Finished my australian schooling and I want to do computer science at uni.
1. Is CS a worthwhile degree? Is it better to do something like math and learn programming on the side?
2. For australians is pic related a quality university for CS?
I've heard USYD doesn't have a great CS program do you know anything about that?
Cheers I've heard lots of people like "You can just learn programming by yourself and get a CS job" but honestly the course seems so rigorous that it would be really hard to cover all that material by yourself while doing another course you know?
depends on what you want to do after... maths/stats+programming can lead to fiance and banking jobs, and research.
don't fall for the engineering meme unless you know you are going to get first class honours
list=PL6B940F08B9773B9F is UNSW about C programming, i suggest you get in as much programming and maths knowledge as you can before you start uni.
if you go into computer science you will want to start learning about discrete mathematics.
hope this helps
Thanks I'm really pretty good at maths I came first for 4u and 3u maths at my school. I can program some shit in java but nothing in C yet.
Based buckland what a legend I saw him lecture before in person he's a god.
Can u elaborate on the engineering meme if you don't get honours?
Aren't finance/banking jobs kind of dull?
Sorry for all the questions
I'm just a science student at UTS, but I don't think you can fault USYD's CS program, its put you in a better position than the IT courses offered by the other unis. I'm guessing you've read that off some whirlpool post.
>2. For australians is pic related a quality university for CS?
unsw is in the group of 8. that's all you really need to know, supposedly it's better than usyd now which if true makes it pretty good.
by "engineering meme" I mean that every man and his dog is studying engineering now. In alot of the newspapers and recruiting there is a lot said about how australia has a shortage of engineers.
What they really should say is that australia is short on talented, experienced engineers.
There are alot of people studying engineering but not many engineering jobs/opportunities for graduates.
You have to get engineering work experience to graduate from most unis, and all of the biggest companies who go to job fairs take the best students( so highest GPAs) for their vacation work and graduate programs. the research labs at uni's have similar requirements. Most of the vacation programs require students to be going in to their last year
So what I'm getting at is that its hard to get anywhere in eng if you aren't first class honours(gpa>6.0). In QLD the scholarship students have work exp sorted for them after they finish their first year but they are an exception.
Alot of people who study engineering don't work in an engineering capacity after they graduate, or they change degree.
Finance and banking jobs are dull but they have good pay attached to them, have good work-life balance and are pretty stable.
Alot of what I said about vacation work is true for mathematics and computer science- be prepared to compete for positions/research which means having a excellent GPA.
Sorry for the long post/rant, there's so much I wished I knew going in
Keep asking if you have any more questions
Wow okay that's fair enough. I've heard about that before honestly. So if I'm quite good at maths you'd recommend CS + Stats to open up the doors to lots of different careers?
How's medical science? I've heard it's brutal.
Depends what degree what are you interested in?
top class bant
So you want to transfer into medicine I take it or are you interested in doing research? What made u pick medsci over something else?
You don't transfer into med but you do it postgraduate if you do. Undecided, going to do honours and go from there.
I've been programming since I was 9-10, and med has always fascinated me so I wasn't all that keen on studying CS for 3-4 years, I'd learn the nuances of dmath and that'd be about it. I got offers for CS, Engineering, IT but decided on where I am now. Call me insane.
Yeah, that was my line of thinking. There is certainly a demand for CS/IT Grads here and if you can sustain an interest in it you should do well among a sea of rajeshs who can't program for shit.
Another ausfag here. What about UTS?
I thought it was good originally, since it has "technology" in its name, and I also went to the open day which was OK. But firther studies show that it's actually worse than UNSW. Why?
>don't fall for the engineering meme
*Don't do engineering period unless you're already getting friendly with places that will provide industrial training because the companies in Australia are stingy fucks and you'll be hunting for 3 years straight trying to secure some
UNSW staff especially in Chemical shit on everyone before 4th year and in Mechanical, you have to go to a fucking TAFE for prac.
(students are friendly though)
If you like CS shit though and also security and are prepared to work your arse off nights on end (for the glory and all I guess, the UNSW students eat up all the Google internships too for various things), you can be one of Davies' pets. His students always dominate the rankings at CySCA. The recent one they took 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th but those students are definitely dedicated as fuck
I did my CS degree in Melbourne. I slacked at Maths at high school too, managed fine in CS maths. It's much more interesting, though still not really that practically related to your degree. You only do basic calculus, some linear algebra, logic, probability. I found it kind of enjoyable actually once you get the hang of it.
I feel kind of bad that CS is getting inundated with trade schoolers who want to learn Ruby.
Pure Computer Science is a really fascinating subject in its own right.
I mean, I'm not really that into it, and it's still really fascinating.
If you study at UNSW, you have a 94% chance of finding full time employment within 4 months of graduating. UTS is 74%, USYD 70-80% (cant remember) UWS 64-67%.
I just finished my 1st year of CS at UWS, i wish i had been mature enough in year 12 to stay focused and not slack off, oh well.
Technology isn't a reference to computer technology, rather a reference to the universities origins as a technical college before it changed into UTS. We've only existed as UTS since '88 whereas a lot of others have been around since the 40's of earlier, so they have that sort of prestige about them.
From what I have seen, UTS performs at the top however graduates less people, so when you're don't look at a per capita basis, ANU, UNSW, USYD etc all remain at the top.
I have no regrets about my enrollment, the higher ups aren't pussies shit deathly afraid of change and the STEM facilities are excellent, and uninfected by SJW cunts.. Journalism and comms is another story though.
>is cs a worthwhile degree
In terms of job prospects?
Sadly, it's like any other STEM degree. Unless you get work experience from the University or you fluke a job on Seek or LinkedIn, you will be unemployed after graduation even with a decent average.
>should i do maths at unsw
If you are seriously considering this I'll give a full review of their school from someone who spent 4 years there, if it's just a passing thought I won't.
No one gives a shit about the prestige of your university here. A pass degree from UNSW isn't worth any more or less than a credit or distinction degree somewhere else.
I wouldn't recommend UNSW from experience because it's full of international students (read: Mainland Chinese) and if you are just a regular domestic student then you will find yourself alienated and miserable.
>worse than unsw
Probably that's because of their research output. UNSW has sold their soul to the Chinese so they can buy every foreign academic with a publication history and every new piece of technology so they can get into top journals.
I have never studied there but their undergrad courses are probably on par.
>1. Is CS a worthwhile degree? Is it better to do something like math and learn programming on the side?
Programmers with CS degrees are rare on the Australian job market at the moment, while the need for software is increasing all the time, so you'll have recruiters pursuing you quite vigorously.
You will have to do a programming internship during your degree if you want to a competent programmer though, CS degrees don't really teach you day-to-day programming, just lots of theory
Yeah, but you get the whole "what the fuck is a Turing Masheen or Dijkstra algorhythm!? Useless crap. I just wanna make videoh games" crowd pressuring Computer Science out of Computer Science, which is quite shit.
I did a maths + cs degree and i noticed that cs has almost to nothing to do with programming. After cs you can stay in the academy and research or start almost from zero and learn to program, get experienced and find a job.
If your goal is to get money and all the ladies, dont study cs, ecause as >>52467381 said, its shit.
If you want something for yourself, be a better human being and get some skillz you wont get anywhere else, do math and cs on the side. Because cs is actually math. I enjoyed my degree very much and dont regret it.
Remember, the most important thing is the exp.
From what I understand Melbourne Uni has the best CS program in the state. I have some friends that went to RMIT and don't really have many kind things to say about it, but they all ended up in great jobs eventually. Don't know anything about Swinburne. Speaking from my own experience, the first and second years of CS at Monash were very hard, but learnt at a very fast pace. Third year was pretty average, to not great, but I'm overall happy with the quality of the degree. Doing it again, I definitely would have gone to Melbourne, their final project absolutely shat on ours at Monash, and their coursework seemed harder/brand more recognized internationally, etc.
i went to usyd, the os course there was a joke especially in comparison to unsw's; they have one that allows you to build an os from scratch.
maths at usyd was pretty fucking great though. Really challenging shit.
anu and melb would like a word.
Graph theory helps a shitload in algorithms, calculus not so much. linear algebra is good for graphics.
At the end of the day, your perseverance will outshine the university you attend so long as it is halfway respectable. Degree doesn't mean shit if you can't pass the interviews; they just get you a foot in the door.
give me the full review
I have a lot of asian friends in my classes at school especially I don't really see the problem unless they literally can't speak english
what math would you recommend? pure/stats/quant/applied?
Do you brehs use a recruiter to find a job, or do you just apply at the companies you want to work for and follow up on your application?
also, is this really what australian diplomas look like?
looks like some crap you get in kindergarden for participating in field day
>caring what a diploma looks like rather than what it stands fo...
yeah nah, that does look pretty nice.
it really wouldn't be too hard to make it look a little more...regal would it?
I did a bachelors with honors, double majoring in Maths and CS, but not at UQ. Generally for CS you do fairly basic linear algebra (vectors, matrices, etc.) and some pure CS topics such as boolean algebra, regular languages, DFSA, etc. Maybe some basic calc as well.
In addition I did differential equations, real analysis, multivariable calc, complex analysis, modern algebra (group theory, semigroups, etc.), graph theory, number theory, combinatorics, and continuous groups. I mainly focused on discrete mathematics rather than calculus. Otherwise it would have been classical mechanics, fluid dynamics, stuff like that.
thank you, will be looking into the CS topics.
I also have knowledge of set theory, and some of the foundations, but pretty weak in that area right now.
Anyway, if anyone from UQ could answer, I will be writing down what you say so I can brush up on it on my own before classes begin.
>Would you recommend a CS/Math dual?
If you're interested in Maths, sure. Or if you're interested in getting into a field which requires a high level of mathematical literacy. Originally I was just doing Maths, but taking lots of CS papers as well out of interest. I did the dual because I figured that I'd probably end up taking enough papers from each to get it anyway. I'm glad I did.
>Is it a lot of work?
It's not really that much more work, you're just much more constrained in what papers you can take. In second year I did something like 8 papers, one of which I got to choose. I guess that could make it more difficult in that you can't pad your semester out with easy filler papers.
>What job did you get?
Software engineer at a very well-known company.
First year is straightforward if were a good 4 Unit student. You take Higher Maths 1A/1B and Discrete Maths. Higher Maths 1A is a rehash of the 4U course with more emphasis on theory and Higher Maths 1B has some new content in ODEs/Linear Algebra and Stats. Discrete Math is a CS course in the Maths program, not that difficult.
Second Year when I went through was a mess. Higher Several Variable was the old Real Analysis course with the Multivariate Calculus course. The lecture notes were completely insufficient for the first part of the course (the fucking textbook was out of print) but the second part was fine. Higher Linear Algebra was awful because of a shit lecturer who is gone now, no textbook that followed the course for when you fall behind or didn't understand something and completely inconsistent lecture notes.
I have checked the handbook recently and they have introduced a new subject which I assume to be the Real Analysis section of Higher Several Variable. So, hopefully they have fixed those issues.
Higher Complex Analysis, DEs and Statistics were fine. This is because they weren't hashed together units from an earlier period. Linear Models and Mathematical Computing were also offered in Second Year. Linear Models was a really awful course as it doesn't seem to follow at all from the earlier Stats courses. Mathematical Computing is dry, but alright- it teaches MATLAB and numerical methods for PDEs which seem kind of pointless.
Third Year depends on your major. I did Pure, so I did Analysis and Algebra. I didn't enjoy these courses because they didn't really feel like the logical continuation of the second year courses, overall I didn't feel that I had understood really what the point of the exercise was at the end.
A lot of the electives aren't great. They have a lot of the same problems as the second year units where there is no logical continuity and they are a lot more work than they should be.
I didn't have much of an interest in doing Honours at the end of Third Year and I was fed up with the shit teaching and poorly thought out courses.
From the few friends that I had who did it, they pretty much said it's the same as third year except you write a thesis based on some lecturer's research interest. UNSW didn't really have much going in the way of consulting or working on big problems for industry at that time, so it was a completely academic exercise that was done in the academic's free time.
Overall, I do not recommend going to UNSW to study maths. I found that even as a good 4 Unit student and someone who had a good Credit/Distinction average in first year without much effort, that I was completely unable to understand the courses beyond Second Year and I started hating a subject that I loved so much in High School that I wanted to devote the next 4 years of my life to it.
I don't really know whether I'm one to be giving you advice but I feel that prospective students like yourself should know the truth about this place seeing as though your employment prospects and life for the next 10 years will be dictated by your performance at University. They will more or less lie to you until you are just doing their courses and they have your money. They couldn't give a shit at that point. I did Advanced Science, I got repeatedly dragged into the student student center and they'd ask me to drop out.
As soon as you fall behind which is inevitable based on the course material and their retarded views on what adequate support is, you are done for. Then it's just a matter of dragging yourself through the program until you are finished.
The love or passion for the subject is sucked out of you and you just end up miserable, bitter and angry. Then you have the humiliation of unemployment and sending your shitty CV out to everywhere which no one takes seriously.
>you sound like a train wreck
Yeah, I was. Fortunately I'm talking about this in past tense.
I did another degree after that and did well enough to get out of University.
I've only rediscovered Maths through my present job and I realise how much that place made me hate the field and everything else.
As if I haven't written enough to dissuade you, just do it somewhere else.
Just finished my first year at UTS doing IT.
If you don't want to do any math subjects it's the way to go, it's the only IT degree in NSW that doesn't require you to do any math subjects I think.
Saying that though, I'd say 5 out of the 8 subjects I've done so far have been and joke and were run by people who have no idea what they're doing.
I'm not bad at math but I didn't really want to spend 6-12 months of my life studying it so I figured UTS was the way to go.
Yeah, a few of the subjects were really good so I'm hoping 2nd year has more of those.
They have like an "elite" IT program though where you work for some big well known companies while you study, so that might be worth taking a look at. I know a few people that have done it and they've all finished their degrees with awesome high paying jobs. Because they only take like 30 people a year in the program as well, they're a pretty tight-nit group with lots of parties etc.
I studied pure.
Most of the things you see in cs is mostly close to algebra.
If you want to see some fucked up things that will blow your mind, then applied. Its mostly physics in math. How to describe the world using different types of equations. Really cool.
Statistics is not math. I cant find a good analogy but statistics is not math but you take some ideas from probability theory and try to make assumptions from experiments. You practically learn to count to ten and thats it. Bachelors in statistics...
Im not a math wizard. In my uni we learn a bit of everything so i have a general knowledge about the subjects. But, like everything in the world, it depends on what you want to do with the degree.
One of my teaching assistants, who was doing his doctorate in the in applied math, told me he was offered a job that would make him rather rich for a long time. Its like somebody here said, the world is in need for good engineers, and mathematicians are the best.
Most of the people that i know, who finished a degree in pure math stayed in the academy to further study maths. But you can do practically whatever you want. You can study cs, physics, some kind of engineering etc.
Although all i said sounds rather great, it will probably not get you a job right after graduation.
I had lots of fun, i learned a lot and it helps me in my work as a programmer. Although not that frequently.
If you need anything, you may ask me =]