What does good and evil even mean anymore?

>>523089
it never meant anything in the first place

>>523094
>inb4 /thread
How were these terms even made then?

>>523089
Good is what you like and evil is what you dislike.

>>523099
To further one's political agenda

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>>523089
Depends on your political views...

>>523089
All existence is evil.

>>523089
People who slam the word subjective, have never really taken a basic philosophy course. There is intrinsic good.

I'm under the assumption that if you don't understand this, you really haven't sat in a productive college course, or comprehended philosophical discourse effectively.

And judging that most of the people on this board are born in the 90s, I suspect the latter to be mostly true.

>>523538
>There is intrinsic good
Only in some philosophical systems. Usually the one's derivative of Plato.

Some philosophy is beyond good and evil

Good and evil definitely exists, but only in the human sphere. Eventually one must transcend all duality to a place where good and evil are replaced with beneficial and deleterious, wholesome and unwholesome, truth and error, etc.

>>523538

>there is intrinsic good

That's a subjective opinion.

>>523538
>There is intrinsic good.
Prove it then.

>>523538
>intrinsic good

put a trigger warning on that shit

>>523089
If you help humanity advance, you are good. If you harm humanity, you are bad.

>>523538
>People who slam the word subjective, have never really taken a basic philosophy course. There is intrinsic good.
Prove it then. Shouldn't be too hard, just a syllogism or two since it's basic phil.

>>524340
>implying notions of what is progress and what is not aren't completely subjective and resulting in every political conflict, ever

You sure are a smart one.

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>>523538
>intrinsic good

>>523089
Is it ok to skin you alive?

>>524259
>>524321
living in harmony with oneself and society. the way of being produced by mindfulness, detachment, and the extinguishing of unwholesome states. living life in accordance with a transcendent principle. the quality of a liberated mind that is not beholden to sensuality or other neurotic complexes. Eudaimonia. Following the Tao. Enlightenment. Spiritual growth. Self-knowledge. Producing the Gold of the alchemists. The list goes on and on and on.

>>524374
>>>school

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>>524365

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>>524365
Shit, you almost had me reply to that

7/10

>>524386
I've had this debate a million times and I don't think I've ever heard a single argument that wasn't regurgitated r/atheism memes and epic reaction pics.

You have no frame of reference with what is being discussed. Whereof one does not know...

>>524383
>>>learntoexplainthingsimply

>>524401
It was a fucking noun list you cretin.

A high level of discourse is expected here.

>>523161
Link to this quiz please

>>523089
>>523089
ethical vs unethical.

The subjectivity of morals has no place in discerning "good" or "evil". The objectivity of transgressing on other people, does.

>>524407
>a high level of discourse is expected here
might I remind you we're posting on 4chan?

>>523538
Do you even Wittgenstein

>>524391
>debate
>spout a stream of vague and nonsensical terms
>expect a response

>>524401
>posting on a history and humanities board
>doesn't know what eudaimonia is

Fine: when you take care of your shit and live for something higher than securing your animal comforts the good reveals itself clear as day. But what do you expect from autists who think you have to logic the good into existence instead before they're allowed to experience it

>>524419
Seriously, go back to school

>>524417
>might I remind you we're posting on 4chan?
Read the fucking sticky cunt

>>524365
>Pick one of mindfulness, detachment, extinguishing of unwholesome states, transcendence, Eudaimonia, Tao, Enlightenment, Spiritual Growth, Self-knowledge, Alchemylol, New Age hippy shit, et cetera

Sounds pretty subjective and half-assed m8.

Also privileges "Harmony" as an assumed good when it's pretty clear some people just want chaos. It really is like you picked up The New Age Thesaurus and just listed a bunch of random entries.

>>524420
>Complaining about autistic logic
>Thinks throwing out a truck load of phrases constitutes an explaination

>>524448
None of that shit is new age you mental midget

>>524360
Depends on the reason.
Is it to save the city of Shanghai from exploding?
then yeah.

>>524450
>Hurr durr ur a mental midget
Nice retort.

There isn't anything more New Agey than tossing about a bunch of "enlightenmenty" sounding words and acting like they're all the same.

Why don't you explain Eudaimonia for us all, since you seem to have a hard on for that particular word?
>>524420

>>524450
Different person, who do these terms prove intrinsic goodness?

Like >>524448 said, these are all subjective persumptions of a "proper state of harmony"

>inb4 "dont fucking reply to me unless your're going to contribute to the thread"

>>524455
You can find every single one of the those sentiments expressed in the Upanishads, among may, many other texts

>>524467
DELETE THIS

>>524468
>Eudaimonia
>In a Hindu text

In what? The Greek translation?

Have a quote or you just gonna throw books at me instead of demonstrating any understanding of the words you type?

>among many, many other text
>All of which I read of course, unlike your midget minded self
You sound like a fucking hipster. You've been tasked with demonstrating "intrinsic good" and instead you've only engaged in some pathetic dick waving. Try an argument, or even a description.

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>>523089
FUCKING AZTECS GET OUT MY FUCKING BOARD REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>524484
A detached, objective, systematic observation of one's consciousness eventually leads to the elimination of neurotic and otherwise harmful mental patterns, which loosens the ego's grip over the mind and leads to an unshakeable, expanded awareness that is universal across religions and is associated with qualities we call good.

In other words if you face up to and conquer the shit that bothers you deep inside, you're not as insecure and afraid anymore and the natural radiance of your mind shines forth. You literally can't tell me there's no evidence because I and millions of others have experienced it for ourselves

>>524517
Muh feels: The Post

>>>/out/
>>>/tumblr/

>>524524
lol

This is what you get when you try to level with autists who know nothing outside of video games and anime. Ite g, peace

>>524529
cya later pal :^)

>>524524
Not that anon, but are you suggesting that your brain can't be 'over-clocked' like with hypo-mania and mania (crazy about of neurotransmitters or some shit maybe), shit can literally be epiphanies and euphoric as fuck, 1 week can feel like months.

>>524517
Are you suggesting that no crazy dictators etc have ever had a similar experience?

t.atheist

>>524536
amount*

>>524517
>>524529
>"A detached, objective, systematic observation of one's consciousness eventually leads to the elimination of neurotic and otherwise harmful mental patterns"
>"elimination of neurotic and otherwise harmful mental patterns"
>"because I and millions of others have experienced it "
>"This is what you get when you try to level with autists"

also, argumentum ad populum famuel

>>524536
Yes, I am, because a crazy dictator is not observing his thought processes as a detached observer. If he did, he wouldn't be a crazy dictator. We're not even taking about spiritual ecstasy. That shit is a hindrance on the path.

We're talking about perfecting yourself as a human being as far as it is in your capacity to do so. Theism, the Christian God, all that trash has nothing to do with this. That shits for plebs still waiting for salvation to come from outside themselves

>>524550
lol, thousands of years of wisdom writings retroactively refuted by a muh fallacies argument. Please

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>>524570

>>524570
Yeah, and people believed that miasma and humors were a thing.
Age does not verify anything. If anything age calls for reevaluation.

>>524570
I'm just refuting the argument used in this instance

I doubt any of the unnamed writings say within them "This book is correct because many follow it", so I have no issue with them.

>>524577
What a meme argument. Refute the points made instead of regurgitating facebook posts

>>524517
Funny, my impression of eudaimonia was more of a Virtue Ethics thing where it was a state of "happiness" or "fulfillment" that coincides with alignment with objective virtues that lie outside of oneself and has relatively little to do with personal self-improvement.

In short, more of a society oriented thing than an individual "conquer your own shit" thing. The degree to which eudaimonia has to do with your own improvement is incidental at best, only relevant in the assumption that what's good for the goose is good for the gander so-to-speak.

Also, as an aside, the Greeks didn't really have any problem with "ego". In no way would eudaimonia from embodying virtues entail a loosening of "ego". Not too sure that the case would've changed for the modern usage of the term either.

Anyhow, it sounds like you've misappropriated the word to me.

>For the basis of what I'm taking Eudaimonia to mean see:
>http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/ethics-virtue/

>>524570
>thousands of years of wisdom writings
You really ought to stop conflating different cultural ideas, it isn't all "the same stuff" and that's why I say you sound like a New Age Hipster.

>>524593
I could post 10 different passages from 10 different cultures that sound like the exact same thing. The good exists, but the paths to it differ

Honestly though thank you for actually giving me an argument. Thank you

>>524606
No problem, as long as a bit of good faith is thrown in I don't mind giving an actual response.

If you want to re-rail this thread, you could try taking the 10 different passages from 10 different cultures and demonstrate how they come to the same "good".

Despite my hipster insults, it's a legitimate angle. Schopenhauer was highly influenced along these lines from what I understand.

>>523089
I would always describe good as the minimization of suffering while evil would be the maximizing of it, or at the very least creating suffering to further your own goal.

like first poster said it never meant anything. Its been subjective since we created the concept, and the more specific the subject is the harder it is to place it in a good/bad category. Murder is easy, things like arbotion, gay marriage blah blah all subjective

Well MORE subjective than things like murder which most humans will agree is "bad"

>>525372
Oh but when WE kill it isn't murder, it is a war / justice / self-defence by the armed wing of the state / etc.

>>523089
Nothing, moral realism is vacuous.