Is it more prestigious to be an elite operator like Delta or more prestigious to be a spook like this guy? Spooks seem to inspire more fear and mystery than even the most elite military soldiers.
SOF members of recent times have degenerated into nothing but attention whores. I wouldn't work in an environment where my coworker could decide to write a book after retiring and put my identity at risk.
They all seem to be on the same level. Pic related, all on the same level.
I know you're joking but none of those guys are spooks, they're military.
>inspire more fear and mystery
If you actually read a book on the miserable history of the CIA clandestine service, you'd know the CIA has a deliberately cultivated mystique and reputation, but absolutely no track record to back that up with.
speaking of delta in sicario, i got the impression they weren't introduced into whole medellin scheme and genuinely believed they were sent to deal with ordinary border drug bust. at the end of the day any special force unit is just a skilled labor with strict need-to-know basis
Only to people outside the game. They've got a bad case of political self-sabotage and have gradually decreased the number of competent field agents in favor of political appointees from stateside.
They're pension whores now. You want competent humint, goto the DIA.
What worries me more than anything is you retards with no affiliation.
All we need is one of you wingnuts to go off the reservation and start putting 4.73 X 25 rounds into some billionaire hedge-fund manager to completely collapse the entire world economy.
God forbid you take out an entire board of directors or fuck with the FANG stock options.
Daily reminder that Iran has all sanctions lifted on Monday, Martin Luther King day and the U.S. market will be shut down, but Iran will be dumping all of the oil they have been stockpiling over the last few decades.
Get your stockpile and supplies ready. The happening is fucking happening.
>being deliberately ignorant
>willfully lapping up that Hollywood propaganda
Read a fucking book once in a while
Sicario is such a fantastic movie, for any who haven't seen it at least watch this scene so you can understand the upcoming moustache guy operator meme:
That depends entirely on what you mean by political appointees. There are only a handful of personality types that can successfully carry out the bulk of HUMINT recruitment, and they tend to gravitate away from the CIA as it is right now because they're shunted aside for fresh college grads who went from mom and dad's house right to college then to the CIA. They're preferred because they follow orders and can be molded to agree with the CIA's thinking, whereas personalities that tend to be good at HUMINT tend to be more freethinking. People forget that Miles Copeland was a jazz musician of all things.
Also, you do know that the DIA is pretty much run by "former" CIA right? The Deputy Director of intelligence agencies run the show.
The DIA Directorship rotates every four years between generals of different branches. The Deputy Director, an "ex-CIA" civilian stays the same. The military personnel similarly rotate in and out while civilians with intelligence backgrounds remain in.
>SEALs turned into hollywood attention whores
>therefore everyone else is writing books and making movies allowing the public to have a general working knowledge of said force' composition
we still don't hear shit from any of the respectable forces, no books being pumped out by active duty SF dudes detailing classified operations, and we sure as fuck don't get shit on delta.
Sometime give this book a read. He strongly implies that the CIA had one of his informants murdered to protect their interest in the drug trade while having the DEA take out their rivals.
Thanks, I will.
I am gathering as much CIA-drug trafficking related material as I can.
Actually it's SVR. FSB is kinda like FBI, SVR is like CIA, GRU is military intelligence.
However, all three operate outside of Russia. It's a bit like they are competing, division of authority is blurry.
In an intelligence agency the director is a political appointee and the deputy director is promoted from within the ranks. The deputy director of everything from the CIA to the DIA is the one running the show. Just because you can't make heads or tails of a sentence (I did forget an "s") doesn't make it factually incorrect.
you wont be thrown in a cage. youll just get deserter status and wont ever be able to get a job that pays over 10 an hr for the rest of your life.This isnt the 1800's they aren't going to jail you for desertion.
>one of the worst MoH games ever
>8 options to do the same thing with the same shitty animation
>tries so hard to be hard
You probably like BF Hardline too
>read a book on the history
>of an organization whose activities are largely classified
Hardly anyone knows with certainty whether the CIA is competent or not. Even many people who work for the CIA are likely unaware of most of its activities. Taking a look at their declassified activities and pointing to them as failures based on that is as foolish as blindly declaring them to be invincible superman.
That said, given the degree to which world events of the past ~50 years have worked out in America's favor, I think they're probably doing an alright job.
>of an organization whose activities are largely classified
>doesn't realize a very large chunk of CIA activities in the cold war have been declassified
>doesn't know shelves of books have been written on the CIA's failures and fuckups
>given the degree to which world events of the past ~50 years have worked out in America's favor, I think they're probably doing an alright job.
Don't confuse cause and effect. The right thing to say is, shit turned out alright *in spite* of the CIA.
Both of us are just speculating desu. My point is that it's absurd to judge the whole organization based on the declassified stuff. This is especially true considering that declassifying "successful" operations is likely to hurt whatever benefits were gained from them.
>the information is declassified, analyzed and written about
>it's absurd to judge an organization based on information which was declassified wholesale since the soviet union is long dead and gone. it's much better to judge it based on an aura of power and mystique, which was revealed to be deliberately manufactured in said declassified information.
You might be interested to know that the CIA gladly declassified the few successful covert operations they had in the cold war, like when they liquidated Che Guevara in Bolivia. It was all the awful shit they fucked up or missed that they wanted to hide, unsuccessfully in the end.
The correct answer to the question "is the CIA incompetent" is "we don't know for sure, as most of the relevant information is classified. The information that we do have suggests that they are competent to some degree, but also very capable of fucking up".
I'm not trying to play up the CIA as being magic superspies, I'm just responding to >>28559935, who suggested that the CIA is wholly incompetent.
Kek, whatever sweety. Don't get butt mad because you can't admit that you weren't clear.
Acting like you were talking about all Intelligence Agencies. What a turd.
>most of the relevant information is classified
No, it isn't.
>The information that we do have suggests that they are competent to some degree, but also very capable of fucking up
No, they mostly fuck up, and badly. In fact, when the stakes are high, the CIA has fucked up:
- Missed the Chinese intervention in Korea
- Completely blacked out in Cuba when the missile crisis happened
- Had no sources of note in Hanoi during the entirety of the Vietnam war
- Never penetrated the Soviet Union at a meaningfully high level during the entire Cold War. Every agent they had were Soviet volunteers. Most of them were exposed and executed by the KGB.
The list goes on. Again, all this information is declassified and publicly available.
Considering operators can transition into classified gov work, and the SAD/SOG/whatever they're called are either at or above tier 1, I'd say 'prestige' goes in favor of orgs like the CIA.
We hear about operations up to and including Devgru and Delta, but I haven't heard jack shit about Special Activities Division.
>Names no events from the last 20 years.
So... the CIA /was/ incompetent. No one is really denying that. We're talking about the current abilities of the agency.
>Never penetrated the Soviet Union at a meaningfully high level during the entire Cold War. Every agent they had were Soviet volunteers. Most of them were exposed and executed by the KGB.
How many Soviet Spies were actual soviets, as opposed to volunteers? It's my understanding that the vast majority of HUMINT is done via recruitment. The most damaging Soviet spies were recruited.
Fun exercise that my dad saw Delta dudes do:
>Get 4 operators below 20-foot-high window
>Have another jump on top of those 4
>Operator on top leaps while the 4 on bottom throw him
>Grabs top of window
>Fires into room, entering building
>Proceeds to clear floor
He also had a story of a dude they called "Delta Doug," who did shit like a 12-miler backpack in a little under 2 hours. He beat a guy who competed in college for long-distance running and was close to being a world-class competitor.
Basically, you don't want to fuck with Delta.
Didn't read the thread so sorry if this is already pointed out. Spooks and delta are cool and all but SEALs are the most highly trained unit in the army and have the hardest entry requirements.
>the first shooting war of the cold war
>completely blanks out on intelligence
>every single clandestine operation in China and NK failed
It's called fucking up when it matters most, a pattern which repeated itself over and over again.
>So... the CIA /was/ incompetent. No one is really denying that. We're talking about the current abilities of the agency.
It's now confirmed that the CIA fucked up on Iraq WMD intel. It's hard to imagine an agency with that much baggage and entrenched bureaucracy fixing itself in one or two decades, but the CIA is known to have a good PR department.