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Imperialism hate-thread
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You are currently reading a thread in /his/ - History & Humanities

Thread replies: 84
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SYRIAN EDITION
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But Anon, imperialism is literally the solution to the problem of intercultural contact.
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>>599943
You misspelled democratic confederalism.
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>>599946
No, that doesn't work, it's just idealist garbage.

Now the guidance of lesser peoples and savages to civilization while efficiently exploiting their resources is where it's really at. You also make a good profit in the meantime. What's not to like?
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>>599946
how do u want your people's identity and sense of purpose on earth senpai

just cuck my shit up
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>>599970
And by that you mean it's been a success the only time it's been tested?

>Now the guidance of lesser peoples and savages
>Not believing in the equality of the peoples in 2016
>2.0.1.6
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>>599973
Along religious and ethno-linguistic lines.
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>>599975
All people are clearly not equal, Anon. It's not that hard to get through your skull. You say you want to accept diversity but then make silly claims like that.

>2016

Memes
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>>599980
>All people are clearly not equal
>2 - 0 - 1 - 6
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>>599985
Memes
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>>599987
2 0 1 6
0
1
6
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>>599994
Do you have anything to contribute or are you just going to keep throwing a fit?
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>>599985
>actually believing that people are equal

In what? Capabilities? Certainly not, that's largely genetic and cultural. Equal opportunities? Yeah, in your dreams.

It's really simple, anon. Western civilization, as the unquestionable high point of human achievement, should intervene in lesser cultures and bring them our values. If they are led by stubborn leaders and backwards ideologies, we should intervene with more aggression and tear them down. The people in those countries deserve to profit from western thought, even if they don't know it yet.
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>>600003
B-b-but anon, they don't profit from it, WE do. And they're backward because we fucked their shit up. Your lack of cultural relativism and presence of western exceptionalism denotes a lack of education. Have you ever read The Communist Manifesto anon? Edgyness is not avant-garde anymore.
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>>600036
>They're backwards because we fucked their shit up

I'm sure they were living in gleaming cities paved with gold before the eternal anglo & co arrived, Anon.

>Lack of cultural relativism and presence of western exceptionalism

Why is it so hard for you to accept that the West is truly exceptional, Anon? We have it better than most other cultures.
Or perhaps you just want to reverse it and say Western culture is shit and the savages living in mud huts are the best.

>Communist manifesto

More idealist garbage, this isn't getting us any colonies, son
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>>600036
>we fucked their shit up
Might makes. If western Europe didn't defend itself from the Ottomans, we would be crushed. It's incredibly hypocritical to blame the west for cultural domination when the cultures we "wronged" wanted to invade us just as much, but they couldn't, because they sucked at the conquest game.
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>>600036
>And they're backward because we fucked their shit up
Literally WE WUZ
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>>600036
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>>600043
>I'm sure they were living in gleaming cities paved with gold before the eternal anglo & co arrived, Anon.

Literally.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_I_of_Mali

>Why is it so hard for you to accept that the West is truly exceptional, Anon? We have it better than most other cultures.
Or perhaps you just want to reverse it and say Western culture is shit and the savages living in mud huts are the best.

That's what you fundamentally don't understand: you're judging your society as better with criteria created by said society. If your criteria of a good civilization/society/culture is "How good is religion X respected?" then your 'inherently superior' candidate doesn't qualify.

>More idealist garbage, this isn't getting us any colonies, son

Literally the biggest continuous (including colonies) landmass in the world was created due to the Communist Manifesto.

>>600050
>Might makes.
So if I break into your house and kill you, I can steal all your shit?

> the cultures we "wronged" wanted to invade us just as much, but they couldn't
Prove it?

>>600061
>>600075
See >>599987
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>>600084
>So if I break into your house and kill you, I can steal all your shit?

You can, but hopefully society has an efficient authority to keep you from doing so.
The concept of "world police" does the same for relations between states. It's unethical to sit by and watch backwards countries kill each other over ethnical and religious background, when we could intervene and put a stop to it. Unfortunately, violence isn't stopped by being warm and fuzzy.
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>>600084
>Literally

So the royalty was having it great. If you think that's quality of life, then you must be just fine with the shit state Africa is in nowadays. After all, if El Presidente is living in luxury, the people must be fine.

>You can't judge your society as better with criteria created by said society

Yes, I can. I can clearly point at any tribe living in hovels and barely scraping a living with inefficient agriculture and shepherding and say that my society is better.

>Communist manifesto creates empire

I blame muh human nature :^)

>The west is evil, everyone else was peaceful and innocent

How deluded can one person be?
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>>600139
The guy is literally pointing out the lack of cultural relativism as a fault. That's about enough to see where he's coming from.
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>>600139
>So the royalty was having it great.
Oh yeah, because the people in Enlightened Egalitarian Europe had it so good amirite?

>Yes, I can.

Yes, it was tongue in cheek. Of course you CAN use a stupid, flawed and biased system. What I meant was closer to "only literally retarded people who'd do that".

>I blame muh human nature :^)
See >>599987

>How deluded can one person be?
Quoting things I never said in order to feel better about muh lazy way to see the incredibly complex world.

>>600154
>I LEARNED COMPLEX TOPICS ON THE INTERNET, IM AN EVERYTHING INTELLECTUAL
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>>600139
>>600170
>Having it so good
>So much better than living in my village, cultivating my farm
>Because I know I'm of the inherently superior race
>Even so I never met any other
>Working 18 hours a day so that my country can ruin itself with expensive colonial ventures.
>It's gonna be SO worth it when I die at 20!
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>>600170
>Oh yeah, because the people in Enlightened Egalitarian Europe had it so good amirite?

Is this man serious? They had it better than the poor sods living in the jungle.

>Stupid, flawed and biased system

You mean the one where you put everything at the same level and everyone is equal. Clearly you can't compare cultures because that is mean and inhuman.

>Proceeds to meme harder

>Missing the point entirely
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>>599937
I came here to agree that empire dies indeed suck.
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>>600179
>Be black man in Africa
>Die

kek
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>>600003
> Certainly not, that's largely genetic and cultural.
You haven't done your homework, now have you?
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The only way out of imperialism is if we decide to live in an anarchist self dependent society otherwise someone will always try to get something out of someone else. And trust me I see that shit a lot down here.
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>>600210
I wish I could bring you the marvels of communism and egalitarianism, Anon.
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>>600170
>stupid, flawed and biased system
>thinks everyone is equal
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Im actually trying to take out my government because what I see happening in Africa is self imperialism. Our own governments and a few sick individuals are sapping us dry.
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>>600189
How is having your own farm in your own village worse than

>We automatically mounted the machine gun for action. Then like animals we burrowed into the earth as if trying to find protection deep in its bosom. Something struck my back where I carried my gas mask, but I did not pay attention to it. A steel splinter broke the handle of my spade and another knocked the remains out of my hand. I kept digging with my bare hands, ducking my head every time a shell exploded nearby. A boy to my side was hit in the arm and cried out for help. I crawled over to him, ripped the sleeves of his coat and shirt open and started to bind the bleeding part. The gas was so thick now I could hardly discern what I was doing. My eyes began to water and I felt as if I would choke. I reached for my gas mask, pulled it out of its container – then noticed to my horror that a splinter had gone through it leaving a large hole. I had seen death thousands of times, stared it in the face, but never experienced the fear I felt then. Immediately I reverted to the primitive. I felt like an animal cornered by hunters. With the instinct of self-preservations uppermost, my eyes fell on the boy whose arm I had bandaged. Somehow he had managed to put the gas mask on his face with his one good arm. I leapt at him and in the next moment had ripped the gas mask from his face. With a feeble gesture he tried to wrench it from my grasp; then fell back exhausted. The last thing I saw before putting on the mask were his pleading eyes.

>You mean the one where you put everything at the same level and everyone is equal.

And by putting everyone on the same level, you mean judging them by the criterias you choose? How convenient!

>I hereby decide that all men smoking Winston Lights are inherently superior to everyone else.
>Luckily my powerful friends who also smoke Winston Lights also agree and that magically make the system less stupid, flawed and biased.
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>>600170
>Incredibly complex world
>Disregards diversity in cultures and races and insists everyone is the same
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>>600213
Bring them on. Thats why they made the net right?
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>>600222
>Saying everyone is the same
>Arguing against the idea of inherent cultural and racial superiority and white exceptionalism
Totally what I said. You guys have great reading skills 2016/2016
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>>600220
Because machineguns gave them better farms, Anon. It was all for them.

>Still insisting on putting everyone on the same level
I'm gonna hire a couple of inexperienced, uneducated people to do the job that the qualified applicants were supposed to do. After all, they are inherently different and can't possibly be compared, but as I believe that everything and everyone is the same, I trust they'll do a fine job.
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>>600226
>Arguing against the idea of inherent cultural and racial superiority and white exceptionalism

And so we reach the bottom of the barrel. He's just really, really butthurt at whites,
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>muh imperialism

Cry more, savages.
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>it's 2016
>your argument is invalid because of this

Jesus Christ, please go back to reddit.
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>>600230
>Going from arguing white supremacy to shitting yourself about job qualifications.
Just give up already.

>>600234
I guess believing that makes it easier than reading books or taking classes about something before expressing your retarded opinions.
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>>600236
>mfw it could all have been avoided if everyone was equal

WHY WASN'T EVERYONE EQUAL
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>>600239
I don't see what's wrong, you started talking about cigarettes, Anon.

>Reading books and taking classes
I'm sure the only valid books and classes are the ones that express opinions you agree with. Everything else is retarded.

>mfw diversity tells me my opinion isn't accepted

B-But
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>>600241
We tried to make you equal. We tried to educate you.

You refused. You wanted "independence". You got it. Now enjoy the ruins.

http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1713275,00.html

>"Even if you go 1,000 kilometers down this river, you won't see a single sign of development. When the whites left, we didn't just stay where we were. We went backwards."

>"When the Belgians and the Portuguese were here, there were farms and plantations — cashews, peanuts, rubber, palm oil. There was industry and factories employing 3,000 people, 5,000 people. But since independence, no Congolese has succeeded. The plantations are abandoned." Using a French expression literally translated as "on the ground," he adds: "Everything is par terre."

>"On this river, all that you see — the buildings, the boats — only whites did that. After the whites left, the Congolese did not work. We did not know how to. For the past 50 years, we've just declined." He pauses. "They took this country by force," he says, with more than a touch of admiration. "If they came back, this time we'd give them the country for free."
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>>600247
It was all whitey's fault. But now that we're independent, everything is gonna be aight.
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>>600246
>I don't see what's wrong, you started talking about cigarettes, Anon.

That's called an analogy but you see that in high school.

>I'm sure the only valid books and classes are the ones that express opinions you agree with. Everything else is retarded.
>mfw diversity tells me my opinion isn't accepted

Why do you keep arguing against things I never said? Why is it so hard for you to just stop posting? Go anon, go. You spend too much time on internet anyway.

>>600247
>Living the sweet life, so much better thanks to our enlightened masters :^)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_major_famines_in_India_during_British_rule

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocities_in_the_Congo_Free_State

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_slave_trade

>>600268
>It's NEVER the fault of the white man!
>NEVER
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>>600272
>Analogy

kek

>N-Never said that, Anon, s-stop putting things in my mouth

>mfw they rule themselves now
>mfw whitey practised slavery, the evil bastard
>mfw even with Leopold they were having it better
>mfw what I learned from all this is that it's always whitey's fault
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>>600272
>pretty normal life, only sometimes starve because of fuck ups
vs
>always starving, always duing
>>
This whole thread is one retard arguing against trolls. Christ.
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>>600003
Exactly. Violence must be used to bring regressive civilizations to more advanced stages.
t. Leon Trotsky
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>>600236
>the eternal anglo tries to justify slaughtering defenseless and technologically disadvantaged tribes
Meanwhile the Germans actually educated their colonial subjects and included them in the system of colonization.
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>>600236
is that photo ironic?
>screenshot from AC:3
>edgy as fuck
>shine the light of enlightenment
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>>600236
Imperialism didn't help anyone. It was not done to enlighten primitive subjects. It was done to increase the wealth of the subjugating nation. Technology would have disseminated without that exploitation, just like it has always disseminated, through trade, not empire.
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>>600385
If they hadn't exerted control through military means, they would have exerted control through trade.

They did both, but still.

What happens in modern Africa is that they let mostly the natives police themselves and go about exploiting the resources unhindered. Pretty cool.
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>>600272
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_major_famines_in_India_during_British_rule

There has always been famines in India.

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocities_in_the_Congo_Free_State

It was shit, but it only lasted 5 years before being changed to something better.

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_slave_trade

The British Empire abolished the Atlantic slave trade.
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>>600385
>It was done to increase the wealth of the subjugating nation.

Nice meme, most colonies were unprofitable.
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>>599937
Syria was a perfectly functioning state right until the US started arming extremist groups masked as "moderate and democratic"
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>>600449
Just like Lebanon was a perfectly functioning state right until the Syrians started arming extremist groups masked as "progressive and socialistic".

Payback is a bitch.
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Our equals.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9foi342LXQE
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>>600532
>Comparing Romans with Sub Saharan civilization

You have no idea what you're talking about, do you?
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>>600577
He's pointing out that cultures definitely aren't equal
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>>600581
Of course, they're different cultures. Cultures aren't equal. So what?
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>>600590
Durr
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>>600592
???
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>>600443
>empire was for the benefit of the conquered
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>>600604
Not really, although most empires ended up contributing something positive to their colonies, even if it was unintended. And no one denies that atrocities were commited, unless they are severely delusional.

You see? Good things and bad things.
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>>600577
If it's been two thousand years and you're still behind the ancient world, something is seriously wrong.
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>>600614
The supposed benefits of empire can, do, and would have been accomplished without empire. They are just an excuse to justify said atrocities and systemic exploitation.

All that one could reasonably argue was that empire less to more swift modernization, but even that is still arguable.
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>>600745
I wasn't trying to justify anything, I was just stating a fact.
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implying imperialism is a morally guided effort to improve the world and not a cash grab and that growing an empire isn't an automatic enlistment into an eventual collapsing of the state.
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>>599946
Joe Biden has some very harsh words for the PKK recently. He called them outrageous and as bad as ISIS, and said Rojava will absolutely not get a voice in the peace process.
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How do people that justify colonization explain the fact that the most prosperous non-western nations - Japan, South Korea, and China, are the only ones who were never colonized by Europeans?
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>>600236
That is the most cringeworthy thing I ever read.
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>>600236
>Nigel with paki neighbours actually believes this as hes waiting for his welfare
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>>603559
No one is trying to justify colonization, they are opposing the meme that we should let oppressive regimes off the hook just because they say "muh colonial history".

The Japanese colonized South Korea. Are you saying South Korea was never colonized or that only colonization by evil whitey is wrong?

China was one of the poorest countries until it started to open up to the world.

Japan was forced open by the US, it is completely feasible that they would have remained isolationist if left alone.
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>>603559
You forgot Siam senpai.
Also, the profitable bits of China, as well as all of Korea, were totally colonized.
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>>603659
>Siam
>Not everyone's basic bitch
Thailand only survived as a bufferzone between the English Raj and French Indochina.

>>603559
>China
A bazillion unfair treaties, with bits straigth up carved from it and annexed.
>Japan
Opened up by force, took to European ideals most fiercly out of all the eastern powers. Forced to be passive cucks to the Americans after the end of WII
>Korea
Unfair treaties ala China, colonized by Japan who tried to emulate European Powers, all but vassalized by the Americans and the USSR.
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>>603810
>with bits straigth up carved from it and annexed.
The concessions were like just fucking cities on the coast. The great mass of China was (shakily) held by the Empire, and then the Republic + Warlords afterwards.

Hell, at times they were just bits of cities. Like the German colony of Qingdao.
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>>603659
Siam is sort of not prosperous.
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>>603820
Sort of. It's fairly prosperous by the neighborhoods standards. Better then Vietnam, and Indonesia, way better than Burma, Laos, and Cambodia. Of it's neighbors, only Malaysia and VERY recently, China are doing better (for how long).
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>>603816
You know the cities are the most populated region right?

It's like if you took out New York, Boston, Washington, New Orleans, Charlotte, Miami, Orlando, Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Seattle out of the United States.

There, only 11 cities. That's nothing.

Oh, and keep in mind that it's not like these cities were in some sort of economic or cultural bubble from the rest of China, either.
>>
>in the beginning every country had a big pile of diamonds with which to buy stuff
>one day the white man stole everyone's diamonds
>this is why we are poor
Do people really believe this?

Is this something else people have to agree to or they will be called racist like diversity?
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>>603896
nah, it's much simpler;

if something goes right
>we da best!
if something goes wrong
>fucking whitey imperialists
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