>>54882025 Way too lenient on Germany because the Americans and Brits wanted to menage them.
Inflicting on Germany what Germany had done to Russia (Brest-Litovsk) would have done much to defang the Germans. Also the UK actually heping France to enforce the treaty as they should have. Or Germany paying their debts instead of weaseling out.
>>54882025 >germans start shit at Europe, ruining the continent forever, putting so much shit in the lands of Flandres that the soil becomes polluted with tetanus >the french population is destroyed, society and power both >the french want to make sure that the germans don't invade again, so they want to rightfully balkanize Germany back to before their stupid union >Americans refuse >Hitler rise to power and burn Europe again
As Ferdinand Foch said again : "This isn't a peace, this is an armistice of twenty years". Every kraut who dare saying that "Boo hoo hoo Versailles treaty was unfair ;_;" need to compare with the 1871 "peace" treaty where France had to give one of their wealthiest region away and pay 5 billions of franc-or for reperation. We didn't have Uncle Sam to back us.
Basically the stupid thing was letting Germany believe that it was a nation.
For centuries there was no Germany. There were shitty duchies and counties who more-or-less were tied together, but spent more time fighting each other than co-existing (Hence why Alsace-Lorraine is french and not germany, contrarily to what retards say).
But then, the biggest of autists, Bismarck, decided to unite the world of Untermenschs to satisfy their superiority complex, even though Germany had no world relevancy.
What we should have done was destroying the heart of german nationalism.
It was what happened in 1945 when historical Prussia was divided between the USA and the USSR :^)
>>54882708 You can argue for both. Actually enforcing the treaty, like preventing Germany from remilitarizing the Rhineland would have been a good start. But really, partitioning the whole country (at least separating the Ruhr) could have done much as well.
But at Versailles, the French were pretty much the only ones who wanted to dismantle Germany while Americans in particular so more interest as keeping it as whole as possible because of commercial considerations. The end result was a bastard treaty that did little to weaken Germany in the long run while France had its industrial heartlands devastated by the war, its usines pillaged and its mines flooded by retreating German troops.
>>54882851 Alsatians explicitly don't want to be part of Germany, though, and they were apparently very tsundere when they were annexed.
>>54882844 You couldn't really stop Germany from unifying. The people wanted it for a while, regardless of their stupid government system, and I don't see any reason why they shouldn't have been able to.
>>54882946 I think partitioning/balkanizing the country would've actually been unjust. As it stands, Versailles would've been mostly alright if it had been enforced strictly.
>>54883096 Yeah, having the USA taking a bigger role in international affairs and clearly enforcing the treaty alongside France would have been the best option since the UK would certainly have followed suit. The American Congress chose otherwise though so we'll never know how that would have turned out.
>>54883276 It would have been difficult to get the American public to support taking an active role in enforcing the treaty. Many of them thought our participation in the war had been unnecessary, and we didn't really have enough of a problem with Germany to justify continued presence in Europe.
>>54883388 The only element of Germany's punishment that I think was unjust was forbidding the Austrians from joining them.
An enlarged Germany would've undoubtedly caused a lot of butthurt, but I think it would've been alright if this Germany was strictly demilitarized, occupied and forced to pay.
>>54882025 FUCK TRIANON FUCK TRIANON FUCK TRIANON FUCK TRIANON
JUSTICE FOR HUNGARY
FUCKING FRENCH FROGS YOUR PUNISHMENT CAME FOR THE GREATEST CRIME COMMITTED IN HISTORY I LAUGHED WHEN THE SANDNIGGERS BLEW THEMSELVES UP IN PARIS AND I SINCERELY HOPE THERE WILL BE A LOT MORE OF THIS. ENJOY THE MASSIVE INFLUX OF CULTURAL ENRICHENERS HAHA FUCKING FAGGOTS HAHA. AND DON'T THINK THE "AWAKENING" WILL COME, YOUR RIGHT WING PARTIES ARE NOTHING AND INCOMPETENT, THE DAUGHTER OF MARIE LE PEN FUCKED A NIGGER. TOP KEK M8
TOO BAD GERMANY IS DEAD ASWELL, THEY WERE THE ONLY ONES WHO SUPPORTED THE REVISION OF TRIANON T.B.H LADS
>>54882025 Way too lenient, should have dissolved the German Empire and abolished Prussia into several states based off of historical states such as Hannover. It also should have not have gotten rid of Brest-Litovsk.
Factually Versailles had two problems, it conceded too much to Germany and wasn't enforced even going as far as to stimulate foreign investment into Germany. Also Britain didn't follow through with the defense agreement, and the French politicians were too weak to fuck Germany's shit up when they refused to pay and when Germany didn't respect the terms regarding militarization. Naziboos try to paint it as something horrible but seriously, it was not a worthy peace to the saddest, utterly tragic, greatest, most destructing war the world has ever seen.
>>54890489 Attributing the greatest responsibility to Germany however is entirely factually accurate, as is attributing sole responsibility to Germany for opening the Western front in an especially cruel and horrific way through the rape of Belgium.
>>54890489 >Attributing sole responsibility to Germany was nonsense.
No it's just how wars work. Do you think the peace treaty was supposed to be some kind of fair punishment based a country's "responsibility"? No, they won so they could just do whatever the fuck they wanted to do. I mean losing a war is not supposed to have fair consequences.
>>54892609 You don't understand. Prior to WWI there was no precedence for writing something like that into a post-war settlement. The normal procedure was -- together with reparations -- to "forgive and forget". Writing article 231 when the German Empire acted no different than any other great power of the time had to have unforeseen consequences.
>>54894103 Well, you show me then the treaties that do something like article 231. Can't find anything like that in the peace of Frankfurt, or in the documents of the Congress of Vienna or the Peace of Westphalia.
>>54893390 There was no "normal procedure". There are no rules in international politics and war. It all depends on the balance of power, and when the balance is in your favor, you can do whatever the fuck you want (eg. partition of Poland). The reason why a lot of wars ended with just reparations or small land gains was because nation were rarely completely defeated. Those wars just ended, because continuing them would not be worth it for the winning side. But in wars like WWI the fighting didn't end until one side was completely unable to continue it (or at least came very close to that point), which means they are defenseless and the winner holds all the cards.
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