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>France favors centralization and hierarchy
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You are currently reading a thread in /his/ - History & Humanities

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>France favors centralization and hierarchy
>Germany favors decentralization and federalism

How true is this meme?
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>>567959
Specious reductionist crap. Sounds like you're a Poli Sci major.
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>>567972
Not him but both of those statements are demonstrably true. There are four German countries in Europe, as opposed to one French state. Germans gravitate towards regionalism and sectionalism, have many important cities besides just Berlin, and only actually made inroads to unify when confronted with an exterior threat. If you go to Germany or Austria today you will see regional colors, emblems, and flags everywhere, far more often than the national flag. No, that is not just because of their Nazi past causing an aversion to nationalism, because the Swiss demonstrate the same traits.

France on the other hand, has made conscious efforts to cripple regional sentiment and keep the country centralized. They have destroyed numerous nationalities, wiped out dialects, and eroded regional cultures in the course of doing this. The French have a almost pathological need to keep French identity unitary, even to the point of putting the brakes on completely harmless regional movements such as recognition of tiny minority languages on a European level.
>The 1999 Report written for the government by Bernard Cerquiglini identified 75 languages that would qualify for recognition under the government's proposed ratification of the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages. 24 of those languages are indigenous to the European territory of the state
>...ratification was blocked by the Constitutional Council as contradicting the Fifth Republic's constitutional provision enshrining French as the language of the Republic
Contrast this to the behavior of Switzerland or the UK.
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>>568358
>four German countries
Luxembourg, Germany, Austria and ...? Switzerland can hardly be called German.
Also I wouldn't us that as an example as thios was forced upon the 'german people', even if they are now fine with it. Luxembourg and Austria were never part of the german State (Imperial Germany).
However this is somewhat true for the modern German state and it's highly federalised Structure, which however is a result of the reconstruction after the 3rd Reich (which was incredebly centralized).
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>>569054
Liechtenstein?
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>>568358
>completely harmless regional movements
They are harmless until they become a threat. Regionalism is not a good thing for a country. See the UK, Belgium, Spain ...
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>>568358
>There are four German countries in Europe, as opposed to one French state.
France, Belgium, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Monaco, Andorra.
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What is in your opinion the best structure for a country? I mean, which of the two?
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>>569731
This.
First you subsidize language associative schools, then you teach it in public schools and use on road signs, then you make it compulsory to learn, then it replaces the national language and then independentists get autonomy and in the end the country splits.
Switzerland is fine because it's small, federalized and economically sound, but France can't do it.
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>>569759
Centralism.

Then again, I'm french.
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>>569759
The French model for all practical purposes, but I like dialects, cultures, variety, and languages, so even if it means instability, German, in my opinion.

>>569731
As far as I can see, the UK has demonstrated that allowing self-determination and autonomy works for keeping multinational countries together. Imagine what the poll numbers would have been for Scotland leaving if they had refused to give them a referendum, it would be just like Catalonia up there. I think it's important to recognize that different situations call for different measures, though, and there is no set in stone way of dealing with this. I just can't see Breton, Occitain, Picard, Savoyard, etc separatism ever becoming an issue the same way Catalonia has.
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>>569731
>Regionalism is not a good thing for a country.

It's a good thing for the parts of the country that escape the clutches of central power, though.

Some of the best parts of Europe, such as the Low Countries, Switzerland and Northern Italy, were formed by such "regionalist" attempts at reducing the power of central authorities.
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>>569759
Centralization is good on the short term, but it makes society too fragile in it's attempt to destroy any intermediary corp of society that menaces central power. In the long term, it only destroys a nation soul and culture, making it servile and unable to self-organize. See the history of Russia and China, for example.
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>>568358
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vergonha

>The aim of the French educational system will consequently not be to dignify the pupils' natural humanity, developing their culture and teaching them to write their language, but rather to humiliate them and morally degrade them for the simple fact of being what tradition and their nature made them. The self-proclaimed country of the "Human rights" will then ignore one of man's most fundamental rights, the right to be himself and speak the language of his nation. And with that attitude France, the "grande France" that calls itself the champion of liberty, will pass the 20th century, indifferent to the timid protest movements of the various linguistic communities it submitted and the literary prestige they may have given birth to.

>France, that under Franco's reign was seen here as the safe haven of freedom, has the miserable honour of being the State of Europe—and probably the world — that succeeded best in the diabolical task of destroying its own ethnic and linguistic patrimony and moreover, of destroying human family bonds: many parents and children, or grandparents and grandchildren, have different languages, and the latter feel ashamed of the first because they speak a despicable patois, and no element of the grandparents' culture has been transmitted to the younger generation, as if they were born out of a completely new world. This is the French State that has just entered the 21st century, a country where stone monuments and natural landscapes are preserved and respected, but where many centuries of popular creation expressed in different tongues are on the brink of extinction. The "gloire" and the "grandeur" built on a genocide. No liberty, no equality, no fraternity: just cultural extermination, this is the real motto of the French Republic.

The French Republic had got away with too much. I really hope Muslims cause a civil war and destroy the country, reckoning is overdue.
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>>569828
I also prefer the german model, but how do you feel about what's going on in germany right now with the refugees?
i fear they destroy german culture
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>>569868
kek, are you fundamentalist christian by any chances ? The vendéens got what they deserve, they were traitors who liked better the English than their own countryman.
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>>569868
Delicious.
And paradoxally, I'm satisfied to see that there is no french version of this article.
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>>569868
>lose a civil war
>g-genocide!
Vendeens truly are the best at victim playing, even the Bretons aren't that annoying.

>>570199
I'm sure it's that BR poster.
He always brings it on /int/ for some reason.
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>>567959

W H O C A R E S
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>>570199
>fundamentalist christian
And there are still people advocating the nefarious Church.
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>>570500
I do, its an interesting topic
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>>570500
> Asking who cares
> On /his/ - History & Humanities
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzYGWF6qrts
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>>569860
china is doing perfectly well and russia didn't lose the soviet union because of that
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france = republic
sith = monarchy
jedi = democrats
vader = bonaparte

y/n
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>>567959
Still Germany is more of a nation state than France.
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>>570715
wut
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>>570715
Bonaparte is a grey jedi.
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>>569868
Just banter pêh
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>>569733
>Belgium
>French

Fuck off.

t. Flanders
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>>570884
>t. Flanders
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>>567959
>structure and hierarchy
>France

lmao

>Liberté
>Egalité
>Fraternité

>decentralization
>German

Bismarck and Hitler would like a word.
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>>569759
How about: it depends on the fucking country?
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>>570884
Their government model was constructed when the Francophone side was dominant and is pretty inspired by the La Republique. This is part of the problem nowadays, of course.
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>>570903
Hitler is Hitler, but Bismarck wasn't that centralized. The Laender still had some power; in fact reducing their number under the Reich only contributed to their power (you have like 11 states and not fuckton of principalities which increases your relative bargaining power).
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