>>52878143 We're not poor. We can afford SMS in the US. Whatsapp is for 3rd world shitholes like Europe where SMS is too expensive for them so they have to rely on a single companies service instead of a generic number you can use on anything.
>>52877308 Just switched from textra to signal and the quick reply is pretty similar. Hopefully you like the transition as much as I have and, with the signal desktop app coming you can bridge the two devices
I've been using Hangouts in conjunction with my Google Voice number (going to switch my main number to a gvoice number once my contract is up). I was thinking of switching to google's Messenger, but I imagine none of this stuff provides the security that these other apps offer.
>>52877886 >>52877908 Signal is FOSS fucking shill, also it's not just a SMS app, it's a messaging app, able to make voice calls or sending photographs from inside the app, just like Whatsapp It's also audited, unlike most secure apps out there >>52877652 Signal doesn't, you can literally make your own client, the protocol is libre, just like the client and the server
Marlinspike is a fucking faggot, but all this points are FUD >>52881133 SMSSecure
>>52881280 By using the phone OS's inbuilt function for handling that mode of communication. Its a total and utter basic, just like actually making a call, or sending and receiving emails. I'd rather have this built into the OS, instead of having to start a fucking app, everytime I want to use it.
>>52881327 Actual first world countries have unlimited internet anyway so the internet connection is not a problem. Also there are phones that have two day battery even with 4G so there's zero reason to use SMS.
>>52881155 In order to reap the benefits of Signal's encryption, the other users need to have it as well. But it also does regular (unencrypted) SMS, so you can use it while convincing your friends and family to switch.
>>52882019 >there's zero reason to use SMS except if you need to reach someone that doesn't use your app/service of course you could install all of them (WhatsApp, Fb Messenger, Viber, Skype, Telegram etc) but that would be plain stupid when you could just send an SMS
>>52881772 There is no phone messenger I'm aware of that protects metadata effectively. SMS literally broadcasts it to the government; even Tor is not suitable against a global passive attacker. Secure communication is an open research problem, and phones, where you want to minimise power usage and data usage, present a unique challenge on top of that making the likely solution some kind of hybrid node/point P2P.
Of course, if you have a better idea, I'm all ears.
>>52882324 >Of course, if you have a better idea, I'm all ears. A community of federated XMPP servers is definitely a better solution than tunneling all the traffic through jewgle servers, NSA servers and a single server operated by moxie hosted probably on AWS or another company tied to three letters agencies. Hell, even plain SMS is better than Signal, at least only my government can read my shit.
I used to use TextSecure but they switched to Apple emoji for some dumbass reason. Using Textra now since it supports way more customization. I can have the font size way the fuck down and actually have a good conversion assistant.
>>52886779 I don't want people calling me any time they have anything to say. What if I'm at a funeral and my ringtone goes off? It'd be embarrassing for everyone to hear "LET THE BODIES HIT THE FLOOR" in that situation
>>52888662 Avoiding SMS just to not use it would mean bloating my phone up with shit like Facebook Messenger, Kik, and multiple other messengers. There's no universally popular messenger in the US other than Facebook's and iMessage, and I'm not switching devices and using Facebook just to talk to people. On the other hand, everyone has SMS and I don't need any additional bloat to communicate with anyone
>>52888846 >no one asks >people cry about the possibility to use other methods to reach people in our global mobile network besides SMS >they want SMS being popular again, blog on 4chan about their life and how hipster they are >actually nothing is stopping them from only writing SMS >someone calls them out on that >they keep crying for attention >>>/tumblr/
>>52884257 That irritated me, too; you can go back to Android stock emoji in the settings. I understand why - it was the 'hairy heart' thing, but Google fixed that in later Android versions. Still.
>>52884516 GCM is only used for wakelocks. (GCM is also the only supported wakelock method that works in Deep Sleep mode and doesn't require admin exceptions on Android Marshmallow. I don't like that, not one bit, but it's what we have.)
>>52882630 No, that has the exact same metadata problem.
And several governments get the ability to read SMSes, including full content and metadata. You're literally broadcasting it to anyone who will listen, all of the crypto is weak, and GCHQ more or less engineered the backdooring of GSM from day one.
You do realise that the metadata problem can all be boiled down to timing, right? All I need is the time, and the ability to see the timings of most internet/other comms packets that cross the relevant areas, and in short order your federated XMPP is fucked, Signal is fucked - even Tor is fucked against correlation like that given sufficient targeting and time.
Defending against that is extremely hard - when I say it's an open research problem, I mean it. It's not one you can solve with a glorified IRC with XML bolted on.
>>52885225 Both >>52887883 It's still FOSS, all of it's code is licensed under the GPL, despite Moxie being a jewish faggot and despite it requiring GCM Anyways, forks that don't require GCM exist, like LibreSignal >>52882630 No one can read what you send using the Signal protocol
>>52890322 >No, that has the exact same metadata problem. It would be a huge pain in the ass to perform a timing attack against a shitload of servers located literally everywhere in the world and operated by a very large pool of people. With Signal, whatsapp and the like everything is routed through a single server hosted in the USA. This way they don't even need to use some arcane large scale attack, they just go to the owner of the server/ISP/hosting provider without even needing any paper signed by a judge and get whatever the fuck they want.
>>52890983 >everything is routed through a single server hosted in the USA No. You're right in saying that metadata attacks are theoretically easier (there's only one server setup across all servers, making things like info theoretic PIR pretty much useless), but practically, they are using many servers to distribute load geographically, and the connections to them are far more secure than SMS. TLS is "broken," but it's more than enough to make dragnet attacks too expensive, especially since the certs are presumably pinned in the app.
>>52891115 >but practically, they are using many servers to distribute load geographically This is obvious, but those servers are all owned by a single corporation, just send a subponea to said company and you basically own their whole network. For Signal it is probably really just a single server (I don't think they have a large user pool). As for SMS, they are shit, I never said otherwise because they clearly are but, from the standpoint of the average european user, they are far more "private" than Signal. With SMS only my carrier and my government can look through my shit while with Signal I also have to worry about USA government (where the server/s is/are hosted), USA government for a second time since moxie is from USA, probably at least a couple of other european states, some tier1 ISP, the owner of the backbone, the USA based datacenter where the server is probably located, the fucking NSA and probably someone else I don't even acknowledge the existence of.
>>52891443 >This is obvious, but those servers are all owned by a single corporation, just send a subponea to said company and you basically own their whole network. And this is different from SMS networks how? They're not even encrypted, so subpoena not necessary if you have a network tap.
>For Signal it is probably really just a single server It's not, that's exactly what I was saying.
>With SMS only my carrier and my government can look through my shit Lol no. The US does global dragnet surveillance of metadata for calls and SMS, this is why everyone internationally was so pissed.
>>52888044 Then you set it to the "important" ringtone. So when you're at a wedding and the priest asks "Does anyone have any objections to why these two should not be wed?", your phone will burst out "THAT QUESTION WILL BE ANSWERED THIS SUNDAY NIGHT WHEN JOHN CENA DEFENDS THE BELT AT WWE SUPERSLAAAAAAAAMMMMM".
>>52897440 Generally speaking, neither academia nor industry consider key escrow to qualify as actual e2e encryption. The typical definition used for e2e is that only the sender and recipient can access the plaintext.
>>52891685 >And this is different from SMS networks how? They're not even encrypted, so subpoena not necessary if you have a network tap. With SMS the traffic does not leave my country, and in europe no one gives a shit about spying on its own citizens (someone try but without a proper budget it's going nowhere). SMS are also "somewhat" encrypted (A3, A8), at least they are where in transit from the phone to the cell it is connected to.
>It's not, that's exactly what I was saying. It's still a huge single point of failure, all the servers are still owned by a single jew who is also from USA.
>Lol no. The US does global dragnet surveillance of metadata for calls and SMS, this is why everyone internationally was so pissed. They had some bullshit equipment attached to certain ISP network in certain nations, it's not a glogal dragnet. They intercept everything that goes through USA, that's why everyone was pissed because they are literally treating every non USA citizen as a potential terrorist.
With SMS you are hiding in plain sight, the traffic is so huge that LEA are not even able to get some goatfuckers texting for months/years who also trained in siria for months/years and then came back in europe to fuck Paris up. With Signal you are just one of the not so many faggots using an encrypted app made by a jew who is already in every known and unknown blacklist.
Textra for now but it's awful. I don't use SMS to chat, that fucking dialog view makes it hard to find the latest sms with chronological date/time/sender. I need something that threats it more like email.
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