>>651705 Corsica was under French government a year before Napoleon's birth, but they weren't French ethnically. Plus Napoleon's father was from mainland Italy. There are literally French conspiracy theories about how Napoleon's mother had an adulterous affair with a Frenchman who fathered him,. this is the narrative of the Napoleonic Society.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Challenge_of_Barletta italian general generally suck (see Cadorna and Bava Beccaris) but our soldiers are really tough. We are simply good idealistic fighters (see Garybaldi)
It doesn't matter if Italy did anything in the 18th or 19th centuries, public opinion only goes back as far as 100 years. Therefore, Italy is shit and no Italian has done anything good militarily speaking.
This phenomenon also explains the French surrender monkey meme despite Napoleon and WWI having been a thing.
>>650693 the condiotirre (sorry if its mispelled) Were some amazing italian mercs. Also Garibaldi's redshirts were known for beating larger forces time and time again as well as being excellent guerrilla fighters
>>650693 Garibaldi fought against two empires, was hunted by french and Savoiards and managed to escape with her agonising wife and a priest. He destroyed the Bourbon army in Sicily with only 1000 bad armed soldiers. He helped the birth of two States (Uruguay and Italy). He sent his son to steal Imperial germany battle flag during Vosges battles. He was probably the best general in recent history.
>>651855 this. Italian military bad name comes from the shit generals following 1860 unification. Diaz and Cadorna and ammiraglio Persano etc were shit tier nobles who maybe never saw real action in person
the name of the devil who for first time in human history threw a bomb from a plane is Giulio Gavotti. Ironically, if not tragically given the time we are living in, the first land to know an air bombing in human history is Libya
>>651855 he was indeed one of the greatest guerrilla fighters of recent history, but he was also a skilled war leader. he actually managed to win the archetipal 'uphill battle' in Calatafimi, pic related
>>651869 >He was probably the best general in recent history. lol no not by a fucking long shot best Italian* general in recent history, but he doesn't even start to compare to generals from countries with relevant modern militaries.
>>652015 Italy eventually won WWI after the most horribly bloody offensive the country had ever seen. Italy didn't win WWII, they turned coat and allied with the winning side, but they weren't the ones that won the war. When the Italians were actually fighting in WWII, they lost, consistently.
The various states and militaries of the Italian peninsula during the Renaissance were nothing. Unlike the tenacious, medieval city states that successfully fought off a Holy Roman Emperor, they were more an object of conquest for the more powerful leaders of this period. They fought amongst each other, for sure, but when Charles VIII marched through Italy in 1494, the Italians conceded to him without a real fight, opening their gates for fear of a greater defeat. The Swiss mercenaries were the relevant soldiers of this period, and as mercenary leaders, Condotierri were untrustworthy opportunists, with not too many of them being renowned for their martial prowess.
For the next half century, the Italian peninsula and the states it entailed would be nothing but the chew toy for the French, Austrians, and then Spanish. Venice and the Papal states (of course) were pretty much the only states strong enough to back up a claim to sovereignty, and otherwise German mercenaries and later Spanish soldiers dominated the battlefields of the Italian wars, with the Italians themselves being most notable for their infighting.
If you want a compelling period in Italian military history, that would be the medieval period, and not the Renaissance. The Renaissance was mostly the rape of Italy by other countries.
>>650693 Lombard League Venice :DDDD. Memed as a merchant republic, was also a military power. Especially navally. Sicily if you consider the Normies who set up ther Italians. Genoa was famous for its crossbows for some time in the medieval ages. Also the risorgimiento (inb4 France)
>>653338 By the end of the fifteenth century Spain, France and England had strengthened their monarchies and disposed of armies that could outnumber by many times any militia the Italian states could offer. Add to this the fact that northern italy was the most culturally and economically advanced region in Europe and you get why
>>650716 Italians singular were pretty good, it's when they fight as a modern nation-state they kind of suck
The innovations of the condotierri and merc system of the likes of Venice were at the cutting edge, unfortunately the disunity of the country meant that once places like France caught up they were able to leap ahead and steam roll the Italians
The distinct lack of Italians giving a damn and the disparity between various regions still dicks over the military and it's poor strategic planning and political system ensures it entered conflicts it had no business being in (Ww1 and ww2)
>>653320 exactly he was incited by Abraham Lincoln in person but Garibaldi refused his offer because it wasn't clear at the time that northerners would abolish slavery. Garibaldi himself freed slaves in south america.
>>652343 the exact spelling is "Condottieri" a famous example is the Disfida di Barletta, were there was a tournament between french and italian cavaliers and Italians won https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Challenge_of_Barletta
L'Armata Brancaleone, and the follow up Brancaleone alle Crociate by Mario Monicelli are two extremely funny movies about Brancaleone, a condottiere, and his pathetic adventures
>>654236 We are talking about ethnicity, and the Italian master nation was the backbone of the Principate and even the late Republic before they started to allow non-Italians(before Caracalla, only Italians for the most were citizens) into the ranks and the army.
You have to understand that Italians don't lack bravery, or that they somehow carry a gene that makes them rubbish at large scale wars. Italians in general find the concept of fighting for a corrupt government absurd, and we don't do it. Also to put your life on the line for some abstract concept like patriotism equally absurd. Italians are loyal to their family first and foremost, then their village or town, then their region. That's where it ends really except during football matches where everyone is Italian. There is nothing to be gained from patriotic fervor and regimes quickly forget the people who come home maimed or don't come home at all, so Italians don't buy into it. As for bravery, well if you came to Italy and started to cause trouble then the locals would give you the beatdown of the century, or maybe even kill you depending on the severity of the trouble, this doesn't happen in most countries.
Apart from wars we are good at so many other things anyway. Best art, best women, best cooking, good music, good film, good culture, great inventions.
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