal semi automatic firearm to an illegal new manufacture machine gun, with a major caveat: the difficulty of the conversion process depends heavily on what model of firearm you're dealing with, but generally, if a person has the will, knowledge, and tools required to convert a semi automatic firearm to a fully automatic one, they also have the means to straight up manufacture fully automatic firearms from scratch. Firearms are not complicated devices, see >>28604471
Wow thank you guys for the input, i really appreciate it.
Im finally learning
assault weapons are all weapons. I can assault anyone with any weapon.
An assault rifle refers to a select fire rifle chambered in a intermediate round like 5.56
most ar15s are semi automatic, and fail to fit inside this definition.
in 30000 shooting deaths, 19000 are suicides, 2500 are accidents in those 8000 something murders, 223 instances involved any sort of rifle.
gun control should keep all the guns out of the hands of some dangerous people, but because that's hard and means cops would actually have to do their jobs, Congressmen go for the easy votes from people who don't know any better and bans some guns for all people
Look man. You keep posting that memetale shit and I might just have to click that report option. Just a few clicks and key strokes and boom you're banned like a AGM-114 Hellfire atomizing some jihadi. Your /k/ days are over and you'll have to try some forum to socialize or one of the shitty chan spin offs. Don't temp me.
totally forgot about your other questions
there's more to bullets than just caliber. inside your caliber there's the amount and type of gunpowder, and the weight and type of bullet.
there's quite a performance difference between 55 grain fmj 5.56 and 77 grain otm 5.56
a big reason why the 5.56 and 9mm are under powered meme exists is because these older, lighter fmj rounds have poor performance, while the modern stuff kicks ass, and people can't make the distinction between them.
people can print guns, but it's not working very well yet. The big problem is 3d printers copy current deigns instead of working around the limitations of their plastic. An ar15 lower is at those dimensions it has because it's aluminum. Plastic with those dimensions isn't strong enough for 5.56
plastic ammo isn't really there, and you can't 3d print gunpowder.
meme term that is missused more than anything else.
>some guns are more lethal then others
if a gun is lethal it is lethal, you cant kill a man more than dead
they matter a lot, think about cars and tires
yes, but its pointless because they'll break after 1 shot
"Assault weapons" don't exist.
Battle rifles do.
Gun control is ALWAYS a platform politicians foist on naive people that don't know shit about guns.
Almost all guns can easily be made full auto. On a 1911 if you remove the disconnect you get a full auto pistol. It's that easy for lots of weapons. The worst you'll go through is dremeling a piece of scrap metal to fabricate a part or two.
Semi auto rifles are, in my opinion, MUCH more deadly than full auto rifles because semi autos force you to aim and take much longer to run out of ammunition.
You can literally make explosives from your own piss and trash.
HERE'S SOMETHING YOU NEVER HEAR ABOUT- instead of making guns illegal, why don't we just make murder illegal? Isn't that a much better solution? It would be... if criminals followed the law in the first place.
Gun control is a contradiction. It's a hype excuse to get money from taxpayers.
The only thing gun control does well is endanger lives. Gun free zones are kill zones for mass shooters. Gun laws only affect law abiding citizens. Therefore, gun control endangers everyone's lives.
You used to be able to buy full auto guns from magazines. We never had mass shootings until after gun control programs were created.
The state is literally creating terrorism.
It's all a scam to steal money, steal votes, and steal lives.
This was the most educated thread on /k/ I've ever seen. I'm surprised good job guys
I am so fucking impressed with this thread. Never before have so many people on /k/ been so helpful.
>Dont all guns posses the ability to kill
Contrary to what you see on Hollywood, guns aren't death wands. You don't just point them at someone, pull the trigger, and watch them crumple dead.
They launch metal projectile which must rip through flesh and bone and damage or destroy critical biological systems in order to eventually cause death. Try to actually visualize this when you think about the lethality of a gun.
Reality isn't a video game where a gun has some damage value that gets applied to the target. There is a real, physical bullet that travels through the air and impacts the target. It penetrates to some depth, ripping and shredding as it goes.
There are many places you could shoot a person where there are no vital organs or tissues, and they would likely survive. There are other places (but not many) where you could shoot someone that would leave them dead almost immediately.
Remember, this is a physical reality. The bullet moves faster than you can see, but it's there. Ripping, shredding damage, not magical death wand. Therefore bullet speed and size obviously matter. Don't your other questions start to answer themselves when you stop using Hollywood magical thinking, and start thinking about it physically? Like a fucking grown man with agency and competence?
and that's fine I shoot 55 grains m193 almost exclusively because it's cheap and right now, all im shooting is paper
oh god you right we need to fix this
>what went wrong
He came to us admitting he was naive, jackass. Don't be a dick
"assault" is just a word applied to the wrong thing.
Sorry. It's upsetting sometimes how intellectually crippled some people are by television and video games. They start viewing the world as these simple logical systems, instead of as the complex, messy, physical place it is.
They think: get shot = die
It's not even real to them, in a physical sense. It's just a video game calculation. It's not his fault that he's intellectually crippled, but it still bothers me.
The good news is, it's curable with a strong regimen of going outside and actually doing things.
There are some good answers in here but I think they missed a part of the topic.
There are different types of ammo for different things, such as self defense and plinking.
In terms of accuracy which is what I think you were asking about, there is what is known as "match grade" which should deliver a more accurate shot, but will make little difference to a novice.
If you were asking about kill power as I said there are different types, hollow points are typically called self defence ammo because they maximize damage by expanding on impact.
Kinda impressed by /k/ today by the responses in this thread.
Just about the only 2 places you can shoot a human and have pretty much instant incapacitation/death are the brain stem (draw a triangle with 2 points on the edges of your eyebrows and the 3rd at the tip of your nose, a shot in the center from the front will intersect the brain stem at the base of the skull), or a center of mass hit that nicks the aorta. The brain stem shot is actual instant incapacitation, instant loss of motor control, and you just drop like a sack of potatoes, like you were a puppet and the strings were suddenly cut. The aorta shot won't inhibit nerve activity, but it takes literally seconds to bleed out internally from that.
But that definition is wrong. An Assault Rifle is a rifle capable of selective fire, meaning, the operator can choose to fire single, or multiple rounds with a single pull of the trigger.
you're only partially correct. While rifles, pistols, and shotguns are all lethal, they encompass different threat envelopes. They're all just as lethal as one another when employed correctly to maximize the threat presented (i.e. taking a shotgun against a target over 100m away is just plain stupid, and manouvering a longarm down a narrow hallway decreases it's effectiveness).
You're find with the other two.
>But that definition is wrong.
He said assault weapon not assault rifle, read before you post.
>taking a shotgun against a target over 100m away is just plain stupid, and manouvering a longarm down a narrow hallway decreases it's effectiveness
I see you don't know what rifled slugs are, and I see you don't know what kinetic energy transfer rates are.
Essentially this. Shotguns are just as deadly but generally for n00bs. I would take issue with this man's saying that a long heavy weapon can't be used in an enclosed space. If the operator is food enough, he can quickscope anyone attacking him at any range the AWP is really good for this. Hope this helps.
Sources: the same ones as the poster I am quoting.
SON I THINK YOU MEAN AMERICA'S RIFLE
>Never before have so many people on /k/ been so helpful.
Hello there newfag, in the past /k/ had actual gunsmiths showing custom fabrication, lots of reloading discussions, and ELR shooting discussions. However now it is just shitposting about moist nuggets and slavshit, this board is much much worse than in the past and it shows no signs of ever getting better.
Does the brand matter? Yes and No. It depends on the gun. While my knowledge on the subject is limited I think I understand the primary reasons behind this.
Some ammunition will not feed as reliably in some guns. It is probably related to the shape of the bullet or type/strength of powder.
My 22LR Buckmark jams once or twice per magazine using Winchester lead nose bullets, but I shot the copper jacketed bullets made by another company and they work fine. This is probably due to the jacketing, not the brand though.
I've read that steel casings used by some ammo companies put more wear on firearms over time.
The problem is that this isn't a legal argument, it's just a philosophical argument.
Basically, saying that a semi auto with scary features is an assault weapon and not known to the fathers but one without scary features is not is like saying the same thing about a musket, because cosmetic features.
No AWB has ever restricted cosmetic features on black powder or manual action weapons so there isn't really a legal argument to be made.
Now, you could ask libtards on the street whether it should be banned and get their retarded reactions and laugh at it, that's totally doable.
I've been on 4chan since 2004, /a/ and /k/ specifically since 2009 (there was a period of time where I was mostly on 7chan, pooshimer, and desuchan before that), and /k/ exclusively since 2013.
I've mostly seen things get better until recently when the mods started being fags and deleting gun control threads.
The /k/ of two years ago was more obsessed with slavshit, didn't see modular rails coming, legitimately hated glocks, the /k/ of four years ago didn't have OPpenheimer and McNig IIRC.
Well there are almost no gunsmithing or reloading threads and maybe one elr thread a fiscal quarter now, so I would say it has steadily been getting worse.
If you knew physics this navy nukes posts would not be so amazing.
I have yet to see this tripfag post anything good.
Except we barely have Op since dox, and mcnig keeps trying to leave (it never works). All but maybe 4-5 of our tripfags dont contribute anything meaningful. Some things are better some are worse, at least we have late night/k/
Funny you mention that, this is the first time I have looked on this board in 6 months. I have spent almost all my time on /out/ recently because it isnt infested with stupidity as badly as this board is. If I actually want information about firearms now I just go to snipershide.
The fact that you are here asking questions instead of just swallowing an regurgitating whatever shit politicians say on the subject is immensely refreshing. Thank YOU.
Something else I'll add to the knowledge being passed around: the ability to fire in full auto does not make a gun deadlier. In fact, when not applied properly in the correct situation, it's more of a detriment than anything else. It's really only meant for when you're in a group of armed guys fighting another group of armed guys, and you lay down automatic fire to keep the enemy pinned while your buddies move into a more adventitious position: suppressive fire. Or in close-quarters room-to-room sort of fighting.
My impression is that /k/ has always had very little actual talent, it doesn't help that a lot of different hobbies and careers can contribute to /k/ so that nobody represents all of them.
Still, I think /k/'s opinions have only been getting better and better and are still the best on the internets.
I need to lurk /out/ more, I'm trying to get my base weight under 20lbs.
>It's not even real to them, in a physical sense. It's just a video game calculation.
Probably one of the biggest "that's fucking awesome" things MGSV did was that even if you used lethal force you could just disable guards instead of killing them as long as it wasn't a definite killshot or you didn't execute them once downed.
The statement on FMJ being less deadly is only partially correct. A standard wall in a house has a chance of stopping hollowpoint ammunition. FMJ will punch right through walls, furniture, people, etc, and you may end up hitting unintended targets on the other side, particularly with rifle ammunition. So it's hard to say which one is more dangerous.
>The statement on FMJ being less deadly is only partially correct.
He said he's noguns, I didn't want to make this overly complicated.
For a noguns, they're probably thinking of being directly shot when it comes to deadliness, not 3 or 4 walls and accidentally shot.
To be fair, the bullet only had an arm's worth of flesh before zipping through to the little girl behind.
I guess this is a sure example of bullet advancement since the days of that famed FBI shootout where an arm was enough to render a bullet not as lethal.
Most people are smart enough to paint their barrels black or grey.
Still, you can never trust anything 100%.