Except for few deluded commies everybody is radicalising exponentially. When a paki allegedly molested (probably he just followed for a while) a 14yo a week ago, a crowd tried to smash the refugee centre's door and lynch him. Cops found holes of bullets on the walls lel
>>53675451 Can you resume the video to me pls ? Also, in France people who were anti-islam are still anti-islam and people pro-islam are still pro-islam. The main change is that people who doesn't care or doesn't know what to think about islam and refugees tend to be more anti-islam than before
>>53675699 I saw that http://corrieredelmezzogiorno.corriere.it/salerno/cronaca/16_gennaio_11/extracomunitario-molesta-14enne-gente-assalta-centro-d-accoglienza-0accf8e8-b839-11e5-843f-a9997240be2e.shtml What happened next ? Did they finally get the Paki ?
>>53675451 idk if related but a lot of cops on street and for the first time since the 89 revolution there are anti-tero military,usually one or two that pop up in places,fully armed we hardly have any sandniggers except some "students" and shady bussiness men,and most of the muslims here are tatar,and they are ok people no cause no trouble.
>>53675848 give me a break only stupid and weak nation let things like this happen. you were castrated after WW2, which sas pure karma in working. now average german is effiminate sissy and average deutsche medchen is drunken spoiled whore. deal with it (hoever you can lol)
>>53675883 Worse. Vice actually has some journalists who report news and write stories. The Young Turks is an left-wing authoritarian political vlog. They don't actually do any journalism. Even buzzfeed sometimes does real journalism. TYT does not
>>53676874 No, just stop. I'm conflicted between, trying to integrate the informaotion into Cologne's incidents, and ruling a resemblance out because it probably wasn't as severe:
>Cologne Finger in pussy was prolly the hardest, mostly it was groping like in Jpapnese subways.
>That Subweay incident Might be dead, or broken everything including soul, severely damaged in all dimensions, the guy following her trying to pull her out might be a relative or her bf... what the fuck?
>>53677033 Most European groups have more deaths than births. Look at Sweden. There are only like 8 million ethnic swedes living there, but they've imported over a million nonswedee into their country. Look at France. Walk around certain parts of Paris and try to find a single french person.
jesus christ you fucking Europeans complain about everything.
Muslims are fucking cool people and never cause any sort of trouble. 9/11, any other suicide bomber and rapist etc etc are NOT muslim, they just pretend to be. be happy that they are muslim and be happy that they chose to go to your country, that means they like you. Muslims are hard working too, and contribute to society by showing you guys Islam. also their food is fucking incredible.
meanwhile HERE in USA, we have it much worse. we have Mexicans crawling in here like there is NO tomorrow. they are the majority of beggars on the streets, they don't work and are never hard working, they are always loud with their fucking constant parties and they push their fucking religion all the time.THEY are the majority of crime, not blacks, not muslim. also they have no cultural food to offer to the US.
We Americans would gladly trade our fucking Mexicans for your Muslims.
>>53677313 >europe >look at certain parts of paris
typical american ideology then
look at chinatown in new york, all chinks, oh noes, genocide of USA...
don't believe projections at face value, immigrant natality levels usually drop to local ones in 2-3 generations
obviously, keeping the flood gates open for decades to come would be suicidal, but as you can clearly see, it's actually stopping after only 5 months of increased activity, people are getting restless and demand a decrease in immigration numbers
>>53677456 >>>and contribute to society by showing you guys Islam
how is shitslam a contribution? shitslamists execute professors and scientists that teach stuff that can cure cancer, and put unwashed stinky bearded goat fuckers to teach.. goat fucking? barbaric 6th century unculture?
there is a reason mudslimes today contributed nothing to modern science
Am I the only one that thinks the issue isn't with some racial fucking bias towards rape, but instead with the sheer amount of refugees, allowed in without any real background checks, without any serious police presence, mostly uneducated, unemployed, 18-30 year old men?
Why does everything come down to two extremes? Why can't we have a rational middle ground between you fucking /pol/tards and the SJW neo-left?
The point is, I think it's overly simplifying the matter to just say "well y'see arabs are natural born rapists." I also think it's simplifying the matter to say "all hu(wo)myns are 100% equal all the time, our social safety nets have absolutely no limits, and our government programs can support unlimited strain!!!"
Believe all you want that you're the only one with the truth, and that these races are actually rape-beasts who can only be controlled with a bullet, but at the end of the day you're being just as """"rational"""" as the "KEIN MENSCH IST ILLEGAL" sorts. The truth of the matter is that lack of education, employment, and future prospects breeds crime. In addition, allowing millions of 18-30 year old men (the biggest criminal demographic across the board) to just stagnate, without including any police presence - it's just as stupid and ideological as you racial realists. Why's the world controlled by fucking memetics?
there were two confirmed rapes in cologne on new years. that's still disgusting but not yet the end of western civilization. these horrible crimes happen everywhere: sweden: 46,5 reported rapes on 100.000 inhabitants usa: 32,99 germany: 10,44 japan: 1,85
>>53679102 >muh studies >mfw 90% of /pol/ linked studies don't actually agree with /pol/s stance, but they keep posting them and shouting about their preconcieved notions while merely glancing through the study and missing the point
I think the pic says it all, /pol/ will immediately say "muh niggers are monkeys", not even understanding what X:A ratios are
>>53679281 >You don't need a study to prove that you fucking moron. Just look at the most crime ridden cities in the world and you can see the lack of educaiton and employment there. >it's an "anon conflates correlation with causation" episode >yet again take your own advice [email protected]
Sexual offending runs in families: A 37-year nationwide study >http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2015/04/05/ije.dyv029.abstract?utm_content=buffer05007&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer "Results: We found strong familial aggregation of sexual crime [odds ratio (OR)=5.1, 95% confidence interval (CI)=4.5–5.9] among full brothers of convicted sexual offenders. Familial aggregation was lower in father-son dyads (OR=3.7, 95% CI=3.2–4.4) among paternal half-brothers (OR=2.1, 95% CI=1.5–2.9) and maternal half-brothers (OR=1.7, 95% CI=1.2–2.4). Statistical modelling of the strength and patterns of familial aggregation suggested that genetic factors (40%) and non-shared environmental factors (58%) explained the liability to offend sexually more than shared environmental influences (2%). Further, genetic effects tended to be weaker for rape of an adult (19%) than for child molestation (46%).
Conclusions: We report strong evidence of familial clustering of sexual offending, primarily accounted for by genes rather than shared environmental influences. Future research should possibly test the effectiveness of selective prevention efforts for male first-degree relatives of sexually aggressive individuals, and consider familial risk in sexual violence risk assessment. "
>>53675451 It's a mixed reaction between being outraged at the muslims for doing it, gloating at European liberals for their stuck up attitude and constant moralising on our conflict and hope that they will finally understand us or at least stop meddling.
>>53679281 >you dont need to prove ah, the eternal no u "discussion"
I swear, they should make an imageboard exactly like 4chan but install an algorithm made by google or someone to just autoban all the 'no u' posters, then people could actually talk to each other for a change. Not just spam 'no u' and memes. I mean memes should be spammed but there should also be threads with the algorithm turned on so people could actually talk for a change.
>>53679281 Im sure that those things correlate, but you disentangle genetic influences from enviromental ones from correlation alone. You can use twin-studies, which do show a genetic influence:
Genetic influences in criminal convictions: evidence from an adoption cohort >http://science.sciencemag.org/content/224/4651/891.short "The possibility that genetic factors are among the causes of criminal behavior was tested by comparing court convictions of 14,427 adoptees with those of their biological and adoptive parents. A statistically significant correlation was found between the adoptees and their biological parents for convictions of property crimes. This was not true with respect to violent crimes. There was no statistically significant correlation between adoptee and adoptive parent court convictions. Siblings adopted separately into different homes tended to be concordant for convictions, especially if the shared biological father also had a record of criminal behavior."
Our politicians are very worried. And condemn the German response.
The Dutch news and people are all over it. And there is a very strong anti-refugee climate now. Anti-rape sprays are handed out for free by Wilders. The amount of protests against refugee centers has increased. Dead pigs have been found at refugee centers several times.
I feel like the 'oh those poor refugees' sentiment is well and truly gone by now and people are well aware of the dangers. every radio show I listen to that brings up the topic of refugees is bombarded with mostly negative or at least critical messages as opposed to the usual 'where is da lurv?' SJW drivel
the first batch of the refugees are due here in the next week afaik. I swear to fuck if I see a bunch of idiots with 'refugees welcome' signs at the airport upon their arrival I'm just going to jump off the nearest tall building
>>53675451 Anyone in my country who isn't a fucking idiot eating up all the fear mongering know its just a few bad apples and most people are actually really good people. This is barely a news worthy story, stop trying to make it anything else.
>>53680134 Im saying that the cause of sexual offending is partly genetic, and because some groups are more likely to commit those kinds of crimes they might also be more likely to have genes which cause sexual offending.
I dont think thats too crazy, and if criminologists actually believed what I say is totally wrong they would more than happy to prove me wrong. But they dont.
>>53680343 In physics, or in math, or in any hard science, counter argument does not exist. 1+1 is 2 and you cant disprove this (if we both agree on axioms of mathematics etc etc, one can simply claim math doesnt even exist..). Meanwhile you can find a counter argument for almost every theory in social/soft sciences. That's why social/soft sciences are all just a bunch of theories, so far they basically discovered 0 laws in their fields, you know, 0 things where counter example does not exist.
Not even to mention how useless and unemployable those things are economically.
>>53680859 Timmermans (the Dutch vice president of the European Commission) has tried to warn countries about the refugee crisis before it began. And then Merkel went: wir schaffen das. And it all went downhill from there.
>>53681013 Three laws of behavior genetics and what they mean >http://people.virginia.edu/~ent3c/papers2/three_laws.pdf
First Law. All human behavioral traits are heritable. Second Law. The effect of being raised in the same family is smaller than the effect of genes. Third Law. A substantial portion of the variation in complex human behavioral traits is not accounted for by the effects of genes or families.
Obviously these might not be accepted by all scientists and researchers.
>>53680532 >there is such a thing as a "propension to rape"-gene You dont have any idea how genetics work right?
That certain populations have different views on the woman condition and that they start behaving in an improper manner up to the point of sexual assault and rape needs to be accepted and acknowledged. But ffs stop trying to pin it on MUH GENETICS, there is actually little to none behaviour that is explicated solely by genes. The fact that they gave been brought up in conservative patriarchal societies (like literally based on the father, the anthropology definition not the feminist one) with fucked up values regarding women (honour crimes, marrying children etc) is plain sufficient to explain their chimp manners.
Also your last bit about the burden of proof lying on people trying to disprove your talking-out-of-your-ass-umptions is a argumentative fallacy. You want to make a point, prove it, it's not up to us to disprove your theory.
I never said it was all in the genes you inherit and neither do those studies, but genes do play a role. Now, Im sure that if European researchers wanted to they could check if the frequencies of these genes differ between populations, but somehow I dont think they will do that.
>>53678379 >racial fucking bias towards rape, Of course not. I'll argue for cultural bias. You are right about the numbers and background checks, which would help get people with buy-in of European culture.
>>53681267 You can't even quote the paper properly
>If the first two laws are taken lit- >erally, they seem to herald a great >victory for the nature side of the >old debate: Genes matter, families >do not. To understand why such >views are at best an oversimplifica- >tion of a complex reality, it is nec- >essary to consider the newest wave >of opposition that behavior genet- >ics has generated
Turkheimer work is often misinterpreted by racist retarsa trying to find ground for their races theories. If you read the paper conclusion it blatantly says that these laws have been derived from misdesigned studies that are either unreprosucrible or have flaw in their design leading to over significance of small statistical variations. He is calling for better designed studies while acknowledging that the little part that can be controled in a real life experiment is actually what matters least.
The foremost Israeli expert on licking European tears posted a snippet from Ovid's Rape of Europa and continued: >seriously bad shit happened in Europe that night, perpetrated by immigrants >police all over Europe either did nothing, or did little only to be suppressed by PC politicians for fear of linking the events to the immigrants >the press got word of the rapes, but suppressed them for the same PC reasons >politicians blame the women, and direct the public to conform to the social rules implied by the rapes >Germany is still receiving thousands of migrants every day, schengen and the threat of immigrant unrest make the flow unstoppable >Merkel barely offers up lip service, does nothing against the immigrants and anyone who opposes i still a racist or a fascist >the immigrants arrogantly see themselves as masters of the domain, and seek to push women out of the public sphere, which is exactly what happened in the Arab Spring >PC defies reality using the power of suggestion, but that won't sustain itself and reality will defy PC >PC saw Israel as the main sickness of the Arab sphere and the world, the curing of which would bring peace and unite PC with reality. This was disproven. >the immigrants just served to bring out the true colors of the European elites, letting out all the deceit and the violence
>>53681791 >>53681148 eh, social/soft sciences are still lack the academic rigor of hard sciences, in fact one can argue that soft and social sciences are academically 'lazy' even, because of how much of their work is falsifiable
in any event, from an economic perspective, those things are borderline useless (according to starting salaries and employment rates) therefore we can all somewhat agree that social and soft sciences are a very poor life decision (unless you are already a millionaire or something)
>Sofie Peeters's account of everyday sexist insults women face triggers debate about inaction over universal problem http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/aug/03/belgium-film-street-harassment-sofie-peeters
Yes, universal. Like all these Norwegians harassing women: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nw_6-21jClI
Or NYC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1XGPvbWn0A
Or Riga: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnZsH4kNyLI
Anyway, during the last few years some of the genes which govern behavior have been found(like 1-5% of the variation in IQ, less than 1% of the variation in neuroticism) and this process will likely continue during the coming decade. Eventually we will be able see if there is any variation in the frequencies of the genes between populations. I think there is variation and therefore I welcome these kinds of studies, but do you think the people who believe in enviromental factors are as confident as me?
>>53679392 This study also have been wisely disproved. The correlation is retarded
>kids born in a dysfunctional family with a criminal father and taken away to be placed in foster family tend to have behavioural problems too >omfg it must be genetics
Ffs, read the study design, you don't have a proper control group. Also no control for the foster family to control the family effect. This generates a shitton of bias.
And the worst part about your argument is the correlative part. I'm not going to insult you by explaining how correlation and causations are two different things but think of these two points: Of all these behavioural studies they only find generic correlations in genetic profiles between a few individuals, there is no specifical shared gene or group of genes across all these samples to explain the same phenomena.
Two: we are only talking about correlations, like a and b have the same kind of behaviour and they also share similarity in their genetics, but there is never an explanation of the mechanics behind it like: group of gene X , significantly tied to this behaviour, generates activate the transcription of this kind of protein leading to this alteration in hormones or sensitivity of receptors or whatnot that can explain agressivity. There isn't even any macro or micro phenotype screening additional to the genetics correlation to try to find the mechanism.
That's a HUGE methodological shortcoming.
Keep educating yourself about the scientific methods and look at all the studies of one field instead of cherrypicking the two that suits your prejudices. That's how science work
>>53682233 In Sofie's film the harassers were Maghrebis.
She got a lott of shit from lefties telling her she was targetting them out of malice, when it's just than IRL, it's maghrebis who harasses women on street not european men, because europen have a culture of respecting women and sexuel self-restraint unlike ar*bs and their inferior rapist culture.
>>53682373 I an quoting the exact same paper you linked. You didn't bother to read of all it, because if you did you'd see the conclusions are pretty contradicting your views.
I think you are missing the pijbt about the whole genes VS environment controversy. These scientists are focusing on a very tiny portion of our behaviours and are trying to find broad correlations in vast numbers. That means the explicative effect are usually very small, because human beings are very complex and behaviour are the results of a gazillion factors that it is impossible to control for. And even if you put people through the exact same experience for years they would all react differently and you would still have no fucking idea if it is due to genes or not. It's a broad field of exploration but you need to understand that nobody (outside a few biased fanatics on each side) think that we will have any predictive power out of those research ever.
You think you can settle the debate of "poor little guys are kept in ghetto and that's why they are violent" vs "blacks are apes and will be violent anywhere" by digging on these studies but you shall soon realize that's not pertinent. Also , properly designed studies tend to favour the first hypothesis (inb4 shitstorm I'm just stating the state of the art, but it is obviously nuanced and not a vindication of any political side).
Genetics is very complex and the presence of genes is absolutely meaningless when the environment can decide if they are expressed or not. You can dig on the CpG methylations for example.
>>53682421 >This study also have been wisely disproved. Thats isnt true.
>Of all these behavioural studies they only find generic correlations in genetic profiles between a few individuals, there is no specifical shared gene or group of genes across all these samples to explain the same phenomena. It wasnt that kind of study. They didnt look for specific genes.
>Keep educating yourself about the scientific methods and look at all the studies of one field instead of cherrypicking the two that suits your prejudices. There arent many studies that dare to take genes into consideration, but hopefully that will change.
>>53683100 >PhD in epigenetics >epigenetics You are bullshitting. Epigenetics in humans are very over-hyped and not even the researchers who came up with it are as enthusiasthic as the media seem to be.
>And even if you put people through the exact same experience for years they would all react differently and you would still have no fucking idea if it is due to genes or not. >It's a broad field of exploration but you need to understand that nobody (outside a few biased fanatics on each side) think that we will have any predictive power out of those research ever. Yes we can. When we have found the genes responsible for, say IQ, we will be able to see what kind of difference they make, what effecy malnutrition has, etc.
>>53677033 You're oversimplifying tremendously. Most European populations are quite old on average, Germany in particular, and most of the "refugees" are quite young. Muslims may only account for some 6-8% of Germany's population, but that proportion easily doubles or even triples when you're talking about the under-18 demographic. And with a million more set to come this year, the process will only accelerate. Germany is well on its way to having its indigenous population replaced by Middle Easterners.
>>53683579 >a kid with highschool level understsnding if science is lecturing me about a whole field of science to which I dedicated 9 years of my life. >also he knows better than hundreads of recognized scientists the potential predictive power of our genome.
You know nothing John snow, all your statements reveal how little you understand about the complex mechanism you are talking about. You cannot even read a study properly, yet along have a critical view of its design. Stop being so assertive, learn some humility and go educate yourself.
As I said, read about the scientifically.method and how to design a study and the common bias, then read all the studies on a particular topic with a critical eye. To get an idea of what is the state if human knowledge on this particular topic. You can start with the more recent ones and explore the bibliography to get a better understanding. That's called the state if the art and that's the starting point of any reasoning.(shoulders of giants, remember?)
Quoting two studies that you have only read someone else conclusion on it, probably in a website that try to vindicate some political views, is no way of doing science.
>>53683699 >6-8% more like 5-6% before syrian crysis and out of those, 60% are turks, a good portion of them being seasonal migrants anyway
the key part is >the process will only accelerate
this won't happen, because 1.) don't mind the memes, the german people will want to close the doors, as will the politicians, they're already pushing back refugees to austria (albeit in smaller numbers)
2.) studies (which I'm too lazy to dig up now) show that immigrant natality drops to almost native levels by the 2nd-3rd generation
Sure, Germany might alltogether get a sizeable muzzie minority, but they're not having its population replaced, it's you who are oversimplifying tremendously.
>>53678379 The people who keep trying to make this about race are idiots. This is about religion and culture. These "refugees" come from an actual rape culture where women who aren't Muslim, don't dress in a fashion considered modest according to Islamic cultural norms, and don't travel without a male relative chaperoning them are fair game. They can be harassed, groped, and raped, and beaten and it's all perfectly acceptable because it teaches them a lesson.
The sheer numbers, lack of policing, and lack of background checks are a serious problem, and the EU's decision to allow boats to cross the Mediterranean rather than blockading them and towing them back to their ports of origin and forcing the people to register and submit to thorough background checks before being permitted to enter Europe was a huge mistake. Criminals are getting in. Jihadis are getting in. And untold thousands of Islamic fundamentalists with every intention of doing their best to transform whatever European country they end up in into an Islamic state are getting in.
>>53684410 I don't have to prove anything to you, you are free to believe me or not, i don't care. Also you seem to know very little because epigenetics is responsible for something as simple as cell differentiation. Is all your cells have the same genes and yet some turn into liver, some other into bones and some into the hairs that make your neckbeard.
Genetics have currently less predictive power than economics, that should have you think a little bit.
>>53684738 >Genetics have currently less predictive power than economics If you mean the genes we have identified thusfar, then yes I agree. Although I think you will be one of people who get very disappointed when we have found the majority of the genes responsible for IQ.
>>53676501 Maybe 10 years ago. Now, west influence NGOs would protest. He'd get beaten up to the point of falling to coma or something, but he would't get killed. >>53675964 I wouldn't say serbians enjoy it,they hate it, but there is some feeling of poetic justice, after seeing west destroy your country to support people just like in those videos. the same people with rape, torture and killing charges, like ramus haradinaj (pic related). Who are now respected politicians in kosovo.
>>53685160 >The fact that you believe firmly that we will find such genes proves by itself you have no idea about genetics. We have already identified some of the genes and we will find more in the future.
Northern "Logic" Due to Remorse and almost an, without question coercion of left wing ideologies, Germany decides to let "refugees" in their country. From an area of the world where: The Habit is desertic and warm Public Violence is Encouraged to a point where it seems more of gladiatorial arena than a street. The sense of nuclear family is strongly cultivated from a Abrahmic point of view where the women and children and no less viewed them objects to acquire, sells and or trade.
Expect them to drop all their years of education and raise and behave. In a country where they can drink above all.
What could possibly go wrong? You deserve it. France deserves it. Everybody told ya not to, but you went a followed the serpent's lies.
>>53685429 I would like to think you are trolling yet I am not optimistic about your retardation.
You have, at best, highschool understanding of oversimplified basic mechanisms. If you'd bother to read a bit you'd discover that you have barely scratched the surface and are misnderstanding it. Genetics is not a building blueprint where if you have a line on the print you'll get a wall on the building. The mechanisms at work are highly complex with thousands of different molecules interacting to get to a an equilibrium. And such equilibrium can be dramatically modified by small changes to other completely seemingly unrelated molecules. Ffs even the CONFORMATION of the and molecule have an impact (see histones ) you don't even realize the crucial importance of epigenetics in human development and you are making assumptions out of your ass.
I don't care for your political beliefs, the science you are trying to use as argument is deeply flawed and you do not even understand(nor read) what you are citing as evidence.
>>53685951 If you cannot even understand why it is laughable.it tells a lot about the validity of your assumptions.
Meta-analysis are the strongest scientific evidence and there are plenty in all fields. Here is a simple example of one , in the same kind of field citing 92 studies http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/bul/110/1/26/
This is a relatively strong proof of the impact of upbringing and environment. A much harder argument than the small survey you found on stormfront. I chose something going against your political belief on purpose to piss you off because I'm getting tired of retarded ignorant people acting like they know better.
>>53686267 >Its not I gave you various examples of why the studies you cited are weak evidence due to flawed design and methodology. If you do not understand this basic fact I cannot do anything else to help you.
You need to take your political beliefs out of the equation, science don't care for them. If you think niggers and Muslims are incompatible with our western democracies, it's okay, I do share some of this belief. But using flawed science and retarded theory is not helping your cause. Politics can be debated, science cannot. It is true, false and more likely: it's fucking complicated we do not understand enough about it to draw clear conclusions.
In your case genetics do not explain IQ and will most likely never do. Deal with it, grow up and it doesn't mean you aren't right to refuse immigrants.
>>53686778 >In your case genetics do not explain IQ and will most likely never do. We have already found some of the genes:
GWAS of 126,559 Individuals Identifies Genetic Variants Associated with Educational Attainment >www.sciencemag.org/content/early/2013/05/29/science.1235488.abstract "A genome-wide association study of educational attainment was conducted in a discovery sample of 101,069 individuals and a replication sample of 25,490. Three independent SNPs are genome-wide significant (rs9320913, rs11584700, rs4851266), and all three replicate. Estimated effects sizes are small (R2 ≈ 0.02%), approximately 1 month of schooling per allele. A linear polygenic score from all measured SNPs accounts for ≈ 2% of the variance in both educational attainment and cognitive function. Genes in the region of the loci have previously been associated with health, cognitive, and central nervous system phenotypes, and bioinformatics analyses suggest the involvement of the anterior caudate nucleus. These findings provide promising candidate SNPs for follow-up work, and our effect size estimates can anchor power analyses in social-science genetics." Heres Steve Hsus blog, which has tons of info: http://infoproc.blogspot.com/search/label/iq
>>53685322 >I meant when it comes to things like personality, IQ and health. The media people make seem like everything is explained by epigenetics. Everything isn't explained by epigenetics, but epigenetics is, again, a fundamental part of how our genes work. So, yes, epigenetics is important for all those things. What you presumably are trying to say, is how to what degree we can affect our epigenetic makeup, and what effect that will have. Now this is, like with genetics as whole, a very difficult question that we are trying our best to answer. Epigenetics is also a relatively young field, with a somewhat limited base of research yet. But research is rolling in all the time, so maybe we'll see soon. One of the things we do know by now, is that prenatal exposure to smoking will mess up your epigenetic makeup, which of course can have quite large effects.
>>53686894 >genetic factors in divorce Ffs get a grip
>The paper was published in "Current Directions in Psychological Science" Yes and the one I cited comes from the Psychological bulletin that has thrice the impact factor and the ranking. It is then both more robust methodological my and more recognized. Before saying any kind of bs you could have a t least googled the if of the journal and looked at the paper citing the one you posted to get an idea of its receptions and critics.
Anyhow science isn't a gotcha game when you find ONE paper going your way. As I proofed there are vast chances to find a better paper going the other way. The scienfific methods means you need to look at all the papers on one field to understand what the challenges are, where are the discrepancies and what are the consensus. These are built slowly (especially in fields as complex and soft as psychology) when the evidence piles up on one side of the scale.
>>53682515 >She got a lott of shit from lefties telling her she was targetting them out of malice, when it's just than IRL, it's maghrebis who harasses women on street not european men, because europen have a culture of respecting women and sexuel self-restraint unlike ar*bs and their inferior rapist culture. The response to the NYC was even better. First the identity politics people threw a fit because there were no white people harassing her.
Then the director tried to defend the POC by saying that he edited out all the white people. Literally jumped on the grenade.
Personality and divorce: A genetic analysis. >http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=buy.optionToBuy&id=1996-06400-007 "M. McGue and D. T. Lykken (1992) found that divorce risk was, to a substantial degree, genetically mediated; prior research has identified numerous social and psychological factors that affect divorce risk (G. C. Kitson, K. B. Barbi, & M. J. Roach, 1985). The present study attempted to link these domains by examining the extent to which genetic influences on one such psychological factor, personality, explain divorce risk heritability. A sample of adult twins from the Minnesota Twin Registry completed a marital history questionnaire and the Multidimensional Personality Questionnaire (A. Tellegen, 1982). Positive Emotionality and Negative Emotionality factors were positively related to divorce risk, whereas Constraint was negatively related. In women and men, respectively, 30% and 42% of the heritability of divorce risk consisted of genetic factors affecting personality, and personality and divorce risk correlated largely as a result of these common genetic influences."
Also if you had bothered reading the abstract of the article I quoted , the fact that the overall negative effect of divorce is widespread in time and across cultures and groups should have you convinced that the consequences on the children are due to the environmental change of this single event rather to some protein coded by a genetic sequence.
I mean when you are trying to argue the other way around with a study about 7 pairs of adopted twins you are making a fool of yourself
I'm seeing quite some Poles saying they're happy about this, whether it's just jokes or not. Are poles still angry about the WW2 thing or is it something else? If so, why do some Poles defend Russians then, like they didn't fuck them up in WW2 about as much as Germans did.
>the fact that the overall negative effect of divorce is widespread in time and across cultures and groups should have you convinced that the consequences on the children are due to the environmental change of this single event rather to some protein coded by a genetic sequence. That doesnt prove its enviromental at all.
>>53689241 >a few twins (we dont know if they were raised separately btw) score identically on an arbitrary personality quizz >some of these traits are correlated to divorce rates (with ridiculous effect size) >PERSONALITY IS HERITABLE AND GENES EXPLAIN DIVORCE
Small sample size, poor repeatability, poor follow up of subjects, weakness of the effect, no control.group etc.
That's a lot of bias for one study. It proves pretty much nothing
>>53689449 >no u but that makes your own post bullshit too, doesnt it?
I am not any kind of expert or anything, but this correlation between Africa and everything being shit over there and Europe and everything being great over there makes me wonder just how much genetics effect things
All I know about genetics is that every cell has them, and they are basically instructions for the cell what to do, they are like machine language for computers that has been compiled yet, the cell being the compiler. Now I also know people managed to get much taller corn, much fatter pigs, and much braver horses through genetics.. as I said I dont know shit about human genetics but from here it looks like it effects the culture and society.
>>53689555 If you read the study that is exactly the conclusion it draws after analyzing 92 other paper that have been selected for their good methodology. There is strong scientifically evidence that divorce has a big impact on children development and future. I don't know what's hard to grasp, kids that live this traumatic experience at some point of their life have different outcomes in life than kids who don't. That's pretty much a case study.
Genome-wide analysis of over 106,000 individuals identifies 9 neuroticism-associated loci >http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2015/11/20/032417
We are in the process of finding the genes. It will happen.
And personality is heritable:
Personality similarity in twins reared apart and together. >http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/psp/54/6/1031/
Meta-analysis of the heritability of human traits based on fifty years of twin studies >http://www.nature.com/ng/journal/v47/n7/full/ng.3285.html "Despite a century of research on complex traits in humans, the relative importance and specific nature of the influences of genes and environment on human traits remain controversial. We report a meta-analysis of twin correlations and reported variance components for 17,804 traits from 2,748 publications including 14,558,903 partly dependent twin pairs, virtually all published twin studies of complex traits. Estimates of heritability cluster strongly within functional domains, and across all traits the reported heritability is 49%. For a majority (69%) of traits, the observed twin correlations are consistent with a simple and parsimonious model where twin resemblance is solely due to additive genetic variation. The data are inconsistent with substantial influences from shared environment or non-additive genetic variation. This study provides the most comprehensive analysis of the causes of individual differences in human traits thus far and will guide future gene-mapping efforts. All the results can be visualized using the MaTCH webtool"
>>53689693 I don't even know what you're arguing against. The swede boils down everything as caused by genetics, and that epigenetics is negligible. He writes off the whole field. This is the premise I disagree with because his view is too simplistic. He is also very quick to jump to conclusions from a single study that proves his hypothesis, even ones from 25 years ago.
In actual fact, epigenetics is extremely important as it controls when and how much protein is made. Gene expression produces function, not genes. You can have a dormant or recessive gene in the genome of all your cells that has little to no function at all.
>>53689693 If you want to picture how strong genetics are think of the box experience.
Take two identical twins. But one of them in a closed box, they have food and light and the temperature is okay, there's a hole to pee and poo. But they have no clothing and won't have interaction with any human being. The box is big enough for the kid to run around etc but they never see a human being in their life. When sick, they get drugged by the food before being treated so they never remember encountering anybody.
Meanwhile the twin is raised normally by a normal family.
At 18, do you think they will score identically on an IQ test? Do you think they will have the same behaviour? Do you genuinely think they have the same divorce changes? How much the fact that they have the exact same gene code will make them identical?
>>53690111 I am appalled at your retardation. If you believe that everything is genetic (up to divorce chances and criminality) then it would seem obvious to you that the whole regulation mechanism of genes expression has an impact.
I mean any epigenetics paper is a proof that it has one before it explicits a mechanism of regulation. You cannot dissociate genetics and epigenitcs, it makes literally no sense.
It's like saying that you believe in blueprints but not in architects when it comes to construction buildings.
>>53689693 His post was succint too, but it came in support of my clearly laid case that the kid have no idea what he is talking about. He is making affirmation out of his ass and does not even read the studies he quotes. It is documented all along the thread, there was no need to add additional proofs.
Twin studies are a narrow view and inherently biased
Because how the hell so you get identical twins to be raised by different families? Because of inherent failing in families and parenting so the kid get adopted in the first place ffs. It's a huge shortcoming
The number of genetically identical twins that have been adopted at birth or very young, placed in very different normal families, is close to zero. And still it would not be a perfect study as you would be missing controls for the family effect.
Eveybody knows that and that's why these are only used as indicative for further in depth research. Stop jumping to conclusions and making retarded assumptions.
There is currently no scientific proof of what you are saying. Period. Googling "genetics + behaviour" and cherry picking the abstracts won't do it.
>>53690906 >Because how the hell so you get identical twins to be raised by different families? >Because of inherent failing in families and parenting so the kid get adopted in the first place ffs. >It's a huge shortcoming You are making stuff up. And it doesnt even make sense.
>The number of genetically identical twins that have been adopted at birth or very young, placed in very different normal families, is close to zero. And still it would not be a perfect study as you would be missing controls for the family effect. What the hell are you talking about? You are guessing about the age of adoption, and what do you mean by "very young"? They looked at 14 million twin-pairs and parenting was irrelevant. What more do you need?
>Eveybody knows that and that's why these are only used as indicative for further in depth research. Yes, gene research. As I showed above we are in the process of finding the genes responsible for different personality traits(and IQ) and we have already found some.
>>53690776 How dense can you get??? I mean you don't even understand the words you are using. Epigenetics is not dissociable from genetics. Simplifying, it's basically the mechanism that affect gene transcription, how the gene affect the rest of the body, if it is coding or not. I mean, it is responsible for cell differentiation. So you understand?
All your cells have the same dna right? The exact same, like twins, except they are cells. And then, some turn into muscle and some other into bones. Yet the have the same DNA What makes them behave differently? Epigenetics It's fundamental and regulate how your genes are expressed. There is no genetics without epigenetics!
I am getting tired you do not understand anything. This conversations looks like this:
>retarded swedish kid: I think perpetual motion will be discovered soon, and it will proof my theory about big oil and the Jews >me: err I don't think so, there is no such thing as perpetual motion >RSK: here is a bunch of experience and videos that prove you wrong >me: all these experience are inherently flawed(states the reason why) here is a paper disproving your theory >RSK: it does not >me: that pretty much exactly what it does. Also the laws of thermodynamics make it impossible for your theory to be true. >RSK: I don't know thermodynamics but I don't think it applies to my magnet machine >me: *appalled* wait, what? >RSK: until you show me a paper proving that thermodynamics have an effect on magnets I will not magically believe you.
>>53691676 That is not what I meant when I said I want to see proof of the connection between epigenetics and IQ. English is not my first language so I might have explained it clumsily. What I meant was that epigenetics is used as a way to explain the differences between individual, and also groups, and for that there is no proof.
>>53692047 Heres an example of how its used in the media:
>http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1262154/Dont-blame-genes--change-them.html "As the baby grows, signs of intelligence will be linked to a clever parent or relative; musical or sporting ability likewise. How talented we are, how likely we are to develop diseases such as diabetes or alzheimer's, even whether we have a sunny or a gloomy nature, are all heavily influenced by our genes.
Or are they? Among the most radical and surprising findings of genetic research is the idea that genes aren't fixed and set at the moment of conception, like cards in a hand of poker. Instead, most genes come with dimmer switches attached.
One of the most fascinating of the new findings is how little brainpower really is down to genes.
A book published this week, the Genius In all Of Us, suggests we have been far too ready to explain mental abilities such as IQ and musical ability simply in terms of having the right genes.
'That's not to say there aren't important genetic differences between us,' says author David Shenk.
' But research suggests most of us do not come near to tapping our potential, whether it's intellectual or sporting, until we've spent a vast amount of time working on it.'
His message is one that pushy parents are going to love: he believes families, schools and society could do a great deal more to encourage children to make more of their abilities.
'IQ scores can be altered if people get the right push,' he says."
There is no proof of this. States have spent billions trying without anything to show for it.
>>53692215 And then theres the others who say that experiences during ones life have an effect on which genes get passed on, and therefore it might also have an effect on IQ. This connection has never been proven to exist.
>>53692047 It's quite funny that when someone tries to explain something for you, you just keep on going as if nothing happens. You shown that you don't have the slightest grasp of what epigenetics even is. It's not about explaining it clumsily, it's about not knowing what you are talking about, but still yapping about as if you do.
>What I meant was that epigenetics is used as a way to explain the differences between individual, and also groups, and for that there is no proof. Now this is clumsy.
>>53692215 Yes, the media, especially tabloids, are sensationalist and rarely understand the research they write about. Much like you.
>>53679123 >>53679059 But it literally has. If you don't think it doesn't, go back to /reddit/. People are different. You don't call all dog breeds equal. Deal with it. >>53681499 >>53679680 >>53679392 Sven is right. >>53687907 >>53682421 The truth hurts, doesn't it? Genetics do play a big part, it's BOTH genetic and environmental and some races are genetically superior (higher average intelligence etc.)
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