[Boards: 3 / a / aco / adv / an / asp / b / biz / c / cgl / ck / cm / co / d / diy / e / fa / fit / g / gd / gif / h / hc / his / hm / hr / i / ic / int / jp / k / lgbt / lit / m / mlp / mu / n / news / o / out / p / po / pol / qa / qst / r / r9k / s / s4s / sci / soc / sp / t / tg / toy / trash / trv / tv / u / v / vg / vip /vp / vr / w / wg / wsg / wsr / x / y ] [Search | Home]
4Archive logo
Weekly Form Thread #1
If images are not shown try to refresh the page. If you like this website, please disable any AdBlock software!

You are currently reading a thread in /ic/ - Artwork/Critique

Thread replies: 53
Thread images: 21
File: FormThread1.png (54 KB, 291x321) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
54 KB, 291x321
Weekly thread it is.


So what's form?

Form is essentially how light interacts with an object in space to create the illusion of structure and shape, this then occupies that space with a 3 Dimensional object. This object can be anything from a cube to a complex warhammer character. The principle is still exactly the same, cubes, spheres etc make up the entirety of the complexity in the warhammer character.

An artist will typically light the character using a single directional light, this technique is good as it is easy to replicate the form. However, in art there is a sense of composition in everything, even lighting. So having a contrasting bounce light on the side of the character can create more interest for the viewer.

Task at hand: There are four basic primitive structures of form:


Now your task is to recreate a CYLINDER, CUBE, SPHERE and a CONE from pic related.

Useful Resources:

What is this thread about?
This thread is for beginner and intermediate to professional artists alike, any anon on the board is encouraged to do the activities and is encouraged to learn from one another.

What is Form?
My interpretation of FORM is the interaction between light and an object so as to build shape and structure on that object. Light interacts with objects in many ways, an artists goal is to try and replicate how realities principles of lighting effect their drawn objects.

So what will we be doing?
We're going to have weekly tasks that build on your understanding of form, we will try to provide theory (when I say we, I'm referring to all the anons here that understand form) and practical knowledge that will equip you with the means to start practicing.

by joining these forms together you are able to eventually create a warhammer character like I mentioned before, its really just as simple as that. Of course you can add texture, ambient lighting, occlusion shadows etc if you want to get technical, but you can make a pretty solid piece just following the basics.

Now your task is to recreate a CYLINDER, CUBE, SPHERE and a CONE from pic related.

Pay attention to the elements that make up the form of the object such as:

Form: Notice the movement of values from light to dark and especially mid-tones, keep it simple, you only need 2 values to begin with, and in the end you should have not used more than 4 values all together,

Core shadows: Shadows that have the closest edge contrast and value contrast, so where dark grey meets light grey in the middle of a cylinder.

Bounce/reflective light: Light will jettison out from the direction you desire, that light will hit the object, there will be light that will completely miss the objects as well and may hit reflective surfaces, this light then will cause a glaring shine on an objects opposite edge.

Highlight: This generally is where the direction of light is exactly perpendicular to the object and is also where the light is the most intense. Which is why a sphere for example will typically have a dot of white to pure white value on its light side.

Cast shadow: The shadow cast by the object on the plane/surface it is seated on.

you can find your own pictures of the primitive shapes, I chose pic related as it is a good indication of form and directional rendering.
>recreate a CYLINDER, CUBE, SPHERE and a CONE from pic related.

I think separating the draw thread even more is the worst decision that has ever come to /ic/ since the appearance of stylization thread. Nevertheless the only way to win against you tyrants is to come into a thread and conquer everybody, only to unite again. I will do my best to do so.


going to come back to this, have to get some college work done first. Hopefully there will be people posting some stuff here!
File: Form1.jpg (57 KB, 500x604) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
57 KB, 500x604

so the task is to recreate the pic in the op? i'm a little confused

yeah, me too. I dunno what I"m supposed to do, like, just draw primitives...? or copy the OP?

recreate the 4 primitive shapes, fully rendered, making use of core shadow, bouncelight, cast shadow, and values to create form.

You can use any image you like to out the sphere, google it or use the image I gave, as it is simple and shows direction in which the light is traveling.
This is a neat exercise. I'll attempt later tonight or tomorrow. Catching up on other studies in the mean time.
What's the best way to practice shapes in proper perspective?
I can't even imagine a cone being 3d in my mind let alone draw it
File: shapes-01.jpg (208 KB, 532x753) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
208 KB, 532x753
Did some cylinders. I've knew how to practice shapes, so I just never did them.
File: sphere.jpg (78 KB, 758x542) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
78 KB, 758x542


Good stuff. Do not be afraid of rendering. Even with a pencil, also hold your pencil like you'd hold your rubber, and use the edge of the pencil to get beautiful, long gradations, ALOT of major lighting issues you're having can literally be solved in a single swipe of your pencil, I'm not even shitting you.

Observe how Jeff Watts makes use of his pencil hold, I've begun using this method to and it works well and im self-taught in regards to the method :



Perspective looks good, I see you're dabling into foreshortening too which is great as well. Although, best you leave those kinds of things out of doing shapes as you want rendering to be as easy as possible. I know you haven't taken the leap but it would be good if you took pencil to paper and started getting some gradations going.


Good work dude, I also see that you're making use of edges, which is also quite important.

As far as the render goes, it is quite solid. Be sure to add highlights and have a white tone on the left side. There is also some smudged work, I assume this is because you've tried to correct a gradient by painting over it, remember with the help of gradients you can actually get the entire thing rendered.

As far as the core shadow goes, you've done a solid job, although following the core shadow from bottom upwards is fine but as soon as we get to the top there is this circular blended area, and the top side has a lighter value rim. You typically don't see this on a sphere, so I would try to remove that by using a soft round brush.

Also in regards to the bounce-light, remember everything acts like a gradation, so the bounce light will actually scatter in all directs, its the intensity you have to worry about. Do form studies of objects in good lighting, ones that do have extreme values. As the concept of highlights has not been touched in this study and it is a good idea to try and understand that.
I'm actually sick and tired of it not picking up the file I add lol.
File: Form2.jpg (58 KB, 800x566) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
58 KB, 800x566

wow ok I'm so done fuck you 4chan.
File: Form2process.gif (199 KB, 315x349) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
199 KB, 315x349

Here is a break down step by step of the process used. Sorry about the weird cropping that is in the gif hopefully the general process is still clear, let me know if it isn't clear and i'll try to explain.

>Perspective looks good, I see you're dabling into foreshortening too which is great as well. Although, best you leave those kinds of things out of doing shapes as you want rendering to be as easy as possible. I know you haven't taken the leap but it would be good if you took pencil to paper and started getting some gradations going.

thanks for the feedback.
Alright then, I'll go ahead and start shading it in. I'll try to make the image first posted here once I get the chance.
this thread is gay.
op should fuck off
Opinions on pencil smuging?

What are the alternatives for pencil drawing besides smudging and hatching?
Is it worth investing in a smudger?
File: Form3.jpg (228 KB, 900x838) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
228 KB, 900x838
Took a break from rendering primitives, did a Haddon Sundblom study (master of form, you should check him out)

Brill, good luck, and remember doesn't matter if you do bad or good, what matters is what you learn from it. The first time you draw and eye is going to be bad, but the 1000th time the eye will be very well drawn. Same principle. Then, you can create complexity using form as a means.


Of course there are multiple different ways to render/draw/paint and what not. The method I've found most useful and the method that I think promotes building form the best is the technique Jeff Watts uses. He didn't create the method of course, it goes back to traditional masters hundreds of years ago. You basically hold your pencil like you would your rubber, use your whole arm as a means of movement and draw smooth linear moving gradations. Light essentially is gradients, it hits a surface, scatters and that is what a gradient is, a full Warhammer rendering to a good standard in form-terms is literally hundreds if not thousands of controlled gradients. So building gradients (for me) is key to representing form clearly.

You should never smudge, and cross-hatching should be used minimally when certain elements of the image are present, such as textures clothing, facial scarring, weapons etc..

A very BEGINNER thought process is that you need certain tools to be able to do something, ultimately you'll fit nicely into your own comfort zone, utilizing many tools here and there. However, if you can't render out something simple with just pencil and paper alone then perhaps its time you went back to basics.

Also, smudging is only good when it is controlled in a way so as to solely create lost edges. This concept is hard to grasp and only masters can do it well.

Hope you have a nice day too anon.
not bad! kinda too light, so don't be afraid in trying more values.

dude that's cool, try some shading and experiment more. at first it's pretty hard but im sure you'll get hang of it. perspective looks neat.

bro, i really appreciate you starting the weekly form thread. I'mma start submitting my stuff soon as well :) and start being active in this thread
got a question: who are some artists do you suggest best to study for form?
pardon my grammar typos
establish a vanishing point on your canvas and have all figures respect said point

Hiya, no problem I feel form is an extremely significant element to art so discussing it is worthwhile.

>who are some artists do you suggest best to study for form?

>Haddon Sundblom
>Syd Mead
>John Singer Sargent
>Ruan Jia
>Anders Zorn
>Willem Claeszoon Heda
>JC park
>Jaime jones

another really good example is Ulysse Verhasshelt, you can find him on facebook. His entire work focuses efficiently on form and building imagery on it. Its good because hes not a master of form, he's just very very good at it - His work is mainly in the sketch stages so you can learn a lot from it, he does finished pieces here and there too that you could learn from.

-These are just a few names, out of the thousands of modern/old masters, the list could literally go on forever and ever until I reach the limit lol.

crap missed your comment, sorry

I agree with anon here>>2354791

make sure to experiment with having objects above and below the vanishing point, the perspective view of the object will change. I like to google 'Sci fi landscapes/perspectives' and study some of the images with really good perspective.
How to render with pen and brushpen? I'm a n00b that uses those instead of pencil.
what about line art, is there form without shadows and all?
File: FORM5-2.jpg (105 KB, 1000x324) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
105 KB, 1000x324
I don't really use pen or brush pen, Its a limited medium as you can't play with gradients to build form! I'd say definitely stick to pencil if you can, its just you have to get accustom to it and learn to be disciplined with it through practice.

yep you can show form without actually rendering, by isolating shadow shapes and sketching them down pic related with this technique. Its the general sketch phase, you want to draw these simple things out, a solid early sketch means your later rendering is a lot stronger.
File: most_autistic.gif (80 KB, 700x700) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
80 KB, 700x700
>I'd say definitely stick to pencil if you can

>Its a limited medium as you can't play with gradients to build form!

You can still show tone with cross hatching.

ofc but its not as intuitive is what I'm getting at. With a pen you'll have to spend a lot longer building gradients in comparison to a pencil where you can just use the edge of the pencil to build gradients with ease.
File: DSC_0159.jpg (3 MB, 3840x2160) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
3 MB, 3840x2160
Tried using all of the forms in perspective inside of a room. Also tried using lighting and a box that had different vanishing points, so many comfort zones stretched.
File: shapes-and-stuff.jpg (139 KB, 1248x516) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
139 KB, 1248x516
Here's my attempt via pen and regular pencil.
File: FORM6.jpg (177 KB, 2000x667) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
177 KB, 2000x667

Great work. Keep practicing, play with highlights and bouncelights. Make your shadows darker dont be scared of extreme values. If you fuck it up you can always redo it on another paper. Practice makes perfect.

Good stuff, I see you're trying to put all the elements of 3D together. Your core shadows are present, bounce-light is present. You should make sure to blend in between the light side of the core shadow and the bounce-lit region. Make sure you develop your cast shadows, they are a very difficult thing to learn if you're doing the rendering from imagination as knowing where the shadow lies can be difficult.

Also be more confident with your lines, especially with pen, use your arm as an extension to draw straight lines. Practice good draftsmanship.
Thanks for the insight.

>Also be more confident with your lines, especially with pen, use your arm as an extension to draw straight lines

I'm usually told this a lot; people say I have great line quality, but lack confidence in my line work. I do the Peter Han warm up every morning, and I can get down the lines fairly well. I guess when it comes to studies, I'm nervous about messing them up, or whatever.

I'll try again, but this time give the pencil in shadows a cast shadow.
File: Braqueplate1.jpg (154 KB, 1000x1282) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
154 KB, 1000x1282

every study is a mess up, even professionals mess up. Nothing will ever be 100% perfect. A lot of the elements that you might find tricky are actually really easy and it only takes a few studies here and there for you to have 'aha' moments. When you understand the different metrics of certain things, that's pretty much what art is in my opinion. A lot of things we'd easily understand but symbolism and other unnecessary information is always present acting as a guise. Professionals and masters are just artists that have managed to filter out the unnecessary information and absorb the necessary information.
It is sloppy but i tried merging simple forms.
File: cubecone.png (100 KB, 674x454) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
100 KB, 674x454
fuck, that looks so good.

What program + resolution do you use?
Your edges look kinda jagged but i like that.
Would like to recreate.
File: primitives.jpg (138 KB, 1125x945) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
138 KB, 1125x945
I don;t think i can be assed to do the cone... rendering is such a pain in the ass

photoshop cc
I normaly just go A4, A3 depending on what I like. I always bump my images down to 1k res though when I save. So maybe a compression thing.
File: cylinderspherewall.png (273 KB, 709x567) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
273 KB, 709x567
Yeah, you must have your resampling set to "nearest neighbor".
Pretty much all the other settings will give you smoother edges when resizing.
Is there any website where I can place a cube/sphere and see how it reacts to light from different sides?
File: rtwer.jpg (403 KB, 1280x720) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
403 KB, 1280x720
like this?
File: daknow.jpg (39 KB, 400x479) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
39 KB, 400x479

are you even looking at an actual sphere
nope...u mad lol brb jk
I'm having troubles laying down drop shadows. Please help me. It's to know whether or in what conditions the shadow will be blurry, or short, solid, translucent, dark, warped, etc. Basically shadow is affected by perspective. Is there a way to mechanically determine it? I just got into perspective made easy in that part and it doesn't really explain in depth so...

1. A strong light source results in strong shadows. A weak light source will produce a weak shadow. The less secondary light sources (ambient light) the harsher the shadows. Leaving out ambient light can be a stylistic choice. Think black and white comic book art with deep shadows. Or turning on a spotlight in a pitch black room.

2. Cast shadows become bigger and blurrier the closer the object is to the light source, and smaller and firmer the closer the object is to the surface the shadow is cast on. The edges of a cast shadow are not uniform. If you place a cube on the ground and light it so it produces a cast shadow, the edges will be firmer the closest to the cube and blurrier at the other end.

3. The length of the shadow is determined by the angle the light source hits the object. Think about the sun. Shadows get longer at the start and end of the day. In the middle of the day the sun hits you from above and your shadow is beneath you.
Could somebody please dump lots of forms references (preferably photos-- but 3D renders could work if they are done really well)? I tried googling but it's always the same angles. I remember months ago somebody dumped forms refs with a lot of reflected light but forgot to save them.
Thread replies: 53
Thread images: 21
Thread DB ID: 461177

[Boards: 3 / a / aco / adv / an / asp / b / biz / c / cgl / ck / cm / co / d / diy / e / fa / fit / g / gd / gif / h / hc / his / hm / hr / i / ic / int / jp / k / lgbt / lit / m / mlp / mu / n / news / o / out / p / po / pol / qa / qst / r / r9k / s / s4s / sci / soc / sp / t / tg / toy / trash / trv / tv / u / v / vg / vip /vp / vr / w / wg / wsg / wsr / x / y] [Search | Home]

[Boards: 3 / a / aco / adv / an / asp / b / biz / c / cgl / ck / cm / co / d / diy / e / fa / fit / g / gd / gif / h / hc / his / hm / hr / i / ic / int / jp / k / lgbt / lit / m / mlp / mu / n / news / o / out / p / po / pol / qa / qst / r / r9k / s / s4s / sci / soc / sp / t / tg / toy / trash / trv / tv / u / v / vg / vip /vp / vr / w / wg / wsg / wsr / x / y] [Search | Home]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.
This is a 4chan archive - all of the shown content originated from that site. This means that 4Archive shows their content, archived. If you need information for a Poster - contact them.
If a post contains personal/copyrighted/illegal content, then use the post's [Report] link! If a post is not removed within 24h contact me at [email protected] with the post's information.