Why has critique of religion gone so far down the toilet today?

>>680561
>Why has critique of religion gone so far down the toilet today?

Because disbelief is seeping into the masses.

>>680561
Because you are basing your opinions on 4chan and tv.

J. L. Mackie has provided better arguments than all those authors put together.

Why were the proponents of religion in the toilet from the get go?

>>680628
The only other option at the time was shitting streets?

liberalism made it impossible to go at it with any kind of depth in the mainstream

>>680570
This, any philosophy or ideology turns to shit when you let the plebeian masses get a hold of it. Having your philosophical opinions matter should be a privilege of the proven intellectual aristocracy only.

Because the interests of the revolutionary communist movement changed. It was useful to criticize religion in the XVIIIth century when the Church was a influential political institution, but now that religious resistance to communist revolution has been undermined, they now seek other potential power centers to destroy.

>>680637
>liberalism

Not political correctness? They're not synonyms btw.

>>680643
The ones who are truly enlightened by their own intelligence?

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>>680647
You joke, but you are right, many atheists nowaday are attacking non-conformist thinking in the name of political correctness, so they can shift the power of legitimizing of political discourse to the intelligentsia, see the whole "Atheism+" movement.

When people didn't see that atheism was a communist trojan horse after that, the whole "atheists are smart and rational" meme was dead.

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>>680649
Quiet, peasant, keep your fedora memes to yourself.

>>680655
I see the Atheism+ movement, but I don't see them representing most of New Atheism.

>>680561
Because, as elitist and faux-patrician as this might sound, philosophies and arguments go right to shit when the common man gets ahold of them. The sad fact is that most people are emotional retards who can't into reason or logic. So whenever an idea reaches critical mass and gets embraced by large groups of people, the mentality behind it goes to hell.

>>680702
this ++

>>681123
A less violent re-experience of the proliferation of Protestantism perhaps?

>>680561
Because there isn't any new arguments to be made.
Theology is a solved game.

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>>680643
>tfw American founding fathers were right to restrict voting to landowning citizens

>>681123
But some of the greatest minds of Christianity came about long after it reached "critical mass". Christianity didn't really go pleb until the Reformation.

>>680561
>Why has critique of religion gone so far down the toilet today?
Because we want to make sure that religion is flushed out completely. We'll follow it anywhere. Deep down the toilet and out into the sea of shit where it belongs.


I'm a pleb, but even i know that people like the 4 horsemen(3 now that Hitchens is dead). Maajid Nawaz, Prof. Krauss, Ayan Hirsi Ali are all great critics.

>>680646
>They're not synonyms btw
Two years ago I would have agreed with you but these days, they pretty much are

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Why don't fedoras understand allegories?
They always pick some 'violent' verse, and then go on about 'le 3000 year old sand barbarians'.

Also where is all the critique of philosophical religious material?

Not even christfag, but I can't recall a single occurrence where somebody from the contemporary atheism movement made a solid argument against Christianity. Most of them don't even have a proper understanding of the material; they think God is literally supposed to be a man on a cloud.

>>680561
Because you are a biased theist/deeist/whatever who doesn´t really know the contemporary critiques of relgion who matter. Instead you post an edgy fedora meme and ciclejerk with the same 10-12 people that flood his with religion memes. Most people here are atheist/agnostics and behave way more civil than the theeists on this board.

>>681368
Modern (millennial) interpretation of intellectualism is blindly following figures of authority and the position of their teachings instead of independant thought and interpretation.

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>>681331
>they think God is literally supposed to be a man on a cloud.

You do realise that many of the people that wrote the Old Testament literally thought pretty much exactly that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_in_Judaism

>>681249
>the 4 horsemen are all great critics.
>4 horsemen;
>great critics;

They are super populist and simplistic.

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>>681385
Yet another platitude. Slightly ironic to be alleged of this for holding atheist views but fine whatever.

>>681407
>>681408
The point stands. There is legit critique of religion that leads people to hold atheist views. Religious people here offer some vague metaphysic as answer to this critique and expect people who have no intrest in religion whatsoever too deeply entrech themselves in material that has no relevance to them, most of the time if you actually do that it is just some "weed lmao" argument like everything must have a creator or stuff like this. Face it, most atheist people are pretty chill about it ( see the bazillion religious threads here where no preachy atheists interfere) just because dawkins and co. scare and anger you don´t behave like a dick. Not like religious people are waaaaaaaaaay more preachy....

>>681426
>The point stands.

It is not clear to me you are making a coherent point at all, or how whatever point you are trying to make relates to my post about the conceptions of Heaven of people that wrote the Bible.

>>681438
Ah shit sorry i linked the wrong post, apologies for that. Wasn´t adressed at you, your point is valid.

>>680646
These days they are 100%synonymous

>>681456
In ´murica maybe. Don´t assume the rest of the world has gone as mad.

>>681456

What horseshit. Can you honestly say, for example, Bill Maher or Sam Harris are 100% politically correct?

>>681407
>taking the old testament verbatim
You do realize that the Christians have thrown away a lot of the old testament
Christians no longer observe Saturday or sacrifice things

>>681462
>literally all of Europe sensors news about refugees so they aren't racist

>>681480
Liberal parties here are mostly opposed to the refugees. Don´t assume the political spectrum in america fits on the whole world. Liberalism in germany for example mostly allies with more rightwing parties.

>>681472
>You do realize that the Christians have thrown away a lot of the old testament

'Thrown away the Old Testament' seems like a very strange claim and not true.

Am I full aware that most Christians now consider much of the OT metaphorical and don't follow the ancient Jewish laws from the OT?

Yes of course I am aware of that.

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>>680561
It's because religion is irrelevant that it is seen as a joke by neets.
If they try to implement theocracy you will see the professional rethoric ramp up lickedy split.

>>680570
/thread

first post best post

>>681407
Pretty much everybody holds God as transcendental being beyond comprehension, old jew cosmology doesn't change anything about that.

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>>680561
Technology and oversocialization

>>681496
Not him, but they also throw out s lot of the theology, like the whole "trinitinarinism is heresy" that you get in Deuteronomy 6:4

>>681674

You may want to ask yourself why you believe that, when the origins of your belief are based on old Jewish cosmology. Even in the NT Jesus literally flys up in the air to go to Heaven.

Maybe you should have just stopped believing nonsense rather than trying to persuade yourself huge chunks of your own Holy Book are allegorical.

>>681681
But that verse is a fundamental part of Christianity, when Christ said I and my father are one, he was referencing that verse.

Christians are actually much more true to the OT's theology than Jews are.

>>681485
That's because liberalism in America means something completely different than to the rest of the world.

Liberals there are the closest they have to socialists. Since McCarthy killed their leftwingers and their sympathizers, socialists and liberals united against the oligarchs and landowners that were the conservative republicans in the second half of the 20th century.

>>680570
This. Lay philosophy is shit philosophy. Not even because they're stupid or anything, it's just a lot of work to get to the point where you have anything interesting to say about any given field.

Plus the more gets said about something the harder it becomes to offer informed or unique contributions.

>>681988
>>681198

>>681331
>they think God is literally supposed to be a man on a cloud.

Source material isn't totally consistent on whether God is a physical entity in the OT.

>Also where is all the critique of philosophical religious material?
Because the philosophical material isn't really that bad? Especially for when and where it was written. Ecclesiastes is top notch shit.

People who don't like a thing don't single out its strong points for discussion. I'm not sure why you'd expect them to.

>>680561
Because there's nothing literally at all to say. God has already been taken from the cave, he's been investigated fully, and the only people who believe are looking at shadows inside of caves.

>>682000
Reformation is post printing press. Plebs got easier access to the source material long after said source material was compiled.

>>682021
The whole purpose of rampant iconography was so plebs could have access to the material.

>>682027
The church usually had a tense relationship with lay-preachers of any stripe. Their devotional artworks were meant to convey their specific interpretation of things. Not to crowd source new theology.

>>680561
>What happened to the great geniuses like Thomas Paine, Voltaire, and Bertrand Russell?

Because you're comparing people famous for being great geniuses to random faggots on the internet.

>>682166

This.

We live in the era of Facebook etc. It's like comparing some Christian redneck to Aquinas.

>>682002
>Source material isn't totally consistent on whether God is a physical entity in the OT.

Well it was written by a ton of different people of course, but the earliest stuff therein generally describes Yahweh as an anthropomorphic being.

>>682166
/thread