>>27078457 Fun fact: However, anybody from an ex-commi state you will see on the internet and IRL talking about history, will most of the times talk out of communist nationalism than objective reasoning If you want to be cool use the flag with the buffalo.
>>27079201 Because you were broken off from Romania by Russia and lots of Russians got dumped there (like in the Baltics). Russia has of course an interest that this stays that way because of Transnistria and >muh sphere of influence
>>27079485 Because I imagine it like it'd be if East Germans would nowadays consider themselves a separate people from us because of Soviet propaganda (in a theoretical scenario) and started to call themselves "Brandenburgers" or something like that. Or Aistrians who think they're not German because the Allies told them so after WW2
>>27078170 I can tell you something about Moldova and I'm 100% unbiased because I didn't know where this country is until you posted this.
>go to the lake >want to pay for entry >two busses of moldovans coming in, all with MOLDOVA T-shirts >behave like fucking monkeys >have never heard of the queueing system in the developed and civilized part of the world >HUEHUE
Fuck you guys. Fuck you and your romanian brothers and everybody else in that area. You are literally gross apes and you do not belong to Europe.
>>27079650 All what the soviets did, or tried to, was just to emphasis the moldovan variant over standart romanian, and call it another language. I can show you numerous examples where other regions in Romania have poetry in their own variant. But you won't see anyone claiming it's soviet propaganda at work.
People just call themselves moldovan because that's what they can best relate to, the region, the traditions and the variant.
Do you understand now?
>>27079771 Did they even speak romanian? i mean, they could have been russian, and we have lots of those in cities
>>27079921 Yeah, of course regional pride is strong here too (most famously in Bavaria I guess) but still.. - the borders are weird, some parts of Moldova are not really in Moldova (and that's a product of the Russians if I'm not mistaken, kinda reminiscent of African colonial borders) - the other macro-regions aren't separate countries
>>27079485 A lot of countries twice older than that exist that didn't have a problem with uniting with other countries to form their nation state.
Moldavia existed since 1400, and so did Wallachia. No Romanian country existed. You don't see Transylvanians or Wallachians fighting against "Romanian" occupation because they are the Romanians as you are. Moldavia nowadays doesn't make sense. Maybe it makes Russian sense since they were the ones that made your existance today possible. This is why people bring Russians to the discussion. Because they are the sole reason you exist today as a separate country of Romania.
>>27079485 >Romania wasn't the only one with historicly movies filtered through propaganda.
That happened ten times worse and in the wrong direction in Moldova. The Russians spread propaganda that "Moldovans are different", even though the Moldovan SSR is just half of the historic Principality of Moldavia that they took after 1812, the other half being in Romania. They forced a new cyrillic alphabet, taught Russian in schools, tried to slavicize the language. Classic divide et impera. Don't buy their shit. Up until 1812 you were indistinguishable from your brothers across the Prut. The official language of Moldova is Romanian, not Moldovan.
That was due to the soviet repartition plans in the 50's
We said to ukraine ssr, have sea access and mountainous regions and we'll get in exchange transnistrian autonomous ssr.
Wasn't a good decision from our politicians at the time, what can you do.
>- the other macro-regions aren't separate countries
Austria is a separate country, tho. Infact, our countries are the same in this case. Austrians don't call themselves germans out of pride, and we do the same, however none is going to claim scientifically they are distinct cultures.
>>27080282 >Austrians don't call themselves germans out of pride
Austrians do refer to themselves as Germans/Deutsche in an ethnic sense. Moldovans push the ridiculous idea that not only should they be a different state that has no historical roots before the 1812 Russian annexation of "Basarabia", but also a different people with a different language. The variant of Romanian they speak is or was slightly different from Romanian I will admit and riddled with archaicisms since it didn't undergo the 19th century changes Romanian did, but to call it a different language when Italy has so many dialects that are vastly different from Italian and yet still not "languages" is ridiculous.
>>27080282 >Austrians don't call themselves germans out of pride, and we do the same Yeah, thanks to external interference/brainwashing. Even before the Anschluss vote (and no it wasn't (significantly) rigged, there was just no need for it), they did some other referendums shortly after WW1 in the early 20s in different states - always 98-99% pro-Anschluss And that's where the Russians come into play in your case - they shaped your identity
>>27080282 >scientifically evaluating culture Stop with this.
Austrians are separate from Germany because the west prevents them from being united with Germany, the same way Russians prevented you from uniting with Romania.
Why do you think Austrians didn't put a fight when Hitler invaded? Why were they annexed so easily and Hitler's army welcomed? Even after the fall of the Reich, the allies had to make it a condition of the peace treaties to have both countries separate then and into the future because they know Austrians and Germans had no greater problem of uniting as Bavarians and the rest with the Germans.
>>27080282 > Austrians don't call themselves Germans out of pride I remember a great feeling of excitement when the Anschluss happened. The only reason Austria remained separate is because they had a Power struggle with Prussia against who will unite the future German nation. THIS is the thing witch breads nationalism.
Austrians are similar to Bavarian and yet Bavarian's are still united with Germany (even if they bitch about the north because its some how their fault they had been raped by Russians and are not as developed).
If it would have not been for Germany loosing they would have still been united today and I bet happy.
>>27080064 Actually, the people from Wallachia always called themselves "rîmleni" (sons of rome)
And the region was always called "?ara Romîneasc?" by the people in the principalities
And it makes sense because that was where the roman occupied regions in Dacia were.
Theoreticly, in 1859 Romania did occupy Moldova, but in practice it was a joint union pushed by moldovan politicians, but the point still stands. And there were people at the time who were against the union, too, like today.
>>27080138 You'll be surprised when i'll tell you it wasn't russians who pushed for the cyrillic alphabet. Infact, after WW II, there were 7 changes to the official language of mssr. There were two factions, the moldovan intellectuals that wanted to keep latin script and the ones that wanted cyrillic script. It was by no means "pushed" by anyone, and it was our own doing
I've seen demographic atlases of the Austrian empire where with regard to the regions of the empire they inhabit they referred to themselves as "Deutsche". IIRC Transylvanian Saxons were referred to as either "Sachsen" or "Siebenbuergische Sachsen".
And we speak a variant of the DacoRoman dialect, called moldovan. What you think "Romanian" is, is nothing but the standartised version of the muntenian variant.
Because the first intellectuals Romania as a modern state ever had were moldovans, the official grammar was loosely based on the moldovan variant, and that changed when wallachians took over the political and intellectual sphere.
>>27080563 There are idiots everywhere pushing idiot politics all the time.
The difference was/is, your idiots were/are backed by Russians.
Why do you think Africa didn't separate into ethnic nations after colonialism even though all of them went through civil wars? Because the idiots that didn't the want colonial countries to break were supported by Russians/United States and the others that fought for their nation state weren't.
Here is quote and you can check wipedia "Denumirea de „români” pentru vorbitorii limbii române, este timpuriu atestat? atât în Transilvania, în ?ara Româneasc?, Dobrogea, cât ?i în Moldova dintre Carpa?i, Nistru ?i Mare, nu numai de cronicari moldoveni precum Miron Costin, Ion Neculce sau Grigore Ureche, ci deasemenea de umani?ti renascenti?ti din secolul al XVI-lea care, fiind în majoritate trimi?i ai Sfântului Scaun, au c?l?torit în aceste ?inuturi."
Here is a quote form Miron Costin the chronicler: ^ Miron Costin : „A?a ?i neamul acésta, de carele scriem, al ??râlor acestora, numele vechi? ?i mai dirept? ieste rumân, adec? râmlean, de la Roma. Acest nume de la disc?licatul lor de Traian, ?i cât au tr?it [...] tot acest nume au ?inut ?i ?in p?n? ast?zi ?i înc? mai bine munténii decât moldovénii, c? ei ?i acum zic ?i scriu ?ara sa rumâneasc?, ca ?i românii cei din Ardeal. [...] ?i a?a ieste acestor ??ri ?i ??râi noastre, Moldovei ?i ??râi Muntene?ti numele cel dirept? de mo?ie, ieste rumân, cum s? r?spund? ?i acum to?i acéia din ??rile Ungure?ti l?cuitori ?i munténii ?ara lor ?i scriu ?i r?spund? cu graiul: ?ara Româneasc?.” în De neamul moldovenilor"
>>27080772 >upper bulgaria Upper as in better? :^)
>Începutul ??râlor acestora ?i neamului moldovenesc? ?i muntenesc? ?i câ?i sunt ?i în ??rile Ungure?ti cu acest nume, români ?i pân? ast?zi, de unde sunt? ?i de ce semin?ie, de când ?i cum au d?sc?lecat, acéste p?r?i de p?mânt?, a scrie, mult? vréme la cump?n? au st?tut sufletul nostru. >români ?i pân? ast?zi
Miron Costin, Grigore Ureche and Dimitrie Cantemir referred to their own language as româneasca, or if they made the distinction, said it was identical to Romanian. They saw themselves AND the Romanians in Transylvania (!) as Romanians ethnically, referring to them as Romanians too.
Example from G. Ureche:
>În ?ara Ardealului nu l?cuiescu numai unguri, ce ?i sasi peste sam? de mul?i ?i români peste tot locul, de mai multu-i ?ara l??it? de români decâtu de unguri. Iar? în ?ara Ungureasc? de jos, unde s? chiiam? Unguriia cea Mare (sau cumu-i zicu unii pre limba nem?asc? Panoniia), acolo numai unguri tr?iescu, iar? de s? afl? ?i români pre alocurea, înc? lége ungureasc? ?in.
>>27080454 External politics in medieval times shaped our identities more or less. Most moldovan words come from polish, ukrainian and russian, and romanian from turkish, bulgarian and greek, you see. Doesn't mean one region is less suited for existence than the other, that is completely subjective.
>>27080493 Just to be clear, nobody ever wanted a union. Nobody even from 1859, absolutely nobody from the core population was asked if they want to join Wallachia or not, and the same happened in 1918. Whatever union happened, it happened in very dangerous external circumstances. Other than that, nobody in their right mind would have concieved such an idea that they should join together.
It's the same with Austria. When they were an empire they didn't need a union because they were stronger, and after WW II they wouldn't have made it all alone, hence cry for union.
The Moldovan Cyrillic alphabet was introduced in the early 1920s, in the Soviet bid to standardise the orthography of Moldovan/Romanian in the Moldavian ASSR, at the same time furthering political objectives by marking a clear distinction from the "bourgeois" Latin-based Romanian orthography introduced in Romania in the 1860s. As was the case with other Cyrillic-based languages in the Soviet Union, such as Russian, Ukrainian or Belarusian, obsolete and redundant characters were dropped in an effort to simplify orthography and boost literacy, making it also different from the Romanian Cyrillic alphabet used from the Middle Ages until the second half of the 19th century in the Principalities of Vallachia and Moldavia. Abandoned for a Latin-based alphabet during the Union-wide Latinisation campaign in 1932, it was reinstated as official in 1938, albeit using an orthography more similar to standard Romanian. Following the Soviet occupation of Bessarabia and Northern Bukovina, it was established as the official alphabet of the Moldavian SSR until 1989, when a law returned to the standard Latin-based Romanian alphabet.
There were several requests to switch back to the Latin alphabet, which was seen "more suitable for the Romance core of the language," in the Moldovan MSSR. In 1965, the demands of the 3rd Congress of Writers of Soviet Moldavia were rejected by the leadership of the Communist Party, the replacement being deemed "contrary to the interests of the Moldavian people and not reflecting its aspirations and hopes".
The Moldovan Cyrillic alphabet is still the official and the only accepted alphabet in Transnistria for this language.
The same guy that wrote that the king should only be ellected by local nobility, and that kingship shouldn't be hereditary, partly because he was nobility too? He then proceeded to give excuses, of how that's the most democratic way and so forth. In other words he was very biased in his works, he maybe took some anecdotal cases of people calling themselves that, and quickly made a generalisation as mentioned in the book. You can't just cherrypick what suits you, it doesn't work like that.
>>27081112 > He then proceeded to give excuses, of how that's the most democratic way and so forth. In other words he was very biased in his works, he maybe took some anecdotal cases of people calling themselves that, and quickly made a generalisation as mentioned in the book
Yeah sure thing buddy, and then Miron Costin and Cantemir did the same... Ba da daca esti asa Moldovean, ia sa-mi raspunzi ceva pe limba ta "moldoveneasca"? Ca sa vedem cat de mult se difera de a mea. Hai coaie, ia se te vedem, Sasha.
>>27080786 And why do you assume it's always evil russia behind everything? Average people have all the right to express their opinions when their country will be soon obliterated out of existence just because a minority wanted.
I bet you wouldn't like it if some politician from Portugal would try pushing for uniting with Brazil, would you? You would speak up against such an act, like anyone would.
>>27081112 There are less then 156,400 (0.11%) Moldovans in Russia since the last census. I assure you most people (like us) work in the west. there are 320.000 People with Double Romanian-Moldovan censorship working in Romania, the rest are all in the west. I know Moldovans from Italy, Spain and EVEN a Moldovan here from England.
Be realistic mate.
>>27081112 >The same guy that wrote that the king should only be ellected by local nobility, and that kingship shouldn't be hereditary, partly because he was nobility too? He then proceeded to give excuses Do you think "national" propaganda was in play in the late medieval age mate? And how would admiring Moldovans call them self's "Rumani" would benefit him in any way shape or form.
>>27081290 >Kozmov He is either from a mixed family or not Moldovan. Ask him.
>>27081309 Uite o sursa mai neutra un calator prin tari:
...dup? o c?l?torie prin ?ara Româneasc?, Moldova ?i Transilvania, Ferrante Capecci relateaz? prin 1575 c? locuitorii acestor provincii se numesc pe ei în?i?i „romanesci” : „Anzi essi si chiamano romanesci, e vogliono molti che erano mandati quì quei che erano dannati a cavar metalli...”
>>27080964 >nobody in their right mind would have concieved such an idea that they should join together >nobody in their right mind understands the concept, or worse, aceepts the concept, of a nation-state As I said, there are idiots everywhere.
>Austria is the same The HRE was the beginning of the German nation state. Sure, german states were stubborn as modolvans are, but smarter in that they understood the concept of nation states when it got stronger. The fall of the Austro-Hungarian empire just allowed for better integration in a German nation because they no loger had to bring millions of Hungarians, non Germans, with them. Not because they were "weaker" or "crying".
Bavarians and others joined firstly and easier with Prussia because they had no union with any other non German state to impede them.
>>27081118 That idea of the romanian nation-state was entirely based on moldovan propaganda in the west at the time, m8t. There was no refferendum of sorts, it all happened without the will of the people.
>>27081205 lol Cantemir was a greek for god's sake.
>>27081597 Dimitrie Cantemir s-a n?scut la 26 octombrie 1673 într-o familie nobil?, în localitatea Sili?teni din comuna F?lciu, azi în comuna Dimitrie Cantemir din jude?ul Vaslui, în partea de sud a ora?ului Hu?i.[necesit? citare] A fost fiul lui Constantin ?i al Anei, n?scut? Banta?. La 14 ani a fost nevoit s? plece la Constantinopol (1688-1690), unde a stat 12 ani, ca z?log al tat?lui s?u pe lâng? Înalta Poart?, înlocuindu-l pe Antioh, devenit ulterior domn al Moldovei.
Brother, even the Cantacuzino family was Greek and the Bassarab family has a Cuman name...do you really expect Noble families to be form the same fucking country?! Half of Europe was ruled by ethnically different houses.
>>27081597 >That idea of the romanian nation-state was entirely based on moldovan propaganda in the west at the time, m8t. There was no refferendum of sorts, it all happened without the will of the people.
... wtf am I reading.
Yeah and the 1918 assembly at Alba Iulia also happened without the will of the people. Funny that, how three different principalities wanted union (or else Moldova would have left by now), only the Russian-owned 1/2 of Moldova doesn't, according to you.
>lol Cantemir was a greek for god's sake.
.... do you even know who he was? Jesus fucking Christ. Read his works. He was Moldovan and his name does not have Greek origins either (rather it's apparently derived from "Khan Temir").
I can't speak for Moldovans but in his particular case, it's because he's Russian. And no, I'm not just name-calling, he has thus far failed to write anything in Moldovan/Romanian, or respond to evidence written in that language. Which means he'd much rather prefer a union with Russia.
It is a mystery to me as well. From the Romanian side I've heard they don't want to be dragged down economically and have more poor people in their country. According to them if that would happen not only would Romania be the turd of Europe, but the turd witih a tip ("c?cat cu mo?", Romanian expression).
Oh, and I also forgot: the exertion of Russian pressure preventing it every time it's close to happening. IIRC Putin made some economic warning to Moldovans if they sought closer economic ties with Romania.
>>27081555 So all of the population were idiots? just because of your subjective opinions? i don't understand...
>>27081596 So what exactly is there any relevance to what i said earlier?
>>27081718 His father was greek and most of his childhood was spent in constantinopol. After selling the country to the russians, Cantemir would be the last man on earth i'd ask about what moldovans considered themselves at the time
>>27081745 What school of propaganda? Russia being a scapegoat for everything is not a valid argument, no matter what school you went to
Oh, now after Russia annexed Crimea they're very open to unification http://moldpress.info/2014/07/08/moldovenii-sunt-deschisi-la-unire/ Title 2: The Moldavians are open to unification. I hope it will never happen, though
>Un rol important l-a jucat propaganda unionist?, întreprins? de c?tre liderii partidei na?ionale, în cele dou? ??ri ?i în str?in?tate. Activitatea desf??urat? în emigra?ie, îndeosebi în Fran?a
>>27081788 1918 happened on the backgroud of anarchist russian soldiers pillaging and raping everything they saw in their eyes after deserting the frontlines. We even asked for romanian regiments to help us fight them.
Do you even history m8t?
>>27081924 Why are you appealing to unionism in a time when will of people exists?
"Mama sa – Ana Banta?, era descendenta unei familii de boierna?i, la origine negustori din L?pu?na. De?i analfabet, ?tiind numai s? se isc?leasc?, Constantin Cantemir a dat o educa?ie aleas? copiilor s?i Antioh ?i Dimitrie. El a invitat în familie dasc?li dintre cei mai instrui?i din ?ar? ?i din str?in?tate, "
As I said mate..he was Nobility what did you expect and he was at least half Romanian by birth As much as Vlad the Impaler and Mihai Viteazul. You are completely ignoring anything ANYONE of us wrote :(
>>27082596 >Cantemir >Moldovan He was more Moldovan then you will ever be. There is no such thing as perfect ethnic purity around this parts and you should know. Hell I am 25% saxon.
>>27082596 >Un rol important l-a jucat propaganda unionist?, întreprins? de c?tre liderii partidei na?ionale, în cele dou? ??ri ?i în str?in?tate. Activitatea desf??urat? în emigra?ie, îndeosebi în Fran?a
German principalities had wars against each other and against Unification, even Garibaldi had to take Rome by force because of the Aristocratic (in the power sence) interests. Russia was unified by blood and so was Medieval Poland.
We all had our struggles. But we still had Hora Unirii https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEUfTba6ZE8
I think it's just sour grapes at this point, I don't even know what angle this guy is coming from anymore. What is he trying to prove, that "Moldovans" are somehow superior or better or even different than "Romanians"? Then what about the Moldovans in the Romanian half of Moldova?
>>27082679 Nobody really sees you as true moldovans here either. You're too busy sucking wallachian cock nowadays, trying to compensate for lack of self-esteem.
>>27082696 >Show me anything to prove that he's Greek
http://enciclopediaromaniei.ro/wiki/Antioh_Cantemir His family:
>În familia vorbeau limba greac?, limba mamei, Casandra
>>27082823 It still does not change the fact that there is no will of the people, or whatever arbitrary reasons for people to be united because of x reasons. Unions happen during external threats or by blood and sword, and that's it.
>>27082988 Yes there is and there was. Even when the Moldovans deflected to Michel the Brave and even during the Unification process. But "Traranii" had always been simple people with simple needs. You are incredibly biased against the smart people witch thought about our communal origin and about what we are as a whole: Romanians.
>>27082988 >trying to compensate for lack of self-esteem.
Look who's talking.
P.S. Look what great Wallachian cocksuckers your country has produced:
What about Transylvanians, Oltenians and Banatians? Are they cocksuckers too? Or Maramuresani, how come they aren't as butthurt as you? If there's one place with a distinct culture in Romania it would be that one, why don't they spout the shit you do?
>>27082988 >You're too busy sucking wallachian cock
Lol, look at this guy raging so much, talking about sucking cock, when you guys have the russian hui deep in your asses. Last time I checked all of you speak Russian, all of you speak Romanian with Russian accent and loanwords. Top lel m8
This, really if they are all like this they can rot in hell for all I care. It's not even worth the effort getting and a useless land, the only reason I had sympathy towards them was from some feeling of Romanian fraternal unity, but if they're this russified...
>>27083140 Moldova was conquered by Michael the Brave, the whole unification process was due to mass chaotic armies, like i said, external threats.
I'm not biased. The thing is, there's not so much objective proof that we're the same people, and i'm not reffering to east moldova and the rest of Romania, but the nation whole. The same arguments could be used by Russians, because we were under Russian rule for some 200 years, or that some slavic tribes lived on the territories of Romania.
When they'll be proof that we've been a single people since the beggining, maybe then i'll consider a union feasable.
>>27083158 They arn't butthurt because you arn't in the country to see and interact with them. All of them will get laughed at because of their variant, they just don't see a point to complain.
Great patriot nationalist i see, working abroad. Why arn't you in the country, fierceful romanian warrior?
>>27083172 Kind of hard when there are multiple points to adress at the same time.
>>27083895 >Trust me, you don't want to go there m8t Are you ashamed of our raped and ignorant you are? or how you lack any statistics. Or do you want to just ignore the post's like my last ones?
>>27083895 >Said the moldovan speaking in a variant dictated by wallachians Considering a great majority of our intellectuals came from Moldova like Eminiescu I think you are just peaking out of your ass. Moldova was a the from of the Romanian intelligentsia.
>>27084055 >Are you ashamed of our raped and ignorant you are?
>Considering a great majority of our intellectuals came from Moldova like Eminiescu I think you are just peaking out of your ass. Moldova was a the from of the Romanian intelligentsia.
I know this very well, how does that go against my previous post?
>>27084200 Well just because we have "same" things doesn't mean we have to unite. You don't see americans uniting with UK, and i can provide a million other examples. Union for the sake of historical assburger doesn't do good for people and their quality of life.
>>27084232 I think i posted on KC once, i don't like that place.
>>27084256 I see, do you understand that uniting people based on genetics is a horrible idea? It's the most terrible basis for any union to happen. Nobody will take it seriously.
>>27084411 >Well just because we have "same" things doesn't mean we have to unite.
So now you're backpedaling?
>there's not so much objective proof that we're the same people
Now you're saying:
>Well just because we have "same" things doesn't mean we have to unite.
So you acknowledge that they are the same people?
>Union for the sake of historical assburger doesn't do good for people and their quality of life.
But you just said it would hinder us economically, the corollary of which is that it would benefit you economically. The only one whose quality of life would not be better would be you, Sasha, for being forced to learn Romanian.
>>27080760 >And we speak a variant of the DacoRoman dialect, called moldovan
Just to clarify on what my compatriot stated. The academic language is still standard Romanian, but the informal slang is closest to the one from Eastern Romania, the other half of Moldova. However a lot of people mix it with slavic words as well, especially in Transnistria.
>>27084411 >I see, do you understand that uniting people based on genetics is a horrible idea? It's the most terrible basis for any union to happen. Nobody will take it seriously. Retard you are the ones who asked about unifying factors and you are the one who said not to go there with no mention.
I understand you are a biased prick but at least you should follow the logical chain of the conversation.
Also I did not see ONE word in Romanian this whole time? do you even speak the native language of Moldova rusky?
>>27084573 >Your compatriot I need to test you with something: Where did came from (nation)
I missed this post, but what I meant was that there was an influx of neologisms from French and other sources in the 19th century in Romanian. From what I read in Moldova that wasn't the case initially, but the language was updated later.
Whenver someone disagrees with them, or when they want to hold the upper hand in the conversation, they just shout "Russian occupant! Russian occupant! your opinions are not valid! lalala i can't hear you fuck off back to Russia!! alala!"
>>27084817 >we have a number of SAME words in our vocabularies
As a result of recent russification efforts, not common origins.
>We have been in the SAME borders for a long time
Tcha, great argument. "I took it and held it for a while! It mine now!" This says nothing about two people being the same.
>we have a number of SAME traditions
... such as?
Moldovan music, folk costumes and dances look nothing like the Russian ones, Moldovan history has nothing to do with Russia. What the fuck are you saying? You'd have to be a retard to claim there's more closeness between Moldova and Russia than Moldova and Romania. Not to mention the language.
>just because you just happen to have something in common, even if that thing is common to both of you was not too long ago, it isn't an argument for a union.
Yet when you take those things into an ensemble, and consider also economically and politically favourable conditions, they are.
>>27083589 >and not socially feasible for us. indeed it is not; whilst I obviously agree that a good portion of Moldovans are ethnic Romanians, but there isn't any point in reunification. Romania has got a significant amount of Gypsies and this will definitely cause social upheavals. I remember this year's case when 3 Arab students were expelled from Moldova for fighting in a mall. Imagine if we had Gypsies at every corner. Other people will go apeshit about this situation, no matter the advantages that might be brought by the unification. Two separate countries is the way to go for the foreseeable future at least.
>>27084833 Servus, de se intampla pe aci? Nui bai, ca explic eu:
>I highly doubt the quality of life will jump over night, when the other region of moldova itself is poorer as we are
Asta e fals. Pur si simplu fals. Moldova ruseasca este un e excrement economic si geografic si nu as vrea sa o vad unita cu Romania. Ei au fost , dar nu mai sunt ca noi; si aste este bine avand in vedere ca suntem de 5 ori mai bogati ca ei. Cea mai buna tactica este sa oferim pasapoarte si cetatetie celor ce vor sa vina aicea (adica majoritatea tinerilor) si sa lasam dependentii si batranii acolo. Situatia se va normaliza imediat ce o sa aiba criza demografica si nu o sa mai alba alternativa jugul rusesc.
Nu inteleg de ce va agitati asa, stati calm am castigat.
Eu unul Moldovene iti urez be ai venit un factiunea Vestului si supunere placuta. Cat de curand o sa doresti sa fi roman dar sper ,ca pana atunci, sa intelegem de ce nu ar trebui sa fi. Voi sunteti ceva mai jegos ca "Sudistii" si pe ei am invatat cu greu sa ii tolerez.
>>27085199 >As a result of recent russification efforts
The exact same could be said about Wallachia's efforts to standartise the language after 1859.
>... such as?
Colindele come to mind, also maslenita, we call it differently over here but it's basicly the same practice.
>You'd have to be a retard to claim there's more closeness between Moldova and Russia than Moldova and Romania
I am not claiming anything, i said this would have been the case if i wanted to argue on the side of Russian annexation. Alot more countries have same things in common, for example between Romania and Bulgaria..does this make a good argument for the countries to unite? No, that would sound silly
And i honestly don't think a union would be a good economical choice for Romania
>>27085260 >Look! i said he's wrong! therefor he really is and not just because i say so!
Yup. Like i said earlier in the thread, Austria is separate from Germany, and yet it has lower unemployment, and they generally are doing pretty good without a union.
>>27085351 >Show me a statistic that shows Chisinau is better than Iasi. Chisinau is twice the size of Iasi, it automaticly means we're richer. More people=more money This is what basic logic dictates. Also i've been to Iasi, it's not that different from Chisinau as far as architecture and landscape goes.
>Your cities are worse than Botosani
Source? do you have something to back up this claim?
>>27085451 He didn't believe that the region was poorer as we are, i have provided a source.
>>27085244 You are a highly depended and futures state: >Remittances from Moldovans abroad account for almost 38% of Moldova's GDP, the second-highest percentage in the world.
38% of Moldova's GDP, the second-highest percentage in the world.
>The Information and Security Service of the Republic of Moldova has estimated that 1,200,000 to two million Moldovan citizens (almost 45% of a population of some 3.6 million) are working abroad, most illegally.
>>27084774 >.. which end in "escu"... then I'm wrong apparently. But go to statistica.md and check the excel version from the last "recensamint". The top ones were: Moraru, Morari, Melnic, Cojocari, Turcan, Lupu, Ivanov, Postolache..
>>27085808 Nu dar sunt dependenti de noi si puterea de informatie si propaganda a Rusiei a luat sfarsit o data cu agresiunea lor in Ukraina. Asta e doar un mascarici si nu as vrea riscul sa am in tara multi omeni ca el (acestia devening agenti separatisti instant).
Credema asemenea esecuri nu au ce cauta la noi. mai ales cu frica aberanta de tigani neintelegand ca ei sunt atrasi de prosperitate si in nici un caz de Moldova peste Prut.
>>27085654 >The exact same could be said about Wallachia's efforts to standartise the language after 1859.
That's not the case since the Wallachian and Moldavian variants of Romanian weren't that different to begin with. Provide evidence that they were. The same changes were applied to both.
Dimitrie Cantemir wrote in Descriptio Moldaviae (1714) that the languages are the same. Even the Transylvanian one.
>Muntenii ?i Ardelenii, au tot o limb? cu Moldovenii, numai cât le este vorba pu?in mai groas?, precum giur, Românul jur, Dumnezeu, Dumnez?u, acum, acuma, acela, ah?la ?i mai au ei ?i alte cuvinte care nici sunt cunoscute Moldovenilor, iar? la scrisoare nu le obi?nuesc ci urmeaz? întocmai dup? ortografia graiului Moldovenesc ?i cu aceia cunosc ei într'adev?r, c? vorba Moldoveneasc? este mai curat? decât a lor, m?car de ?i nu o m?rturisesc fiind opri?i de antipatiea ce este între Moldoveni ?i între Munteni.
What is wrong with you? What is your problem, exactly?
>>27086188 Except nobody thinks that other than romanians projecting this idea on us, so they can have a reason to call people who disagree with them "russian occupant" and act as if they won the argument
>>27086250 >Except nobody thinks that other than romanians projecting this idea on us, so they can have a reason to call people who disagree with them "russian occupant" and act as if they won the argument
But Moldovans clearly realize we are the same otherwise you wouldn't have people like Nicolae Botgros making music in Romania and your official language, state colors, everything being Romanian. And you are a Russian occupant (your words, you brought them up on your own), or else you'd speak some Romanian with us, which you can't. You're a countryless slavic gypsy with no identity, not wanted in Moldova among the Latin-speakers, and who can never be part of Romania. Go back to Russia.
I didn't see it initially. Considering that everything written in Moldavian style is completely intelligible to me, and that Russian is a completely different language, I think we can agree on which has a bigger influence if it were to affect the local dialect.
Language standardizations happened everywhere in Europe, e.g. Germany and Italy. They picked one variant and stuck with it. Injecting elements from a completely foreign language (Russian) is something different.
>>27086400 >I guess accusing people of being russian don't work for them anymore It seams reason doesn't do the trick either. Its kinda hard to win debates when people deliberately ignore facts and posts.
>Muntenii ?i Ardelenii, au tot o limb? cu Moldovenii
>Valachiae et Transylvaniae incolis eadem est cum Moldavis lingua, pronunciatio tamen rudior, ut dziur, Vlachus proferet zur, jur, per z polonicum sive jgallicum; Dumnedzeu, Deus, val. Dumnezeu: akmu, nunc, val. akuma, aczela hic, val: ahela.
>>27086594 "Dar când o compari cu Republica Moldova ai impresia c? România este un stat super-bogat, iar Moldova este din Africa. În România sunt drumuri mult mai bune, investi?ii. Aici se fabric? ma?ini, utilaje de tot felul, agricultura este în cre?tere masiv?. Nu mai pomesc faptul c? în România politicienii au început s? prind? fric? de justi?ie. În România, un fost premier a stat la închisoare, pe când în Moldova, un actual deputat, de?i este condamnat de o instan?? româneasc?, se plimb? liber pe str?zile Chi?in?ului. Iar, c? s? le închid definitiv gura tuturor celor care habar nu au despre ce vorbesc când încearc? s? compare Moldova cu România, v? dau doar o singur? cifr?." >PIB-ul Moldovei a fost în 2012, 24 miliarde RONI, pe când PIB-ul jude?ului Cluj a fost de, ATEN?IE, 26 miliarde lei. A?adar, dac? Moldova s-ar uni cu România, România ar mai avea un jude?, unul s?rac, vai de steaua lui!
hahahhahahah un judet mai sarac decat Cluj, si cluju singur va bate....
These are always my favorite threads on /int/, when posters from countries that have poor relations with neighbors get into shouting matches with each other. I genuinely learn a lot.
Oh, and to make this relevant, can some knowledgeable person explain to me in simple terms how the dissolution of the soviet union led to the independence of Moldova and Romania and how their relationship became so contentious?
>>27087509 >and how their relationship became so contentious?
The relationship is good, but some people from Romania just don't understand that apart from our minorities, there are also enough Romanians in Moldova who don't want the country to unite with Romania. Honestly, Romania is a great country, but who would like to unify with a nation which is stereotyped as Gypsies ? Definitely not Moldovans who are poor, but at least are able to retain their dignity. Solve your problems and give us time to look at our issues. Maybe when the situation becomes clearer on both fronts then it would make sense to think about a joint state.
>>27090372 >but who would like to unify with a nation which is stereotyped as Gypsies
This nigga trolling yo
Moldovans/Romanians would never stereotype Romanians as gypsies because they know what Romanians are and they are themselves Romanian. Fuck off Russian scum.
Also great reason... Some fictitious stereotype, as opposed to common origins and national and historic ties, economic benefits, righting the wrongs of the past (the abduction of Basarabia by the Russians), etc.
>>27090613 >Moldovans/Romanians would never stereotype Romanians as gypsies because they know what Romanians are and they are themselves Romanian
That's not the message that I conveyed. What was meant is that Moldovans don't want to be viewed as such by foreigners only because the country of Romania fucked up and let Gypsies spread as zergs. Fuck off, kid.
>>27087509 The relationship between our two countries isn't in the least ''contentious'' don't let this thread fool you. There are universities here in Romania which have 1-2 spots per degree type reserved for Moldavians and payed by the state. That should be saying something about our international relations.
>>27090372 > Definitely not Moldovans who are poor, but at least are able to retain their dignity You are nothing to nobody, and I have no idea what Moldovan dignity is. Also you should worry more about how people see you then how they see us.
> Maybe when the situation becomes clearer on both fronts then it would make sense to think about a joint state. Why should we unite with a poverty stricken-shithole who is willing to whore it self-out when "things are better". Go with Russia their media dominates you and so their mentality.
>>27090677 >Wasn't there just now this incident of that Belorussian girl abducted by Moldovan gypsies...
She was sold to Gypsies by a Belarus family. Those Gypsies simply accepted her and they raised her without any complaints from her. We have probably the smallest amount of Gypsies in Europe and even those are well educated and don't defame our country.
>>27090704 European Comission and The Association of Roma in Europe estimate a minimum of 10% of Gypsies in the Romanian total population. I think you are the one who should not take your state-released demographics statistics seriously.
>>27090677 >implying Moldovans have any different stereotype We do, we are stereotyped as very cheap, but hard-working construction workers. I don't hope for you to know this, as I'm certain that an average Romanian considers Moldovans inferior to them.
>>27091193 >t?? sar cu curu-n sus c?-s a?ela? popor da sînguri nu stiu ?ini-o fost dacii. Nu mai abera tarane tu ai ignorant tot ce am postat noi. Stiu cine suntem, si nu te mai chinuii de zor sa scri "Moldoveneste". Nici Grigore Ureche nu scria ca tine hehe.
My Romanian coworker told me that literally the only difference between Romanians and Moldovans is that Moldovans are poorer, but that the Romanians living in the area near Moldova are just as poor too.
you know what happens in the census, bitch; it's your country afterall and you should inform yourself and not me. They basically interrogated people and if one was obviously a Gypsy but declared himself as Romanian, Hungarian, etc. then the evaluator would be obliged to note that person's statement. It wasn't a objective statistics.
>>27091417 It was part of Romania until Stalin took it and made it Soviet land during WW2. Their language is to Romanian what Serbian and Croatian are to each other or what Ebonics is to English, i.e. Bullshit.
>>27091739 >Gypsies were mentioned in moldova by Ureche and Cantemir too, now you magically think you're eastern European only gypsy free zone? Kek
We have them as well, but they are like 1% of the country at most. We are talking millions in Romania and this is also the country were the majority of Romanians/Hungarians are getting older and the young ones have a fertility of 1.53 children per woman as opposed to 3-4 children among Gypsies. Face the reality
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