>>561347 It's Lotharingia that is rich. It has nothing to do with the HRE.
I still don't get why people always talk about the HRE. It's not like it was the most powerful or interesting realm in Europe. Capetian France, or Spain when ruled by the Habsburgs both have a way more interesting history. Yet, most of the time, threads are about the HRE. Why ?
HRE sounds a bit exotic and weird, with its oddball decentralised system of electors and shit. There isn't really anything like it anymore, so people are naturally interested in it.
Same deal with Byzantium. Obviously very different from HRE, but still it's something which was once very powerful and significant and is now totally erased, yet leaving many traces behind. So it's interesting, like dinosaurs.
>>561439 Cologne is ultra famous (even without the recent ficki ficki fest). Before I got into history and geography (and started travelling) I also knew quite a bit about Leipzig, Dresden, Nuremburg, Hannover, Bonn, Stuttgart, and Dortmund. It's possible that people only know Berlin, Munich, Hamburg, and Frankfurt in America, Canada, or Australia, but doubtful anywhere in Europe. The guy you replied to is 100% right, in Germany even cities with like 200,000 people or less in them can be very important.
>>562908 Not really, I'd say the average person would just know Edinburgh (popular uni destination for continental Europeans), Manchester (for its recent musical significance) and of course London for the UK. French cities other than Paris are generally very obscure, but I suppose the average person would know Marseilles or Lyons. Individual German cities are just more likely to hold current and historical significance, since any given German city is likely to have been a capital city of something at one point. Also, a lot of people follow German football and would know cities through teams.
>>562933 Be honest buddy, you're german or an american heritagefag. There's no way that the average guy who knows of Leipzig, Mainz, Bonn and shit doesn't know of Nantes, Strasbourg, Metz, Rennes, Dijon, Lille, Tolouse, Bordeaux, Rouen, etc in France or Canterbury, Leeds, Liverpool, Newcastle, Glasgow, Inverness, Bath, etc in Britain. Especially if you use the football argument, since EPL >> Bundes popularity wise.
>>562955 I am American but I have lived on both continents pretty much 50/50, I have no idea if I'm German or not nor do I care very much. I can't prove any of them to you because this is all just based on personal experience. I would say people know the regions of France more than any individual cities (Champagne, Burgundy, Provence, Bretagne, Aquitaine, Normandy) because that comes up in regards to France far, far more than cities do. People do definitely know Bonn though because it was the capital of West Germany.
>>561377 Daily reminder that the conception of state defended by Voltaire was put in practice during the Jacobin period of the French Revolution and it was such a disaster that it managed to revive French Catholicism as bulwark against it!
Guy shouldn't be an authority on political science. Or anything, for that matter.
>>561415 The funny thing is that Germans bring this same "decentralization" principle wherever they go, including the economy, which is still based on small and medium sized enterprises.
Also, in Brazil, the state most heavily colonized by German immigrants, Santa Catarina, is also known for having no "major city", instead it has a network of prosperous small and medium-sized cities with their own local companies.
Now, if I were a racist, I would say that's becaus Germans are the master race. But since I know better, I would say it's because Germans spent so many centuries living under the decentralized rule of the HRE that they brought it's spirit to them to new lands.
>>563813 >Holy The empire that was supposed to defend catholicism became the first mutli-religious state by recognizing the rights of protestant princes to practice their religion. It failed to defend catholicism. Spain on the other hand was no infested and converted more people than the HRE could dream of. >Roman It's as roman as Russia and Turkey. >Empire Failed empire, its borders have no meanings and when Napoléon destroyed it, no one gave a fuck.
>>564383 Well the burden of proof isn't on me to disprove shit like "hurrr it's basically the star wars of the 1200's" but >voltaire is a ruling class, academically acclaimed philosopher who endorsed specific claims which had impact on scholarship and revolutionary state development, for better or for worse, who happened to satirize their world like 99% of philosophers have done >george carlin gets quoted on facebook, has influenced the niche corner of the entertainment industry centered in funnymen, and will never be partly responsible for introducing an entirely new politics into the world
>>563911 >The empire that was supposed to defend catholicism became the first mutli-religious state by recognizing the rights of protestant princes to practice their religion. It failed to defend catholicism. nearly 900 years after the donation of pepin, and the fight against the lombards to save the papal state ultimately, it failed, but mainly because the character of the empire itself changed overtime. that doesnt change the fact that even the sovereign rulers of the time acknolwedged the Kaiser as the worldly head of western christianity, even if just in a ritual way.
>It's as roman as Russia and Turkey. both engaged the idea of translatio imperii (altough relating to the byzantine empire), with more or less legit claim. but lets be honest, the germanic people where the only ones succesfully claiming the inheritance of the WRE, and roman traditions were much more alive in the HRE then they were in russia or anatolia under turkish rule.
>Failed empire, its borders have no meanings and when Napoléon destroyed it, no one gave a fuck. just as i said above, of course it ultimately failed, because it isnt existing anymore. but you are generalizing nearly 1000 years of history by just taking the last few years into account. the empires borders werent the same over all this time, be it the shape, the strength, or the "meaning". but thats the thing with all empires, they have highs and lows. besides, the dismantling of the HRE was a pretty big deal, i think many people "gave a fuck".
>>561352 I think we should get rid of this meme because it's perpetuated by SJW cucks like John Green and they actually believe that the HRE was neither Holy nor Roman nor an Empire, even though the medieval HRE was all three.
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