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traditional art
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You are currently reading a thread in /ic/ - Artwork/Critique

Thread replies: 35
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hey guys, so i grew up a poor fag but i've had access to computers all my life and when i was 14 i saved up and bought a drawing tablet (a shitty one but still)

ever since i've been doing daily studies and i've gotten very good at painting on photoshop and painttool sai and stuff like that

but i've never had enough money to get into traditional art until now, so i just went out and bought a bunch of brushes and gouache tubes, and a nice heavy expensive moleskin notebook

i have no idea how to use these, i only have some small experience with water colours and i've never had any formal training

what do? how do i learn? my older brother showed me how to mix paint but he's gone to college now and i don't know anyone who could teach me

i've read dozens of books on anatomy and drawing and i have 4+ years experience with painting on photoshop but i have no idea how to apply these skills in a physical medium with real big brushes and canvases

what are some good resources that could teach me these stuff? like a good online video series or some books
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>>1801423
on older brother: he's getting a phd in america through a scholarship, that's why he's older than me but still in uni
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>expensive
You should start by buying cheap shit to start out with.

The process in traditional is a lot different than digital, because you can't just undo and redo and repaint everything whenever and however you want.

IMO Since you haven't done it before, you should just try to get the feel for it first. Don't try to make a master painting or even necessarily a painting yet. Do a similar thing that you would do when sketching, draw random objects/shapes and try to get familiar with how paint blends and works.
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You should practice with colored pencil to get a hand on how to work with graphite pencil, ballpoint pens, dip pens and to understand how color work in most other physical media.
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get a copy of Alla Prima by richard schmid.

Learn how to mix well first; do a colour wheel, colour charts (seriously!), value charts, etc.

then do monochromatic paintings, move on to Zorn palette, and finally a full palette. Gouache will kick your ass but after you learn it, other mediums except watercolours will be easy mode.
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>>1801462
bullshit. zorn is an advanced pallette, not a stepping stone. if you're trying to learn colour you need to be able to more or less emulate the colours you see irl. otherwise you'll be making all kinds of compromises and decisions you're not equipped to make as a noob, and then trying to pass the result of as expressionism because it's so fricking ugly.
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>>1801445
well i lied when i said i had *no* experience since i sketch regularly with graphite and charcoal but honestly they're a whole different thing from paint, or at least that's what it feels like
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>>1801462
thanks for the tip anon, i was dropping by the book store today anyway so ill look for it

it's actually on my phone as a pdf because i downloaded a bunch of art books en masse but ill look into getting a physical version since that's what this is about

this is exciting guys. im finally makin this hapen
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I thought it doesn't matter what medium you use, fundamentals always stay with you.

Am I wrong or do you just need a few days to learn how to handle the tools?
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>>1801503
my problem's with the technique, how to hold a brush, how to mix paints, etc
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>>1802062
invest on one of the how to paint videos on gnomon and you won't regret it.
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>>1801462
>>1801471
The correct answer is start with a dead color palette.

Payne's grey (your "blue")
Burnt sienna (your "red")
Yellow ochre (your " yellow")
Titanium white

This will keep you keep you from going color crazy at first.
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I'm also starting out with traditional. Mechanical and charcoal pencils are my favorite. With the former you need to have some patience but it will teach you to develop some sensitivity too.

Charcoal is awesome to lay down values and render in a very short amount of time but it's messy so you better get a big sketchpad.

Get a kneaded eraser, x-acto knife and a sand paper strip. Also learn to hold the pencil with the tip of your fingers, in away that it's raised at an almost horizontal angle to the paper, this will even the values and help you cover big areas very quickly.

For painting I've found that some pastels can mimic oil painting finish, you can put layer after layer without too many repercussions and it's easier to control than "liquid" painting. Moreover they are dirty cheap.
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>>1802062
Here some basic knowledge, with examples and stuff. Go to the Opaque watercolor painting chapter.
(btw, awesome and overrated book imo)

http://pastebin.com/Td0bWhgZ
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>>1803829
I mean underrated, of course,
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>>1803458
that's actually how I hold normal pens, people keep pointing it out when they see me writing as if its that unusual
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>>1803829
thanks mate i'll check it out

I'm still reading through alla prima, it's really chunky and I'm learning a lot more than I thought I would
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>>1803390
can i get some links? the first site i got when i googled gnomon looked like it was more about 3D art
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Best paints ever.
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>>1801433
I disagree with this. I learned bad habits with my acrylic painting when I first started by buying shitty student grade Liquitex "Basics". I had to do 3, sometime 4 layers over the same fucking area to make the paint opaque. You get what you pay for, and in the case of paint, it's pigment. I could have bought some holbein acryla gouache or Golden professional acrylics and gone over those areas once. One tube of paint would go a lot further. Sure, you save 4 times as much money buying the cheap shit, but you use 4 times as much paint to get the same opacity, and even then, you have worse looking color and you destroy any chance of doing a looser painting where you can make one intentional stroke that matters - you now have to go over that same stroke 3-4 times and ruin the improvised look of that stroke.

OP, I suggest checking out gnomon workshop. Study color theory basics and just start doing basic paintings based off those theories (such as complementary, monochromatic, triadic, analogous, etc.) I also suggest starting with a limited palette, white, black, burnt sienna, ultramarine blue, and yellow ochre. When you feel like you have pushed those colors as far as you can and you can't achieve certain mixes, that's when you add more. I suggest adding a warm and cool of each red, yellow, and blue when you get there. You can mix almost anything from that palette with the exception of certain very saturated neon/unnatural shit.
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I'll teach you everything you need to know about traditional media and color theory /b/rother.

You will have to be patient w/ me though bc my drugs are kicking in.

PS: BFA degree here, 28 years experience
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>>1805648
(cont.)

Another thing to know about color that I wish someone told me - aim for neutrals and only use saturated colors as accents - very limited within a painting. You can neutralize colors by mixing towards their complement, mixing white, black, or grey. (tint, shades, tones). Even by reserving your saturated colors, people will still think your paintings are super colorful and vibrant if you do it well.

In terms of painting methods - start from the back and work your way forward. If you have a figure in the distance, it might be fun to paint the face, but the edges are going to get all fucked up if you paint the face first and background second. It's easier to paint the background, then paint the figure on top of that background. Also, keep your background loose - keep strokes broad, you can't see detail on shit in the distance and it helps give depth to your painting. The viewer's eye will fill in the rest of the information. Also, work with the largest brush you have first, when it starts to feel clunky and inaccurate, switch to the next size smaller. Repeat until you are at the end of the painting and putting in the minute details of the foreground with a small brush.

Generally, always start loose and tighten up as you go.

>>1804157
that's ink, not paint, and ink is generally pretty translucent, though a good medium if you learn how to use them well. I prefer FW over that brand though.
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>>1805653
>that's ink, not paint
Not op, but that is suspended paint.
Dr.Ph Marten's also makes colored ink for cheaper.
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>>1803437
I saw pic related a while back, been meaning to try it(don't have Payne's Grey, need to pick up a tube).

Another fun exercise is to use a palette of Viridian, Cadmium Orange, and Dioxazine Violet rather than the usual red-blue-yellow trio.
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>>1805658
I stand corrected, looks ink as fuck... just realized it says watercolor though, which is a strange way for watercolor to be packaged, already liquified like that. I've been using schmeinke watercolors, expensive as fuck ($100+ on amazon for a basic set) but the colors are fucking pretty and there's a lot of pigment in it, so it goes a really long way.
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>>1805653
a few extra little basic pointers:

Your palette:
Get a butcher tray (from an art store) or some of those disposable palette paper sheets. Fold some paper towels, wet them so they're damp, and lay them at the top of your palette. Put a piece of tracing paper over the paper towels and lay your colors out on that. This will keep your acrylic paint from drying out while you work. The plus side of the butcher tray is you can throw plastic wrap or aluminum foil over top if you need to take a break or go to sleep and it will keep your paint wet for a day or two (if the towels are moist enough).

Have a bucket of water there for cleaning your brushes and some paper towels laid out next to that.

ALWAYS WET YOUR BRUSH BEFORE IT TOUCHES THE PAINT!!!!! (except oils). You will destroy your brand new brushes if you touch a dry brush right to the acrylic paint. If you're done using a brush temporarily, rinse it really hard in your water bucket and lay it flat on the paper towels. Don't toss it in your water bucket bristles down or you fucked your brush up. After your painting session, do a thorough cleaning with soap and water, preferably brush soap.
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>>1805704
why do you use schminke over w&n?
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>>1805752
There's just much more pigment so the colors are richer. W&N is not great - with oil paint too, they're okay if that's what you've got, but I don't go for them first. I tried schminke first based off my teacher's recommendation, and since he's a master watercolorist, I took his word for it and he was insanely right.

His work:

http://jeffreysmithillustrator.com/
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>>1805753
i've never tried schminke but to say w&n isn't great is simply not true
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>>1805753

where you studying/what major bruh
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>>1805770
illustration at Art Center College of Design
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>>1805650
op here, what kind of drugs?

i have skype so we could use that or you could just keep replying here since this thread looks like it'll live forever
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>>1805767
Yeah, especially since w&n has a solid color range and great quality.

If you want a high pigment load and don't want to pay out the ass, try M.Graham's watercolours or those liquid watercolours someone posted before.
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>>1805752
Not that guy, but W&N's caps alone are reason to not use their paints.
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>>1805704

Technically they *are* inks since they're color suspended in liquid. The company's most famous product is their dye-based liquid watercolors, which aren't permanent or lightfast. The Hydrus paints are for people who like working with the dyes but don't want the downsides.

The paints really are spectacular. They are very vibrant and highly concentrated. The liquid medium (and the dropper in the cap) makes it easier to get going quicker and achieve accurate mixes over and over.
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