Siege of Leningrad was pretty shit because of the starvation. Also the first day of Iwo Jima was probably pretty fucking crazy because of how small of an island it was and the frequency of casualties over a short period of time
There were some folks near my camp who dropped Christianity and went back to the old ways during the height of the horrorshow. Their reasoning was the same as that of our ancestors: If God cares about the world so much then why would he allow all this?
>>671194 World War I was worse, I'd say. >toxic gas >constant shelling >men dying of basic diseases in the trenches >sleeping in the side of a ditch, being lulled to sleep by MG nests >the smell of rotting corpses in no man's land >knowing at some point you'd have to climb over and run straight towards death >dying from the smallest wounds because of shit medical attention
Probably the biggest tragedy in human history. >men coming home shellshocked and nobody would care
>walk out of command post >some lost german flips his shit, panics and shoots you in the arm and gets the fuck out of there >hit you in the bone >at aid station, get patched up, pass out on a fucking horrendously filthy mattress >awoken by a horrendously painful itch >thick line of termites leading from the mattress to under your cast eating at your wound >have to run outside and find a fucking stick to jam under your cast into your wound because anything is better than what you're currently experiencing
I'd have ran to the nearest pistol and just killed myself instead. Fuck Stalingrad.
>>671438 The Congo Wars (not the same as the Congo Crisis back in the 60's during the Cold War)) were two wars that fucking ravaged the Democratic Republic of the Congo starting from 1996. It technically ended in 2003, when the transitional government took charge in the country, but fighting still persists as of today in the far east. The second war killed more than 5 million people, making it the deadliest conflict since World War II. The deadliest phase, the Second Congo War (1998-2003), is also called the Great War of Africa. The conflict started as semi-good guys vs semi-good guys with valid reasons for fighting, but then it turned into a grimdark monsters vs monsters war, with all the parties involved taking advantage of the rich resources of the DRC and generally stomping the country to the ground. When I read about the 30 Years War europeans had I was shocked by the similarities. Considering all the different factions explaining the whole thing in one post seems impossible.
Mobutu Sese Seko Kuku Ngbendu Wa Za Banga (pomopus name he gave himself) which means "The all-powerful warrior who, because of his endurance and inflexible will to win, goes from conquest to conquest, leaving fire in his wake." was that fucker you sometimes see in old photographs wearing a leopard print hat and was commander of the DRC since 1965. He promised everybody the moon and didn't do shit but steal from the nation.
At the start of the war, DRC was (kek) a failed state, the army had to maintain themselves by looting and the east areas were out of the capital’s control, controlled by the Banyamulenge, Tutsi living in Zaire. The main problem with the ethnic term is that it doesn’t differentiate between the Tutsi that historically immigrated and the ones that came more recently because of the turmoil in Rwanda and Burundi. When Mobutu ordered them repatriated, that included the Banyamulenge, and many of them ended forming part of the Rwandan Patriotic Front, a rebel group.
>>671474 When the Rwandan genocide came to an end, the Rwandan Patriotic Front was at command and started to persecute the former Hutu genocides (called génocidaires), prompting most of them to flee to Zaire. The problem was that many Tutsis that had fled the genocide had the same idea, and soon victims and victimizers were in the same place. Guess how well that came out. To add insult to injury, Mobutu not only couldn’t control what happened in the area, but actually tried to help the génocidaires for an eventual invasion of Rwanda. Things escalated until a Banyamulenge rebellion started in 1996 and a militia headed by Laurent-Désiré Kabila was formed, the Alliance of Democratic Forces for the Liberation of Congo, after which the neighboring countries of Rwanda, Angola, Burundi and Uganda decided to join the conflict for different reasons; Rwanda to stop attacks to the country from the génocidaires in Zaire and to establish a puppet regime in Kinshasa; Uganda and Burundi because of their sympathy with the Tutsis; Angola because Mobutu’s cronies provided the partisan group UNITA with armament (at that time, Angola was still caught in a civil war). Zaire received support of the UNITA and the Army for the Liberation of Rwanda, formed for the most part of former génocidaires. Other countries also contributed, like Ethiopia, Eritrea and Zimbabwe.
Because Zaire’s army was shit, the AFDL and its allies gained control of the east area, achieving the objective of destroying the camps the genócidaires used as bases (it deserves to be mentioned, anyway, that Rwanda took advantage and repatriated all the Tutsis it could, despite their nationality, to recover population and workforce; not to mention the possible atrocities committed to the Hutus refugees). They decided to keep pushing and by 1997, Mobutu had been deposed and Laurent-Désiré Kabila claimed himself president and renamed the country Democratic Republic of the Congo, that was the end of the 1st war.
>>671488 In a decent world, this would have ended here, with a clusterfuck country in need of reconstruction and Kabila trying to get the country back on its feet. However, since this is the real world, the new regime was exactly like the one before, the corruption was still rampant, the ethnic tensions remained because of the centralized government and, to worsen things up, Kabila realized he was seen as an instrument of the foreign governments, so he started to turn against them, eventually expelling them from the country.
In 1998, a few of militia groups mutinied and started to fight with the government and, starting from there, ALL HELL broke loose, as multiple nations entered (or re-entered) to the DRC, in a confusing mess that is almost unexplainable. The only comprehensible thing was the ravaging and the humanitarian disaster that followed the fighting. Ironically (or maybe not), on THIS occasion the sides were reversed; Uganda, Burundi and Rwanda were now the enemies of the DRC (along with some Tutsi movements, the Movement for the Liberation of Congo and the Rally for Congolese Democracy), while Angola, Chad, Namibia and Zimbabwe were the allies of DRC, along with some other parties like Libya and Sudan; most of them were in it for the resources in the country, especially the diamond industry (Zimbabwe, Namibia and Libya being the most blatant examples of this). There were about 25 armed groups involved, because many of the countries involved had rebel militias that entered the war in the opposite band, and sometimes some of them split to form new militias.
>>671523 In 2001, Laurent-Désiré Kabila was killed by his bodyguards and his son, Joseph Kabila, took the presidential office. He started negotiations with Rwanda to end the conflict but in the meantime, the exploiting of the Congo’s resources continued. With time, however, the fighting slowed and eventually stopped, in part because Rwanda achieved to convince the DRC of complying with some of their objectives (although others, like the disbanding of the Interahamwe, which took part in the genocide of 1994 and had taken refuge in Congo, didn’t), but for the most part it was because the parties involved started to get tired of the never-ending violence.
Today, the conflict still persists in the form of rebel groups in the main conflict areas of the east, like the Kivu and Ituri conflict or the militia group Mai-Mai, which simply slipped out of control of the government. Some of the groups are funded by other governments, which only make things more complicated. As for the humanitarian cost, there are millions of displaced internal and externally, more than five million deaths and all the sides acting like monsters with all kinds of crimes, including mass killings and war rape.
The Second Congo war was an orgy of massacres, rapes, torture, and cannibalism. HIV & AIDS skyrocketed due to all the rape.
I knew a guy with no hands that told me about how some sick Mangbetu fucks got bored and bet on the gender of his wife's unborn child. After raping her to death they tore out her child to see who was right. All while he was forced to watch. The fetus was fed to a dog.
Last I heard the old guy shot himself after getting asylum in France.
Enemy at the gates was a decent book. Not a personal account, little dry and detached sometimes going into the history of it, but it helps you understand the battle a lot better, and there's more than enough personal accounts and little stories of how fucking awful it was.
My favorite was the shit sifting operation prisoners in PoW camps had. They'd shift the grain out of shit so they could eat it again.
"The mortality in Siena began in May. It was a cruel and horrible thing. . . . It seemed that almost everyone became stupefied seeing the pain. It is impossible for the human tongue to recount the awful truth. Indeed, one who did not see such horribleness can be called blessed. The victims died almost immediately. They would swell beneath the armpits and in the groin, and fall over while talking. Father abandoned child, wife husband, one brother another; for this illness seemed to strike through breath and sight. And so they died. None could be found to bury the dead for money or friendship. Members of a household brought their dead to a ditch as best they could, without priest, without divine offices. In many places in Siena great pits were dug and piled deep with the multitude of dead. And they died by the hundreds, both day and night, and all were thrown in those ditches and covered with earth. And as soon as those ditches were filled, more were dug. I, Agnolo di Tura . . . buried my five children with my own hands. . . . And so many died that all believed it was the end of the world."
I know wars are more stylish than diseases, but Jesus.
Do people forget that the Black Plague killed half of Europe?
>>671583 >I knew a guy with no hands that told me about how some sick Mangbetu fucks got bored and bet on the gender of his wife's unborn child. After raping her to death they tore out her child to see who was right. All while he was forced to watch. The fetus was fed to a dog. >Last I heard the old guy shot himself after getting asylum in France BULL SHIT
Anyways, in terms of pure casualties sustained in a short period, the early Western Front of WWI takes the cake. Hundreds of thousands of dead within a month.
Stalingrad is notable though, since lots of Russian units were basically martyred in the defense. Fighting at Mamayev Kurgan sounds like it would've been a hellish experience. Then you get the whole 300,000 Germans trapped in the pocket with only 91,000 surviving to surrender. Shit was pretty bad tbqhyf
Probably gas warfare. Most notable in the First World War.
By 1917, they had mustard gas which didn't really smell and would affect troops before they could react. There are stories of men avoiding gas with gasmasks, only for them to get the liquid form stuck on their boots. When they retreated to their bunkers, the gas remnants on their boots would kill everything in a confined space.
>>671721 Have you ever read the Doomsday Book by Connie Willis? It's historical/science fiction (the "present day" of the book is like 2050, but the protagonist goes back in time) but it's really good. Not entirely sure how accurate it is but it seems to get a lot of details right, and it does an excellent job of portraying the horrors of the plague. It's probably the most I've ever been affected by a book; I think it gave me a nightmare, or at least a really weird dream.
Sichuan under Zhang Xianzhong sounded pretty fucking shitty.
>The events surrounding Zhang Xianzhong's rule and afterwards devastated Sichuan, where he was said to have "engaged in one of the most hair-raising genocides in imperial history". Lurid stories of his killings and flayings were given in various accounts. According to Shu Bi (蜀碧), an 18th-century account of the massacre, after every slaughter, the heads were collected and placed in several big piles, while the hands were placed in other big piles, and the ears and noses in more piles, so that Zhang Xianzhong can keep count of his killings. In one incident, he was said to have organized an imperial examination ostensibly to recruit scholars for his administration, only to have all the candidates which numbered many thousands killed. In another, to give thanks for his recovery after an illness, he was said to have cut off the feet of many women. The severed feet were heaped in two piles with those of his favorite concubine, whose feet were unusually small, placed on top, and these two piles of feet were then doused in oil and set alight to be what he called "heavenly candles" > In November 1645, according to de Magalhães, Zhang, after hearing that "a huge and powerful army was coming against him", announced that "the people of his kingdom had a secret pact with the enemy and planned an uprising; because of this he was determined to kill all, leaving not one person alive". The Jesuits, who now "understood the evil of this man", reported that while they managed to save a few of their people who were taken, the rest were killed. Zhang's policy of terror increased in intensity, especially in 1646 after he had decided to abandon Sichuan. By then, Zhang's government had virtually disintegrated, all but three of his principal officials had either committed suicide or were executed.
If it didn't kill itself, the highly unusual Spanish flu could have easily wrought hell on earth, considering it had infected 500 million people (which included the remote pacific islands and the Arctic.)
>>672072 I don't know about that. Verdun had more intense shelling, sure, but Passchendaele had the mud. People were literally drowning in mud-filled shell holes. Plus the this sector had been seeing action since 1914 so the shelling kept unearthing decomposing bodies and shit. Both pretty bad though.
>>675494 Do you really think Verdun didnt have mud?
>The concentration of so much fighting in such a small area devastated the land, resulting in miserable conditions for troops on both sides. Rain combined with the constant tearing up of the ground turned the clay of the area to a wasteland of mud full of human remains. Shell craters became filled with a liquid ooze, becoming so slippery that troops who fell into them or took cover in them could drown. Forests were reduced to tangled piles of wood by constant artillery-fire and eventually obliterated. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Verdun#Morale
The Belgian colonization of the Congo was pretty nasty.
I remember reading about it in a history magazine, and apparently there were these massive walled off landfills that nobody besides government officials were allowed to see/enter, and during the decolonization of the region they were opened up, only to reveal giant mounds of nude corpses, often mangled or disfigured, and it was revealed that the landfills were used by the Belgians to hide people killed by colonists.
I could be mistaken but I distinctly remember something like this.
The Belgians weren't the first ones into the Congo. Their king Leopold was, but he did so as a purely private venture that he fooled the west into believing was a philanthropic endeavor to civilize and uplift the population of the Congo.
In reality, it was a ruthless exploitation of the people and resources of the country by a man determined to make massive returns on his investment.
>'I have to record the most heart-rending scene that I ever witnessed. The turnkey unlocked the cell door and ... then came forth a yellow exhalation, the produce of the bodies of the men confined therein. I announced to them who were reprieved from death and which of them were to die. It is a literal fact that each man who heard his reprieve wept bitterly, and each man who heard his condemnation of death went down on his knees and, with dry eyes, thanked God they were to be delivered from this horrid place.
>The morning came, they received on their knees the sentence as the will of God. Loosened from their chains, they fell down in the dust, and, in the warmth of their gratitude, kissed the very feet that had brought them peace.'
>>671194 >Was Stalingrad the closest thing to hell on earth humanity has experienced?
Something people get wrong about Stalingrad is that the majority of the battle was outside of the city. We think of urban ruins and fighting through broken factories but no more than a third of the German 6th Army ever entered the city.
>>679064 True, but some of the most famous battles took place near or in the city, like the grain silo, Red October factory, Mamayev Kurgan, etc. To Hitler, cutting the Volga meant taking Stalingrad. Pretty dumb, but at least we got this sweet monument out of it.
Eastern Front in WW2 was generally fucked up but that was mainly because Germans and their allies committed horrific war crimes. Warfare itself was brutal and with many casualties but you really don't understand how vast Russia is and how thinly spread those troops were. In terms of hellishness of combat, Verdun takes the prize.
It's interesting to see where forensic science is today and that remains from WW2 are being exhumed for identification, i.e. the mass graves of dead from the USS Oklahoma at Pearl Harbor. There's some pushing to collect bodies from the Yamato. I wonder if Russia will embark on something like that.
I've read that constantly coming up and down from high levels of stress and fear to relative calm is actually a catalyst for combat fatigue. Studies of WW2 bomber crews who did this had significantly higher rates than ground troops who had a more metered exposure to stress over the same time frame.
It depends on the individual but the worse possible scenario in WW1 wasn't the trenches or even the gas, but the tunnels.
Tunneling to mine the enemy lines as they do the same to you, occasionally breaching each others tunnel, forced to fight it out in pitch darkness, or being buried alive if they hear you first and dig bore holes to collapse your tunnel.
>>679496 I never knew about the tunnels being that expansive. Thanks for the documentary, anon.
>forced to fight it out in pitch darkness Oh God that sounds more terrifying than normal. For some reason when I hear/read about hand-to-hand fighting in ww1/2 I get really quesy. Something about it just seems more primal or barbaric than hand-to-hand with swords and shields. You have to beat the other guy to death or stab him with a knife. No actual melee weapon training (to the extent a sword wielder would have), just desperate bludgeoning.
He's not saying that they weren't. But why would you enter a city when your enemy is trying to surround that same city and encircle you? The Germans were outside of it for a reason, not because the Soviets were pushing them out. Contrary to that, the Germans had actually taken the city and it is important to remember that the Battle of Stalingrad mainly refers to the Soviet effort to repulse Germans from Stalingrad.
just because as many people didnt die as one of the worst epidemic of all time doesnt mean the war wasnt hell on earth at the front.
the Spanish flu was spread over the entire globe.
the Western front was concentrated death where if you weren't bellow ground you were dead. Rats in the millions living amongst you. At anytime you could be shot, blown up, gassed, catch any number of disease that could kill you ect. you were covered in lice, filthy, starving, in a war you were told would be a chivalrous affair over in 6 months yet 4 years later everyone of your mates who you signed up with has died and you find yourself killing other men just like you day after day with no humanity.
Men came back from the war as shells of human beings.
but since not as many people died as the flu that means it wasnt that bad.
>>679150 >Studies of WW2 bomber crews who did this had significantly higher rates than ground troops
If you think about it, every mission for a bomber crew would be like going over the top + being in an artillery barrage. Before you mission you have hours, maybe days to anticipate the fear. Then when you're up there most of the crew has to sit around waiting for something to happen and when it does, you're effectively in the middle of a artillery barrage, but instead of being able to run to your bunker or foxhole, you have to sit around in a fragile tin can surrounded by explosives and kerosene and do a high stress, technical job that could kill everyone if you fuck up. Every time you go up crashing, burning alive, falling, drowning, getting peppered with shrapnel are all a seriously possibility and you have no escape, nowhere to run, nothing to hide behind. Every time you go up someone from your squadron will probably get wounded or die. Then when you touch down, you're immediately back to sitting around and anticipating the next mission.
>>671853 I think that often times though the guns would range well behind the front lines meaning that units that had been rotated into support trenches or villages for respite could still find themselves under fire. I'm currently reading Storm of Steel and it seemed to occur frequently for Junger.
I think everybody who listens to Dan Carlin has probably looked up the bone fields.
There's a documentary I've been looking for since this thread started, but it was on a third party website that I guess no longer exists, that featured a Russian relic hunter who digs around Volgograd/Stalingrad and finds German identity discs and tries to return them to families. Anyway, he mentions the bone fields too, but apparently it had been cleaned up by the local or national government and buried somewhere.
>>671194 The Sacking of Carthage was pretty brutal, imho.
Imagine hundreds of thousands of people being slaughtered with swords, spears and flames in house to house urban combat. Keep in mind the Carthaginians had been preparing for months, turning every building into a fortress and arming every person they could. Many starved to death before the Romans even made their final attack. Nothing of the city remained when it was all over. Any Carthaginians who survived were sent off to slavery.
>Complete dark >Air is toxic >dead bodies all around rotting >nothing to eat, let alone drink >burned all over your body, included the lungs >for days >no hope of getting away >some will eventually >the survivors had to get back on the mine one week after because they needed the money
>>687043 3 days after the explosion, hopes to find more survivors were thin, and the company decided to seal the air opening. 20 days after the explosion, 13 miners find their way out of their own. 24 days after the explosion, another man get out of the galleries after walking trough hundred of kilometres of dead bodies and agonising people.
>Abandoned in the high sea >Not enough place for everyone. >You must stand and hold people around you. >Thirst is not a problem since there is water up to the knees >yup, you can actually drink this way and it filter the salt >Ho, forget about this "sleep" thing. >After a time, the skin get out of the legs, but this is not the worse >There is nothing to eat. >In a first time. This problem is solved quickly. >Dead bodies make good flotation device. >Sharks start to know the spot. If you let them eat the dead, you sink. >Actually have to fight sharks with knives >Sun. Motherfucking sun. >Illnesses. >"Provisions" are running low. >The number one cause of death for the whole thing is to be killed in an argument.
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