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What are some historical events, people,...
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You are currently reading a thread in /his/ - History & Humanities

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What are some historical events, people, places etc. that you personally believe have been tampered with or revised in some way?

>inb4 Holocaust
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>>544863
The Armenian Genocide
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>>544863
Orwell would be impressed
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>>544863
I never understood how could the members of the central committee and government officials let stalin kill them one by one. He's killing everybody, you know your time is coming eventually, how hard is it to just pull out your gun and shoot?
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>>544889

He was. He was so impressed, in fact, he wrote several books about shit like that.
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>>544897
Because if you shoot Stalin everyone loses the soviet union.

So you hope you live to enjoy it with Stalin.
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>>544897

Pure propaganda.

Stalin only ever killed traitors.
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>>545023
Which according to him was the entire central committee or any party member with power apparently, so the question stands.
Except molotov i guess, there was some weird sociopath bromance there.
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>>545023
Hello, red side of /pol/.
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>>545037

There is no reason to show mercy to traitors.
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>>544863
>>inb4 holocaust
Well fucking hell. Why are you people so afraid of the holocaust. Historians don't plug their ears at something they suspect will be disagreeable.
>b-but da JOOZ dindu nuffin!!1!!!1!!
Kill yourselves. Cowards.
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>>545116
Faggot
That is all.
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>>545116

>>>/pol/
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>>545116
People don't like you because that's all you fags ever think about. You regurgitate the same infographs over and over and circle jerk about how much you hate Jews.
Nobody cares outside of /pol/
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>>545116
You could learn something on this board. You could expand your horizons. You could see the breadth and depth of the human experience.

But you'd rather shitpost about Jews.
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>>544863
There's a lot of shit about the roman republic that sounds hard to believe to me. I think things like Marcus Antonius's orator skills or Cato's stubbornness have to be at least a little bit exagerated.

>>545116
There's no real disagreement among historians regarding the holocaust so there's no reason to plug any ears. There is, on the other hand, a containment board unable to contain itself that keeps shitting on threads.
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>>545116
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>>545082
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>>544889
literally what happened f a m
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Dissolution of Austria-Hungary obviously. It would never ever happen without Entente winning the war and partitioning them, but certain groups want you to believe it was inevitable.
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>>545206
>There's no real disagreement among historians regarding the holocaust
I agree. Us functionalists are correct and those intentionalists and synthesisers are trying to white wash the nations of central europe of their collective guilt. (Browning, Ordinary Men)
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>>546000

>2000+16
>Functionalism

wow I didn't even know they existed anymore
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>>546011
So far I've noticed that the people with the reading to speak on the topic are all functionalists here. Browning is much loved.
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almost all of them. It's nearly impossible to avoid biases when writing histories or any other factual material so i that sense everything is revised and tampered with. With modern propaganda almost nothing can get through without being filtered, especially in totalitarian states.
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>>546027

Oh, I love Browning. I thought he was a synthesis historian but it's been literally years since I studied Holocaust historiography. I guess I got mixed up, but doesn't Browning take a lot from synthesis like Kershaw's cumulative radicalisation thesis?
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>>545888
This, it wasn't nearly as dire a situation as people like to make it out in retrospect. It was actually relatively stable and was growing economically, the monarchy was relatively effective, and overall it was functional if not chaotic. Especially with Franz Ferdinand's reform plans it would have definitely had a fighting chance of making it through the 20th century in some form or another.
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>>544863
What actually happened and what is perceived to have happened in history are equally important. You could say that basically everything has been tampered with just because we have hindsight
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Holocaust
World Wars 1 and 2
Moon Landing
9/11

And lots more.
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>>546065
>Moon landing.

I've looked through a telescope at an observatory and seen the Apollo 11 landing site.

Of all the conspiracies the Moon Landing is the worst. You can literally see the stuff they left on the moon.
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>>546065
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_loUDS4c3Cs
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>>545116
It was an event that was so massive, on such a scale, spread out over a long period of time. The people who carried it out admit to carrying it out. No one involved ever denied it, they just tried to minimize their involvement in it.

Saying that the holocaust never happened is like saying that the Vietnam War never happened. When you say that something like that never happened, an event on the order of 9/11, it immediately marks you as a crank.
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>>546079
You can actually find written documents about the vietnam war.

You cannot find a single written document about gas chambers.
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>>546074
>>546078
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>>546090

Is it not plausible to imagine that they were destroyed? I think it's enough that even the fucking SS defence witnesses didn't dispute that gas chambers existed, they just said they had nothing to do with the SS
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>>546074
http://www.telescopes.com/blogs/helpful-information/18965572-can-you-see-objects-left-behind-on-the-moon
>Unfortunately the answer to this question is no. Not even the most powerful telescopes ever made are able to see these objects. The flag on the moon is 125cm (4 feet) long. You would require a telescope around 200 meters in diameter to see it. The largest telescope now is the Keck Telescope in Hawaii at 10 meters in diameter. Even the Hubble Space telescope is only 2.4 meters in diameter. Resolving the lunar rover, which is 3.1 meters in length, would require a telescope 75 meters in diameter. So our backyard 6 inch and 8 inch telescopes are not even going to come close!

Now shut the fuck up
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>>546090
You think they wouldn't have destroyed the limited documents they did create about it?

And that's absolutely a lie, there are written documents and schematics for the chambers.
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>>546094
What is wrong about either of those two posts?
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>>546074
>I've looked through a telescope at an observatory and seen the Apollo 11 landing site.
Do you think us stupid?
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>>546095
It's plausible, but then you might as well argue that the nazis had rockets which visited the far side of the moon, only their plans were destroyed!

>I think it's enough that even the fucking SS defence witnesses didn't dispute that gas chambers existed,
It's not, witnesses at the Nuremberg trials were tortured into signing confessions.

It's incredible how low the standards at which evidence is held drop when one is talking about the holocaust.

I'm not a denier btw, I'm just underlining the hypocrisy.

>>546102
>You think they wouldn't have destroyed the limited documents they did create about it?
I think at least one would've survived the war. Instead there's this whole mythology that nazis allegedly used secret code words to talk about gas chambers. Ridiculous if you want my opinion. Add to this the fact that there are plenty of telegrams describing execution quotas of jews killed by the einsatzgruppen in soviet territories, so it's not like nazis didn't record their atrocities.

>And that's absolutely a lie, there are written documents and schematics for the chambers.
Care to share them?
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>>544863
All of it
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>>545116
/pol/ no one is offended. no one cares in the slightest about your views or how retarded they are.

you get told to stop shitposting about it because you always shitpost about it. we've heard it and we didn't care. just stop.
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>>546192
>I'm not a denier btw
You're an ignorant retard who can't keep his mouth shut then?
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>>546192

>you might as well argue that the nazis had rockets which visited the far side of the moon, only their plans were destroyed!

Hardly. It would have been very much the rational thing to do to start destroying that kind of incriminating evidence when it became apparent Germany was losing the war.

I'm not a muh six gazillion shill, either, in fact I probably think most victims died of disease, but I don't see any reasonable cause to doubt that Nazis also actively exterminated probably millions of Jews and gas chambers were one such method of doing so
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>>546242
Cute. You have a pavlovian response to anything which remotely questions the sacro-sanct fact of the holocaust.

It's basically the new religion of the post ww2 west. With anti-blasphemy laws and all in some euro countries.
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>>546250
You don't know what you're talking about, yet you keep talking and talking but nothing of value is every being said.

Maybe you don't realize, so I'm telling you.
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>>546244
>Hardly.
Why not? If your line of defense is "the evidence was burnt", you can pretty much claim anything.

>It would have been very much the rational thing to do to start destroying that kind of incriminating evidence when it became apparent Germany was losing the war.
Right, but statistically the probability that every single fucking document was burned is incredibly slim.

>but I don't see any reasonable cause to doubt that Nazis also actively exterminated probably millions of Jews and gas chambers were one such method of doing so
It should be reasonably doubted because of lack of evidence, like anything.
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>>546256
>You don't know what you're talking about,
Why do you say that? I think you're resorting to ad hominem because you've been talking out of your ass this whole time.

I'll reiterate the question you've been ignoring for the past two posts :

>Care to share them?
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>>546260
I'm not that person, but you could just google Auschwitz Gas chambers and you'd find telegrams, schematics and other things.
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>>544889
he based 1984 on Soviet Union
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>>546265
>just google it bruh!
That's not up to me to do. He claimed something, he must prove it.

And as a life-changing and enlightening experience, I suggest you try googling "auschwitz gas chambers telegrams" and tell me how many you find.
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>>546270
If you don't know even the most commonly known things about a subject, you shouldn't be such an obnoxious cunt about your ignorant opinion and read, instead of writing pointless stupid posts.
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>>545881
Kek.
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>>546279
Different dude but you're not saying anything.

The dude keeps asking you to post anything backing up your claim, which youve already stated is a simple Google search away and all you've done is sling shit because your feelings are hurt.

If all you can do is say "hurrdurr you're so stupid" then fuck off. If not, actually answer the content of his post and prove him wrong.
>>
What if we made a sticky that said in all caps: ANYONE WHO POSTS ON THIS BOARD ADMITS THE HOLOCOAST DID NOT HAPPEN

Maybe the fucking /pol/ tards would go away and we could have actual threads about things?
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>>546288
No matter how much information you throw at these clowns that proves them wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt, they'll just come back tomorrow with the same thread and pretend it didn't happen.
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Jew propaganda 1/2
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>>546429
2/2
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>>546429
>>546430
3/2
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The naked Jew guy on the right side of this photo has been doctored in
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>hurf durf wild claim that no credible historians would support
>where is your evidence?
>HURF DURF ITS YOUR JOB TO PROVE ME WRONG SHILL
Why do some boards breed so many retards?
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>>546440
The original photo, as it appeared in the newspaper during World War II. I didn't believe it at first myself, but when I looked up the article in the newspaper's archives online, the naked Jew guy isn't there.
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>>546440
>>546467
That was examined a couple years ago and the conclusion was that the guy was shopped out for the newspaper, not the other way around.
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>>546090
>muh gas chambers
you do know other methods were used in the holocaust too?
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>>546430

That.. actually looks like a fake. Or that woman is just very large

Dunno if it really is
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>>546508

Also two trees repeat in the forest background
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>>545888
Certain groups at the time. I seriously doubt it matters to anyone powerful these days.
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>>546499
Examined by whom? And why would it have been shopped out for the newspaper? That doesn't make any sense.
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>>544863
Yezhov was NKVD and the bloody dwarf a real monster just like the anmial that came after him Beria
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>>546065
to deny the moon landings is to conclude the ussr and usa were working together during the cold war. so you going to have to explain that--that essentially the cold war didnt happen.

the ussr acknowledged all apollo missions. they never denied one bit of it. so if they didn't happen ussr was in on the cover up.

>hur dur the ussr couldnt have known
do not embarrass yourself by showing you dont understand that both the ussr and usa had the technology to easily detect eachothers activity in orbit and deep space. its basic radio technology.
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>>544863
jewish involvement in the transatlantic slave trade.
Anything where jews were not victims but aggressors.
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I thought this thread might be fun, stimulating and thought provoking and then realize of course this was going to attract tin foil hats.

I do believe history can be altered or skewed (e.g. usa "internment" camps vs nazi "concentration" camps or our allies are always "freedom fighters" and never "terrorists" yet these are all the same thing.) but this thread is a great example why academics or politicians etc wont waste their time discussing this.
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>>546542
Photographic analysts.

You were about to be all like...
>Hurr Durr JEW

>>546501
>Einsatzgruppen
>Exhaust Trucks
>Denial of medical treatment and food in the ghettoes.

>>546318
>>546429
>>546430
You have discovered that the Soviets ran a propaganda campaign. Congratulations.

>>546260
>>546257
>>546250
>>546192
https://www.awesomestories.com/asset/view/Nuremberg-Trial-Film-Nazi-Concentration-Camps
http://nuremberg.law.harvard.edu/php/docs_swi.php?DI=1&text=doc_anal
http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/holocaust/h-engineer.htm
http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/ar/argaschambers.html
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/g/goebbels-joseph/goebbels-1948-excerpts-01.html
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/wannsee.asp
Heinrich Himmler speech about the extermination of the Jews https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a_cmbi3iIg
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>>546625
To be fair, if it wasn't the Holocaust deniers, what the fuck would this thread be about? Ancient historians exagerated their accounts? Everyone knows that and pretty much nobody disagrees, or the regular tinfoil that the moon landing was faked? Which is pretty much a claim that the cold war was faked.
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>>546065
Everything you just listed here marks you as a high school drop out.
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>>546625
How's your first day on 4chan going?
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>>546542
>>546467
Hell, looks at the picture it links to a fucking blog of all things.
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I always thought 9/11 truthers were dumb but I think /storm/ has them beat there
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>>546097
>>546129

even the Russians tracked Apollo 11's flight to the moon. What reason do the Russians have to confirm it if they thought it was fake during the Cold War/Space Race??
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>>544863
The killing of Benito Mussolini.
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>>545116
Because it derails the thread
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>>545035
And Berya. Don't forget Berya.
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>>546046
>Australia-Hungary
Kek
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>>546000
Browning doesn't white wash CE, he black washes the Heer (rightly so).
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>>546011
Götz Aly
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>>545035
He and Molotov were Gentiles, which is why they bonded.
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>>544863
Pullo and Vorenus.
I doubt they'd have been able to escape an enemy camp.
Figure Caesar just wanted a good story to tell the folks back in Rome.
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>>545116
This.

jidf (a real organization) obviously disagrees, though.
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>>546573
>to deny the moon landings is to conclude the ussr and usa were working together during the cold war.
Ding ding ding. Correct!

The international banking mafia controls Russia, USA, UK, and every other country with a central bank. The moon landings and the cold war were for a psychological purpose, and the countries USSR and USA played their role in the act.

"All Wars Are Bankers Wars" is a recommended watch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfEBupAeo4

And "War Is a Racket" by Smedley Butler
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>>545116
Holocaust denial is not history. It requires an assault on the study of History.

We present you with the evidence and you immediately try to disqualify it. We give you sources and you handwave them away. You should be asking why you're so afraid to consider the overwhelming possibility that it happened. Not the other way around.
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>>545082
All reds are traitors.
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bathory
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>>544863
Wasn't Yezhov chief of secret police or something?
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>>546097

Do you realize that things on lunar surface cast shadows. Those shadows can be seen with telescopes.
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Why haven't I filtered Holocaust yet?
Regardless of my own doubts about it, no good thread has ever come out of it on this board.
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>>546870
They were intercepting radio signals and using sophisticated telemetry, not watching it through a telescope.
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>>546065
>>546074
>>546097
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?feature=605

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment

There's also the reflectors that Apollo 11, 14, and 15 left on the moon. You can still reflect lasers off of them and measure the exact distance to the moon.

I don't understand why there are people who want to deny the greatest achievement in human history.
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>>552474
Those prove nothing. Nobody denies that things were sent to the moon, what people reject is the idea that humans went there.
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>>545116
we got 1 year prison for questioning the holocaust
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