>Bulgaria less developed and poorer than Romania
>Turkey less developed than Trinidad and Tobago and poorer than Mexico
>Albania less developed and poorer than Turkey, Venezuela and Algeria
>Macedonia less developed and poorer than Jamaica
fucking Christ, how the hell there's such a huge ass gap between Greece and its neighbors?
no I'm talking between Greece and Turkey, there's no fuckin' way one would pick Turkey over Greece to live, even Turks, despite all of their nationalism silly muslimness, there's no way if someone offered them a Greek citizenship they'd say no and stay in Turkey.
Not speaking Greek would make things hard, but purely in terms of living standards, the average place in Greece is much more developed since its such a smaller country (and has a better gdp per capita). I would still choose Istanbul over Athens though, not to say that I wouldn't live there out of cultural interest
nah , overall from the general picture I get from Turks on /int/ is that they hate being turkish and living in Turkey. The only reason why they decline to answer straight up to my question is because they are ashamed of it since we're sworn enemies and stuff.
But it's ok, I kinda feel bad for them too, must be tough living in a muslim country where everything's censored .
The /int/ fags are generally social outcasts from Turkey, its not exactly a good idea to trust more of their judgements on social perspectives etc.
Most of them have an inferiority complex about their country being shit whenever they see something, and downplaying anything positive as "meh, thats nothing". You would think from them that most Turks don't like Erdogan but its the opposite really.
Oh, and most of them are very much antinationalist and pro-European, so it ashames them that many don't think that Turkey is European or should be, and it gives them the sense that Turkey is worse than it is (though it is mostly a shithole, yes, but its still eastern euro standards, not THAT bad). The problem is that leftists in Turkey in general want to cuck themselves into whatever Papa Europe is doing. A lot of them think that things like LGBT and feminism should be staunchly defended simply because that's what happens in developed countries, though /int/fags are a little different from the typical leftist
I'm biased because
but yeah, it did happen. Not going to feel ashamed or guilty for it or anything, but yeah, it did happen. A shame, but it was war and they were plotting and pulling shit in eastern anatolia, so whaddayagonnado
cut it out with all the /pol/ talk and stuff, I hate reading long replies without any essence.
Truth be told if you'd put any sane person infront of the barrel of a gun and told him choose a country between those two for the rest of your life, hardly anyone would pick Turkey and that includes Turks too. Just the same way I'd pick any richer and more developed place than Greece, there's no shame in that.
But go ahead now, you can reply to me with some irrelevant while dodging my facts.
I'm not arguing that most people wouldn't go, they would, I'm just explaining that this isn't purely because Turkey is 100% worse and all Turks hate Turkey or anything. There's a big social element to it too. An ultranationalist would probably say no, a leftist would do it in a heartbeat, most others would deeply consider leaving their family for the "enemy" etc., though ultimately the majority would go. It's not so simple as looking at the numbers.
Come to think of it, it might not even be the majority. There's also the fact that the Greek economy is shit and a lot of people would be turned off by that to begin with, most don't know about infrastructure, HDI, quality of life etc. shit that well.
>>53150987 This too, going to a country where there's nobody who gives a shit about you is intimidating, and the fact that a lot of people will shun you makes things worse. I'd say most Turks would agree to going to a country in Europe where there isn't any ultra strong stigma against Turks (i.e not Balkans) that has a better reputation with its economy and history and shit, but Greece...
>most important reason: he is using my religion as political (and so as economical) profits.
>raised pkk when they were about destroyed and legalized abdullah ocalan leadership
>he is so sect-ist he rejected to took turkomens from iraq because theyre shia and took kurds and more than +2million syrians just because theyre sunnis
>acts like nationalist when elections approach then removes name of "Turk" from everywhere
>rejects what he says just after 30 minutes
>blaming the whole world when bad things happens and he even use this as increase-vote politic
>he says that he is economically liberal but he even tried to ban private-class because his enemy "hoca" makes huge money of it
>he increase tansions of country extremly. etc. he even mentioned atatürk as drunkard and after gezi protests he claimed that he is keeping his partisans as "ready-for-death" soldiers
>he liquidate turkish army and still whines about army that they can "Coup d'état" against him and says that army is against him cuz he is conservative
>he jails everyone who speaks against him
>made majority of conservatives -which were the most apolitical people- to hate everyone who doesnt vote fore AKP. evenmore they see people who doenst vote for him as "traitor"
>and because of all these, hatred against religious people in Turkey is dramatically increased. meanwhile, i have to imply that i dont like him to break stereotypes against me
Most people don't want EU (I don't either) but a lot of people still want to be European, live the European life etc., support things Europeans would. Not saying that goes for everyone but its really common from what I've seen.
You would probably know better though
only leftist want to be "european life" which makes 25% of population (i dont count kurds as leftist cuz even their party is left-winged theyre religious almost like arabs) rest of see europe as United States of LGBTs and henpecked men who allows their daughters to have sex with everyone
There's a general meme that Islam to an extent is good since it prevents degeneracy. I was born to an atheist family here, I wouldn't know shit about that. Is that true? Since Turkey is more western than other Muslim countries, is that a good balance or do you think its too conservative still?
its true if its ruled by well-intentioned goverments or when people is well-educated about religions and actually research about it
but its awful for countries when un-educated people makes majority of country and being conservatives at the same time. they are so easily manipulated youd be confused if theyre for real and than usually get mad about situation.
simply doesnt work for any mid-east country included turkey for now
You mean EU? Will never happen. But Turkey will have visa free access into France and all the other EU countries starting sometime in 2016, so pack your bags if you don't want that. I recommend NZ
>implying NZ even exists
>implying I didin't just epically meme him
Erdogan's only been around for a bit over 10 years, the whole country doesn't revolve around the guy. He's not a dictator or some shit, though he is iffy and pretty authoritarian
But yeah, Greece is a better place to live generally. Turkey's economy is rising pretty nicely though, hopefully we can get our gdp/capita up to a decent level. That's the biggest issue since we're bigger than the UK but have less than a third of its GDP. Obviously that's not a good recipe for living standards across the country
>Turkey's economy is rising pretty nicely though, hopefully we can get our gdp/capita up to a decent level. That's the biggest issue since we're bigger than the UK but have less than a third of its GDP.
Sell more kebab